Synth-DIY Yahoo! Groups Archives

Thread

soft sync?

2003-05-25 by jamescoplin

from the recent discussion it appears that several of us have gotten
on rex about wanting hard sync on the oscillators. i know i got a
little over the top with that point when talking to rex about it
after purchasing my system. it went something like:

me - "hi rex, i think my osc are messed up because the sync isn't
working"

rex- "well they use soft sync instead of the hard sync you are
probably used to. it a much more subtle effect."

me - "i can't tell that it does anything!"

rex - "i said it was subtle."

me - "well, it's crap."

or a reasonable facimile thereof. ;)

so, does anyone have any use for the soft sync? i really can't tell
that it does anything except make the osc "slightly" buzzier and not
in a particularly useful way. kind of like using dsg as a lowpass
filter kind of buzzy way. am i missing something? i hate to think how
much i paid for that sync jack not to be using it! ;)

james r. coplin

Re: soft sync?

2003-05-25 by John Papiewski

The main use for soft sync is locking two or more oscillators to a
master frequency. If you have oscillators without softsync tuned
together they will always be "beating" against each other. Maybe the
beat might be slow but it's there. Soft sync eliminates the beating
between oscillators. To use it first tune the oscillators together.
Then establish one oscillator as the master and patch its sawtooth to
the sync inputs of the others. A little fine tuning may be necessary
after sync'ing to eliminate the jerky beating from an osc that's
'almost' locked. The soft sync will only lock the frequency when the
relative frequencies are simple ratios.

Soft sync is for creating new tones based on multiple oscillators when
you *don't* want the chorusing of beat frequencies. The result is
tighter and cleaner.

Hard sync on the other hand forces the slave oscillator to start a new
cycle from the master oscillator regardless of the frequency
relationship. This can be accomplished on the Serge by feeding one DSG
pulse source into another DSG's trigger input. As long as the slave
DSG's cycle is shorter than the master's you've got a hard sync relation.

Best

John P.

jamescoplin wrote:

Show quoted textHide quoted text

> from the recent discussion it appears that several of us have gotten
> on rex about wanting hard sync on the oscillators. i know i got a
> little over the top with that point when talking to rex about it
> after purchasing my system. it went something like:
>
> me - "hi rex, i think my osc are messed up because the sync isn't
> working"
>
> rex- "well they use soft sync instead of the hard sync you are
> probably used to. it a much more subtle effect."
>
> me - "i can't tell that it does anything!"
>
> rex - "i said it was subtle."
>
> me - "well, it's crap."
>
> or a reasonable facimile thereof. ;)
>
> so, does anyone have any use for the soft sync? i really can't tell
> that it does anything except make the osc "slightly" buzzier and not
> in a particularly useful way. kind of like using dsg as a lowpass
> filter kind of buzzy way. am i missing something? i hate to think how
> much i paid for that sync jack not to be using it! ;)
>
> james r. coplin
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> SergeModular-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Keep on Patchin'!
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>

Re: soft sync?

2003-05-26 by johnrichoux

I use it to generate subtle bass patterns. Osc Saw ->Inverter ->DSG trig, then
modulate the DSG with something or other. Usually comes up as some sort of 7th
chord pattern. Can sound like the bass part on Michael Stearn's "Planetary Unfolding."

Here is a question: the NTO Variable output has several (but not all) wave shapes that
will trigger the DSG without the inverter. I can understand the pulse shape area
triggering. But why will the saw area trigger when the saw output won't? Even some
of the sine area will trigger.

If I had to choose between hard or soft sync, I'd prefer soft.

jmr

Show quoted textHide quoted text

--- In SergeModular@yahoogroups.com, "jamescoplin" <moog@q...> wrote:
> so, does anyone have any use for the soft sync? i really can't tell
> that it does anything except make the osc "slightly" buzzier and not
> in a particularly useful way. kind of like using dsg as a lowpass
> filter kind of buzzy way. am i missing something? i hate to think how
> much i paid for that sync jack not to be using it! ;)
>
> james r. coplin

Re: soft sync?

