Emu XL-7 & MP-7 User's Group

Greetings Experts!

Weird thing today! - Xl7 began randomly sending out voice triggers,
ocaasional hits, then short busts of clusters and then ramping up to
all notes all the time in chaos

I disconnected built-in keypad multipin but the problem remains! =
this is not coming from the keypads

in Controllers Menu I turn Local Control OFF, and all is fine

condition at this time: 

Controllers Menu > turn Local Control ON = chaos
Controllers Menu > turn Local Control OFF - OK

no local controls at all, however I must have access to the CH Volumes
during Live Performance

of course I have a gig tomorrow, so if anyone knows of this syndrome
and can offer any guidance or input, I appreciate it very much! 

Thanks in advance

Ed

On Aug 2, 2006, at 1:54 PM, gongworks wrote:

> Greetings Experts!
>
> Weird thing today! - Xl7 began randomly sending out voice triggers,
> ocaasional hits, then short busts of clusters and then ramping up to
> all notes all the time in chaos
>
> I disconnected built-in keypad multipin but the problem remains! =
> this is not coming from the keypads
>
> in Controllers Menu I turn Local Control OFF, and all is fine
>
> condition at this time:
>
> Controllers Menu > turn Local Control ON = chaos
> Controllers Menu > turn Local Control OFF - OK
>
> no local controls at all, however I must have access to the CH Volumes
> during Live Performance
>
> of course I have a gig tomorrow, so if anyone knows of this syndrome
> and can offer any guidance or input, I appreciate it very much!
>
> Thanks in advance
>
> Ed

I'd back up your patch & sequence data and then to a reset of the  
machine. If it's software related, all efforts tinkering with the  
hardware (which I consider somewhat dangerous) will be for naught.  
Reset the machine first and see if it is still happening. If not,  
load your data back in and you're in business. If it is, load your  
data back in and find a way to route the control info being sent out  
on MIDI back into the XL.

Sorry if my "solution" lacks nuance, but I believe in getting things  
done. ;D
---
Mibrilane





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, Mibrilane <mibrilane@...> wrote:
>
> 
> On Aug 2, 2006, at 1:54 PM, gongworks wrote:
> 
> > Greetings Experts!
> >
> > Weird thing today! - Xl7 began randomly sending out voice 
> > triggers...

> I'd back up your patch & sequence data and then to a reset of the  
> machine. If it's software related, all efforts tinkering with the  
> hardware (which I consider somewhat dangerous) will be for naught.  
> Reset the machine first and see if it is still happening. If not,  
> load your data back in and you're in business. If it is, load your  
> data back in and find a way to route the control info being sent out  
> on MIDI back into the XL.
> 
> ---
> Mibrilane
> 

Thanks Mibrilane this sounds encouraging. I see nothing on Resetting
the machine in the manual - is this an Eloader function? 

> 
> 
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

On Aug 2, 2006, at 2:44 PM, gongworks wrote:

> Thanks Mibrilane this sounds encouraging. I see nothing on Resetting
> the machine in the manual - is this an Eloader function?

No - hold down both cursor keys at boot - this gets you into  
"diagnostics mode" - it is one of the last options.

Be sure to back up all of your user data first. Aaron scolded me once  
for advising a reset without including this caveat.

---
Mibrilane





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, Mibrilane <mibrilane@...> wrote:

> hold down both cursor keys at boot - this gets you into  
> "diagnostics mode" - it is one of the last options.
> 
> Be sure to back up all of your user data first. Aaron scolded me once  
> for advising a reset without including this caveat.
> 
> ---

Thanks Mibrilane - doing a search in this group for E-loader (since I
cannot get the 2 to talk) - I noticed that you had advice for someone
else using eloader in Mac OS9 w/OMS - that's me too. They usually work
fine and speak to each other - not today. I am sure I will find it...
but not by using logic at this point, and if you have any suggestions
I appreciate it too. Simple thing - Mac OS9.2.2, OMS  Eloader 1.1 -
Command Station..need something to jar Eloader into seeing XL7...thanks

Ed

I'm never gonna live that one down, am I...  =)

The symptom you're describing sounds very much like a MIDI loop, but you've said you've disconnected all MIDI cables, so that shouldn't be it.

