Emu XL-7 & MP-7 User's Group

Hey guys, I've been waiting and hoping that there was going to be a new OS 
release that would address the lack of Megamixing or RPS/RPPR facilities 
in the XX-7 before I began using the XL-7 in a 100% live situation (and 
not combined with turntables like I currently do).  However, with Summer 
NAMM come and gone (the most obvious place to announce a new OS), it seems 
I'm going to have to just figure out my own way around these limitations 
so that I can start preparing a live set once again (one of the main 
reasons I got the XL-7).  The biggest issue I have, is how to switch 
patterns live, so that I can keep some continuity between them, and still 
retain the flexibility to use which ever pattern fits the mood.  I could 
certainly program some 'filler' patterns, but that would require a hard 
and fast set list, something I want to avoid if possible.

I had originally hoped that the Beats functions on the trigger buttons 
would help me out here, but in use it's less than ideal and is generally 
more headaches than it's worth.  The riffs don't start on time with 
whatever is playing, so even after a few months of practice, I still can't 
trigger them accurately more than 50% of the time (and there's no second 
chances live!).  Plus, they're just not flexible enough to use most of the 
time, and they end up sounding like what they really are, someone else's 
music, not mine.

So then I attempted to create my own Presets with custom arps to address 
the problem, which by and large seemed to be the best solution, as long as 
I stuck to simple arps.  Downsides are that it still has the issue with 
trigger timing, and in order to get a full 16 triggers, you pretty much 
need to limit yourself to the 16A channels for writing, the 16B channels 
being reserved for your Trigger Presets.  Oh, and there's no easy way to 
switch trigger Presets mid-set, as I need to save and load the set ups via 
Multi's.

Next idea was to just use my Korg Er-1, and sync it to the XL-7 to add 
some fills and consistent drum sounds while switching patterns.  This so 
far is the easiest solution, as the two stay nicely in sync and I can 
select which ever pattern in the ER-1 I want with the volume down and then 
fade it in when  I need it.  Downsides are that I can only use drum sound 
for the most part, and by the 5th or 6th pattern change, it does sound a 
bit "samey" and dry compared to the XL-7 sound.  Oh yeah, and that adds 
one more bit of kit (not a huge issue) and another wallwart to accomidate.

So, I'm looking to you guys to chime in and let me know how you address 
these issues, or what you think Emu can do to improve the situation. 
Obviously, with in the current hardware limitations too, so it's got to be 
feasible.  I think Emu has done a great job at sorting out the bugs and 
getting our boxes studio ready, now lets see (and help) them focus on the 
live use aspect!

rEalm

I've been experimenting with a new live setup by DJing two drum 
machines.  I'm putting a dj mixer between the MP-7 and the Roland D2.  
Basically, the meat and potatoes of what I want to do is on the MP-7 
and then I blend in the D2.  Fade out the MP-7 and then hang out on the 
D2, while I reset the command station. And then start over.

Obviously, a new OS for the command stations that would include more DJ 
friendly live functionality would be greatly appreciated and I agree 
with Eric on his comments.  

http://www.chrisshively.com/

He could always paint it :)

rEalm





"David Jones" <spec@...>
08/01/02 09:23 AM
Please respond to xl7

 
        To:     xl7@yahoogroups.com
        cc: 

        Subject:        Re: [xl7] Re: XX-7 live tips?


heh , you shoulda got a XL-7, the color would go more with the d-2 ;)
----- Original Message ----- 
From: djnorythm 
To: xl7@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Thursday, August 01, 2002 2:13 AM
Subject: [xl7] Re: XX-7 live tips?

I've been experimenting with a new live setup by DJing two drum 
machines.  I'm putting a dj mixer between the MP-7 and the Roland D2. 
Basically, the meat and potatoes of what I want to do is on the MP-7 
and then I blend in the D2.  Fade out the MP-7 and then hang out on the 
D2, while I reset the command station. And then start over.

Obviously, a new OS for the command stations that would include more DJ 
friendly live functionality would be greatly appreciated and I agree 
with Eric on his comments. 

http://www.chrisshively.com/




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> I will note however that I've found the capabilities of the apprigio
> system in the XL-7 to be most usefull for (thus far) essientially
> serving as sort of a replacement to Roland's RPS system

'tis a shame, then, that the arpeggio interval stuff is broken. (See
the bug database.) This really needs to be fixed in the next OS
update.

> Is there any way to go about reaching a desired channel utlilizing
> no more than one or two button clicks?

My XL-7 isn't here right now, but: can't you use the assignment panel
in the middle to attach the data entry wheel to track/channel
selection?

> On another issue, I also was wondering where on earth is the USB
> port on the XL-7, I can't locate it at all and granted I am yet to
> read the manual cover to cover, I can't find any mention of it in
> the manual (contents or index).

It's on the back: it's a USB *client* socket, not a host socket. (USB
is stupid this way; Firewire isn't.)

