Emu XL-7 & MP-7 User's Group

The popularity of softsynths was probably a major factor in killing E-mu's hardware synth line.  It's a shame on many levels, but it's true, "obsolescence is key" if you collect physical gear.

There is not one softsynth that will ever be "collectible" (or even usable in a few years)

In my home studio, other gear may come and go, but I will always own at least ONE E-mu synth.  They will always be classic in my mind.  (and none of those Japanese synths can even touch the elegant design of the user interface, IMO)

My PX-7 with WORLD, VINTAGE, and POP ROMs is staying right where it is, permanently.  What a great, great little box!

--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, Andy Hutson <andylama@c...> wrote:
> The popularity of softsynths was probably a major factor in killing 
E-mu's hardware synth line.  It's a shame on many levels, but it's 
true, "obsolescence is key" if you collect physical gear.
> 
> There is not one softsynth that will ever be "collectible" (or even 
usable in a few years)
> 
> In my home studio, other gear may come and go, but I will always 
own at least ONE E-mu synth.  They will always be classic in my 
mind.  (and none of those Japanese synths can even touch the elegant 
design of the user interface, IMO)
> 
> My PX-7 with WORLD, VINTAGE, and POP ROMs is staying right where it 
is, permanently.  What a great, great little box!

I agree.  I think that since E-mu no longer supports any of it's 
legacy gear, they should at least license the production rights out 
to people who would be interested in continuing to manufacture roms, 
etc.  Not to mention making available the schematics of said legacy 
gear available for people interested in keeping it running, but they 
won't even do that.  Because of this, I will never buy any of their 
software gear.  I'd switch my loyalty to a company that is willing to 
continue to support legacy gear.  Unfortunately, I don't think such a 
company exists any longer.

On 1/19/05 3:09 PM, "An ONymous" <blisstree@...> wrote:

> I'd switch my loyalty to a company that is willing to continue to support
> legacy gear.  Unfortunately, I don't think such a company exists any longer.

Well, Wine Country does a good job supporting Sequential gear - that's kinda
what they do. But they're not making new stuff, at least nothing that I know
of...

As far as the actual "producing new gear" companies go, none of them really
support legacy gear very well. Why provide support for something that is no
longer generating revenue? On a simple business level, spending money just
to keep old customers happy with the idea that a few of them will appreciate
it enough to keep buying your stuff only goes so far before it is no longer
a cost benefit to continue supporting the product.

At least the "big 3" companies (Roland, Yamaha, and Korg) acknowledge the
fact that they made older gear. I remember owning a Kawai K5000S for a
while, and finding more than the minimal reference to it on Kawai's website
was extremely difficult. Technics won't acknowledge that the SX-WSA1 ever
existed. Granted the products were unsuccessful due to the poor marketing
efforts (and ludicrous pricing in Technics case) but the complete disowning
of the product makes me avoid that company.

--
Mibrilane

Hmmmmm.  This reminds me . . . . During the past year, I saw 
something in the copyright office website about provisions for 
software or computers were no longer being maufactured, or something 
like that.

Sorry I don't recall all the details. But it was a provision so that 
for either obsolete (non-manufactured/supported) hardware (or 
software; I forget which), it would not be a violation of copyright 
to break the code and make the gear/software usable.

This may or may not apply here.  As Seam has commented, Creative is 
preserving the samples in its roms (as they have a right to do) 
since they are marketing them in a different form--softsynths.

But, I suppose, now that the P2K line is legacy gear, >>perhaps<< it 
is now legal for others to do things with it.

Caveat: The above is 100% pure speculation--thinking-out-loud.  
Consult your attorney before doing anything that might land you in 
trouble.

