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2005-01-14 by charlsalash
I've been testing mis eboni black with BO on EEM (epson 2200). Prints are cooler with mis ink but the dmax is also noticeably lower. Overall I find the print made with Eboni black less pleasing. You can (apparently) raise the Dmax by adding somme contrast to the print, but then I find the tonal range less pleasing. Anybody else noticed? Jerome.
2005-01-14 by Paul Roark
It appears that the dot size and/or some other factors are affecting the relative performance of Eboni v. UC MK. On the older (even 1280, I believe) printers the MK dmax advantage was minor and the coolness of Eboni made it look darker and more pleasing. At the 4000 level, the dmax difference has become more noticeable. The same thing was happening with respect to the PK. That is one reason I decided to experiment with different PK mixes. Unfortunately, the same tricks will not work with Eboni. Paul www.PaulRoark.com
-----Original Message----- From: charlsalash [mailto:gureghianj@...] Sent: Friday, January 14, 2005 6:52 AM To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Digital BW] Mis eboni ink dmax I've been testing mis eboni black with BO on EEM (epson 2200). Prints are cooler with mis ink but the dmax is also noticeably lower. Overall I find the print made with Eboni black less pleasing. You can (apparently) raise the Dmax by adding somme contrast to the print, but then I find the tonal range less pleasing. Anybody else noticed? Jerome. Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as they are often being updated. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same page. Please follow these basic guidelines: - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep them short. - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the membership without notice. - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from the membership. - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner and Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines" in the Files section: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/ BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE "OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE "OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP. Yahoo! Groups Links
2005-01-14 by Tony Bonanno
Hi Paul, Then someone who is contemplating using BO printing with the Epson PRO 4000 would probably do well to just stay with the UC matte black instead of replacing it with the Eboni Black ?? I do remember when I had my 2200, the Eboni gave me better results and I used it for all my B&W printing. But maybe not the case with the 4000 ?? Thanks, Tony Bonanno --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Roark" <paul.roark@v...> wrote: > At the 4000 level, the dmax difference has > become more noticeable. The same thing was happening with respect to the > PK. That is one reason I decided to experiment with different PK mixes. > Unfortunately, the same tricks will not work with Eboni. > > Paul > www.PaulRoark.com > > > -----Original Message----- > From: charlsalash [mailto:gureghianj@n...] > Sent: Friday, January 14, 2005 6:52 AM > To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [Digital BW] Mis eboni ink dmax > > > > > > I've been testing mis eboni black with BO on EEM (epson 2200). > Prints are cooler with mis ink but the dmax is also noticeably lower. > Overall I find the print made with Eboni black less pleasing. > You can (apparently) raise the Dmax by adding somme contrast to the > print, but then I find the tonal range less pleasing. > > > Anybody else noticed? > > Jerome. > > > > > > > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as > they are often being updated. > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint > > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to > unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same > page. > > Please follow these basic guidelines: > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep > them short. > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames. > Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the > membership without notice. > - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W > printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from > the membership. > - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and > guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner and > Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines" in the Files section: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/ > > BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT > YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE "OWNER" AND > "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU > FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY > DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, > GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE "OWNER" AND > "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE > POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY > TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR > ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY > THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER
> MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP. > > Yahoo! Groups Links
2005-01-14 by Paul Roark
>Then someone who is contemplating using BO printing with the Epson >PRO 4000 would probably do well to just stay with the UC matte black >instead of replacing it with the Eboni Black ?? I would use the Eboni in BO due to its more neutral color. The UC MK I would consider seriously only for the very darkest areas where the color is masked. I would definitely use MIS PKN3 for BO glossies. (Do not call MIS about this yet. It's not yet on the web site.) >... when I had my 2200, the Eboni gave me better results >and I used it for all my B&W printing. >But maybe not the case with the 4000 ?? For BO, I think it probably still will be the case -- Eboni for BO, MK for best dmax where color doesn't matter much. Paul www.PaulRoark.com __________________________________ --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Roark" <paul.roark@v...> wrote: > At the 4000 level, the dmax difference has > become more noticeable. The same thing was happening with respect to the > PK. That is one reason I decided to experiment with different PK mixes. > Unfortunately, the same tricks will not work with Eboni. > > Paul > www.PaulRoark.com > > > -----Original Message----- > From: charlsalash [mailto:gureghianj@n...] > Sent: Friday, January 14, 2005 6:52 AM > To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [Digital BW] Mis eboni ink dmax > > > > > > I've been testing mis eboni black with BO on EEM (epson 2200). > Prints are cooler with mis ink but the dmax is also noticeably lower. > Overall I find the print made with Eboni black less pleasing. > You can (apparently) raise the Dmax by adding somme contrast to the > print, but then I find the tonal range less pleasing. > > > Anybody else noticed? > > Jerome. > > > > > > > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as > they are often being updated. > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint > > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to > unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same > page. > > Please follow these basic guidelines: > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep > them short. > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames. > Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the > membership without notice. > - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W > printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from > the membership. > - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and > guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner and > Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines" in the Files section: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/ > > BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT > YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE "OWNER" AND > "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU > FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY > DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, > GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE "OWNER" AND > "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE > POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY > TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR > ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY > THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER > MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP. > > Yahoo! Groups Links Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as they are often being updated. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same page. Please follow these basic guidelines: - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep them short. - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the membership without notice. - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from the membership. - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner and Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines" in the Files section: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/ BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE "OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE "OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP. Yahoo! Groups Links
2005-01-14 by charlsalash
> For BO, I think it probably still will be the case -- Eboni for BO,
MK for
> best dmax where color doesn't matter much.