> To wrap up my own personal questions in regard to this beast, I'm
> having some trouble with one of my mute/trigger buttons,
> specifically mute/trigger button 3.

I've got a bit of cruft with the track/channel up/down buttons but I'm
assuming they'll ride up with wear. Or ride down, or something.

-- 

  nick rothwell -- composition, systems, performance -- http://www.cassiel.com

I will note however that I've found the capabilities of the apprigio 
system in the XL-7 to be most usefull for (thus far) essientially serving 
as sort of a replacement to Roland's RPS system (of course it works well 
for apprigios as well). 

>>>Ditto, it's the closest thing to RPS in the XX-7's at present, as long 
as you don't mind editing User arps. <<<

I'll also chime in that something I'm really digging into with the XL-7 is 
it's ability to jump in and out of record mode while playing (just wish it 
could do this with grid mode as well); 

>>>Hold down PLAY while pressing RECORD (while the XX-7's playing).  :) 
Damn those manuals!<<<

Can't say that I like having to surf through channel buttons in order to 
reach a desired channel.  Is there any way to go about reaching a desired 
channel utlilizing no more than one or two button clicks?

>>>Yeah, that's a good point.  Jumping to a track/channel to spur of the 
momment use the Quick Edit knobs can take too long while you scroll.  I 
think it would be cool to just hold down EDIT + the Track MUTE button for 
that channel to select it.  Much quicker. <<<
 
On another issue, I also was wondering where on earth is the USB port on 
the XL-7, I can't locate it at all and granted I am yet to read the manual 
cover to cover, I can't find any mention of it in the manual (contents or 
index).

>>>I hope you're kidding.  It's on the back, and it's the connector that 
doesn't look like a mains, 1/4", or RCA port :) <<<
 
And yes, yet another question, I've been searching through the manual and 
have yet been able to find how exactly I go about setting what exactly 
Mod1 and Mod2 effect.  Can someone tell me how to go about doing this.

>>>It's on the Patch Cords page for each Preset (the settings of the Quick 
Edit knobs are Preset dependant).  Go to the Patch Cords page and set 
Controllers "M" and "N" to control whatever parameter you want them to 
control, as well as the amount. <<<
 
To wrap up my own personal questions in regard to this beast, I'm having 
some trouble with one of my mute/trigger buttons, specifically 
mute/trigger button 3.  I often find that I have to hit it a couple times 
in order to have it work.  I was thinking that I can probably just dig 
underneath the hood of this thing and do some simple realigning in order 
to solve the problem.  rEalm, as you've been underneath the hood of this 
thing already, mind telling me your thoughts on where this problem may be 
steming from and if my idea on how to fix it might work or not.

>>>It might be just pressing against the case itself, I know my data knob 
wasn't soldered onto the PCB board 100% flat, so my knob was rubbing 
against the case at one point every rotation.  In my case, I just pulled 
the knob off and sanded down the edge of the knob and all was well (you 
can't see it either).  Be careful if you open up the case, especially for 
that section.  The LEDs in the XX-7 all have light pipes that trasmit the 
light to the front of the case, and they ARE NOT glued on.  So if you pull 
off that board to take a look, chances are a bunch of small plastic pieces 
will come loose with it.  Not saying it's an impossible task, but to put 
everything back together you need to use a hot glue gun or rubber cement 
to hold them in place while you reassemble.  It's easy to do, just a 
little bit time consuming. 

So if you're up for it, take it apart and press that button out of the 
case to see if it still sticks.  If it doesn't then it's probably rubbing 
against the case, just sand down the inside of that button hole to make it 
smoother and remove a little bit of the paint (you won't see it).  If it 
does still stick, then it's a faulty button and probably needs to be 
replaced,  I know you just got your XL-7, so I would just take it back and 
get another one if you haven't gone over the store warrenty.  Much easier, 
and you don't need to worry about messing anything up internally and 
ruining your manufacturer's warrenty.<<<

rEalm

My XL-7 isn't here right now, but: can't you use the assignment panel
in the middle to attach the data entry wheel to track/channel
selection?

>>>Yeah, but it's still not as quick a button press(es).  Plus, I need to 
keep that display on the Bars and Beats setting to know where in my 
pattern I am sometimes, especially live. We're just picky I guess! :) <<<

rEalm

I was harping on this problem a while back; it's the main reason why I decided not to buy an XX-7. It's clearly intended to be used as a live sequencer (gooseneck lamp jack) but it lacks one of the most crucial features of a live sequencer, a good way to change patterns during a performance. And if you're not using the XX-7 as your main sequencer, why not get an XX-1 instead?

A program change or sysex message to select pattern numbers would at least let you switch from a PC-1600 or footswitch board (I play guitar too)...but it won't do that either (only the otherwise very limited Electribes will).

Hopefully E-mu will eventually address this with an update, but at this point I've given up and decided to try Ableton Live instead. I wish Live played back MIDI sequences as well as audio, but the degree of MIDI control is much higher than ANY of the hardware sequencers, and I can use Max to cover the must-be-MIDI stuff.

