Emu XL-7 & MP-7 User's Group

2.2 is incomplete in regards to the command stations; specifically
for the Remote Control Button Events and the Remote Control Rotary
Events. Has anyone discovered or does anyone have a more complete
listing for button events and rotary events for the command stations?
 Can anyone verify that the given messages for the buttons and
rotators are even valid?
 I'm attempting to dig into the machine with an old hypercard set of
midi commands and I'll surely post if I find out anything.

You are correct. Several years ago I tried mining for undocumented 
events and found some. I am not sure I ever posted my results here. I 
think Aaron posted code segment for button event definitions, though 
I don't think all of them worked via the Remote Control sysex.

I will search the archives and post links if I find them. I will try 
to find my original spread sheet if I haven't posted it.

I may have posted *.mid files with embedded sysex to turn Remote 
Control on and off. (If you haven't looked at the section on embedded 
sysex, you might want to.)

Years ago, I developed a sequence of Remote Control commands that let 
a user create an entire bank of randomized presets. I never 
distributed it, because I was afraid that if someone ran it with out 
the instructions, they could wipe out an entire bank of important 
presets.

I would be very interested to know what you are doing with Remote 
Control. 

--Steve

PS: I can verify that the documented button and rotary events work 
under OS2.0. (I used a P2500, which is now an XL-2500.)
 

--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, "scodoha04" <scott.d.harvey@...> wrote:
>
>  2.2 is incomplete in regards to the command stations; specifically
> for the Remote Control Button Events and the Remote Control Rotary
> Events. Has anyone discovered or does anyone have a more complete
> listing for button events and rotary events for the command 
stations?

>  Can anyone verify that the given messages for the buttons and
> rotators are even valid?
>  I'm attempting to dig into the machine with an old hypercard set of
> midi commands and I'll surely post if I find out anything.
>

Check out:

Files > E-Mu L.A.W [Links to Archived Wisdom]

I just added an html page with links for two threads:
(1) Undocumented Sysex Commands
(2) Button/Knob Event Definitions

If you post other documentation, tips, methods for using Remote 
Control Buttons and Knobs, I'd be happy to add the start of the 
thread to the page.

BTW, the original idea for E-Mu L.A.W. was an open ended topical 
index to threads of major discussions. For example, if someone were 
to search the archives for the start of some key discussions 
on "Using the E-Mu to Control External Gear" (for example), it would 
be easy to create a Table of Contents html page for that topic.

Hope this helps.

Steve_the_Believer_in_Collaborative_Solutions

I couldn't find them posted. Neither could I find my file or my print 
out. So I created a new table and posted an html version in Files 
(under E-Mu L.A.W.). Look for RC.html.

--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, "steve_the_composer" wrote:

> Several years ago I tried mining for undocumented events
> and found some. I am not sure I ever posted my results here.

 
> --- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, "scodoha04" <scott.d.harvey@> wrote:
> >
> >  2.2 is incomplete in regards to the command stations;
> >  specifically for the Remote Control Button Events . . . .

That's awesome, Steve. Thanks for doing that.


Charles.

--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, "steve_the_composer" <smw-mail@...> wrote:

>
> I couldn't find them posted. Neither could I find my file or my print 
> out. So I created a new table and posted an html version in Files 
> (under E-Mu L.A.W.). Look for RC.html.
> 
> --- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, "steve_the_composer" wrote:
> 
> > Several years ago I tried mining for undocumented events
> > and found some. I am not sure I ever posted my results here.
> 
>  
> > --- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, "scodoha04" <scott.d.harvey@> wrote:
> > >
> > >  2.2 is incomplete in regards to the command stations;
> > >  specifically for the Remote Control Button Events . . . .
>

Hey gang,

is there any reason I can't swap multi setups between models, such as
the P2K and the P25K? I'm able to swap banks OK and was pretty sure I'd
swapped multis in the past, but it ain't working today. Sysex id is 0 in
both cases and the packet delay set to the same. It takes so much longer
to do anything on the smaller P2K but it's much better sized for
gigging, hence my need.

Any help appreciated,

cheers

-- 
Paul
---
"Effectus super absolutionem"
http://www.JointIntelligenceCommittee.com
http://www.myspace.com/jointintelligencecommittee

Should work fine.  Remember that when you send a multi from one unit to
another, it goes into the *current* settings.  You must then save it on
the target machine (the P2K) to the location you want.

