Homebrew PCBs

Has anybody been working on any other printers, and or ink? Something 
that will not clog up I hope. How about the new Epson printers with the 
Claria ink, do they clog? Is that ink pigmented? Has anybody tried it? 
We need more testing.  Hello! Hello! Hello? is that a echo I hear form 
a empty room? I'm going back to photoresist for a while I know I can 
get a great board that way.

On Sat, 17 Feb 2007 23:44:37 +0100, wnnelson0 <wnnelson@...>  
wrote:

>  I'm going back to photoresist for a while I know I can
> get a great board that way.


You can't!!!!!

I already went back to TT for that reason, you need to continue  
experimenting! ;-)

Look we are using regular ink in regular printers, so it should  
theoretically work without clogging all the time. At least i'm thinking  
printers are not meant to clog, i may be wrong, i don't use inkjets for  
regular printing. The only difference could be the heated boards, and i do  
not think direct inkjet is impossible without this, and i'm not even sure  
that caused the clog, most likely we both just got some air into the  
nozzles.

Anyway, i hope you continue trying, and other people as well. I will get  
back to it in a couple of months, i expect i will have to buy more ink to  
do so. I was hoping in the meantime someone would find a cheap easily  
available replacement for mispro but it will not be a problem either to  
spend the $ on ink in a few months if need be. I also need to make the  
curing oven, which means i need to make the controller for it first.

ST

I'm keeping my eye on the guys over at CNCzone as they are getting good results too. Have to see
if they plug up. I have read where the Epson C line is prone to plugging. I just read last night
that air is very bad for the head which I didn't know before. They say to change the cart when it
gets low and not to let it run out completely. Maybe a continuous feed system is the way to go. I
may have a go with the modified bushing approach and CFS after a cooling off period. And then
there's the idea from CNCzone to build a whole new system and just use the essentials form the
inkjet. Maybe a moving gantry and the board stays still, that would make heating the board very
easy if it didn't move. This doesn't sound very hard at all and will design it in the back of my
head for awhile.

I've been playing with a Epson R220 (that prints on CDs) on and off for 
a while. I think Chris is too.

I had put it aside mostly because TT was working just fine. 
Unfortunately, the new toner refills I just received fior the laser 
printer do not work for TT. So my choice is to ressurect the R220 
project or buy a new laser cartidge. The irony is that a new cartridge 
costs more than a new laser printer!

So it's back to the R220 project.

I've expanded the CD tray to print on 4.5" square boards, adequate for 
my needs. I've been able to print on pcb's using the Diptrace pcb 
program over the "hole" area. I have 3 brands of pigmented inks to 
test. I have to admit that I was pleasantly surprised that is started 
up aned printed on the first try after sitting for a few months.

The open issues are still: Correctly preparing the copper and 
determining the time / temp conditons for curing. My wife has a 
electric skillet that she doesn't know she is donating.

I'll keep you posted.

Myc

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "wnnelson0" <wnnelson@...> wrote:
>
> Has anybody been working on any other printers, and or ink? Something 
> that will not clog up I hope. How about the new Epson printers with 
the 
> Claria ink, do they clog? Is that ink pigmented? Has anybody tried 
it? 
> We need more testing.  Hello! Hello! Hello? is that a echo I hear 
form 

> a empty room? I'm going back to photoresist for a while I know I can 
> get a great board that way.
>

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, William Nelson <wnnelson@...> 
wrote:
>

> there's the idea from CNCzone to build a whole new system and just 
use the essentials form the
> inkjet. Maybe a moving gantry and the board stays still, that would 
make heating the board very
> easy if it didn't move. This doesn't sound very hard at all and 
will design it in the back of my
> head for awhile.
>

Been thinking a little more about that, one advantage I can see is a 
built in heater in the "bed" where the board sits, possibly will make 
temperature regulation easier for the preheat of the board.

Another advantage is that the print height could be adjusted easily, 
don't know if that is really needed, but would be simple to achieve.

The real cool way as I see it would be to totally replicate the print 
head itself from scratch, and make it a little more tolerant of more 
conventional resist type of inks, I know it is probably impossible, 
but that would be the ONLY difficult (or impossible) part to make.

The mechanical part of a printer is easily replicated using CNC 
control, its just that pesky print head.  