--Steve

--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, "An ONymous" <blisstree@y...> wrote:
> 
> --- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, Andy Hutson <andylama@c...> wrote:
> > The popularity of softsynths was probably a major factor in 
killing 
> E-mu's hardware synth line.  It's a shame on many levels, but it's 
> true, "obsolescence is key" if you collect physical gear.
> > 
> > There is not one softsynth that will ever be "collectible" (or 
even 
> usable in a few years)
> > 
> > In my home studio, other gear may come and go, but I will always 
> own at least ONE E-mu synth.  They will always be classic in my 
> mind.  (and none of those Japanese synths can even touch the 
elegant 
> design of the user interface, IMO)
> > 
> > My PX-7 with WORLD, VINTAGE, and POP ROMs is staying right where 
it 
> is, permanently.  What a great, great little box!
> 
> I agree.  I think that since E-mu no longer supports any of it's 
> legacy gear, they should at least license the production rights 
out 
> to people who would be interested in continuing to manufacture 
roms, 
> etc.  Not to mention making available the schematics of said 
legacy 
> gear available for people interested in keeping it running, but 
they 
> won't even do that.  Because of this, I will never buy any of 
their 
> software gear.  I'd switch my loyalty to a company that is willing 
to 
> continue to support legacy gear.  Unfortunately, I don't think 
such a 
> company exists any longer.

Hi everybody, my question is simple. How to do one mid.file (with cubase sx 1 )who works with the download function of e-loader. Thanks

		
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What is the end goal Steve? What you describe sounds like OS stuff -
i.e. "...make the gear/software usable". The E-mu samples work fine -
whether they reside on a ROM chip or PC RAM.....and the Command
Station OS's work fine as well. Eloader works fine.


--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, "steve_the_composer" <smw-mail@p...> wrote:

> 
> Hmmmmm.  This reminds me . . . . During the past year, I saw 
> something in the copyright office website about provisions for 
> software or computers were no longer being maufactured, or something 
> like that.
> 
> Sorry I don't recall all the details. But it was a provision so that 
> for either obsolete (non-manufactured/supported) hardware (or 
> software; I forget which), it would not be a violation of copyright 
> to break the code and make the gear/software usable.
> 
> This may or may not apply here.  As Seam has commented, Creative is 
> preserving the samples in its roms (as they have a right to do) 
> since they are marketing them in a different form--softsynths.
> 
> But, I suppose, now that the P2K line is legacy gear, >>perhaps<< it 
> is now legal for others to do things with it.
> 
> Caveat: The above is 100% pure speculation--thinking-out-loud.  
> Consult your attorney before doing anything that might land you in 
> trouble.
> 
> --Steve
> 
> --- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, "An ONymous" <blisstree@y...> wrote:
> > 
> > --- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, Andy Hutson <andylama@c...> wrote:
> > > The popularity of softsynths was probably a major factor in 
> killing 
> > E-mu's hardware synth line.  It's a shame on many levels, but it's 
> > true, "obsolescence is key" if you collect physical gear.
> > > 
> > > There is not one softsynth that will ever be "collectible" (or 
> even 
> > usable in a few years)
> > > 
> > > In my home studio, other gear may come and go, but I will always 
> > own at least ONE E-mu synth.  They will always be classic in my 
> > mind.  (and none of those Japanese synths can even touch the 
> elegant 
> > design of the user interface, IMO)
> > > 
> > > My PX-7 with WORLD, VINTAGE, and POP ROMs is staying right where 
> it 
> > is, permanently.  What a great, great little box!
> > 
> > I agree.  I think that since E-mu no longer supports any of it's 
> > legacy gear, they should at least license the production rights 
> out 
> > to people who would be interested in continuing to manufacture 
> roms, 
> > etc.  Not to mention making available the schematics of said 
> legacy 
> > gear available for people interested in keeping it running, but 
> they 
> > won't even do that.  Because of this, I will never buy any of 
> their 
> > software gear.  I'd switch my loyalty to a company that is willing 
> to 
> > continue to support legacy gear.  Unfortunately, I don't think 
> such a 
> > company exists any longer.

On 1/20/05 8:02 AM, "vibesart" <edmann@...> wrote:

> Eloader works fine.

I personally would like to see E-Loader for Mac OS X - it is written in Java
so it shouldn't be that much of an ordeal to interface the MIDI part of it
with CoreMIDI. I haven't done programming since the mid-'80s, so I'm not
going to be the one doing it, but it'd be nice to see.

I'm not going to hold my breath on that one. Fortunately my Mac G4 runs Mac
OS 9.2.2...
--
Mibrilane

OS X suport was something I was hoping for as well.  Good thing I kept my iMac around 
with OS 9.  My Powerbook has "Classic" only- which doesn't work with E-Loader.  With the 
newer Powerbooks (and possibly all new machines now), Apple stopped supplying OS 9.2 
alongside OS X.

