Emu XL-7 & MP-7 User's Group

I'm having extreme difficulty with the SPDIF output on my MP7. It 
would seem that the digital signal is very weak coming out of the 
box. At first I thought it may have been a cable quality issue, but 
after purchasing a very high quality cable, the problem continued. 
I'm getting a lot of crackles in the signal. I have two soundcards 
with SPDIF input which i've been attempting to use, a Waveterminal 
192L and an Audiophile USB. I've had difficulty with both, although 
the Waveterminal seems slightly more tolerant. I notice that if i 
press my finger on the metal section of the digital jack while 
plugged into the MP7 the charge from my body boosts the signal so it 
is crystal clear... Is there any other way i can boost the power of 
the signal using the MP7 itself or a third party device?

Is there any way to set the clock source on either of your soundcards? I get
lots of crackles when my MP-7 is plugged into my E-MU Ultra sampler but I
don't have the clock source set to the SPDIF input. Setting the clock source
to SPDIF gets rid of the crackles.

Regards,

Stu

-----Original Message-----
From: diveintomercury [mailto:diveintomercury@...]
Sent: 27 September 2003 02:06
To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [xl7] Weak SPDIF signal


I'm having extreme difficulty with the SPDIF output on my MP7. It
would seem that the digital signal is very weak coming out of the
box. At first I thought it may have been a cable quality issue, but
after purchasing a very high quality cable, the problem continued.
I'm getting a lot of crackles in the signal. I have two soundcards
with SPDIF input which i've been attempting to use, a Waveterminal
192L and an Audiophile USB. I've had difficulty with both, although
the Waveterminal seems slightly more tolerant. I notice that if i
press my finger on the metal section of the digital jack while
plugged into the MP7 the charge from my body boosts the signal so it
is crystal clear... Is there any other way i can boost the power of
the signal using the MP7 itself or a third party device?



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I had the same problem with low levels. 
I was told that Emu did this on purpose to avoid "overloading" the 
SPDIF inputs on the recieving end, or other such nonsence.
One of the main selling points for me was the SPDIF output. 
I wanted to free up an analog input pair to my soundcard. 
However, the output is so quiet, I couldn't hear it in relation to 
my other gear. 
Hence SPDIF=Useless.(for me)
Very disappointed.
I went out and bought a rackmount mixer to rout all my modules 
signals through.
A workaround, even though I had to spend extra money on a mixer, 
rearranging my cables in my studio, finding a spot for yet another 
power supply, and the time it took to do this rather than making 
music.
No Kudos to Emu.
About the crackles, I had the same problem in my XL7. 
I don't know if its a QC thing or not, but if my SPDIF cables were 
bumped or moved near the XL7, I would get crackels and audio drop 
outs.
So in theory SPDIF looks cool on paper, but the execution is lacking.

That being said, I love most everything else about my XL7 and am 
having a really fun time with it.

prana
--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, "diveintomercury" <diveintomercury@y...> 
wrote:
> I'm having extreme difficulty with the SPDIF output on my MP7. It 
> would seem that the digital signal is very weak coming out of the 
> box. At first I thought it may have been a cable quality issue, 
but 
> after purchasing a very high quality cable, the problem continued. 
> I'm getting a lot of crackles in the signal. I have two soundcards 
> with SPDIF input which i've been attempting to use, a Waveterminal 
> 192L and an Audiophile USB. I've had difficulty with both, 
although 
> the Waveterminal seems slightly more tolerant. I notice that if i 
> press my finger on the metal section of the digital jack while 
> plugged into the MP7 the charge from my body boosts the signal so 
it 
> is crystal clear... Is there any other way i can boost the power 
of 
> the signal using the MP7 itself or a third party device?

My understanding is that the baseline level for the SPDIF signal is
set where it is to allow for the extreme bumps in level that can occur
when employing various quantities in Resonance thru the filter
section. If you play around with those features (filter.freq.res.) you
will hear what I mean. Since it is a 20 bit D/A there should still be
plenty of quality signal there - but you may have to adjust it with a
digital mixer function - whether in or out of the DAW. However - thru
a good gain stage and converter the analog signals sound great. Thru a
bad converter they will sound....bad. The stuff that I tracked from a
Command station/P2000 thru an Apogee converter sounds really fantastic.