-Aaron

--- Paul Nagle <paul@...> wrote:

> Hey gang,
> 
> is there any reason I can't swap multi setups between models, such as
> the P2K and the P25K? I'm able to swap banks OK and was pretty sure
> I'd swapped multis in the past, but it ain't working today. Sysex id
is 0
> in both cases and the packet delay set to the same. It takes so much
> longer to do anything on the smaller P2K but it's much better sized
for
> gigging, hence my need.
> 
> Any help appreciated,
> 
> cheers
> 
> -- 
> Paul


       
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Aaron Eppolito wrote:
> Should work fine.  Remember that when you send a multi from one unit to
> another, it goes into the *current* settings.  You must then save it on
> the target machine (the P2K) to the location you want.
>   
Yeah, but alas the multi name doesn't change so it obviously ain't 
getting it. And I'm pretty sure I've done it before also. Banks went 
across fine so I must be missing something obvious. Will go scratch my 
head and furrow my brow for a bit :)

Cheers

-- 
Paul               
---
"Effectus super absolutionem"
http://www.JointIntelligenceCommittee.com  
http://www.myspace.com/jointintelligencecommittee

That's what I mean.  They don't go into a multisetup "slot" they just
overwrite the current settings.  The only thing you should notice is
that the presets (and other settings) change.  You then have to save
the current settings to a slot (giving it a name).

I do seem to remember putting the slot ID into the dump, but maybe you
have to send them *all* for that to work?  It's been a while...

-Aaron

--- Paul Nagle <paul@...> wrote:
> Yeah, but alas the multi name doesn't change so it obviously ain't 
> getting it. And I'm pretty sure I've done it before also. Banks went 
> across fine so I must be missing something obvious. Will go scratch
> my head and furrow my brow for a bit :)

> Aaron Eppolito wrote:
> > Should work fine.  Remember that when you send a multi from one
unit to
> > another, it goes into the *current* settings.  You must then save
it on
> > the target machine (the P2K) to the location you want.


       
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Aaron Eppolito wrote:
> That's what I mean.  They don't go into a multisetup "slot" they just
> overwrite the current settings.  The only thing you should notice is
> that the presets (and other settings) change.  You then have to save
> the current settings to a slot (giving it a name).
>   
But isn't the fact that the multi name doesn't change important? If the 
multi were truly being received I think the name would change.

> I do seem to remember putting the slot ID into the dump, but maybe you
> have to send them *all* for that to work?  It's been a while...
>   
I don't *think* there is any way to send all multis, bizarrely enough. I 
have 32 multis I want to transfer but the only option I can find is 
"dump current multi".

Funny old business, cheers for the suggestions :)

Paul


---
"Effectus super absolutionem"
http://www.JointIntelligenceCommittee.com  
http://www.myspace.com/jointintelligencecommittee

First off, the talk of v3 is very exciting. Keeps hope in my heart Aaron! I am using a px-7 with an amt-8 midi interface, ASR-X PRO, xv-5080, korg tr, and proteus 2000. I have two questions, 1st is, can you audition the preset on an external synth before sending the prog change message @ bar 0.00. I would like surf through presets on an external module quickly using the command station not the module. I can do this very easy with my asr-x pro, I wish it was the same. V3? Next is when I change presets on my xv-5080, the actual preset number is not the same. Eg: bank is fine but preset # would be 23 on roland but I need to enter 24 on the px-7 to match.  thanks.

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

jibarosoul@... wrote:
> First off, the talk of v3 is very exciting. Keeps hope in my heart Aaron! 
Hehe, raised my hopes too.
Number one hope would be for less tabbable fields on the P2K. Optionally 
remove the fields for the arpeggiator, volume, pan or at least place the 
track and patch selection fields directly next to each other which would 
*greatly* speed setting up a new multi.
Number two would be remove the need for bank select messages to switch 
multis; instead have a designated multi channel for multi changes.
Number three would be the ability to see which ROM slot and patch memory 
a multi pointed to even when the ROM is removed (not the name of the ROM 
but the location). And maybe have the machines less fussy about ROM 
names - in other words have the patches work, even if wrongly, rather 
than refuse to load.
Number four would be the ability to dump/restore ALL multis rather than 
just the current one.
Number five would be for the command stations' song and pattern modes 
never, ever, to load any patches they feel they need so that the multi 
is the one place that does this.

I bet other folks have different ones :)

We should start a paypal account called "go on then Aaron, there's a 
wonderful fellow". I'd put money where my mouth is. :)

-- 
Paul               
---
"Effectus super absolutionem"
http://www.JointIntelligenceCommittee.com  
http://www.myspace.com/jointintelligencecommittee

--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, Paul Nagle <paul@...> wrote:
>
> Aaron Eppolito wrote:
> > That's what I mean.  They don't go into a multisetup "slot" they 
just
> > overwrite the current settings.  The only thing you should 
notice is
> > that the presets (and other settings) change.  You then have to 
save
> > the current settings to a slot (giving it a name).
> >   
> But isn't the fact that the multi name doesn't change important? 
If the 
> multi were truly being received I think the name would change.