Too bad I know more about drinking Java than writing it :p

Mike 

--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, Mibrilane <mibrilane@c...> wrote:

> On 1/20/05 8:02 AM, "vibesart" <edmann@p...> wrote:
> 
> > Eloader works fine.
> 
> I personally would like to see E-Loader for Mac OS X - it is written in Java
> so it shouldn't be that much of an ordeal to interface the MIDI part of it
> with CoreMIDI. I haven't done programming since the mid-'80s, so I'm not
> going to be the one doing it, but it'd be nice to see.
> 
> I'm not going to hold my breath on that one. Fortunately my Mac G4 runs Mac
> OS 9.2.2...
> --
> Mibrilane

In a message dated 1/20/05 1:38:07 PM Eastern Standard Time,  
mibrilane@... writes:

I'm not  going to hold my breath on that one. Fortunately my Mac G4 runs Mac
OS  9.2.2...
--
Mibrilane



i know...but it's a pain in the ass to be running all new programs in  
panther 10.3 and then have to go into "classic mode".   no  thanks..
 
plastic


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> i know...but it's a pain in the ass to be running all new programs in  
> panther 10.3 and then have to go into "classic mode".   no  thanks..
>  

Plastic, it is clear that you are ready to move beyond "hardware". You
show all the symptoms. I think if XX hardware is not worth jumping
thru hoops to run...then you are done with XX hardware. In my case
(ex) - I maintain an OS9 machine that runs a Creamware Scope DSP Card
(will run in 9 only)...because the CW synths and FX sound so amazingly
great (= superior) that is is absolutely worth the effort. Also
integrated into the system is a SCSI card linked to an E4X thru
PEAK...and the XL7 w/Eloader, and an OS version of DP. All OS9 stuff -
great system , it all works well together. 

In OSX -  Another way that you might be able to BU your XL7 SEQs is to
play them in realtime into your SEQ app - recording all 16 channels,
with th XL7 clocked to the SEQ (or reverse)

constructively,

Ed

On 1/20/05 12:45 PM, "vibesart" <edmann@...> wrote:

> In OSX -  Another way that you might be able to BU your XL7 SEQs is to
> play them in realtime into your SEQ app - recording all 16 channels,
> with th XL7 clocked to the SEQ (or reverse)

Yes, this is the workaround I came up with as well, but E-Loader really is
convenient. Fortunately I also have a back-up G3/233 (Desktop) with the
original Apple MIDI Interface (whee!) which runs Mac OS 9.2.2 - runs ok but
I only keep ancient stuff on it - Retro AS-1, Rebirth, a really old version
of Logic Audio Platinum, DP 2.72, Unisyn 1.14, and or course E-Loader.
--
Mibrilane

$200.00 Eloader solution:

http://www.megamacs.com/v1/index.php?action=view&pid=2608901



--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, Mibrilane <mibrilane@c...> wrote:
> On 1/20/05 12:45 PM, "vibesart" <edmann@p...> wrote:
> 
> > In OSX -  Another way that you might be able to BU your XL7 SEQs is to
> > play them in realtime into your SEQ app - recording all 16 channels,
> > with th XL7 clocked to the SEQ (or reverse)
> 
> Yes, this is the workaround I came up with as well, but E-Loader
really is
> convenient. Fortunately I also have a back-up G3/233 (Desktop) with the
> original Apple MIDI Interface (whee!) which runs Mac OS 9.2.2 - runs
ok but
> I only keep ancient stuff on it - Retro AS-1, Rebirth, a really old
version

> of Logic Audio Platinum, DP 2.72, Unisyn 1.14, and or course E-Loader.
> --
> Mibrilane

Hmmmm. I was just throwing in my two cents on others' comments.  I 
had nothing specific in mind myself.  But now that I think about it, 
it would be nice if I could get the e-loader usb drivers to work 
with WIndows XP.

--Steve

--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, "vibesart" <edmann@p...> wrote:
> 
> What is the end goal Steve? What you describe sounds like OS 
stuff -
> i.e. "...make the gear/software usable". The E-mu samples work 
fine -
> whether they reside on a ROM chip or PC RAM.....and the Command
> Station OS's work fine as well. Eloader works fine.

export the cubase file as a midi sequence,
type 0. Then close cubase open up e-loader 
hit the bank browser then go to your bank and
number that you have been using with cubase
and right click and press download sequence to this
location. voila done.
You must have your midi in and out connected
to your computer and the command station to
do this.