Before doing a master reset, I'd suggest loading the factory multisetup (63) since short of preset and sequence data, it does pretty much the same thing.

-Aaron

Mibrilane <mibrilane@...> wrote: Be sure to back up all of your user data first. Aaron scolded me once  
for advising a reset without including this caveat.

 		
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Thanks Aaron

Restoring Factory Multi-setup (63) does not resolve the problem. If I
do a Master Reset am I assured of losing all Seq and User preset data?
(sorry for the dumb ?s, just to confirm before doing anything at all).

Have you ever known of another situation like this?

thanks very much

Ed

--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, Aaron Eppolito <synthesis77@...> wrote:

> The symptom you're describing sounds very much like a MIDI loop, but
you've said you've disconnected all MIDI cables, so that shouldn't be it.
> 
> Before doing a master reset, I'd suggest loading the factory
multisetup (63) since short of preset and sequence data, it does
pretty much the same thing.
> 
> -Aaron

new info: this chatter is happening on XL7 Voice 1 only

thanks!

Ed

--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, Aaron Eppolito <synthesis77@...> wrote:

> The symptom you're describing sounds very much like a MIDI loop, but
you've said you've disconnected all MIDI cables, so that shouldn't be it.

Tried reconnecting Keypads, in that situation it is whatever XL7
TRK/PRESET voice is selected that goes beserk, Disconnected Keypads -
it is MIDI CH 01 only that is berserk. Turning off MIDI CH 1 stops the
problem. Local Control OFF stops problem.

With this detail, does anyone think think this could still be a
software thing Resolved with Reset the Machine?

thanks again

Ed

--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, "gongworks" <gongworks@...> wrote:
>
> new info: this chatter is happening on XL7 Voice 1 only
> 
> thanks!
> 
> Ed
> 
> --- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, Aaron Eppolito <synthesis77@> wrote:
> 
> > The symptom you're describing sounds very much like a MIDI loop, but
> you've said you've disconnected all MIDI cables, so that shouldn't
be it.
>

Weird.  If you connect a MIDI out to a computer or something, is it
spewing MIDI too?

From what I can tell, it seems that the front panel board is spuriously
generating MIDI messages.  Try turning off rechannelize MIDI and see
what happens.  If you turn on keypads transmit MIDI and turn off local
control, you should coerce the unit to send whatever MIDI it would have
sent to the synth/sequencer to the MIDI out instead.  Then you could
use MIDI-Ox or SendSYSEX on a PC or MIDISpy on a Mac to see what actual
data is flooding.

I'm not sure what it'll tell you, but all signs seem to point to a bad
front panel board.

-Aaron

PS. if you do get a MIDI dump, you can mail it to me off list, though I
might not be able to help.

--- gongworks <gongworks@...> wrote:

> Tried reconnecting Keypads, in that situation it is whatever XL7
> TRK/PRESET voice is selected that goes beserk, Disconnected Keypads -
> it is MIDI CH 01 only that is berserk. Turning off MIDI CH 1 stops
> the
> problem. Local Control OFF stops problem.
> 
> With this detail, does anyone think think this could still be a
> software thing Resolved with Reset the Machine?
> 
> thanks again
> 
> Ed
> 
> --- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, "gongworks" <gongworks@...> wrote:
> >
> > new info: this chatter is happening on XL7 Voice 1 only
> > 
> > thanks!
> > 
> > Ed
> > 
> > --- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, Aaron Eppolito <synthesis77@> wrote:
> > 
> > > The symptom you're describing sounds very much like a MIDI loop,
> but
> > you've said you've disconnected all MIDI cables, so that shouldn't
> be it.
> >
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 


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Some diagnostic questions. (I am assuming you have no midi cables 
going out of XL-7 or going into XL-7.)