Paul, when you say "MK for best dmax", you mean the cartridge
T0348.MK (for 2200)?
I'm using the T0348k on EEM.
Thanks.
Jerome.2005-01-14 by Tony Bonanno
Thanks Paul, that clears it up.... Eboni for BO. Tony --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Roark" <paul.roark@v...> wrote: > >Then someone who is contemplating using BO printing with the Epson > >PRO 4000 would probably do well to just stay with the UC matte black > >instead of replacing it with the Eboni Black ?? > > I would use the Eboni in BO due to its more neutral color. The UC MK I > would consider seriously only for the very darkest areas where the color is > masked. > > I would definitely use MIS PKN3 for BO glossies. (Do not call MIS about > this yet. It's not yet on the web site.) > > >... when I had my 2200, the Eboni gave me better results > >and I used it for all my B&W printing. > >But maybe not the case with the 4000 ?? > > For BO, I think it probably still will be the case -- Eboni for BO, MK for > best dmax where color doesn't matter much. > > Paul > www.PaulRoark.com > > __________________________________ > > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Roark" > <paul.roark@v...> wrote: > > At the 4000 level, the dmax difference has > > become more noticeable. The same thing was happening with respect > to the > > PK. That is one reason I decided to experiment with different PK > mixes. > > Unfortunately, the same tricks will not work with Eboni. > > > > Paul > > www.PaulRoark.com > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: charlsalash [mailto:gureghianj@n...] > > Sent: Friday, January 14, 2005 6:52 AM > > To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [Digital BW] Mis eboni ink dmax > > > > > > > > > > > > I've been testing mis eboni black with BO on EEM (epson 2200). > > Prints are cooler with mis ink but the dmax is also noticeably > lower. > > Overall I find the print made with Eboni black less pleasing. > > You can (apparently) raise the Dmax by adding somme contrast to > the > > print, but then I find the tonal range less pleasing. > > > > > > Anybody else noticed? > > > > Jerome. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other > resources as > > they are often being updated. > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint > > > > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you > wish to > > unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting > this same > > page. > > > > Please follow these basic guidelines: > > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages > to keep > > them short. > > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or > flames. > > Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the > > membership without notice. > > - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of > digital B&W > > printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be > removed from > > the membership. > > - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules > and > > guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group > Owner and > > Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines" in the Files > section: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/ > > > > BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE > PRINT > > YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE "OWNER" > AND > > "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE > LIABLE TO YOU > > FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR > EXEMPLARY > > DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, > > GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF > THE "OWNER" AND > > "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN > ADVISED OF THE > > POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE > INABILITY > > TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED > ACCESS TO OR > > ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR > CONDUCT OF ANY > > THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY > OTHER > > MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP. > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as > they are often being updated. > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint > > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to > unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same > page. > > Please follow these basic guidelines: > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep > them short. > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames. > Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the > membership without notice. > - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W > printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from > the membership. > - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and > guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner and > Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines" in the Files section: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/ > > BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT > YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE "OWNER" AND > "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU > FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY > DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, > GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE "OWNER" AND > "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE > POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY > TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR > ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY > THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER
> MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP. > > Yahoo! Groups Links
2005-01-15 by Richard Sintchak
I use MIS eboni for BO only on my 2200. I find that with EEM the dmax is not all that great but with HPR or some of the Hawk Mtn papers recommended by Clayton Jones (and on some stash of Eclispe Satine I still have) I get very nice, rich blacks. I use EEM for proofing as the tonal range and such is usually pretty similar in general and then print on one of the other papers for the final print. The UC mk is simply too chocolately warm used for BO printing, IMHO. Richard
> > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: charlsalash [mailto:gureghianj@n...] > > > Sent: Friday, January 14, 2005 6:52 AM > > > To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: [Digital BW] Mis eboni ink dmax > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I've been testing mis eboni black with BO on EEM (epson 2200). > > > Prints are cooler with mis ink but the dmax is also > noticeably > > lower. > > > Overall I find the print made with Eboni black less pleasing. > > > You can (apparently) raise the Dmax by adding somme contrast > to > > the > > > print, but then I find the tonal range less pleasing. > > > > > > > > > Anybody else noticed? > > > > > > Jerome. > > >