Ian

--- Chaumet guillaume <guillaumechaumet@...>
wrote:

> Hi everybody, my question is simple. How to do one
> mid.file (with cubase sx 1 )who works with the
> download function of e-loader. Thanks
> 
> 		
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> I agree.  I think that since E-mu no longer supports any of it's 
> legacy gear, they should at least license the production rights out 
> to people who would be interested in continuing to manufacture roms, 
> etc.  Not to mention making available the schematics of said legacy 
> gear available for people interested in keeping it running, but they 
> won't even do that.  Because of this, I will never buy any of their 
> software gear.  I'd switch my loyalty to a company that is willing to 
> continue to support legacy gear.  Unfortunately, I don't think such a 
> company exists any longer.

I don't know man. They are a business. I have a PX-7, which I like
although I think my RM1x is a better sequencer. The sounds on the PX-7
though, uh--forgetaboutit!

I also own an Emu 1820m sound card. I like it a lot even though
sometimes it makes me feel stupid. Now, am I going to pay $250 (if I'm
lucky) for a used Vintage or World ROM? Or am I going to think about
paying $60 to get those for using with my 1820m? You know damn well I
am going to buy the software, even though ROMs are cooler. Emu has
made good moves and I predict they will be around for a while
precisely because they are flexible. Would you rather they stuck with
older stuff and went out of business?

--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, "_5ht" <_5ht@y...> wrote:
> 
> 
> > I agree.  I think that since E-mu no longer supports any of it's 
> > legacy gear, they should at least license the production rights 
out 
> > to people who would be interested in continuing to manufacture 
roms, 
> > etc.  Not to mention making available the schematics of said 
legacy 
> > gear available for people interested in keeping it running, but 
they 
> > won't even do that.  Because of this, I will never buy any of 
their 
> > software gear.  I'd switch my loyalty to a company that is 
willing to 
> > continue to support legacy gear.  Unfortunately, I don't think 
such a 
> > company exists any longer.

> 
> I don't know man. They are a business. I have a PX-7, which I like
> although I think my RM1x is a better sequencer. The sounds on the 
PX-7
> though, uh--forgetaboutit!
> 
> I also own an Emu 1820m sound card. I like it a lot even though
> sometimes it makes me feel stupid. Now, am I going to pay $250 (if 
I'm
> lucky) for a used Vintage or World ROM? Or am I going to think about
> paying $60 to get those for using with my 1820m? You know damn well 
I
> am going to buy the software, even though ROMs are cooler. Emu has
> made good moves and I predict they will be around for a while
> precisely because they are flexible. Would you rather they stuck 
with
> older stuff and went out of business?

My point is that I have been a long time E-mu supporter.  I own an 
E6400, a PK-7, and an XL-7.  I also own an Ensoniq SQ2.  I have 3 
extra roms for the pk-7, as well as about half the emu sample library 
on cd.  I have spent literally thousands of dollars buying gear from 
emu.  Now I get absolutely no support for my loyalty.  If I owned a 
Model T Ford, I can still find after market parts to keep it 
running.  If I bought a 1950s fender amp, I can still get after 
market parts to keep it repaired.  I have nothing if my e-mu gear 
dies.  No upgrade options, see what I'm saying?  For thousands of 
dollars and years of customer loyalty, I have nothing from E-mu.  At 
least with my ensoniq, I can still get parts, etc through syntaur, 
et. al.  but with E-mu, no support.  They refuse to sell their 
support documentation (repair manuals, schematics).  That being so, 
they should give up their patents so other people could manufacture 
and sell parts/upgrades/roms, etc, or at least license said patents 
out, but I was told by an E-mu rep that that just isn't going to 
happen.  I love their gear, but their customer support isn't worth 
jack all.

> My point is that I have been a long time E-mu supporter.  I own an 
> E6400, a PK-7, and an XL-7.  I also own an Ensoniq SQ2.  I have 3 
> extra roms for the pk-7, as well as about half the emu sample library 
> on cd.  I have spent literally thousands of dollars buying gear from 
> emu.  Now I get absolutely no support for my loyalty.  If I owned a 
> Model T Ford, I can still find after market parts to keep it 
> running.  If I bought a 1950s fender amp, I can still get after 
> market parts to keep it repaired.  I have nothing if my e-mu gear 
> dies.  No upgrade options, see what I'm saying?  For thousands of 
> dollars and years of customer loyalty, I have nothing from E-mu.  At 
> least with my ensoniq, I can still get parts, etc through syntaur, 
> et. al.  but with E-mu, no support.  They refuse to sell their 
> support documentation (repair manuals, schematics).  That being so, 
> they should give up their patents so other people could manufacture 
> and sell parts/upgrades/roms, etc, or at least license said patents 
> out....