--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, "pranaearth" <pranaearth@y...> wrote:

> I had the same problem with low levels. 
> I was told that Emu did this on purpose to avoid "overloading" the 
> SPDIF inputs on the recieving end, or other such nonsence.
> One of the main selling points for me was the SPDIF output. 
> I wanted to free up an analog input pair to my soundcard. 
> However, the output is so quiet, I couldn't hear it in relation to 
> my other gear. 
> Hence SPDIF=Useless.(for me)
> Very disappointed.
> I went out and bought a rackmount mixer to rout all my modules 
> signals through.
> A workaround, even though I had to spend extra money on a mixer, 
> rearranging my cables in my studio, finding a spot for yet another 
> power supply, and the time it took to do this rather than making 
> music.
> No Kudos to Emu.
> About the crackles, I had the same problem in my XL7. 
> I don't know if its a QC thing or not, but if my SPDIF cables were 
> bumped or moved near the XL7, I would get crackels and audio drop 
> outs.
> So in theory SPDIF looks cool on paper, but the execution is lacking.
> 
> That being said, I love most everything else about my XL7 and am 
> having a really fun time with it.
> 
> prana
> --- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, "diveintomercury" <diveintomercury@y...> 
> wrote:
> > I'm having extreme difficulty with the SPDIF output on my MP7. It 
> > would seem that the digital signal is very weak coming out of the 
> > box. At first I thought it may have been a cable quality issue, 
> but 
> > after purchasing a very high quality cable, the problem continued. 
> > I'm getting a lot of crackles in the signal. I have two soundcards 
> > with SPDIF input which i've been attempting to use, a Waveterminal 
> > 192L and an Audiophile USB. I've had difficulty with both, 
> although 
> > the Waveterminal seems slightly more tolerant. I notice that if i 
> > press my finger on the metal section of the digital jack while 
> > plugged into the MP7 the charge from my body boosts the signal so 
> it 
> > is crystal clear... Is there any other way i can boost the power 
> of 
> > the signal using the MP7 itself or a third party device?

On my Waveterminal card I can select the digital clock source, and 
i've set it to receive from the MP7. The signal is still crackly 
however. I think this is a signal strength related issue rather than 
a format/compatability issue given that i can solve the crackles 
problem simply by using my finger on the metal rim to boost the 
strength...

--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, "Stu" <routerman@z...> wrote:
> Is there any way to set the clock source on either of your 
soundcards? I get
> lots of crackles when my MP-7 is plugged into my E-MU Ultra sampler 
but I
> don't have the clock source set to the SPDIF input. Setting the 
clock source
> to SPDIF gets rid of the crackles.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Stu
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: diveintomercury [mailto:diveintomercury@y...]
> Sent: 27 September 2003 02:06
> To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [xl7] Weak SPDIF signal
> 
> 
> I'm having extreme difficulty with the SPDIF output on my MP7. It
> would seem that the digital signal is very weak coming out of the
> box. At first I thought it may have been a cable quality issue, but
> after purchasing a very high quality cable, the problem continued.
> I'm getting a lot of crackles in the signal. I have two soundcards
> with SPDIF input which i've been attempting to use, a Waveterminal
> 192L and an Audiophile USB. I've had difficulty with both, although
> the Waveterminal seems slightly more tolerant. I notice that if i
> press my finger on the metal section of the digital jack while
> plugged into the MP7 the charge from my body boosts the signal so it
> is crystal clear... Is there any other way i can boost the power of
> the signal using the MP7 itself or a third party device?
> 
> 
> 
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> xl7-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> 
> 
> 
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to 
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

> I had the same problem with low levels. 
> I was told that Emu did this on purpose to avoid "overloading" the 
> SPDIF inputs on the recieving end, or other such nonsence.

