Emu XL-7 & MP-7 User's Group

Hi List,

I'm pretty much a 'lurker' here, as most of the topics go straight over my head ... but I'm ever impressed with the expertise on this list.

I run my command station and other hardware through my DAW, Cubase ... learning how to do hardware sequencing is one of those things on my 'to do' list, but a ways down from the top.

I run Windows XP and am getting ready to take the 64 bit plunge to Windows 7. 

I've got one major problem ... by MOTU Midi Timepiece parallel will no longer work, since there are no 64 bit drivers for it. It will still function standalone, but will be pretty useless without the multi midi port capacity.

I have heard horror stories about the MOTU Midi 128 Express USB on Windows, although it is supposedly supported with 64 bit Windows drivers.

Can anyone tell me otherwise or suggest any other 8x8 or linkable in pairs 4x4 junction boxes that they know operate under Windows 64 bit?

Thanks.

DF
CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication.

Just my two cents, which may not solve your problem, but...

2010/12/4 D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@...>:
> I run Windows XP and am getting ready to take the 64 bit plunge to Windows 7.
>
> I've got one major problem ... by MOTU Midi Timepiece parallel will no longer work, since there are no 64 bit drivers for it. It will still function standalone, but will be pretty useless without the multi midi port capacity.

Then why do you want to migrate? Is there any important benefit from
64bit OS, that justifies such move?

Also, you may write to MOTU and nag them about providing the
appropriate drivers...

I'm not sure if this would be helpful for you:
http://www.motunation.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=39457

Hope this helps,

Bruno

Yes ... 64 bit OS on PC means virtually unlimited access to RAM. Dell is selling Windows 7 Octacore Servers with 192 GB of RAM installed. Layered samples, anyone?
 
Under XP there is a maximum of 4 GB of RAM available to the system, about 1.2 of which is normally reserved by Windows ... although there is the '3 Gigabyte Switch' trick to increase the RAM available to 32 bit programs. Under Windows 7 64 bit, there is virtually no limit to the program beyond the available installed RAM.
 
Even running 32 bit programs under 64 bit is a huge improvement, now, depending of course on the installed memory, each individual program can access a full 4GB. Since there are samplers and software instruments, while technically VST or VSTi plugins, that can individually access their own 4 GB's with out taking any from the hosting DAW, this is also a huge improvement in function and performance. Simply put, mostly all your 32 but VSTs and VSTi's will continue to run as long as hosted in a 32 bit app under the 64 bit OS.
 
There are also 'bridging' solutions, some provided by the DAW manufacturers and some independtly, that port 32 bit plugins ... with variable success ... to a 64 bit app.
 
But ... while you can run 32 bit software under 64 bit OS ... you can't run 32 bit hardware/ drivers at all.
 
As far as MOTU upgrading the drivers ... the Midi Timepiece AV is already a legacy product for the past 3 or 4 years, no longer supported at all. 
 
DF
CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication.

--- On Sat, 12/4/10, Bruno <brunorc@...> wrote:


From: Bruno <brunorc@...>
Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi Junction Box?
To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 10:58 AM


  



Just my two cents, which may not solve your problem, but...

2010/12/4 D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@...>:
> I run Windows XP and am getting ready to take the 64 bit plunge to Windows 7.
>
> I've got one major problem ... by MOTU Midi Timepiece parallel will no longer work, since there are no 64 bit drivers for it. It will still function standalone, but will be pretty useless without the multi midi port capacity.

Then why do you want to migrate? Is there any important benefit from
64bit OS, that justifies such move?

Also, you may write to MOTU and nag them about providing the
appropriate drivers...

I'm not sure if this would be helpful for you:
http://www.motunation.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=39457

Hope this helps,

Bruno

Because even though it is on the web page, it is not being sold. Check out all the authorized MOTU dealers ... like Sweetwater, for example.
 
The Dell example was simply to illustrate the quantum leap of 64 bit OS.
 
I do have a dual dualcore Xeon 3 Ghz Dell server I bought about 3 years ago as '64 bit' ready. I just have to slap in the RAM and install the OS. I'm shooting for 16GB.
 
As far as where the industry is pushing us, keep in mind that hardware like the Command Station is a computer. It's got an OS and memory and an internal software routine. Yes, because 3rd partys cannot mess with it, it is really robust. But it is a computer.
 
Why has E-mu ... agreed not very successfully since being taken over by Creative ... dropped hardware except for the audio and midi interfaces? They claim the Emulator X can do everything and more than their E4 and Ultrasampler lines. That is, as far as sampling and creating preset banks go. Issues like AD an DA conversion and 'physical interface' of knobs and buttons are of course not part of the software. That part depends on the audio interface and midi controllers the user puts together.
 
DF

CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication.

--- On Sat, 12/4/10, Matt <somatt@...> wrote:


From: Matt <somatt@...>
Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi Junction Box?
To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 11:51 AM


  



well, it seems that the industry wants us to go all software in the future... but if you have the money for a octacore with 192gb of ram, then why not buy the full timepiece av?
http://www.motu.com/products/midi/mtpav_usb


On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 11:41 AM, D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@...> wrote:


  








Yes ... 64 bit OS on PC means virtually unlimited access to RAM. Dell is selling Windows 7 Octacore Servers with 192 GB of RAM installed. Layered samples, anyone?
 
Under XP there is a maximum of 4 GB of RAM available to the system, about 1.2 of which is normally reserved by Windows ... although there is the '3 Gigabyte Switch' trick to increase the RAM available to 32 bit programs. Under Windows 7 64 bit, there is virtually no limit to the program beyond the available installed RAM.
 
Even running 32 bit programs under 64 bit is a huge improvement, now, depending of course on the installed memory, each individual program can access a full 4GB. Since there are samplers and software instruments, while technically VST or VSTi plugins, that can individually access their own 4 GB's with out taking any from the hosting DAW, this is also a huge improvement in function and performance. Simply put, mostly all your 32 but VSTs and VSTi's will continue to run as long as hosted in a 32 bit app under the 64 bit OS.
 
There are also 'bridging' solutions, some provided by the DAW manufacturers and some independtly, that port 32 bit plugins ... with variable success ... to a 64 bit app.
 
But ... while you can run 32 bit software under 64 bit OS ... you can't run 32 bit hardware/ drivers at all.
 
As far as MOTU upgrading the drivers ... the Midi Timepiece AV is already a legacy product for the past 3 or 4 years, no longer supported at all. 
 

DF
CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication.

--- On Sat, 12/4/10, Bruno <brunorc@...> wrote:


From: Bruno <brunorc@...>
Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi Junction Box?
To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 10:58 AM



  

Just my two cents, which may not solve your problem, but...

2010/12/4 D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@...>:
> I run Windows XP and am getting ready to take the 64 bit plunge to Windows 7.
>
> I've got one major problem ... by MOTU Midi Timepiece parallel will no longer work, since there are no 64 bit drivers for it. It will still function standalone, but will be pretty useless without the multi midi port capacity.

Then why do you want to migrate? Is there any important benefit from
64bit OS, that justifies such move?

Also, you may write to MOTU and nag them about providing the
appropriate drivers...

I'm not sure if this would be helpful for you:
http://www.motunation.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=39457

Hope this helps,

Bruno

2010/12/4 Matt <somatt@...>
> well, it seems that the industry wants us to go all software in the future... but if you have the money for a octacore with 192gb of ram, then why not buy the full timepiece av?

True :-)

> On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 11:41 AM, D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@...> wrote:
>> Yes ... 64 bit OS on PC means virtually unlimited access to RAM. Dell is selling Windows 7 Octacore Servers with 192 GB of RAM installed. Layered samples, anyone?

Actually, I keep one 1GB/0.9GHz PC with XP - only to do MIDI things. I
can always use any other machine with whatever MIDI interface as a
slave. But I don't use VSTis, only hardware.

>> Under XP there is a maximum of 4 GB of RAM available to the system, about 1.2 of which is normally reserved by Windows

False. Only 182 MB with Reaper already launched. No eyecandy, no
fancy-shmancy stuff. XP is bloated out of the box, but can be
optimized to the bone.

>> Even running 32 bit programs under 64 bit is a huge improvement

False, unless they need to address huge memory areas - I can agree in
case of VSTi samplers, though. And usually they run as separate
processes anyway, so they have ther 4GBs.

Not everything a company says about their products is true. And the
example with samplers/sound modules just shows the case very well. Our
new product is better mostly because we want to sell it. The truth is,
that people tend to love obsoleted synths, sound modules and
sequencers mostly because they don't crash so often and don't force
you to throw pornographic amount of cash to upgrade. And 90% of this
whole 64bit hype remainds me the new, improved Whizzo butter
("containing 10% more or less is absolutely indistinguishable from a
dead crab"). OK, enough ranting, let's go to the merit:

Just wait with your migration to Windows 7 until MOTU ships their new
Timepiece to the sellers :-)

Regards, Bruno

Hunh? Whence this arrogance?
 
I just asked for a recommendation and when asked why I was upgrading my OS, tried to answer? I'm not trying to waste my time with a software vs. hardware flame out.
 
You should know digital audio is pure. That's why people spend so much time time trying to tweak it to recreate that pleasing analog harmonic distortion.
 
I can make the output of your Emulator II + or the Emulator X sound like anything I want.
 
If your point is that for live performance piped right to an amp of mixing console your Emulator II + will sound better than the Emulator X piped straight out of a computer, I'd agree with you.
 
But if you're trying to say that the Emulator II + is superior to the Emulator X for sampling, sample editing and preset building, ... once proper AD/DA conversion is in place ... I don't think you know what your are talking about.