Just a thought.

As far as the head clogging, I will keep you posted, I modded a new 
printer so it will be interesting to see how long it lasts.  The 
preheated board definately prints and etches better.

Russell.

Hi,

I tried two printers.

1-) Epson R220 with MISPRO yellow (pigment based).

2-) Epson Photo 900 with MISPRO photo black +
Durabright magenta.

R220 is dead because I tried permanent marker ink
(edding T25). Results were very successful down to 8
mil traces. One note, there is no need to suffer with
its CD try. Before printing, adjust the printing head
height by your hand (by rotating its related gear) up
to second highest point (you can raise it up to its
top point if you print in "plain paper" option. But,
since results are much better in "glossy paper"
option, you should rise it up to second point, printer
raises it one more during printing automatically. It
clogs every 48 hours but easily recovered with its
head cleaning process. Please look my past posts.

Epson Photo 900 needs no modification (thanks to Lez).
It clogs in a week but again easily recovered with its
head cleaning utility. I am still trying but finally
results are very good with MISPRO photo black.
Durabright magenta was not etch resistant in my
experiments. Pre-heating of the PCB was useless
because it cools down very quickly. If you made a
metal tray and try heating both, I am sure that it
also yield good results as you performed.

All were in my previous posts.

Best,

Dr.




--- wnnelson0 <wnnelson@...> wrote:

> Has anybody been working on any other printers, and
> or ink? Something 
> that will not clog up I hope. How about the new
> Epson printers with the 
> Claria ink, do they clog? Is that ink pigmented? Has
> anybody tried it? 
> We need more testing.  Hello! Hello! Hello? is that
> a echo I hear form 
> a empty room? I'm going back to photoresist for a
> while I know I can 
> get a great board that way.
> 
> 



 
____________________________________________________________________________________
Don't pick lemons.
See all the new 2007 cars at Yahoo! Autos.
http://autos.yahoo.com/new_cars.html

Hi,

I uploaded some photos under the name "Epson-R220".

Epson-R220-6.jpg

shows which gear you can use to raise printing head.

At the other side (left side), there is an optic
sensor and a wheel with notches. You can easily
understand the top and the point next to top by
looking it while rotating the gear.

I hope this will help.

Best,

Dr.




 
____________________________________________________________________________________
Don't get soaked.  Take a quick peak at the forecast
with the Yahoo! Search weather shortcut.
http://tools.search.yahoo.com/shortcuts/#loc_weather

At 4:51 am ((PST)) Sun Feb 18, 2007, epineh wrote:
>--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, William Nelson <wnnelson@...>
>wrote:
> > there's the idea from CNCzone to build a whole new system and just
>use the essentials form the inkjet.
>  [snip]
>The real cool way as I see it would be to totally replicate the print
>head itself from scratch, and make it a little more tolerant of more
>conventional resist type of inks, I know it is probably impossible,
>but that would be the ONLY difficult (or impossible) part to make.
>
>The mechanical part of a printer is easily replicated using CNC
>control, its just that pesky print head.
>
>Just a thought.

And one that's been touched on here already - there are
print heads available that are resistant to organic-solvent
inks. They are used for labelling goods on the production line.

Expensive too - but not as expensive as starting your own
factory for making print heads.

[ Now I've said that, someone is going to tell us how they
dismantled their print head and made a lost-wax injection
moulding of the plastic parts in high-chemical-resistance
epoxy resin and re-installed the silicon wafer or piezo
crystal and it runs on marker pen refill ink...
    -  youze guys sure are ingenious ;-) ]


Regards, LenW

>And one that's been touched on here already - there are
>print heads available that are resistant to organic-solvent
>inks. They are used for labelling goods on the production line.
>
>Expensive too - but not as expensive as starting your own
>factory for making print heads.

any www link to them?
Cristian

I now have the converted Epson R220 up and runny in place of the now
defunct Espon C94. Yes the head plugged on it too...Well why be any
different than the rest of the group ;) Tried the hot air heat routine
with it and the head promptly plugged. I think it might have worked
had I rigged a shield to keep the hot air from the front of the C94.
One thing I have learned is that when a C94 head is plugged there is
only a slight chance of unplugging it. Tried for two days on this one
with the head sitting in a mix of Ammonia and Alcohol still no go. 