This is not a realistic point of view if you choose to be an owner of
digital hardware. Another way to look at it might be that each and
every one of your E-mu purchases has provided you with great sounds
and lots of functionality...and now all of those sounds are available
in a form (PC) that transcends traditional hardware by about 50% and
is priced very reasonably - this would be the longterm upgrade-path
option. 

On the other hand - your xl7 etc still may be an unmatchable choice
for quick and dirty live work. They sound great - right? To my
knowledge, all parts are available. I just bought some. There should
be no reason that you cannot maintain and continue to use your E-mu
hardware. Everything is available used/cannibalized too on ebay etc -
there are loads of these boxes around.

I just called Emu and they gave me the name of their "authorized 
support agent" for their discountinued hardware.  It is:

   EPR
   813-232-3907

Apparently this EPR company will do repair work on your Emu hardware 
if you require it.  You won't be able to get new ROMs or any other 
add-on, but you can get the thing serviced.

D7


> My point is that I have been a long time E-mu supporter.  I own an 
> E6400, a PK-7, and an XL-7.  I also own an Ensoniq SQ2.  I have 3 
> extra roms for the pk-7, as well as about half the emu sample 
library 
> on cd.  I have spent literally thousands of dollars buying gear 
from 
> emu.  Now I get absolutely no support for my loyalty.  If I owned 
a 
> Model T Ford, I can still find after market parts to keep it 
> running.  If I bought a 1950s fender amp, I can still get after 
> market parts to keep it repaired.  I have nothing if my e-mu gear 
> dies.  No upgrade options, see what I'm saying?  For thousands of 
> dollars and years of customer loyalty, I have nothing from E-mu.  
At 
> least with my ensoniq, I can still get parts, etc through syntaur, 
> et. al.  but with E-mu, no support.  They refuse to sell their 
> support documentation (repair manuals, schematics).  That being 
so, 
> they should give up their patents so other people could 
manufacture 
> and sell parts/upgrades/roms, etc, or at least license said 
patents 

> out, but I was told by an E-mu rep that that just isn't going to 
> happen.  I love their gear, but their customer support isn't worth 
> jack all.

that's good to know.  thanks.  


--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, "dumeril7" <dumeril7@y...> wrote:
> 
> I just called Emu and they gave me the name of their "authorized 
> support agent" for their discountinued hardware.  It is:
> 
>    EPR
>    813-232-3907
> 
> Apparently this EPR company will do repair work on your Emu 
hardware 
> if you require it.  You won't be able to get new ROMs or any other 
> add-on, but you can get the thing serviced.
> 
> D7
> 
> 
> > My point is that I have been a long time E-mu supporter.  I own 
an 
> > E6400, a PK-7, and an XL-7.  I also own an Ensoniq SQ2.  I have 3 
> > extra roms for the pk-7, as well as about half the emu sample 
> library 
> > on cd.  I have spent literally thousands of dollars buying gear 
> from 
> > emu.  Now I get absolutely no support for my loyalty.  If I owned 
> a 
> > Model T Ford, I can still find after market parts to keep it 
> > running.  If I bought a 1950s fender amp, I can still get after 
> > market parts to keep it repaired.  I have nothing if my e-mu gear 
> > dies.  No upgrade options, see what I'm saying?  For thousands of 
> > dollars and years of customer loyalty, I have nothing from E-mu.  
> At 
> > least with my ensoniq, I can still get parts, etc through 
syntaur, 
> > et. al.  but with E-mu, no support.  They refuse to sell their 
> > support documentation (repair manuals, schematics).  That being 
> so, 
> > they should give up their patents so other people could 
> manufacture 
> > and sell parts/upgrades/roms, etc, or at least license said 
> patents 
> > out, but I was told by an E-mu rep that that just isn't going to 
> > happen.  I love their gear, but their customer support isn't 
worth 
> > jack all.