I don't have a problem with 'low levels' as such. The weakness is in 
the actual signal (ones and zeroes) which are not being transmitted 
effectively enough to arrive at the other end of the cable and 
satisfy my soundcards without dropouts. I wonder if there is a device 
which can amplify a digital signal...? After a quick search on google 
I saw only one unit which seemed to do anything like that, however 
its cost was in excess of $4000. For that price i think i'll just 
glue my finger to the jack :)

Hello all,
     Are you sure this is a signal strength issue?  It sounds like it 
might be a grounding issue if you can just touch it and it goes away. 
Exactly what my radio used to do before I properly grounded it. Just 
a thought.  Never hurts to check...

            Best,
                   Flibfree ^=.=^


--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, "diveintomercury" <diveintomercury@y...> 
wrote:
> On my Waveterminal card I can select the digital clock source, and 
> i've set it to receive from the MP7. The signal is still crackly 
> however. I think this is a signal strength related issue rather 
than 
> a format/compatability issue given that i can solve the crackles 
> problem simply by using my finger on the metal rim to boost the 
> strength...
> 
> --- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, "Stu" <routerman@z...> wrote:
> > Is there any way to set the clock source on either of your 
> soundcards? I get
> > lots of crackles when my MP-7 is plugged into my E-MU Ultra 
sampler 
> but I
> > don't have the clock source set to the SPDIF input. Setting the 
> clock source
> > to SPDIF gets rid of the crackles.
> > 
> > Regards,
> > 
> > Stu
> > 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: diveintomercury [mailto:diveintomercury@y...]
> > Sent: 27 September 2003 02:06
> > To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
> > Subject: [xl7] Weak SPDIF signal
> > 
> > 
> > I'm having extreme difficulty with the SPDIF output on my MP7. It
> > would seem that the digital signal is very weak coming out of the
> > box. At first I thought it may have been a cable quality issue, 
but
> > after purchasing a very high quality cable, the problem continued.
> > I'm getting a lot of crackles in the signal. I have two soundcards
> > with SPDIF input which i've been attempting to use, a Waveterminal
> > 192L and an Audiophile USB. I've had difficulty with both, 
although
> > the Waveterminal seems slightly more tolerant. I notice that if i
> > press my finger on the metal section of the digital jack while
> > plugged into the MP7 the charge from my body boosts the signal so 
it
> > is crystal clear... Is there any other way i can boost the power 
of

> > the signal using the MP7 itself or a third party device?
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > xl7-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to 
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

Flibfree,

I just tested your theory and you're quite correct! It does appear to 
have been a grounding issue, many thanks :)


--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, "flibfree" <flibfree@w...> wrote:
> Hello all,
>      Are you sure this is a signal strength issue?  It sounds like 
it 
> might be a grounding issue if you can just touch it and it goes 
away. 
> Exactly what my radio used to do before I properly grounded it. 
Just 

> a thought.  Never hurts to check...
> 
>             Best,
>                    Flibfree ^=.=^

Glad to help.  How did you end up grounding the unit and solving the 
problem?  Sounds like a good thing to know...   Best, Flibfree


--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, "diveintomercury" <diveintomercury@y...> 
wrote:
> Flibfree,
> 
> I just tested your theory and you're quite correct! It does appear 
to 
> have been a grounding issue, many thanks :)
> 
> 
> --- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, "flibfree" <flibfree@w...> wrote:
> > Hello all,
> >      Are you sure this is a signal strength issue?  It sounds 
like 

> it 
> > might be a grounding issue if you can just touch it and it goes 
> away. 
> > Exactly what my radio used to do before I properly grounded it. 
> Just 
> > a thought.  Never hurts to check...
> > 
> >             Best,
> >                    Flibfree ^=.=^

I have been able to get a slightly better signal with SPDIF by 
changing the output setting from SPDIF to AES. I still get pops that 
peg the meters in ProTools. I also have to insert gain in the 
mastering stages as well.

But if it is grounding issue that corrects the low signal, I would be 
very interested in the solution.

_greg

I just taped a wire to the outside rim of the metal jack on my spdif 
cable and used one of the metal screws (wrapped the other end of the 
wire around the screw) on the back of the box to ground it. You could 
use any other metal object, but i found the screws fairly convenient. 
I get a smooth signal now, without horrid digital errors.

> But if it is grounding issue that corrects the low signal, I would 
be 

> very interested in the solution.
> 
> _greg