I'm glad the Emulator II + works well for you. But for studio production work the Emulator X works much better for me.
 
DF
CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication.

--- On Sat, 12/4/10, James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...> wrote:


From: James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...>
Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi Junction Box?
To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 12:48 PM


  



You're all caught up in specs.  It's just numbers on paper.   What about the sound?

There is nothing "Emulator" about the Emulator X software.  It sounds like ass.  It's thin and plastic sounding, and the absolute the most coldest sounding soft sampler out there.  So having one of these Dell's with one of these crazy processors and gobs of ram doesn't even matter if the application sucks and sounds poor and unauthentic. 

I'll put my 8-bit Emulator II+ against any Creative piece of software (Emulator X) in a sound test any day.  What you'll get is a full analog path of the Emulator II verses some software that specs out like crazy, but really is one nasty sounding software program.  I have the software so I know. The old E-MU hardware days are gone. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDxOhnL7pjs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oVpWdxW1K0M&feature=related






On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 1:16 PM, Bruno <brunorc@...> wrote:


  



2010/12/4 Matt <somatt@...>

> well, it seems that the industry wants us to go all software in the future... but if you have the money for a octacore with 192gb of ram, then why not buy the full timepiece av?

True :-)


> On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 11:41 AM, D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Yes ... 64 bit OS on PC means virtually unlimited access to RAM. Dell is selling Windows 7 Octacore Servers with 192 GB of RAM installed. Layered samples, anyone?

Actually, I keep one 1GB/0.9GHz PC with XP - only to do MIDI things. I
can always use any other machine with whatever MIDI interface as a
slave. But I don't use VSTis, only hardware.


>> Under XP there is a maximum of 4 GB of RAM available to the system, about 1.2 of which is normally reserved by Windows

False. Only 182 MB with Reaper already launched. No eyecandy, no
fancy-shmancy stuff. XP is bloated out of the box, but can be
optimized to the bone.


>> Even running 32 bit programs under 64 bit is a huge improvement

False, unless they need to address huge memory areas - I can agree in
case of VSTi samplers, though. And usually they run as separate
processes anyway, so they have ther 4GBs.

Not everything a company says about their products is true. And the
example with samplers/sound modules just shows the case very well. Our
new product is better mostly because we want to sell it. The truth is,
that people tend to love obsoleted synths, sound modules and
sequencers mostly because they don't crash so often and don't force
you to throw pornographic amount of cash to upgrade. And 90% of this
whole 64bit hype remainds me the new, improved Whizzo butter
("containing 10% more or less is absolutely indistinguishable from a
dead crab"). OK, enough ranting, let's go to the merit:

Just wait with your migration to Windows 7 until MOTU ships their new
Timepiece to the sellers :-)

Regards, Bruno

Hmm...

2010/12/4 D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@...>
> I just asked for a recommendation and when asked why I was upgrading my OS, tried to answer? I'm not trying to waste my time with a software vs. hardware flame out.

Seems like in fact you have just had hit a spot that's painful for all
of us (says the owner of Unitor 8 Mk I - obsoleted on Mac OS X), which
in turn provoked some reactions you could find as rough. Sorry.

Every now and then we get a nice piece of gear, and then we find out,
that new computer/mainboard/OS/whatever will not support it. And it's
always frustrating to find out that once again we've got tricked into
the same trap.

In case of my Unitor I found out that to be able to do MIDI from Mac
as well, it would be just cheaper to say "argh" and get the Mk II with
USB - I can always stack them later (if there's a need). Also, the
story of my PC... the integreted video card doesn't support widescreen
modes :-)

BTW: is it possible to stack older and newer Timepieces?

Cheers, Bruno

James ... I think most people would be offended when someone makes a categorical statement that they are, in the other person's opinion, doing something to the neglect of something else on the basis of an assumption on the part of the categorizing individual..
 
But me, not, too. ... and your apology is appreciated.
 
However, I wonder if you really read my last post regarding manipulation of digital audio in a studio context?
 
You are overlooking one giant issue: Kontakt is not a sampler, Emulator X is. Kontakt can manipulate imported samples and play them back ... it cannot sample. Having used Kontakt since the original version up to Kontakt III, I have a good opinion of it and understand why so many 3rd party rompler suppliers use the Kontakt II player.
 
However, as far as importing samples, setting up one shot banks, chopping a vocal for midi, etc., I find the Emulator X to have ... in my view and experience ... a much superior interface and workflow to Kontakt with all that scrolling around to get anywhere. But, obviously, others may see it differently.
 
As far as E-mu going out of business or having soon to be obsolete products, what does that have to do with the price of your Emulator II +? As I'm sure we'd agree, if something works for you, doesn't matter what happens to the company ... as long as your not in need of an 8x8 midi junction box and there are no 64 bit drivers. ;)
 
DF
 


CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication.

--- On Sat, 12/4/10, James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@gmail.com> wrote:


From: James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...>
Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi Junction Box?
To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 1:56 PM


  



I am not being arrogant.  All I am saying is that keep in mind sound, not specs.  Your Emulator X software with the 64 bit OS crushes the Emulator EII+ on paper, but in sonics I think there is a ton to be desired.   You're using basically a server computer that a medium sized call center  would use... to make music on?   Remember you're a musician, not an IT technician. (you may be in real life.. I don't know).   All that triggered from the Command Station?  Bottom line, it's overkill.  Besides, Kontakt sounds better than Emulator X.   Ask anyone.  The filters crack and sound way to digital and thin on the Creative software.   The code is too thick and there is way too much going on there.  I'll use it from time to time if I need an icey cold patch of samples for an ambient track.  In fact I prefer the sound of Kontakt 2 verses the latest version.  There is slight hardware sound to Kontakt II over Kontakt 4.   If you're gonna make
 music for a living and tour the world, and spend the big money, I know that guys like Kaskade, Dead Mouse, Luisine, are using Fruity Loops Studio, and Ableton.    I think most people agree that they won't mess with Creative's Emulator X.  Besides Emu won't even be around in a couple years.  They released their numbers publicly and they didn't even make $200K for the quarter for 4 quarters in a row.  Notice their products just falling offline more and more.  It's a dying division for Creative. 


Sorry, if I offended you.  Have you thought about getting Emu Ultra sampler?  




On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 2:29 PM, D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@...> wrote:


  








Hunh? Whence this arrogance?
 
I just asked for a recommendation and when asked why I was upgrading my OS, tried to answer? I'm not trying to waste my time with a software vs. hardware flame out.
 
You should know digital audio is pure. That's why people spend so much time time trying to tweak it to recreate that pleasing analog harmonic distortion.
 
I can make the output of your Emulator II + or the Emulator X sound like anything I want.
 
If your point is that for live performance piped right to an amp of mixing console your Emulator II + will sound better than the Emulator X piped straight out of a computer, I'd agree with you.
 
But if you're trying to say that the Emulator II + is superior to the Emulator X for sampling, sample editing and preset building, ... once proper AD/DA conversion is in place ... I don't think you know what your are talking about.

I'm glad the Emulator II + works well for you. But for studio production work the Emulator X works much better for me.
 

DF
CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication.

--- On Sat, 12/4/10, James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...> wrote:


From: James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...>

Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi Junction Box?
To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 12:48 PM





  

You're all caught up in specs.  It's just numbers on paper.   What about the sound?

There is nothing "Emulator" about the Emulator X software.  It sounds like ass.  It's thin and plastic sounding, and the absolute the most coldest sounding soft sampler out there.  So having one of these Dell's with one of these crazy processors and gobs of ram doesn't even matter if the application sucks and sounds poor and unauthentic. 

I'll put my 8-bit Emulator II+ against any Creative piece of software (Emulator X) in a sound test any day.  What you'll get is a full analog path of the Emulator II verses some software that specs out like crazy, but really is one nasty sounding software program.  I have the software so I know. The old E-MU hardware days are gone. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDxOhnL7pjs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oVpWdxW1K0M&feature=related






On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 1:16 PM, Bruno <brunorc@...> wrote:


  



2010/12/4 Matt <somatt@...>

> well, it seems that the industry wants us to go all software in the future... but if you have the money for a octacore with 192gb of ram, then why not buy the full timepiece av?

True :-) 


> On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 11:41 AM, D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@...> wrote:
>> Yes ... 64 bit OS on PC means virtually unlimited access to RAM. Dell is selling Windows 7 Octacore Servers with 192 GB of RAM installed. Layered samples, anyone?

Actually, I keep one 1GB/0.9GHz PC with XP - only to do MIDI things. I
can always use any other machine with whatever MIDI interface as a
slave. But I don't use VSTis, only hardware. 


>> Under XP there is a maximum of 4 GB of RAM available to the system, about 1.2 of which is normally reserved by Windows

False. Only 182 MB with Reaper already launched. No eyecandy, no
fancy-shmancy stuff. XP is bloated out of the box, but can be
optimized to the bone. 


>> Even running 32 bit programs under 64 bit is a huge improvement

False, unless they need to address huge memory areas - I can agree in
case of VSTi samplers, though. And usually they run as separate
processes anyway, so they have ther 4GBs.

Not everything a company says about their products is true. And the
example with samplers/sound modules just shows the case very well. Our
new product is better mostly because we want to sell it. The truth is,
that people tend to love obsoleted synths, sound modules and
sequencers mostly because they don't crash so often and don't force
you to throw pornographic amount of cash to upgrade. And 90% of this
whole 64bit hype remainds me the new, improved Whizzo butter
("containing 10% more or less is absolutely indistinguishable from a
dead crab"). OK, enough ranting, let's go to the merit:

Just wait with your migration to Windows 7 until MOTU ships their new
Timepiece to the sellers :-)

Regards, Bruno

Or u could just get ableton it makes for some mean wobbles
But really though, why using a cs if your emulator x is so badass?
Also: there is a motu forum where people might not be so defensive about their beloved hardware.