> a good way to change patterns during a performance.

It has a perfectly good mechanism to change patterns during a
performance: the buttons on the front panel...

I do see your point (and I use the XL-7 for live work as well,
together with Max/MSP for MIDI control). The XL-7 provides as much
MIDI control as I need (program changes and volume control in
particular), and since I use it as a control surface I don't mind
switching patterns directly as well, but if you wanted to sit the XL-7 out
of reach more automation would be nice (such as track mute control).

Certainly, more automation would be nice for sequencing: the more that
can go into the sequencer, the less that you have to fly in or
multi-pass by hand.

> Hopefully E-mu will eventually address this with an update, but at this point I've given up and decided to try Ableton Live instead.

Ableton Live looks interesting, but I've not spent a lot of time with
it. Let us know how it turns out as a performance tool.

-- 

  nick rothwell -- composition, systems, performance -- http://www.cassiel.com

See my posting "Emu alive and Kicking..."
I really love my mp-7. But I find myself using the computer sequencer 
way to often, I actually wanted to go away from it. Then again a 
mophatt would have been enough. I really hope for some new OS-
features like real time pattern switching. I wish it had the 
sequencer guts of the rm1x. I definitely would pay for a further 
devellopment of the XX-7 OS.

Best regards

HEinrich


--- In xl7@y..., "robotchas" <robotchas@y...> wrote:
> I was harping on this problem a while back; it's the main reason 
why I decided not to buy an XX-7. It's clearly intended to be used as 
a live sequencer (gooseneck lamp jack) but it lacks one of the most 
crucial features of a live sequencer, a good way to change patterns 
during a performance. And if you're not using the XX-7 as your main 
sequencer, why not get an XX-1 instead?
> 
> A program change or sysex message to select pattern numbers would 
at least let you switch from a PC-1600 or footswitch board (I play 
guitar too)...but it won't do that either (only the otherwise very 
limited Electribes will).
> 
> Hopefully E-mu will eventually address this with an update, but at 
this point I've given up and decided to try Ableton Live instead. I 
wish Live played back MIDI sequences as well as audio, but the degree 
of MIDI control is much higher than ANY of the hardware sequencers, 
and I can use Max to cover the must-be-MIDI stuff.

--- In xl7@y..., Nick Rothwell <nick@c...> wrote:
> > a good way to change patterns during a performance.
>
> It has a perfectly good mechanism to change patterns during a
> performance: the buttons on the front panel...

Hmmm? Did I miss something? I'm pretty sure last I checked the only way to select patterns was via the data wheel, but it's been several months. Unless you mean stepping up and down...I want full-on, one-touch random access.

> I do see your point (and I use the XL-7 for live work as well,
> together with Max/MSP for MIDI control). The XL-7 provides as much
> MIDI control as I need (program changes and volume control in
> particular), and since I use it as a control surface I don't mind
> switching patterns directly as well, but if you wanted to sit the XL-7 out
> of reach more automation would be nice (such as track mute control).

You're probably not looking to switch patterns as vigorously as I am, but I can see why it would appeal to you as a control surface. And yeah, more track mute control would also be on my list, along with a grid editor that doesn't chase playback.

> Ableton Live looks interesting, but I've not spent a lot of time with
> it. Let us know how it turns out as a performance tool.

Yeah, will do...I know you're adverse to using samples (I'm familiar with some of your work), as am I, but I like the extensive MIDI control it offers.

>> I do see your point (and I use the XL-7 for live work as well,
>> together with Max/MSP for MIDI control).

If anybody's whipped up Max/MSP stuff specifically for the XX-7, I'd love
to steal a copy.

I bought Max/MSP a couple years ago and haven't done very much with it at
all ...
---
* just-john@...  http://just-john.com/cn/rfe.shtml *

Hmmm? Did I miss something? I'm pretty sure last I checked the only way to select patterns was via the data wheel, but it's been several months. Unless you mean stepping up and down...I want full-on, one-touch random access.

>>Actually you can change patterns via foot pedal as well.

You're probably not looking to switch patterns as vigorously as I am, but I can see why it would appeal to you as a control surface. And yeah, more track mute control would also be on my list, along with a grid editor that doesn't chase playback.

>>Gotta say I'd like a Grid mode that simply gave one the option to have it chase playback or not to chase playback. Both modes have their own good and bad points.

Respect,

Aaron Nesby

www.twenty3.tk

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> If anybody's whipped up Max/MSP stuff specifically for the XX-7, I'd love
> to steal a copy.

I've written a simple bank-transfer librarian for the presets in Max;
it does the handshaking stuff. I'd like to be able to back up patterns
as well, but E-mu have no documentation on this, so sooner or later
I'll have to reverse-engineer it.

-- 

  nick rothwell -- composition, systems, performance -- http://www.cassiel.com