Emu XL-7 & MP-7 User's Group

I agree actually, I think in a few years we'll see a revival of NV-VSTi's 
(non-virtual VSTi's).  Even if it means that they simply package the 
VSTi's into hardware controllers (which basically what a VA is now).  See, 
manufacturer's didn't learn this lesson the firs time around, which was 
only a few years ago ironically enough.  At the time all of analog 
keyboards started to lose favor with people looking for "more portable" 
and "easier to store presets" in a synth.  So we got a bunch of menu 
driven synths that while maybe more powerful, we're ultimately less fun to 
program (arguably of course).  So you see this big influx of keyboards 
recently with more knobs and less menu drive.

The softsynth phenomenom is the same thing IMO.  Yeah they sound really 
cool, and yeah they're easy to back up, but they're not much fun to PLAY 
and program unless you have a dedicated control surface for each one! Very 
few control surfaces built today can cope with more than VSTi template in 
a way that barely approaches elegance.  And you have to have one with 
expensive endless rotaries to even stand a chance at decent workflow.

rEalm



In my opinion, the whole softsynth thing is a fad that will 
pass...eventually.








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My thought exactly. Amen.

Cheers.

erik_magrini@... wrote:
> In my opinion, the whole softsynth thing is a fad that will
> pass...eventually.
-- 
Sebastien,
-=-=-=-=-=
Time was invented by an Irish guy named O'Clock.

>I agree actually, I think in a few years we'll see a revival of NV-VSTi's
>(non-virtual VSTi's).  Even if it means that they simply package the
>VSTi's into hardware controllers (which basically what a VA is now).

The XX7 is really cool hardware controller i have a lot of fun with console 
+ vstis, console let you map directly any cc to any controllable soft synth 
parameter, so if you want to set up the controls at your softsynth like the 
knobs at the XX7 you didnt even have to look at the softsynth manual, 
console does mapping the way you want to... once you linked your set of 
instruments and fx like you want to have it there is the possibility to 
store over-all presets, containing all the vst, vsti and mixer settings, so 
you didnt have to close your set and open a new one to keep playing a 
different preset-set. I said before that it isnt possible to mix internal 
and external sequenzer, but with an XX7 there is not so much need for it 
either, you may use cubase or any other sequenzer, midi yoke, and lets go- 
until there are vsti-loadable [hardware] instruments affordable i highly 
recomend playing around with console or VSTack if your PC is powerfull 
enough

Turby

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> I agree actually, I think in a few years we'll see a revival 
> of NV-VSTi's (non-virtual VSTi's)

www.muse-research.com

The Receptor is gonna ROCK!

-m@

> I agree actually, I think in a few years we'll see a revival 
> of NV-VSTi's 
> (non-virtual VSTi's).

See also, the Chameleon
www.soundart-hot.com

-m@

I whole heartedly agree.  I've downloaded tons of demo versions and not a single one has 
had more than a few uses.  Interface just is not there and by the time you spend the cash 
on a good hardware midi interface... you may have well just bought a synth in the first 
place.

--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, erik_magrini@B... wrote:

> 
> The softsynth phenomenom is the same thing IMO.  Yeah they sound really 
> cool, and yeah they're easy to back up, but they're not much fun to PLAY 
> and program unless you have a dedicated control surface for each one! Very 
> few control surfaces built today can cope with more than VSTi template in 
> a way that barely approaches elegance.  And you have to have one with 
> expensive endless rotaries to even stand a chance at decent workflow.
> 
> rEalm
> 
> 
> 
> In my opinion, the whole softsynth thing is a fad that will 
> pass...eventually.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>

The main problem with using the XX-7 as a controller (and I do it all the 
time), is that as soon as you change VSTi's or even patches on the VSTi's, 
the knobs no longer reflect what the current settings are on the new VSTi 
(patch).  So before you can tweak anything, you need to reset all of the 
physical knobs so that they match the knob positions on screen each time 
you change presets.  It's not Emu's fault, this is something that all 
controllers currently have to deal with.  Thus why I said you almost need 
a seperate control suface for each VSTi.

rEalm





The XX7 is really cool hardware controller i have a lot of fun with 
console 
+ vstis, console let you map directly any cc to any controllable soft 
synth 
parameter, so if you want to set up the controls at your softsynth like 
the 
knobs at the XX7 you didnt even have to look at the softsynth manual, 
console does mapping the way you want to... once you linked your set of 
instruments and fx like you want to have it there is the possibility to 
store over-all presets, containing all the vst, vsti and mixer settings, 
so 
you didnt have to close your set and open a new one to keep playing a 
different preset-set.
 