Wow. Are you serious? Whoever said you cannot or should not integrate hardware and software? As, for example, in response to a recent thread, 'Gee, why all the fuss about recording CC messages? That's so easy in Cubase.'
 
As far as what's so "bad ass," I must trust you understand the differene between a sound module/ sequencer and a sampler, no?
 
And if I'm offending some territorial hardware taboos by asking here instead of on a MOTU forum, I'm terribly, terribly not sorry.
 
DF
 


CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication.

--- On Sat, 12/4/10, Matt <somatt@...> wrote:


From: Matt <somatt@...>
Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi Junction Box?
To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 2:16 PM


  




<sarcasm>Or u could just get ableton it makes for some mean wobbles</sarcasm> 
But really though, why using a cs if your emulator x is so badass?
Also: there is a motu forum where people might not be so defensive about their beloved hardware. 
On Dec 4, 2010 2:04 PM, "James Ulibarri" <jamesulibarri@...> wrote:
> Just get an Ultralite. Everything you need to stuff through there will work
> fine with that sound card.
> 
> Sorry if I hurt your feelings, heh. It's gonna be alright.
> 
> 
> 
> On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 3:01 PM, Bruno <brunorc@...> wrote:
> 
>>
>>
>> Hmm...
>>
>> 2010/12/4 D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@... <bienpegaito%40yahoo.com>>
>>
>> > I just asked for a recommendation and when asked why I was upgrading my
>> OS, tried to answer? I'm not trying to waste my time with a software vs.
>> hardware flame out.
>>
>> Seems like in fact you have just had hit a spot that's painful for all
>> of us (says the owner of Unitor 8 Mk I - obsoleted on Mac OS X), which
>> in turn provoked some reactions you could find as rough. Sorry.
>>
>> Every now and then we get a nice piece of gear, and then we find out,
>> that new computer/mainboard/OS/whatever will not support it. And it's
>> always frustrating to find out that once again we've got tricked into
>> the same trap.
>>
>> In case of my Unitor I found out that to be able to do MIDI from Mac
>> as well, it would be just cheaper to say "argh" and get the Mk II with
>> USB - I can always stack them later (if there's a need). Also, the
>> story of my PC... the integreted video card doesn't support widescreen
>> modes :-)
>>
>> BTW: is it possible to stack older and newer Timepieces?
>>
>> Cheers, Bruno
>> 
>>

Sorry you took offense to what I mailed it was meant in jest..
But really, why not sequence your emulator x with ableton?
Good luck on your quest upgrading to windows 7.

Re: emus on acid: Checking this out thank you.

OK, James, for giggles I'll layout my basic setup. Thanks for the Emusonacid ... I'll check it out. But I still think you're underestimating Emulator X viz. Sound Forge, WaveLab or whatever. Record the sample; Emulator X chops it, pitch detects it and places it on the correct pitch key and, if you ask nicely, also spreads it up, down or up and down to the next sample on the keyboard ... about 95% accurately. Maybe need to move the loop end position a tad sometimes. I don't get any of that out of my wav editors.
 
I've got Mackie 624 monitors ... my admitted weak link ... in an acoustically treated studio, RME Multiface II interface with optical in from a Mackie ONYX 800 piping my hardware synths. As far as what Kontakt sounds like, yes, unaffected it has a warmer tone than Emulator X ... but by the time I route through my UAD2 cards in the Cubase mixer, either or any softsynth can sound very, very different. Throw in some native effects and adjust to taste.
 
I think you are focusing, and I agree it is a legitimate point of focus, on the sound produced by the hardware or software. I am focused on the variety of sounds that can be brought to the project with ease and precision, and then the sound produced in the mix. And that's why I am not concerned exactly how the sampler 'natively' sounds as much as I am in its ease of use and power for creating the voice/ instrument I want.
 
DF

CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication.

--- On Sat, 12/4/10, James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...> wrote:


From: James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...>
Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi Junction Box?
To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 2:29 PM


  



If you found a tool that works for you then honestly I'm stoked for you.  Don't listen to me or anyone else.  Do what you gotta do.  It's definitely powerful and is packed with a ton of bells and whistles. To my knowledge there really isn't any power users on this list that I am aware of.  For whatever reason there seems to be a bigger following in the UK and they seem to hang out on the Emusonacid forum.  

Regarding Kontakt not being a sampler.  What would one be missing by using Sound Forge or Adobe Audition to simply record an incoming wave an import it into Kontakt?  That's not much of a feature there for arguments sake in defense of Emulator X. 
And if you have been with Kontakt ever since it's first release... can't you hear the difference verses Emulator X?   What monitors do you have?

As they say if you're gonna run software get the most fastest computer you can afford with the most ram and the biggest hardrive.   So you're doing the right thing. :)   My bad if I harshed your party. 







On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 3:12 PM, D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@...> wrote:


  








James ... I think most people would be offended when someone makes a categorical statement that they are, in the other person's opinion, doing something to the neglect of something else on the basis of an assumption on the part of the categorizing individual..
 
But me, not, too. ... and your apology is appreciated.
 
However, I wonder if you really read my last post regarding manipulation of digital audio in a studio context?
 
You are overlooking one giant issue: Kontakt is not a sampler, Emulator X is. Kontakt can manipulate imported samples and play them back ... it cannot sample. Having used Kontakt since the original version up to Kontakt III, I have a good opinion of it and understand why so many 3rd party rompler suppliers use the Kontakt II player.
 
However, as far as importing samples, setting up one shot banks, chopping a vocal for midi, etc., I find the Emulator X to have ... in my view and experience ... a much superior interface and workflow to Kontakt with all that scrolling around to get anywhere. But, obviously, others may see it differently.
 
As far as E-mu going out of business or having soon to be obsolete products, what does that have to do with the price of your Emulator II +? As I'm sure we'd agree, if something works for you, doesn't matter what happens to the company ... as long as your not in need of an 8x8 midi junction box and there are no 64 bit drivers. ;)

 
DF
 


CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication.

--- On Sat, 12/4/10, James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...> wrote:



From: James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...>
Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi Junction Box?
To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 1:56 PM





  

I am not being arrogant.  All I am saying is that keep in mind sound, not specs.  Your Emulator X software with the 64 bit OS crushes the Emulator EII+ on paper, but in sonics I think there is a ton to be desired.   You're using basically a server computer that a medium sized call center  would use... to make music on?   Remember you're a musician, not an IT technician. (you may be in real life.. I don't know).   All that triggered from the Command Station?  Bottom line, it's overkill.  Besides, Kontakt sounds better than Emulator X.   Ask anyone.  The filters crack and sound way to digital and thin on the Creative software.   The code is too thick and there is way too much going on there.  I'll use it from time to time if I need an icey cold patch of samples for an ambient track.  In fact I prefer the sound of Kontakt 2 verses the latest version.  There is slight hardware sound to Kontakt II over Kontakt 4.   If you're gonna make
 music for a living and tour the world, and spend the big money, I know that guys like Kaskade, Dead Mouse, Luisine, are using Fruity Loops Studio, and Ableton.    I think most people agree that they won't mess with Creative's Emulator X.  Besides Emu won't even be around in a couple years.  They released their numbers publicly and they didn't even make $200K for the quarter for 4 quarters in a row.  Notice their products just falling offline more and more.  It's a dying division for Creative. 


Sorry, if I offended you.  Have you thought about getting Emu Ultra sampler?  




On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 2:29 PM, D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@...> wrote:


  








Hunh? Whence this arrogance?
 
I just asked for a recommendation and when asked why I was upgrading my OS, tried to answer? I'm not trying to waste my time with a software vs. hardware flame out.
 
You should know digital audio is pure. That's why people spend so much time time trying to tweak it to recreate that pleasing analog harmonic distortion.
 
I can make the output of your Emulator II + or the Emulator X sound like anything I want.
 
If your point is that for live performance piped right to an amp of mixing console your Emulator II + will sound better than the Emulator X piped straight out of a computer, I'd agree with you.
 
But if you're trying to say that the Emulator II + is superior to the Emulator X for sampling, sample editing and preset building, ... once proper AD/DA conversion is in place ... I don't think you know what your are talking about.

I'm glad the Emulator II + works well for you. But for studio production work the Emulator X works much better for me.
 

DF
CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication.

--- On Sat, 12/4/10, James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...> wrote:


From: James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...> 

Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi Junction Box?
To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 12:48 PM 





  

You're all caught up in specs.  It's just numbers on paper.   What about the sound?

There is nothing "Emulator" about the Emulator X software.  It sounds like ass.  It's thin and plastic sounding, and the absolute the most coldest sounding soft sampler out there.  So having one of these Dell's with one of these crazy processors and gobs of ram doesn't even matter if the application sucks and sounds poor and unauthentic. 

I'll put my 8-bit Emulator II+ against any Creative piece of software (Emulator X) in a sound test any day.  What you'll get is a full analog path of the Emulator II verses some software that specs out like crazy, but really is one nasty sounding software program.  I have the software so I know. The old E-MU hardware days are gone. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDxOhnL7pjs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oVpWdxW1K0M&feature=related






On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 1:16 PM, Bruno <brunorc@...> wrote:


  



2010/12/4 Matt <somatt@...>

> well, it seems that the industry wants us to go all software in the future... but if you have the money for a octacore with 192gb of ram, then why not buy the full timepiece av?