The R220 is a more robust machine with many similarities to the C94 in
overall design. The print head rids on a round machined stock that
makes its travel very smooth. There appears to be some sort of sensor
in the printhead as well, so there is the "gap sensor" for the media
as well as the sensor in the head. Both need to be satisfied before
the printer will accept the media to be printed on. This required
cutting identical gaps on both sides of the carrier. In this case a
sheet of Formica. Also the two switches living in the pull down CD/DVD
carrier need to be satisfied. (one open - one closed). Then as Bora
mentioned the height can be dealt with manually. As can be seen from
the pictures I uploaded - Mardocks Projects - I went with the infrared
heater. The housing is 3" from the board and bulb, a 250W Sylvania
Infra Red, is closer about 2 1/2" I left the lamp on the PC board for
5 minutes with no ill effects and enough heat was retained through out
the  printing as evidenced by the ink still being smoothly applied,
with no signs of beading. Tried to measure the temperature but was
unable. The settings of the driver software are interesting and not at
all like the C94 settings. The best I have found so far is "Premium
Luster" Paper with "Photo RPM" and this allows selecting "Super
Microweave" . This makes printing slow but the detail and consistent
application of ink make it the best choice I have found so far. I had
to get a couple of other boards made today and did not have a chance
to run my test boards for resolution. I was very happy with the boards
I did get done today though. Resolution is at least 4 Mil.  I will run
some resolution tests as soon as I get a chance. MISPRO yellow in all
six carts. BTW it seems that the C94 MIS Carts will fit in the R220
just change the chip. I cut them off the originals and then used some
of the putty supplied by MIS to attach them to the blank carts. Oh one
more thing I took the Epson CD/DVD carrier and cut the wedge off the
front ( approx 1" ) then I tape this in front of the PC board, makes
the transition from the carrier to the PC board ..well..stepless, smooth.
More as time permits...

John
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
>
____________________________________________________________________________________

> Don't get soaked.  Take a quick peak at the forecast
> with the Yahoo! Search weather shortcut.
> http://tools.search.yahoo.com/shortcuts/#loc_weather
>

Does anyone know where to get a refillable cartridge for the R220?

I have my printer hacked apart and ready for more experimenting, but 
need to put a different ink in it.  I checked on the ink-jet refill 
sites I am familiar with and could not find the cartridges.

On Wed, 21 Feb 2007 12:03:51 +0100, lcdpublishing  
<lcdpublishing@...m> wrote:

> Does anyone know where to get a refillable cartridge for the R220?
> I have my printer hacked apart and ready for more experimenting, but
> need to put a different ink in it.  I checked on the ink-jet refill
> sites I am familiar with and could not find the cartridges.


I believe you are looking at T0481, T0482, T0483, T0484, T0485, T0486?

3.50eur each = 21eur Spongeless with auto-reset chips and a funny syringe  
at <www.cartridge4you.com>.

Quite expensive, many carts cost lotsa money so fewer colors are better i  
guess.

ST

I used this one below pre-filled with MISPRO yellow.
(Believed as the most etch resistant ink)

http://www.inksupply.com/spongless_carts.cfm

MP-T0484-SLC  $10.95

Or an empty one;

SLC-2400-E    $5.50

Exporting the ink separately is generally a problem in
customs. You should order pre-filled one not to face
with problems.

I hope this will help,

Bora


--- Stefan Trethan <stefan_trethan@...> wrote:

> On Wed, 21 Feb 2007 12:03:51 +0100, lcdpublishing  
> <lcdpublishing@...> wrote:
> 
> > Does anyone know where to get a refillable
> cartridge for the R220?
> > I have my printer hacked apart and ready for more
> experimenting, but
> > need to put a different ink in it.  I checked on
> the ink-jet refill
> > sites I am familiar with and could not find the
> cartridges.
> 
> 
> I believe you are looking at T0481, T0482, T0483,
> T0484, T0485, T0486?
> 
> 3.50eur each = 21eur Spongeless with auto-reset
> chips and a funny syringe  
> at <www.cartridge4you.com>.
> 
> Quite expensive, many carts cost lotsa money so
> fewer colors are better i  
> guess.
> 
> ST
> 



 
____________________________________________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta.
http://new.mail.yahoo.com