STEVE:
Using Sonar, I just successfully transferred XL-1 multis (977 byte 
multis) into my XL-2500 w/OS2.0 (1373 byte multis). To see if the 
transfer took place successfully, set the master/global menu display 
to MULTISETUP NAME. After the transfer, the new name should be 
there. 

BTW, I seem to recall that all ports are note created equal and I am 
wondering if that makes a difference.

> 
> > I do seem to remember putting the slot ID into the dump, but 
maybe you
> > have to send them *all* for that to work?  It's been a while...

STEVE: I took a quick look at the sysex manual and didn't see a slot 
ID for the multi listed. Could that have been in a portion of the 
dump listed as "reserved?"
  
> I don't *think* there is any way to send all multis, bizarrely 
enough. I 
> have 32 multis I want to transfer but the only option I can find 
is 
> "dump current multi".

STEVE: You can do this with the aid of sequencer software; not sure 
if you can embed remote control sysex in a pattern to automate the 
process using just 2 E-Mus. (It might be possible, though. If anyone 
wants to try, I'd encourage it and help.)

> 
> Funny old business, cheers for the suggestions :)
> 
> Paul

steve_the_composer wrote:
> STEVE:
> Using Sonar, I just successfully transferred XL-1 multis (977 byte 
> multis) into my XL-2500 w/OS2.0 (1373 byte multis). To see if the 
> transfer took place successfully, set the master/global menu display 
> to MULTISETUP NAME. After the transfer, the new name should be 
> there. 
>   


Paul: I'm also pretty sure I've transferred multis from my P2K to my 
P25K but doing it the other way round is currently eluding me.


> BTW, I seem to recall that all ports are note created equal and I am 
> wondering if that makes a difference.
>   

Paul: I'm using port A in both cases; discovered you needed port A for 
receipt of MIDI clock for the effects so kinda expected this was the 
"main" one.


>
> STEVE: You can do this with the aid of sequencer software; not sure 
> if you can embed remote control sysex in a pattern to automate the 
> process using just 2 E-Mus. (It might be possible, though. If anyone 
> wants to try, I'd encourage it and help.)
>   

Paul: this sounds encouraging. Unfortunately I don't use software 
sequencers, just hardware step sequencers. I do have MIDI-Ox though but 
I'm afraid my sysex hacking is no more advanced than being able to 
search for and change strings.

Many thanks for your thoughts, I'll keep trying. Ultimately I may just 
get both machines out of their racks, swap the ROMs around, make a paper 
note of all the patches in all the multis I need, then put the ROMs back 
and do it all by hand. It's my own fault for simply dumping each multi 
into MIDI-Ox and assuming they'd load back in afterwards just cos the 
banks did.

Cheers

-- 
Paul               
---
"Effectus super absolutionem"
http://www.JointIntelligenceCommittee.com  
http://www.myspace.com/jointintelligencecommittee

Did some more poking about, dunno if the following is useful to anyone 
(if not, please delete me)

I dumped the same multi from both synths.

The multi dump for the P2K is 977 bytes and is accepted by the P25K no 
probs.
The multi dump for the P25K is 1373 bytes and is ignored by the P2K.

Next I'm gonna see if there's an easily-identifiable chunk I can remove. 
The Command Stations allow you to set, for each multi, stuff like the 
handling of incoming MIDI, the display angle (!) and so on. I imagine 
this is the superfluous data.

All good fun for a wet Thursday... :)

-- 
Paul               
---
"Effectus super absolutionem"
http://www.JointIntelligenceCommittee.com  
http://www.myspace.com/jointintelligencecommittee

Those are the sizes I have, too. The P2k based dump definitions have 
info about the contents/size of the dumps. That's why the 12 
controller units can make use of 16 controller dumps--at least as 
far as presets go. Though I have done a side by side comparison of 
preset dumps from both, I have not done that for multis. If you 
haven't figured it out in a week, I should have some time to help 
out. (I assume you have the proteus family sysex guide. That should 
help.) 