True :-) 


> On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 11:41 AM, D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Yes ... 64 bit OS on PC means virtually unlimited access to RAM. Dell is selling Windows 7 Octacore Servers with 192 GB of RAM installed. Layered samples, anyone?

Actually, I keep one 1GB/0.9GHz PC with XP - only to do MIDI things. I
can always use any other machine with whatever MIDI interface as a
slave. But I don't use VSTis, only hardware. 


>> Under XP there is a maximum of 4 GB of RAM available to the system, about 1.2 of which is normally reserved by Windows

False. Only 182 MB with Reaper already launched. No eyecandy, no
fancy-shmancy stuff. XP is bloated out of the box, but can be
optimized to the bone. 


>> Even running 32 bit programs under 64 bit is a huge improvement

False, unless they need to address huge memory areas - I can agree in
case of VSTi samplers, though. And usually they run as separate
processes anyway, so they have ther 4GBs.

Not everything a company says about their products is true. And the
example with samplers/sound modules just shows the case very well. Our
new product is better mostly because we want to sell it. The truth is,
that people tend to love obsoleted synths, sound modules and
sequencers mostly because they don't crash so often and don't force
you to throw pornographic amount of cash to upgrade. And 90% of this
whole 64bit hype remainds me the new, improved Whizzo butter
("containing 10% more or less is absolutely indistinguishable from a
dead crab"). OK, enough ranting, let's go to the merit:

Just wait with your migration to Windows 7 until MOTU ships their new
Timepiece to the sellers :-)

Regards, Bruno

It's all good, buddy. Since forum posting is a useful, if somewhat awkward type of communication, it is easy sometimes to start proceding on assumptions before we confirm what a person really meant by what we thought the said.
 
Since I know there are people in this forum that worked for E-mu in the day and a lot who are real hardware experts, I thought some of them might have some good advice re the 8x8 midi junction box. I do like my CS, even if I spend most of my time triggering the 'Califooooorniah' sample from Dr. Dre's 'California Love.'
 
Just 'Doit.'
 
DF

CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication.

--- On Sat, 12/4/10, Matt <somatt@...> wrote:


From: Matt <somatt@...>
Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi Junction Box?
To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 2:35 PM


  




Sorry you took offense to what I mailed it was meant in jest..
But really, why not sequence your emulator x with ableton? 
Good luck on your quest upgrading to windows 7. 
On Dec 4, 2010 2:29 PM, "D F Tweedie" <bienpegaito@...> wrote:
> Wow. Are you serious? Whoever said you cannot or should not integrate hardware and software? As, for example, in response to a recent thread, 'Gee, why all the fuss about recording CC messages? That's so easy in Cubase.'
>  
> As far as what's so "bad ass," I must trust you understand the differene between a sound module/ sequencer and a sampler, no?
>  
> And if I'm offending some territorial hardware taboos by asking here instead of on a MOTU forum, I'm terribly, terribly not sorry.
>  
> DF
>  
> 
> 
> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication.
> 
> --- On Sat, 12/4/10, Matt <somatt@...> wrote:
> 
> 
> From: Matt <somatt@...>
> Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi Junction Box?
> To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 2:16 PM
> 
> 
>   
> 
> 
> 
> 
> <sarcasm>Or u could just get ableton it makes for some mean wobbles</sarcasm> 
> But really though, why using a cs if your emulator x is so badass?
> Also: there is a motu forum where people might not be so defensive about their beloved hardware. 
> On Dec 4, 2010 2:04 PM, "James Ulibarri" <jamesulibarri@...> wrote:
>> Just get an Ultralite. Everything you need to stuff through there will work
>> fine with that sound card.
>> 
>> Sorry if I hurt your feelings, heh. It's gonna be alright.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 3:01 PM, Bruno <brunorc@...> wrote:
>> 
>>>
>>>
>>> Hmm...
>>>
>>> 2010/12/4 D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@... <bienpegaito%40yahoo.com>>
>>>
>>> > I just asked for a recommendation and when asked why I was upgrading my
>>> OS, tried to answer? I'm not trying to waste my time with a software vs.
>>> hardware flame out.
>>>
>>> Seems like in fact you have just had hit a spot that's painful for all
>>> of us (says the owner of Unitor 8 Mk I - obsoleted on Mac OS X), which
>>> in turn provoked some reactions you could find as rough. Sorry.
>>>
>>> Every now and then we get a nice piece of gear, and then we find out,
>>> that new computer/mainboard/OS/whatever will not support it. And it's
>>> always frustrating to find out that once again we've got tricked into
>>> the same trap.
>>>
>>> In case of my Unitor I found out that to be able to do MIDI from Mac
>>> as well, it would be just cheaper to say "argh" and get the Mk II with
>>> USB - I can always stack them later (if there's a need). Also, the
>>> story of my PC... the integreted video card doesn't support widescreen
>>> modes :-)
>>>
>>> BTW: is it possible to stack older and newer Timepieces?
>>>
>>> Cheers, Bruno
>>> 
>>>
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>

Honestly I am not being sarcastic here. With soft sequencing you could ditch the timepiece (and maybe even MIDI protocol altogether) and just rock a simple nice soundcard or audio interface.

Whew! Glad I could finally make my point, James.
 
FWIW I just picked up Emulator X3 ... again about migrating to 64 bit ... for $184.00 on Amazon. It includes the about 30GB of banks including the entire Xtreme Lead and Studio Grand, as well as parts of most of the other ROMs. If it's end of line, even though E-mu denies it is, the price will probably drop some more. 
 
The main reason I prefer it to anyother softsampler is the way it works with the 3 part navigation tree on the left and the good sized window to the right where you work. Unlike Kontakt where you are always scrolling or hitting buttons to get different views, in Emulator X you simply click on the bank, preset with exploding 3 sub parts of voices. link or processing, sample in the sample pool and .. voila ... immediately your looking at your targeted work area. 
 
Want to make a layered sample preset? Takes literally less than a minute with select the first preset's link window, click to add link, go in the drop down box and select another preset (or 3 or 4) and then keyboard split/ fade and velocity fade to taste. All done. Click one button to save it as a new preset. C'mon, you can't beat it!
 
DF

CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication.

--- On Sat, 12/4/10, James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...> wrote:


From: James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi Junction Box?
To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 2:58 PM


  



Ok, I see your point on the Emulator X being a real sampler now. 
That makes sense.  You're using it as a real sampler then. 

You don't really need anyone's help here.  Respect on the RME!




On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 3:47 PM, D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@...> wrote:


  








OK, James, for giggles I'll layout my basic setup. Thanks for the Emusonacid ... I'll check it out. But I still think you're underestimating Emulator X viz. Sound Forge, WaveLab or whatever. Record the sample; Emulator X chops it, pitch detects it and places it on the correct pitch key and, if you ask nicely, also spreads it up, down or up and down to the next sample on the keyboard ... about 95% accurately. Maybe need to move the loop end position a tad sometimes. I don't get any of that out of my wav editors.
 
I've got Mackie 624 monitors ... my admitted weak link ... in an acoustically treated studio, RME Multiface II interface with optical in from a Mackie ONYX 800 piping my hardware synths. As far as what Kontakt sounds like, yes, unaffected it has a warmer tone than Emulator X ... but by the time I route through my UAD2 cards in the Cubase mixer, either or any softsynth can sound very, very different. Throw in some native effects and adjust to taste.
 
I think you are focusing, and I agree it is a legitimate point of focus, on the sound produced by the hardware or software. I am focused on the variety of sounds that can be brought to the project with ease and precision, and then the sound produced in the mix. And that's why I am not concerned exactly how the sampler 'natively' sounds as much as I am in its ease of use and power for creating the voice/ instrument I want.

 
DF

CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication.

--- On Sat, 12/4/10, James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...> wrote:



From: James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...>
Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi Junction Box?
To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 2:29 PM





  

If you found a tool that works for you then honestly I'm stoked for you.  Don't listen to me or anyone else.  Do what you gotta do.  It's definitely powerful and is packed with a ton of bells and whistles. To my knowledge there really isn't any power users on this list that I am aware of.  For whatever reason there seems to be a bigger following in the UK and they seem to hang out on the Emusonacid forum.  

Regarding Kontakt not being a sampler.  What would one be missing by using Sound Forge or Adobe Audition to simply record an incoming wave an import it into Kontakt?  That's not much of a feature there for arguments sake in defense of Emulator X. 
And if you have been with Kontakt ever since it's first release... can't you hear the difference verses Emulator X?   What monitors do you have?

As they say if you're gonna run software get the most fastest computer you can afford with the most ram and the biggest hardrive.   So you're doing the right thing. :)   My bad if I harshed your party. 







On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 3:12 PM, D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@yahoo.com> wrote:


  








James ... I think most people would be offended when someone makes a categorical statement that they are, in the other person's opinion, doing something to the neglect of something else on the basis of an assumption on the part of the categorizing individual..
 
But me, not, too. ... and your apology is appreciated.
 
However, I wonder if you really read my last post regarding manipulation of digital audio in a studio context?
 
You are overlooking one giant issue: Kontakt is not a sampler, Emulator X is. Kontakt can manipulate imported samples and play them back ... it cannot sample. Having used Kontakt since the original version up to Kontakt III, I have a good opinion of it and understand why so many 3rd party rompler suppliers use the Kontakt II player.
 
However, as far as importing samples, setting up one shot banks, chopping a vocal for midi, etc., I find the Emulator X to have ... in my view and experience ... a much superior interface and workflow to Kontakt with all that scrolling around to get anywhere. But, obviously, others may see it differently.
 