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your right at this point, vsti programmers should implement soft takeover, 
like NI does, or hardware controllers should use endless knobs like the 
doepfer pocket dial...

>From: erik_magrini@...
>
>The main problem with using the XX-7 as a controller (and I do it all the
>time), is that as soon as you change VSTi's or even patches on the VSTi's,
>the knobs no longer reflect what the current settings are on the new VSTi
>(patch).  So before you can tweak anything, you need to reset all of the
>physical knobs so that they match the knob positions on screen each time
>you change presets.  It's not Emu's fault, this is something that all
>controllers currently have to deal with.  Thus why I said you almost need
>a seperate control suface for each VSTi.
>
>rEalm
>
>
>
>
>
>The XX7 is really cool hardware controller i have a lot of fun with
>console
>+ vstis, console let you map directly any cc to any controllable soft
>synth
>parameter, so if you want to set up the controls at your softsynth like
>the
>knobs at the XX7 you didnt even have to look at the softsynth manual,
>console does mapping the way you want to... once you linked your set of
>instruments and fx like you want to have it there is the possibility to
>store over-all presets, containing all the vst, vsti and mixer settings,
>so
>you didnt have to close your set and open a new one to keep playing a
>different preset-set.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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yep that sounds about right realm, do you rember us talking about 
this alot about a year ago? what you say is also true for hardware 
as well.

Just a thought

Mike G.


--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, erik_magrini@B... wrote:
> The main problem with using the XX-7 as a controller (and I do it 
all the 
> time), is that as soon as you change VSTi's or even patches on the 
VSTi's, 
> the knobs no longer reflect what the current settings are on the 
new VSTi 
> (patch).  So before you can tweak anything, you need to reset all 
of the 
> physical knobs so that they match the knob positions on screen 
each time 
> you change presets.  It's not Emu's fault, this is something that 
all 
> controllers currently have to deal with.  Thus why I said you 
almost need 
> a seperate control suface for each VSTi.
> 
> rEalm
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The XX7 is really cool hardware controller i have a lot of fun 
with 
> console 
> + vstis, console let you map directly any cc to any controllable 
soft 
> synth 
> parameter, so if you want to set up the controls at your softsynth 
like 
> the 
> knobs at the XX7 you didnt even have to look at the softsynth 
manual, 
> console does mapping the way you want to... once you linked your 
set of 
> instruments and fx like you want to have it there is the 
possibility to 
> store over-all presets, containing all the vst, vsti and mixer 
settings, 
> so 
> you didnt have to close your set and open a new one to keep 
playing a 
> different preset-set.
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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Yep, the bane of my life when I play out live too :) 

Sorry, I don't remember the conversation last year, but don't feel bad, I 
forgot most of yesterday already too.

rEalm



what you say is also true for hardware as well.


 






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Don't know why I haven't thought of it before, or perhaps it's already been mentioned.
 
www.livepa.org
 
Any of you who produce and perform (key word there) some form of electronic dance music, or experimental, whatever, music that centers around beats and technology etc.
You should check out this site.  I know several of the people on there use command stations  ;)  
It's a very small tight knit community of live electronic musicians from around the world.  The forum moves very slow, but the experience and advice on there is amazing.
I know several of you are into this, rEalm comes to mind... 
Either way, like I said, this site might have been mentioned already, but if not, or for anyone who didn't already know, if you're into the art of Live PA, come check out this site.  And NO, I don't work for them, it's a user driven site, there's nothing corporate about it.  There used to be an email list, the livePA topica list, and it sort of evolved into a site that several of the topica members put together.
I do this because the forum there really does move slow, and it's always to have fresh opinions and experience brought to the table.
 