1. Do the midi in/midi out leds flash when the problem is happening? 
Do the flashes coincide with the random notes?
1a. If midi out led is on constantly, set TRANSMIT MIDI CLOCK to off.
If midi out led flashes along with random notes, either monitor or 
record and examine (external software or internal sequencer). 

2a. What is the KEYBOARD CHANNEL set to? Does changing this change 
anything (such as the channel with the random notes)?
2b. Are you in Quick-edit mode? If so, try the other modes. Does 
this affect the problem?

3. This is a long shot, but try setting all PROGRAMABLE KNOBS to 
ext. Does this affect the problem?

4. Another long shot: What is TRIGGER BUTTONS FUNCTION set to? If it 
is set to Play Note Events, try changing it to Slect Patterns. Does 
this affect the problem?

BTW, what OS does you XL-7 have?

Hope this helps.

--Steve

Hi all

I own a PX-7. A few niggles aside, so far quite pleased with the unit, 
though I am currently having trouble with track/channel assignments. 
Basically when I edit the 'Channel Assign' for a track in the pattern 
menu, the new settings are not saved when I save the pattern itself. Is 
this normal?

thanks
Paul Meehan

Got it! There must be some data on the track for the channel assign 
setting to be stored. Not very useful if you just want to use a track 
for rechannelizing to an external keyboard with 'local' off.

Paul
Paul Muon wrote:

> Hi all
>
> I own a PX-7. A few niggles aside, so far quite pleased with the unit,
> though I am currently having trouble with track/channel assignments.
> Basically when I edit the 'Channel Assign' for a track in the pattern
> menu, the new settings are not saved when I save the pattern itself. Is
> this normal?
>
> thanks
> Paul Meehan
>
>  




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

You need to have data on a track for it to save that track's settings. 
For easy templates, go to step edit mode and put a dummy event (like a
Mod Wheel 0) on each track you want it to save.  To do this, hit the
record button thrice, then twiddle knob 13/M to something and back to
zero, repeating the twiddle for each track (selected via the buttons
next to the LCD).

It does this so you can be playing other stuff on a channel that the
sequencer's not using and not have it always change the preset out from
under you.

-Aaron

--- Paul Muon <paulmuon@...> wrote:

> Hi all
> 
> I own a PX-7. A few niggles aside, so far quite pleased with the
> unit, 
> though I am currently having trouble with track/channel assignments. 
> Basically when I edit the 'Channel Assign' for a track in the pattern
> 
> menu, the new settings are not saved when I save the pattern itself.
> Is 
> this normal?
> 
> thanks
> Paul Meehan
> 
> 
>  
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 


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Thanks Aaron I will check into thises procedures and email you offlist
if I can do a MIDI dump, or post here if not. One of the things that I
did discover is that it is only 1 chnnel t a time- whicever one is
slected int he TR.CHANNEL up.Down buttons - that is the one that will
go berserk. For ex. w/Ch1 selected, MIDO Ch 1 disabled. Local control
ON- the knobs can still be used and no chtter is happening.

sqeaked thru gig last lite using a launchpad with XL7 Local Control OFF.

more soon and thanks again!

Ed

--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, Aaron Eppolito <synthesis77@...> wrote:

>
> Weird.  If you connect a MIDI out to a computer or something, is it
> spewing MIDI too?
> 
> From what I can tell, it seems that the front panel board is spuriously
> generating MIDI messages.  Try turning off rechannelize MIDI and see
> what happens.  If you turn on keypads transmit MIDI and turn off local
> control, you should coerce the unit to send whatever MIDI it would have
> sent to the synth/sequencer to the MIDI out instead.  Then you could
> use MIDI-Ox or SendSYSEX on a PC or MIDISpy on a Mac to see what actual
> data is flooding.
> 
> I'm not sure what it'll tell you, but all signs seem to point to a bad
> front panel board.
> 
> -Aaron
> 
> PS. if you do get a MIDI dump, you can mail it to me off list, though I
> might not be able to help.
> 
> --- gongworks <gongworks@...> wrote:
> 
> > Tried reconnecting Keypads, in that situation it is whatever XL7
> > TRK/PRESET voice is selected that goes beserk, Disconnected Keypads -
> > it is MIDI CH 01 only that is berserk. Turning off MIDI CH 1 stops
> > the
> > problem. Local Control OFF stops problem.
> > 
> > With this detail, does anyone think think this could still be a
> > software thing Resolved with Reset the Machine?
> > 
> > thanks again
> > 
> > Ed
> > 
> > --- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, "gongworks" <gongworks@> wrote:
> > >
> > > new info: this chatter is happening on XL7 Voice 1 only
> > > 
> > > thanks!
> > > 
> > > Ed
> > > 
> > > --- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, Aaron Eppolito <synthesis77@> wrote:
> > > 
> > > > The symptom you're describing sounds very much like a MIDI loop,
> > but
> > > you've said you've disconnected all MIDI cables, so that shouldn't
> > be it.
> > >
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >  
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >  
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> 
> 
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>

Hi Steve - thanks - as below:

--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, "steve_the_composer" <smw-mail@...> wrote:
>
> Some diagnostic questions. (I am assuming you have no midi cables 
> going out of XL-7 or going into XL-7.)

correct altho unit behaves the same regardless

> 
> 1. Do the midi in/midi out leds flash when the problem is happening?

* Yes
 
> Do the flashes coincide with the random notes?

* Yes

> 1a. If midi out led is on constantly, set TRANSMIT MIDI CLOCK to off.

* I did that

> If midi out led flashes along with random notes, either monitor or 
> record and examine (external software or internal sequencer). 

*I will do that! thanks

> 2a. What is the KEYBOARD CHANNEL set to? Does changing this change 
> anything (such as the channel with the random notes)?

* whatever CH is selected is the one that is berserk. Not selected,
that same CH behaves AOK.

> 2b. Are you in Quick-edit mode? If so, try the other modes. Does 
> this affect the problem?

* Remains the same in all 4 modes

> 
> 3. This is a long shot, but try setting all PROGRAMABLE KNOBS to 
> ext. Does this affect the problem?

* this sounds good- I will try this!

> 
> 4. Another long shot: What is TRIGGER BUTTONS FUNCTION set to? If it 
> is set to Play Note Events, try changing it to Slect Patterns. Does 
> this affect the problem?

* will try this one too - thanks.
> 
> BTW, what OS does you XL-7 have?

* 2.XX (?) the latest software as far as I know - unit is still packed
from gig last noite but I will get it out and 
> 

Thanks Steve!

Ed

Glad to hear you found a work around for your gig.

Here's another diagnotic suggestion. But first some background.

I. Remote Control 
Through sysex, you can turn on and off remote control mode. When its 
on you can simulate button presses and knob twists via remote 
control. Also, the E-Mu transmits button presses and knob twists. 
This might be useful in diagnosing your problem.

II. My volume knob
When I started using remote control, I discovered a minor problem 
with my P2500 volume control knob: In certain positions(mainly from 
50% to 100% volume), the knob fluctuates when not being moved. That 
is, it constantly sends out volume change messages randomly 
(generally within a 3-4 point range).

III. Here's how it might help you to diagnose what's going on. 
The theory here is that maybe there are problems with the pads or 
buttons themselves that are causing the note triggers (kinda like my 
volume knob). Looking at the sysex messages generated when the unit 
is in remote control mode should tell you which (if any) virtual 
pads/buttons/knobs are firing.

If this sounds like something you want to try, search the messages 
here for "remote control". That will turn up several posts on the 
subject--including some that give you the sysex command to send.

Using software that will display the sysex midi flow, monitor the 
midi flow coming from the E-Mu. If you cut and paste the sysex-turned-
to-text into a text file, someone can look at it and tell you which 
(if any) virtual pads/buttons/knobs are firing.

--Steve