As far as E-mu going out of business or having soon to be obsolete products, what does that have to do with the price of your Emulator II +? As I'm sure we'd agree, if something works for you, doesn't matter what happens to the company ... as long as your not in need of an 8x8 midi junction box and there are no 64 bit drivers. ;)

 
DF
 


CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication.

--- On Sat, 12/4/10, James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...> wrote:



From: James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...>
Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi Junction Box?
To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 1:56 PM 





  

I am not being arrogant.  All I am saying is that keep in mind sound, not specs.  Your Emulator X software with the 64 bit OS crushes the Emulator EII+ on paper, but in sonics I think there is a ton to be desired.   You're using basically a server computer that a medium sized call center  would use... to make music on?   Remember you're a musician, not an IT technician. (you may be in real life.. I don't know).   All that triggered from the Command Station?  Bottom line, it's overkill.  Besides, Kontakt sounds better than Emulator X.   Ask anyone.  The filters crack and sound way to digital and thin on the Creative software.   The code is too thick and there is way too much going on there.  I'll use it from time to time if I need an icey cold patch of samples for an ambient track.  In fact I prefer the sound of Kontakt 2 verses the latest version.  There is slight hardware sound to Kontakt II over Kontakt 4.   If you're gonna make
 music for a living and tour the world, and spend the big money, I know that guys like Kaskade, Dead Mouse, Luisine, are using Fruity Loops Studio, and Ableton.    I think most people agree that they won't mess with Creative's Emulator X.  Besides Emu won't even be around in a couple years.  They released their numbers publicly and they didn't even make $200K for the quarter for 4 quarters in a row.  Notice their products just falling offline more and more.  It's a dying division for Creative. 


Sorry, if I offended you.  Have you thought about getting Emu Ultra sampler?  




On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 2:29 PM, D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@...> wrote:


  








Hunh? Whence this arrogance?
 
I just asked for a recommendation and when asked why I was upgrading my OS, tried to answer? I'm not trying to waste my time with a software vs. hardware flame out.
 
You should know digital audio is pure. That's why people spend so much time time trying to tweak it to recreate that pleasing analog harmonic distortion.
 
I can make the output of your Emulator II + or the Emulator X sound like anything I want.
 
If your point is that for live performance piped right to an amp of mixing console your Emulator II + will sound better than the Emulator X piped straight out of a computer, I'd agree with you.
 
But if you're trying to say that the Emulator II + is superior to the Emulator X for sampling, sample editing and preset building, ... once proper AD/DA conversion is in place ... I don't think you know what your are talking about.

I'm glad the Emulator II + works well for you. But for studio production work the Emulator X works much better for me.
 

DF
CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication.

--- On Sat, 12/4/10, James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@gmail.com> wrote:


From: James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...> 

Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi Junction Box?
To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 12:48 PM 





  

You're all caught up in specs.  It's just numbers on paper.   What about the sound?

There is nothing "Emulator" about the Emulator X software.  It sounds like ass.  It's thin and plastic sounding, and the absolute the most coldest sounding soft sampler out there.  So having one of these Dell's with one of these crazy processors and gobs of ram doesn't even matter if the application sucks and sounds poor and unauthentic. 

I'll put my 8-bit Emulator II+ against any Creative piece of software (Emulator X) in a sound test any day.  What you'll get is a full analog path of the Emulator II verses some software that specs out like crazy, but really is one nasty sounding software program.  I have the software so I know. The old E-MU hardware days are gone. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDxOhnL7pjs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oVpWdxW1K0M&feature=related






On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 1:16 PM, Bruno <brunorc@...> wrote:


  



2010/12/4 Matt <somatt@...>

> well, it seems that the industry wants us to go all software in the future... but if you have the money for a octacore with 192gb of ram, then why not buy the full timepiece av?

True :-) 


> On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 11:41 AM, D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@...> wrote:
>> Yes ... 64 bit OS on PC means virtually unlimited access to RAM. Dell is selling Windows 7 Octacore Servers with 192 GB of RAM installed. Layered samples, anyone?

Actually, I keep one 1GB/0.9GHz PC with XP - only to do MIDI things. I
can always use any other machine with whatever MIDI interface as a
slave. But I don't use VSTis, only hardware. 


>> Under XP there is a maximum of 4 GB of RAM available to the system, about 1.2 of which is normally reserved by Windows

False. Only 182 MB with Reaper already launched. No eyecandy, no
fancy-shmancy stuff. XP is bloated out of the box, but can be
optimized to the bone. 


>> Even running 32 bit programs under 64 bit is a huge improvement

False, unless they need to address huge memory areas - I can agree in
case of VSTi samplers, though. And usually they run as separate
processes anyway, so they have ther 4GBs.

Not everything a company says about their products is true. And the
example with samplers/sound modules just shows the case very well. Our
new product is better mostly because we want to sell it. The truth is,
that people tend to love obsoleted synths, sound modules and
sequencers mostly because they don't crash so often and don't force
you to throw pornographic amount of cash to upgrade. And 90% of this
whole 64bit hype remainds me the new, improved Whizzo butter
("containing 10% more or less is absolutely indistinguishable from a
dead crab"). OK, enough ranting, let's go to the merit:

Just wait with your migration to Windows 7 until MOTU ships their new
Timepiece to the sellers :-)

Regards, Bruno

Again, another failure from today's Emu.  If it does all that then
they should be asking $999 for it.  They had no problem asking $8500
for the Emulator in 1984!   If you got X3 for that cheap then you got
the deal of the century.  A year ago I was seeing it for $599.  All I
have is X2 and the necessary dongle midi interface that came with it.
Actually, Emu still in business is de-valuing my SP1200, EII's, and
Emax.   Once they really and trully go out then street prices will go
up even more.  Have you seen the price of an SP1200 on Ebay these
days?   They say Dave Rossum is still chief engineer at Emu Creative.
Seriously?  Besides the wireless midi thing, what have then done since
the Command Station that has been worth anything?  They said on their
Facebook page that they were gonna do an anniversary product
commemorating a legacy product from back in the day.   It never
happened.  Creative probably doesn't want to throw any money in that
end of the company.    Weak sauce.