--Steve
 
--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, Paul Nagle <paul@...> wrote:
>
> Did some more poking about, dunno if the following is useful to 
anyone 
> (if not, please delete me)
> 
> I dumped the same multi from both synths.
> 
> The multi dump for the P2K is 977 bytes and is accepted by the 
P25K no 
> probs.
> The multi dump for the P25K is 1373 bytes and is ignored by the 
P2K.
> 
> Next I'm gonna see if there's an easily-identifiable chunk I can 
remove. 
> The Command Stations allow you to set, for each multi, stuff like 
the 
> handling of incoming MIDI, the display angle (!) and so on. I 
imagine 

> this is the superfluous data.
> 
> All good fun for a wet Thursday... :)
> 
> -- 
> Paul               
> ---
> "Effectus super absolutionem"
> http://www.JointIntelligenceCommittee.com  
> http://www.myspace.com/jointintelligencecommittee
>

I'm sorry to butt in.. However, what is V3? Is that version 3 for the command stations or only for the PX-7 (I have the xl-7).. Also what does it offer, and where can I read about this version 3

Paul Nagle <paul@...> wrote:          jibarosoul@... wrote:
> First off, the talk of v3 is very exciting. Keeps hope in my heart Aaron! 
Hehe, raised my hopes too.
Number one hope would be for less tabbable fields on the P2K. Optionally 
remove the fields for the arpeggiator, volume, pan or at least place the 
track and patch selection fields directly next to each other which would 
*greatly* speed setting up a new multi.
Number two would be remove the need for bank select messages to switch 
multis; instead have a designated multi channel for multi changes.
Number three would be the ability to see which ROM slot and patch memory 
a multi pointed to even when the ROM is removed (not the name of the ROM 
but the location). And maybe have the machines less fussy about ROM 
names - in other words have the patches work, even if wrongly, rather 
than refuse to load.
Number four would be the ability to dump/restore ALL multis rather than 
just the current one.
Number five would be for the command stations' song and pattern modes 
never, ever, to load any patches they feel they need so that the multi 
is the one place that does this.

I bet other folks have different ones :)

We should start a paypal account called "go on then Aaron, there's a 
wonderful fellow". I'd put money where my mouth is. :)

-- 
Paul 
---
"Effectus super absolutionem"
http://www.JointIntelligenceCommittee.com 
http://www.myspace.com/jointintelligencecommittee



         


Music is a moral law, 
it gives wings to the mind, a soul to the universe 
flight to the imagination, a charm to sadness 
a life to everything, 
Plato, 400 B.C
       
---------------------------------
Need a vacation? Get great deals to amazing places on Yahoo! Travel. 

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

V3 is a hypothetical OS. So it doesn't exist yet..

 hopefully (if it ever comes) it will be for all the command station line..


On 15/06/07, Shane <lvrshn@...> wrote:
>
>   I'm sorry to butt in.. However, what is V3? Is that version 3 for the
> command stations or only for the PX-7 (I have the xl-7).. Also what does it
> offer, and where can I read about this version 3
>
>
> Paul Nagle <paul@...<paul%40softroom.freeserve.co.uk>>
> wrote: jibarosoul@... <jibarosoul%40aol.com> wrote:
> > First off, the talk of v3 is very exciting. Keeps hope in my heart
> Aaron!
> Hehe, raised my hopes too.
> Number one hope would be for less tabbable fields on the P2K. Optionally
> remove the fields for the arpeggiator, volume, pan or at least place the
> track and patch selection fields directly next to each other which would
> *greatly* speed setting up a new multi.
> Number two would be remove the need for bank select messages to switch
> multis; instead have a designated multi channel for multi changes.
> Number three would be the ability to see which ROM slot and patch memory
> a multi pointed to even when the ROM is removed (not the name of the ROM
> but the location). And maybe have the machines less fussy about ROM
> names - in other words have the patches work, even if wrongly, rather
> than refuse to load.
> Number four would be the ability to dump/restore ALL multis rather than
> just the current one.
> Number five would be for the command stations' song and pattern modes
> never, ever, to load any patches they feel they need so that the multi
> is the one place that does this.
>
> I bet other folks have different ones :)
>
> We should start a paypal account called "go on then Aaron, there's a
> wonderful fellow". I'd put money where my mouth is. :)
>
> --
> Paul
> ---
> "Effectus super absolutionem"
> http://www.JointIntelligenceCommittee.com
> http://www.myspace.com/jointintelligencecommittee
>
> Music is a moral law,
> it gives wings to the mind, a soul to the universe
> flight to the imagination, a charm to sadness
> a life to everything,
> Plato, 400 B.C
>
> ---------------------------------
> Need a vacation? Get great deals to amazing places on Yahoo! Travel.
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>  
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Did you ever do anything more with this after I posted the more 
complete listing? [See Files section.] Did you get the hypercard set 
working?

--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, "scodoha04" <scott.d.harvey@...> wrote:

>
>  2.2 is incomplete in regards to the command stations; specifically
> for the Remote Control Button Events and the Remote Control Rotary
> Events. Has anyone discovered or does anyone have a more complete
> listing for button events and rotary events for the command stations?
>  Can anyone verify that the given messages for the buttons and
> rotators are even valid?
>  I'm attempting to dig into the machine with an old hypercard set of
> midi commands and I'll surely post if I find out anything.
>