Peace,
 
Wesley 

		
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Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs 

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Yeah, I used to visit that place now and then, but as you mention, the 
forum is really slow, so I stopped.  I'll have to headback over there soon 
though, good tip, lots of info hidden on that site.

rEalm





www.livepa.org
 
I know several of you are into this, rEalm comes to mind... 

I do this because the forum there really does move slow, and it's always 
to have fresh opinions and experience brought to the table.
 

 






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don't know why i never thought of using my XL-7 as a controller for softsynths 
before. what a great idea! i use an oxygen8 as well. it's true that it sucks that 
the controllers physical postions won't track changes in patches, but the 
increase is usability more than makes up for it with me. and assigning 
controller to the keyboard (typing keyboard, not MIDI) works well too.

i truly truly hope you're right that softsynths are a fad. it would be nice if they'd 
settle down into their proper place in a few years, and everyone stopped 
acting like they're the answer to all the world's problems. i have scary visions 
of desperately searching for used and beat-up hardware synths 10 years from 
now...

remember when everyone thought that digital and hard disk recording was 
the greatest thing since sliced bread? and people ditched all their hardware. 
now everyone wants cool, fat, warm, etc. etc. analog outboard. the swell part 
is that now the market is full of great sounding, affordable analog gear aimed 
at home/project studios.

with a little luck, something similar might happen with harware synths.

--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, erik_magrini@B... wrote:

> Yep, the bane of my life when I play out live too :) 
> 
> Sorry, I don't remember the conversation last year, but don't feel bad, I 
> forgot most of yesterday already too.
> 
> rEalm
> 
> 
> 
> what you say is also true for hardware as well.
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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don't know why i never thought of using my XL-7 as a controller for 
softsynths before. what a great idea!

>>>Check the files section of thise group too, I've already made a bunch 
of Multisetups for controlling Reason synths and some other VSTi's. <<<

i truly truly hope you're right that softsynths are a fad. it would be 
nice if they'd settle down into their proper place in a few years, and 
everyone stopped acting like they're the answer to all the world's 
problems. 

>>>Yeah, they definitely have their place, and you can't deny how good 
things like Pro-53 and Z3ta+ sound, but I don't think they're the be all 
and end all of audio synthesis.  As with all things, I guess it's just a 
matter of recognizing the strenths and weaknesses of both, and playing 
each to your advantage. <<<

rEalm
(good topic BTW)











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rEalm we where going back and forth with Aaron trying to figure out 
if the pocket dial would work with the xl-7 but it wont work :(

None of my hardware except my yamaha mixer has the "proper" 
encoders.  all synths and samplers and controllers should make this 
manditory !!  

--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, erik_magrini@B... wrote:
> Yep, the bane of my life when I play out live too :) 
> 

INDEED!

> Sorry, I don't remember the conversation last year, but don't feel 
bad, I 
> forgot most of yesterday already too.
> 
> rEalm
> 
> 
> 
> what you say is also true for hardware as well.

The totaly lack of encoders over pots


> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
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Cool, can you tell me what I did yesterday too? :)

rEalm





mike <curiousproductions@...>
05/12/2004 10:43 AM
Please respond to xl7

 
        To:     xl7@yahoogroups.com
        cc: 

        Subject:        [xl7] Re: soft synths a fad?


rEalm we where going back and forth with Aaron trying to figure out 
if the pocket dial would work with the xl-7 but it wont work :(

None of my hardware except my yamaha mixer has the "proper" 
encoders.  all synths and samplers and controllers should make this 
manditory !! 

--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, erik_magrini@B... wrote:
> Yep, the bane of my life when I play out live too :) 
> 

INDEED!

> Sorry, I don't remember the conversation last year, but don't feel 
bad, I 
> forgot most of yesterday already too.
> 
> rEalm
> 
> 
> 
> what you say is also true for hardware as well.

The totaly lack of encoders over pots


> 
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> 
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> 
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