On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 4:25 PM, D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> Whew! Glad I could finally make my point, James.
>
> FWIW I just picked up Emulator X3 ... again about migrating to 64 bit ... for $184.00 on Amazon. It includes the about 30GB of banks including the entire Xtreme Lead and Studio Grand, as well as parts of most of the other ROMs. If it's end of line, even though E-mu denies it is, the price will probably drop some more.
>
> The main reason I prefer it to anyother softsampler is the way it works with the 3 part navigation tree on the left and the good sized window to the right where you work. Unlike Kontakt where you are always scrolling or hitting buttons to get different views, in Emulator X you simply click on the bank, preset with exploding 3 sub parts of voices. link or processing, sample in the sample pool and .. voila ... immediately your looking at your targeted work area.
>
> Want to make a layered sample preset? Takes literally less than a minute with select the first preset's link window, click to add link, go in the drop down box and select another preset (or 3 or 4) and then keyboard split/ fade and velocity fade to taste. All done. Click one button to save it as a new preset. C'mon, you can't beat it!
>
> DF
>
> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication.
>
> --- On Sat, 12/4/10, James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...> wrote:
>>
>>
>> From: James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@gmail.com>
>> Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi Junction Box?
>> To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
>> Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 2:58 PM
>>
>>
>>
>> Ok, I see your point on the Emulator X being a real sampler now.
>> That makes sense.  You're using it as a real sampler then.
>>
>> You don't really need anyone's help here.  Respect on the RME!
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 3:47 PM, D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@...> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> OK, James, for giggles I'll layout my basic setup. Thanks for the Emusonacid ... I'll check it out. But I still think you're underestimating Emulator X viz. Sound Forge, WaveLab or whatever. Record the sample; Emulator X chops it, pitch detects it and places it on the correct pitch key and, if you ask nicely, also spreads it up, down or up and down to the next sample on the keyboard ... about 95% accurately. Maybe need to move the loop end position a tad sometimes. I don't get any of that out of my wav editors.
>>>
>>> I've got Mackie 624 monitors ... my admitted weak link ... in an acoustically treated studio, RME Multiface II interface with optical in from a Mackie ONYX 800 piping my hardware synths. As far as what Kontakt sounds like, yes, unaffected it has a warmer tone than Emulator X ... but by the time I route through my UAD2 cards in the Cubase mixer, either or any softsynth can sound very, very different. Throw in some native effects and adjust to taste.
>>>
>>> I think you are focusing, and I agree it is a legitimate point of focus, on the sound produced by the hardware or software. I am focused on the variety of sounds that can be brought to the project with ease and precision, and then the sound produced in the mix. And that's why I am not concerned exactly how the sampler 'natively' sounds as much as I am in its ease of use and power for creating the voice/ instrument I want.
>>>
>>> DF
>>>
>>> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication.
>>>
>>> --- On Sat, 12/4/10, James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> From: James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...>
>>>> Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi Junction Box?
>>>> To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
>>>> Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 2:29 PM
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> If you found a tool that works for you then honestly I'm stoked for you.  Don't listen to me or anyone else.  Do what you gotta do.  It's definitely powerful and is packed with a ton of bells and whistles. To my knowledge there really isn't any power users on this list that I am aware of.  For whatever reason there seems to be a bigger following in the UK and they seem to hang out on the Emusonacid forum.
>>>>
>>>> Regarding Kontakt not being a sampler.  What would one be missing by using Sound Forge or Adobe Audition to simply record an incoming wave an import it into Kontakt?  That's not much of a feature there for arguments sake in defense of Emulator X.
>>>> And if you have been with Kontakt ever since it's first release... can't you hear the difference verses Emulator X?   What monitors do you have?
>>>>
>>>> As they say if you're gonna run software get the most fastest computer you can afford with the most ram and the biggest hardrive.   So you're doing the right thing. :)   My bad if I harshed your party.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 3:12 PM, D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@...> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> James ... I think most people would be offended when someone makes a categorical statement that they are, in the other person's opinion, doing something to the neglect of something else on the basis of an assumption on the part of the categorizing individual..
>>>>>
>>>>> But me, not, too. ... and your apology is appreciated.
>>>>>
>>>>> However, I wonder if you really read my last post regarding manipulation of digital audio in a studio context?
>>>>>
>>>>> You are overlooking one giant issue: Kontakt is not a sampler, Emulator X is. Kontakt can manipulate imported samples and play them back ... it cannot sample. Having used Kontakt since the original version up to Kontakt III, I have a good opinion of it and understand why so many 3rd party rompler suppliers use the Kontakt II player.
>>>>>
>>>>> However, as far as importing samples, setting up one shot banks, chopping a vocal for midi, etc., I find the Emulator X to have ... in my view and experience ... a much superior interface and workflow to Kontakt with all that scrolling around to get anywhere. But, obviously, others may see it differently.
>>>>>
>>>>> As far as E-mu going out of business or having soon to be obsolete products, what does that have to do with the price of your Emulator II +? As I'm sure we'd agree, if something works for you, doesn't matter what happens to the company ... as long as your not in need of an 8x8 midi junction box and there are no 64 bit drivers. ;)
>>>>>
>>>>> DF
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication.
>>>>>
>>>>> --- On Sat, 12/4/10, James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> From: James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@gmail.com>
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi Junction Box?
>>>>>> To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
>>>>>> Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 1:56 PM
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I am not being arrogant.  All I am saying is that keep in mind sound, not specs.  Your Emulator X software with the 64 bit OS crushes the Emulator EII+ on paper, but in sonics I think there is a ton to be desired.   You're using basically a server computer that a medium sized call center  would use... to make music on?   Remember you're a musician, not an IT technician. (you may be in real life.. I don't know).   All that triggered from the Command Station?  Bottom line, it's overkill.  Besides, Kontakt sounds better than Emulator X.   Ask anyone.  The filters crack and sound way to digital and thin on the Creative software.   The code is too thick and there is way too much going on there.  I'll use it from time to time if I need an icey cold patch of samples for an ambient track.  In fact I prefer the sound of Kontakt 2 verses the latest version.  There is slight hardware sound to Kontakt II over Kontakt 4.   If you're gonna make music for a living and tour the world, and spend the big money, I know that guys like Kaskade, Dead Mouse, Luisine, are using Fruity Loops Studio, and Ableton.    I think most people agree that they won't mess with Creative's Emulator X.  Besides Emu won't even be around in a couple years.  They released their numbers publicly and they didn't even make $200K for the quarter for 4 quarters in a row.  Notice their products just falling offline more and more.  It's a dying division for Creative.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sorry, if I offended you.  Have you thought about getting Emu Ultra sampler?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 2:29 PM, D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@...> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hunh? Whence this arrogance?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I just asked for a recommendation and when asked why I was upgrading my OS, tried to answer? I'm not trying to waste my time with a software vs. hardware flame out.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You should know digital audio is pure. That's why people spend so much time time trying to tweak it to recreate that pleasing analog harmonic distortion.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I can make the output of your Emulator II + or the Emulator X sound like anything I want.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> If your point is that for live performance piped right to an amp of mixing console your Emulator II + will sound better than the Emulator X piped straight out of a computer, I'd agree with you.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But if you're trying to say that the Emulator II + is superior to the Emulator X for sampling, sample editing and preset building, ... once proper AD/DA conversion is in place ... I don't think you know what your are talking about.
>>>>>>> I'm glad the Emulator II + works well for you. But for studio production work the Emulator X works much better for me.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> DF
>>>>>>> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --- On Sat, 12/4/10, James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> From: James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi Junction Box?
>>>>>>>> To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
>>>>>>>> Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 12:48 PM
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> You're all caught up in specs.  It's just numbers on paper.   What about the sound?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> There is nothing "Emulator" about the Emulator X software.  It sounds like ass.  It's thin and plastic sounding, and the absolute the most coldest sounding soft sampler out there.  So having one of these Dell's with one of these crazy processors and gobs of ram doesn't even matter if the application sucks and sounds poor and unauthentic.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I'll put my 8-bit Emulator II+ against any Creative piece of software (Emulator X) in a sound test any day.  What you'll get is a full analog path of the Emulator II verses some software that specs out like crazy, but really is one nasty sounding software program.  I have the software so I know. The old E-MU hardware days are gone.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDxOhnL7pjs
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oVpWdxW1K0M&feature=related
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 1:16 PM, Bruno <brunorc@...> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> 2010/12/4 Matt <somatt@...>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> > well, it seems that the industry wants us to go all software in the future... but if you have the money for a octacore with 192gb of ram, then why not buy the full timepiece av?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> True :-)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> > On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 11:41 AM, D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@...> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> >> Yes ... 64 bit OS on PC means virtually unlimited access to RAM. Dell is selling Windows 7 Octacore Servers with 192 GB of RAM installed. Layered samples, anyone?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Actually, I keep one 1GB/0.9GHz PC with XP - only to do MIDI things. I
>>>>>>>>> can always use any other machine with whatever MIDI interface as a
>>>>>>>>> slave. But I don't use VSTis, only hardware.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> >> Under XP there is a maximum of 4 GB of RAM available to the system, about 1.2 of which is normally reserved by Windows
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> False. Only 182 MB with Reaper already launched. No eyecandy, no
>>>>>>>>> fancy-shmancy stuff. XP is bloated out of the box, but can be
>>>>>>>>> optimized to the bone.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> >> Even running 32 bit programs under 64 bit is a huge improvement
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> False, unless they need to address huge memory areas - I can agree in
>>>>>>>>> case of VSTi samplers, though. And usually they run as separate
>>>>>>>>> processes anyway, so they have ther 4GBs.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Not everything a company says about their products is true. And the
>>>>>>>>> example with samplers/sound modules just shows the case very well. Our
>>>>>>>>> new product is better mostly because we want to sell it. The truth is,
>>>>>>>>> that people tend to love obsoleted synths, sound modules and
>>>>>>>>> sequencers mostly because they don't crash so often and don't force
>>>>>>>>> you to throw pornographic amount of cash to upgrade. And 90% of this
>>>>>>>>> whole 64bit hype remainds me the new, improved Whizzo butter
>>>>>>>>> ("containing 10% more or less is absolutely indistinguishable from a
>>>>>>>>> dead crab"). OK, enough ranting, let's go to the merit:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Just wait with your migration to Windows 7 until MOTU ships their new
>>>>>>>>> Timepiece to the sellers :-)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Regards, Bruno
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
>

Agreed. It's Creative, not the E-mu guys. Ichi now works for UAD on the DSP cards.

Let's hope Creative decides to cast it off and some bright somebody buys all those proprietary rights and starts it up again. That happened to Harley Davison motorcycles.

Anyway, here is the link.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/638901-REG/E_MU_24_56192_Emulator_X3.html

The Creative/ E-mu shop still shows it for $499.00 disconted from $699.00. That is also the price Sweetwater sells it for. I read somewhere from an E-mu guy that if you buy from non-authorized sellers, if you use up your installations on your original disk, E-mu will not replace the disk. This doesn't make sense to me, as I can't see how a CD can keep track, unless it has some little counter in the registry entries ... but we know how to sweep those!

I bought mine on Amazon before I found this price. It came shrink wrapped and new.

Seriously, at this price it is a no-brainer. 

Here's a review from Computer Music for the curious.

http://computermusicreviews.blogspot.com/2009/05/e-mu-emulator-x3-350-pc.html

DF


CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication.


--- On Sat, 12/4/10, James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...> wrote:

> From: James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...>
> Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi Junction Box?
> To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 3:46 PM
> Again, another failure from today's
> Emu.  If it does all that then
> they should be asking $999 for it.  They had no
> problem asking $8500
> for the Emulator in 1984!   If you got X3
> for that cheap then you got
> the deal of the century.  A year ago I was seeing it
> for $599.  All I
> have is X2 and the necessary dongle midi interface that
> came with it.
> Actually, Emu still in business is de-valuing my SP1200,
> EII's, and
> Emax.   Once they really and trully go out
> then street prices will go
> up even more.  Have you seen the price of an SP1200 on
> Ebay these
> days?   They say Dave Rossum is still chief
> engineer at Emu Creative.
> Seriously?  Besides the wireless midi thing, what have
> then done since
> the Command Station that has been worth anything? 
> They said on their
> Facebook page that they were gonna do an anniversary
> product
> commemorating a legacy product from back in the
> day.   It never
> happened.  Creative probably doesn't want to throw any
> money in that
> end of the company.    Weak sauce.
> 
> On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 4:25 PM, D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@...>
> wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > Whew! Glad I could finally make my point, James.
> >
> > FWIW I just picked up Emulator X3 ... again about
> migrating to 64 bit ... for $184.00 on Amazon. It includes
> the about 30GB of banks including the entire Xtreme Lead
> and Studio Grand, as well as parts of most of the other
> ROMs. If it's end of line, even though E-mu denies it is,
> the price will probably drop some more.
> >
> > The main reason I prefer it to anyother softsampler is
> the way it works with the 3 part navigation tree on the
> left and the good sized window to the right where you work.
> Unlike Kontakt where you are always scrolling or hitting
> buttons to get different views, in Emulator X you simply
> click on the bank, preset with exploding 3 sub parts of
> voices. link or processing, sample in the sample pool
> and .. voila ... immediately your looking at your targeted
> work area.
> >
> > Want to make a layered sample preset? Takes literally
> less than a minute with select the first preset's link
> window, click to add link, go in the drop down box and
> select another preset (or 3 or 4) and then keyboard split/
> fade and velocity fade to taste. All done. Click one button
> to save it as a new preset. C'mon, you can't beat it!
> >
> > DF
> >
> > CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its
> contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged
> information. It is solely for the use of the intended
> recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or
> disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws
> including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you
> are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender
> and destroy all copies of the communication.
> >
> > --- On Sat, 12/4/10, James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...>
> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> From: James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...>
> >> Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi Junction Box?
> >> To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
> >> Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 2:58 PM
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Ok, I see your point on the Emulator X being a
> real sampler now.
> >> That makes sense.  You're using it as a real
> sampler then.
> >>
> >> You don't really need anyone's help here. 
> Respect on the RME!
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 3:47 PM, D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> OK, James, for giggles I'll layout my basic
> setup. Thanks for the Emusonacid ... I'll check it out. But
> I still think you're underestimating Emulator X viz. Sound
> Forge, WaveLab or whatever. Record the sample; Emulator X
> chops it, pitch detects it and places it on the correct
> pitch key and, if you ask nicely, also spreads it up, down
> or up and down to the next sample on the keyboard ... about
> 95% accurately. Maybe need to move the loop end position a
> tad sometimes. I don't get any of that out of my wav
> editors.
> >>>
> >>> I've got Mackie 624 monitors ... my admitted
> weak link ... in an acoustically treated studio, RME
> Multiface II interface with optical in from a Mackie ONYX
> 800 piping my hardware synths. As far as what Kontakt sounds
> like, yes, unaffected it has a warmer tone than Emulator X
> ... but by the time I route through my UAD2 cards in the
> Cubase mixer, either or any softsynth can sound very, very
> different. Throw in some native effects and adjust to
> taste.
> >>>
> >>> I think you are focusing, and I agree it is a
> legitimate point of focus, on the sound produced by the
> hardware or software. I am focused on the variety of sounds
> that can be brought to the project with ease and precision,
> and then the sound produced in the mix. And that's why I am
> not concerned exactly how the sampler 'natively' sounds as
> much as I am in its ease of use and power for creating the
> voice/ instrument I want.
> >>>
> >>> DF
> >>>
> >>> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication
> with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally
> privileged information. It is solely for the use of the
> intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review,
> use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable
> laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If
> you are not the intended recipient, please contact the
> sender and destroy all copies of the communication.
> >>>
> >>> --- On Sat, 12/4/10, James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...>
> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> From: James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...>
> >>>> Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi Junction Box?
> >>>> To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
> >>>> Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 2:29 PM
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> If you found a tool that works for you
> then honestly I'm stoked for you.  Don't listen to me or
> anyone else.  Do what you gotta do.  It's definitely
> powerful and is packed with a ton of bells and whistles. To
> my knowledge there really isn't any power users on this list
> that I am aware of.  For whatever reason there seems to be
> a bigger following in the UK and they seem to hang out on
> the Emusonacid forum.
> >>>>
> >>>> Regarding Kontakt not being a sampler. 
> What would one be missing by using Sound Forge or Adobe
> Audition to simply record an incoming wave an import it into
> Kontakt?  That's not much of a feature there for arguments
> sake in defense of Emulator X.
> >>>> And if you have been with Kontakt ever
> since it's first release... can't you hear the difference
> verses Emulator X?   What monitors do you have?
> >>>>
> >>>> As they say if you're gonna run software
> get the most fastest computer you can afford with the most
> ram and the biggest hardrive.   So you're doing the right
> thing. :)   My bad if I harshed your party.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 3:12 PM, D F
> Tweedie <bienpegaito@...>
> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> James ... I think most people would be
> offended when someone makes a categorical statement that
> they are, in the other person's opinion, doing something to
> the neglect of something else on the basis of an assumption
> on the part of the categorizing individual..
> >>>>>
> >>>>> But me, not, too. ... and your apology
> is appreciated.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> However, I wonder if you really read
> my last post regarding manipulation of digital audio in a
> studio context?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> You are overlooking one giant issue:
> Kontakt is not a sampler, Emulator X is. Kontakt can
> manipulate imported samples and play them back ... it cannot
> sample. Having used Kontakt since the original version up to
> Kontakt III, I have a good opinion of it and understand why
> so many 3rd party rompler suppliers use the Kontakt II
> player.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> However, as far as importing samples,
> setting up one shot banks, chopping a vocal for midi, etc.,
> I find the Emulator X to have ... in my view and experience
> ... a much superior interface and workflow to Kontakt with
> all that scrolling around to get anywhere. But, obviously,
> others may see it differently.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> As far as E-mu going out of business
> or having soon to be obsolete products, what does that have
> to do with the price of your Emulator II +? As I'm sure we'd
> agree, if something works for you, doesn't matter what
> happens to the company ... as long as your not in need of an
> 8x8 midi junction box and there are no 64 bit drivers. ;)
> >>>>>
> >>>>> DF
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This
> communication with its contents may contain confidential
> and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the
> use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception,
> review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate
> applicable laws including the Electronic Communications
> Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please
> contact the sender and destroy all copies of the
> communication.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> --- On Sat, 12/4/10, James Ulibarri
> <jamesulibarri@...>
> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> From: James Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...>
> >>>>>> Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi Junction
> Box?
> >>>>>> To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
> >>>>>> Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010,
> 1:56 PM
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> I am not being arrogant.  All I
> am saying is that keep in mind sound, not specs.  Your
> Emulator X software with the 64 bit OS crushes the Emulator
> EII+ on paper, but in sonics I think there is a ton to be
> desired.   You're using basically a server computer that a
> medium sized call center  would use... to make music on?  
> Remember you're a musician, not an IT technician. (you may
> be in real life.. I don't know).   All that triggered from
> the Command Station?  Bottom line, it's overkill. 
> Besides, Kontakt sounds better than Emulator X.   Ask
> anyone.  The filters crack and sound way to digital and
> thin on the Creative software.   The code is too thick and
> there is way too much going on there.  I'll use it from
> time to time if I need an icey cold patch of samples for an
> ambient track.  In fact I prefer the sound of Kontakt 2
> verses the latest version.  There is slight hardware sound
> to Kontakt II over Kontakt 4.   If you're gonna make music
> for a living and tour the world, and spend the big money, I
> know that guys like Kaskade, Dead Mouse, Luisine, are using
> Fruity Loops Studio, and Ableton.    I think most people
> agree that they won't mess with Creative's Emulator X. 
> Besides Emu won't even be around in a couple years.  They
> released their numbers publicly and they didn't even make
> $200K for the quarter for 4 quarters in a row.  Notice
> their products just falling offline more and more.  It's a
> dying division for Creative.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Sorry, if I offended you.  Have
> you thought about getting Emu Ultra sampler?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 2:29 PM, D
> F Tweedie <bienpegaito@...>
> wrote:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Hunh? Whence this arrogance?
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> I just asked for a
> recommendation and when asked why I was upgrading my OS,
> tried to answer? I'm not trying to waste my time with a
> software vs. hardware flame out.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> You should know digital audio
> is pure. That's why people spend so much time time trying to
> tweak it to recreate that pleasing analog harmonic
> distortion.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> I can make the output of your
> Emulator II + or the Emulator X sound like anything I want.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> If your point is that for live
> performance piped right to an amp of mixing console your
> Emulator II + will sound better than the Emulator X piped
> straight out of a computer, I'd agree with you.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> But if you're trying to say
> that the Emulator II + is superior to the Emulator X for
> sampling, sample editing and preset building, ... once
> proper AD/DA conversion is in place ... I don't think you
> know what your are talking about.
> >>>>>>> I'm glad the Emulator II +
> works well for you. But for studio production work the
> Emulator X works much better for me.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> DF
> >>>>>>> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This
> communication with its contents may contain confidential
> and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the
> use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception,
> review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate
> applicable laws including the Electronic Communications
> Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please
> contact the sender and destroy all copies of the
> communication.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> --- On Sat, 12/4/10, James
> Ulibarri <jamesulibarri@...>
> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> From: James Ulibarri
> <jamesulibarri@...>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi
> Junction Box?
> >>>>>>>> To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
> >>>>>>>> Date: Saturday, December
> 4, 2010, 12:48 PM
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> You're all caught up in
> specs.  It's just numbers on paper.   What about the
> sound?
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> There is nothing
> "Emulator" about the Emulator X software.  It sounds like
> ass.  It's thin and plastic sounding, and the absolute the
> most coldest sounding soft sampler out there.  So having
> one of these Dell's with one of these crazy processors and
> gobs of ram doesn't even matter if the application sucks and
> sounds poor and unauthentic.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> I'll put my 8-bit Emulator
> II+ against any Creative piece of software (Emulator X) in a
> sound test any day.  What you'll get is a full analog path
> of the Emulator II verses some software that specs out like
> crazy, but really is one nasty sounding software program. 
> I have the software so I know. The old E-MU hardware days
> are gone.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDxOhnL7pjs
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oVpWdxW1K0M&feature=related
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at
> 1:16 PM, Bruno <brunorc@...>
> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> 2010/12/4 Matt <somatt@...>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> > well, it seems
> that the industry wants us to go all software in the
> future... but if you have the money for a octacore with
> 192gb of ram, then why not buy the full timepiece av?
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> True :-)
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> > On Sat, Dec 4,
> 2010 at 11:41 AM, D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>> >> Yes ... 64
> bit OS on PC means virtually unlimited access to RAM. Dell
> is selling Windows 7 Octacore Servers with 192 GB of RAM
> installed. Layered samples, anyone?
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Actually, I keep one
> 1GB/0.9GHz PC with XP - only to do MIDI things. I
> >>>>>>>>> can always use any
> other machine with whatever MIDI interface as a
> >>>>>>>>> slave. But I don't use
> VSTis, only hardware.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> >> Under XP
> there is a maximum of 4 GB of RAM available to the system,
> about 1.2 of which is normally reserved by Windows
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> False. Only 182 MB
> with Reaper already launched. No eyecandy, no
> >>>>>>>>> fancy-shmancy stuff.
> XP is bloated out of the box, but can be
> >>>>>>>>> optimized to the
> bone.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> >> Even running
> 32 bit programs under 64 bit is a huge improvement
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> False, unless they
> need to address huge memory areas - I can agree in
> >>>>>>>>> case of VSTi samplers,
> though. And usually they run as separate
> >>>>>>>>> processes anyway, so
> they have ther 4GBs.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Not everything a
> company says about their products is true. And the
> >>>>>>>>> example with
> samplers/sound modules just shows the case very well. Our
> >>>>>>>>> new product is better
> mostly because we want to sell it. The truth is,
> >>>>>>>>> that people tend to
> love obsoleted synths, sound modules and
> >>>>>>>>> sequencers mostly
> because they don't crash so often and don't force
> >>>>>>>>> you to throw
> pornographic amount of cash to upgrade. And 90% of this
> >>>>>>>>> whole 64bit hype
> remainds me the new, improved Whizzo butter
> >>>>>>>>> ("containing 10% more
> or less is absolutely indistinguishable from a
> >>>>>>>>> dead crab"). OK,
> enough ranting, let's go to the merit:
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Just wait with your
> migration to Windows 7 until MOTU ships their new
> >>>>>>>>> Timepiece to the
> sellers :-)
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Regards, Bruno
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>
> >
> > 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------
> 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
>     xl7-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com
> 
> 
>

Thanks for the link, Bruno. I have Parallel port MOTUs and WinXP, too. I have bookmarked the page in case I ever upgrade to Windows7.
Steve 

--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, Bruno <brunorc@...> wrote:
>
> Just my two cents, which may not solve your problem, but...
> 
> 2010/12/4 D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@...>:
> > I run Windows XP and am getting ready to take the 64 bit plunge to Windows 7.
> >
> > I've got one major problem ... by MOTU Midi Timepiece parallel will no longer work, since there are no 64 bit drivers for it. It will still function standalone, but will be pretty useless without the multi midi port capacity.
> 
> Then why do you want to migrate? Is there any important benefit from
> 64bit OS, that justifies such move?
> 
> Also, you may write to MOTU and nag them about providing the
> appropriate drivers...
> 
> I'm not sure if this would be helpful for you:
> http://www.motunation.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=39457
> 
> Hope this helps,
> 
> Bruno
>

Ditto ... I was so caught up in my defense of Emulator X and migrating to Windows 7 64bit that I overlooked the link!

I'm so happy I was wrong about the unavailability of 64 bit MOTU Drivers that I could spit sand!

This post also answered the other issues I'd heard about problems with the MOTU Midi Express 128 USB having sync problems.

I got my MTV Parallel as a $35.00 throw in on a Craig's List sale ... "never hooked it up, but you can bring it back if you can't get it to work."

A parallel cable with the correct plug heads and a little search on the internet and at MOTU had me up and running.

After reading this post, I think it's time to try to get another couple of these used on e-Bay or where ever.

I would add that I've also been using a E-mu XMidi 2x2 USB on my setup ... can you ever have enough midi ports? ... and it has worked like a charm. Maybe they've got a better product than MOTU?

DF

DF

CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication.

--- On Sun, 12/5/10, steve_the_composer <smw-mail@...> wrote:

From: steve_the_composer <smw-mail@...>
Subject: [xl7] Re: Midi Junction Box?
To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
Date: Sunday, December 5, 2010, 6:13 PM







 



  


    
      
      
      Thanks for the link, Bruno. I have Parallel port MOTUs and WinXP, too. I have bookmarked the page in case I ever upgrade to Windows7.

Steve 



--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, Bruno <brunorc@...> wrote:

>

> Just my two cents, which may not solve your problem, but...

> 

> 2010/12/4 D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@...>:

> > I run Windows XP and am getting ready to take the 64 bit plunge to Windows 7.

> >

> > I've got one major problem ... by MOTU Midi Timepiece parallel will no longer work, since there are no 64 bit drivers for it. It will still function standalone, but will be pretty useless without the multi midi port capacity.

> 

> Then why do you want to migrate? Is there any important benefit from

> 64bit OS, that justifies such move?

> 

> Also, you may write to MOTU and nag them about providing the

> appropriate drivers...

> 

> I'm not sure if this would be helpful for you:

> http://www.motunation.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=39457

> 

> Hope this helps,

> 

> Bruno

>

Sure, I could Matt, but why would I want to when I can have the best of both worlds? 

In general, my hardware synths give me near zero latency, real-time, no CPU load recording of their outputs, as opposed to trying to bus record a softsynth. If I have the voice I want, I'll always choose the hardware.

What is possibly not clear to those that exclusively sequence from hardware is that from within Cubase all of my synths show up as midi outputs available to any track and on most of them I can chose the preset and/ or bank or program changes completely from Cubase for sound searching or recording... and then easily edit them into the midi track if I prefer.

Of course, I do not do this, since I'd rather record where the program change was going to go as a separate audio file at that point in the project. 

With my midi tracks recorded to audio, it's simple to 'save as' the project, dump all the midi instruments and especially softsynths in the 'saved as' project and get straight to audio mixing.

DF

CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication.

--- On Sat, 12/4/10, Matt <somatt@gmail.com> wrote:

From: Matt <somatt@...>
Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi Junction Box?
To: xl7@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 2:56 PM







 



  


    
      
      
      Honestly I am not being sarcastic here. With soft sequencing you could ditch the timepiece (and maybe even MIDI protocol altogether) and just rock a simple nice soundcard or audio interface.
On Dec 4, 2010 2:35 PM, "Matt" <somatt@...> wrote:
> Sorry you took offense to what I mailed it was meant in jest..


> But really, why not sequence your emulator x with ableton?
> Good luck on your quest upgrading to windows 7.
> On Dec 4, 2010 2:29 PM, "D F Tweedie" <bienpegaito@yahoo.com> wrote:


>> Wow. Are you serious? Whoever said you cannot or should not integrate
> hardware and software? As, for example, in response to a recent thread,
> 'Gee, why all the fuss about recording CC messages? That's so easy in


> Cubase.'
>>
>> As far as what's so "bad ass," I must trust you understand the differene
> between a sound module/ sequencer and a sampler, no?
>>
>> And if I'm offending some territorial hardware taboos by asking here


> instead of on a MOTU forum, I'm terribly, terribly not sorry.
>>
>> DF
>>
>>
>>
>> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain


> confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use
> of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or
> disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the


> Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended
> recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the
> communication.
>>
>> --- On Sat, 12/4/10, Matt <somatt@gmail.com> wrote:


>>
>>
>> From: Matt <somatt@...>
>> Subject: Re: [xl7] Midi Junction Box?
>> To: xl7@yahoogroups.com


>> Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 2:16 PM
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> <sarcasm>Or u could just get ableton it makes for some mean
> wobbles</sarcasm>


>> But really though, why using a cs if your emulator x is so badass?
>> Also: there is a motu forum where people might not be so defensive about
> their beloved hardware.
>> On Dec 4, 2010 2:04 PM, "James Ulibarri" <jamesulibarri@...> wrote:


>>> Just get an Ultralite. Everything you need to stuff through there will
> work
>>> fine with that sound card.
>>>
>>> Sorry if I hurt your feelings, heh. It's gonna be alright.


>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 3:01 PM, Bruno <brunorc@...> wrote:
>>>
>>>>

>>>>

>>>> Hmm...
>>>>
>>>> 2010/12/4 D F Tweedie <bienpegaito@... <bienpegaito%40yahoo.com>>


>>>>
>>>> > I just asked for a recommendation and when asked why I was upgrading
> my
>>>> OS, tried to answer? I'm not trying to waste my time with a software vs.


>>>> hardware flame out.
>>>>
>>>> Seems like in fact you have just had hit a spot that's painful for all
>>>> of us (says the owner of Unitor 8 Mk I - obsoleted on Mac OS X), which


>>>> in turn provoked some reactions you could find as rough. Sorry.
>>>>
>>>> Every now and then we get a nice piece of gear, and then we find out,
>>>> that new computer/mainboard/OS/whatever will not support it. And it's


>>>> always frustrating to find out that once again we've got tricked into
>>>> the same trap.
>>>>
>>>> In case of my Unitor I found out that to be able to do MIDI from Mac


>>>> as well, it would be just cheaper to say "argh" and get the Mk II with
>>>> USB - I can always stack them later (if there's a need). Also, the
>>>> story of my PC... the integreted video card doesn't support widescreen


>>>> modes :-)
>>>>
>>>> BTW: is it possible to stack older and newer Timepieces?
>>>>
>>>> Cheers, Bruno
>>>>
>>>>


>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>

I have motu 2x2 USB and drivers are bloated and require a bunch of install. Other USB midi devices didn't.
My 2 ¢
-matt