2003-05-26 by M. Blake Wilson Law Office

I use it to generate subtle bass patterns. Osc Saw ->Inverter ->DSG trig, then
modulate the DSG with something or other. Usually comes up as some sort of 7th
chord pattern. Can sound like the bass part on Michael Stearn's "Planetary Unfolding."

neat patch, but whats the role of the sync input here?

blake

--

M. Blake Wilson is OdysseySounds
Email: mbw@...
Web: http://members.cox.net/mbw/construction.htm
Music: http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/242/matthew_b_wilson.html
Serge: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SergeModular/

Re: soft sync?

2003-05-27 by John Papiewski

My DSG will trigger from the pulse on the variable waveshaper but
nothing else. The sawtooth output and the variable ws sawtooth are both
positive going so they dont have a rising edge to trigger the DSG. When
was your Serge made?

johnrichoux wrote:

Show quoted textHide quoted text

> I use it to generate subtle bass patterns. Osc Saw ->Inverter ->DSG trig, then
> modulate the DSG with something or other. Usually comes up as some sort of 7th
> chord pattern. Can sound like the bass part on Michael Stearn's "Planetary Unfolding."
>
> Here is a question: the NTO Variable output has several (but not all) wave shapes that
> will trigger the DSG without the inverter. I can understand the pulse shape area
> triggering. But why will the saw area trigger when the saw output won't? Even some
> of the sine area will trigger.
>
> If I had to choose between hard or soft sync, I'd prefer soft.
>
> jmr
>
> --- In SergeModular@yahoogroups.com, "jamescoplin" <moog@q...> wrote:
>
>>so, does anyone have any use for the soft sync? i really can't tell
>>that it does anything except make the osc "slightly" buzzier and not
>>in a particularly useful way. kind of like using dsg as a lowpass
>>filter kind of buzzy way. am i missing something? i hate to think how
>>much i paid for that sync jack not to be using it! ;)
>>
>>james r. coplin
>
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> SergeModular-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Keep on Patchin'!
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>

Re: soft sync?

2003-05-27 by johnrichoux

Blake-
It dawned on me a little while later that I wasn't really addressing the question. Sorry
about that. But what I described was basically the same thing as sync. If an osc saw
out is patched to another osc sync in, you get the same sort of pitch movement.

If I understand things right, with hard sync, the sync destination osc has to be pitched
above the sync-source osc. With Serge soft-sync however, the destination osc is
pitched below the source. Is that a fair summary?

--- In SergeModular@yahoogroups.com, "M. Blake Wilson Law Office" > neat patch,
but whats the role of the sync input here?

Re: soft sync?

2003-05-27 by johnrichoux

I think it was around late 1998. I retested the variable output both to DSG and a DTG
and I get triggering in various locations. If the beginning of saw is 7 o'clock, then it
will trigger from 7 thru 9, a vary narrow portion of sine - about 11:45 (Eastern
Daylight Time), then in the pulse section only from about 3:00 on.

Beats me why it works. Does the variable wave function like the TWS? I don't have
one of those (yet). Is the TWS at all useful for creating pulse waves?

great forum, this.

jmr

Show quoted textHide quoted text

--- In SergeModular@yahoogroups.com, John Papiewski <johnp299792@a...> wrote:
> My DSG will trigger from the pulse on the variable waveshaper but
> nothing else. The sawtooth output and the variable ws sawtooth are both
> positive going so they dont have a rising edge to trigger the DSG. When
> was your Serge made?
>

Re: soft sync?

2003-05-27 by John Papiewski

The soft sync slave can be either higher or lower pitch than the master.
I think usually you'd want a higher pitch.

johnrichoux wrote:

Show quoted textHide quoted text

> Blake-
> It dawned on me a little while later that I wasn't really addressing the question. Sorry
> about that. But what I described was basically the same thing as sync. If an osc saw
> out is patched to another osc sync in, you get the same sort of pitch movement.
>
> If I understand things right, with hard sync, the sync destination osc has to be pitched
> above the sync-source osc. With Serge soft-sync however, the destination osc is
> pitched below the source. Is that a fair summary?
>
> --- In SergeModular@yahoogroups.com, "M. Blake Wilson Law Office" > neat patch,
> but whats the role of the sync input here?
>
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> SergeModular-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Keep on Patchin'!
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>

Re: soft sync?

2003-05-28 by johnrichoux

I don't get anything useful when the slave is at a higher pitch than the master. (thanks
for reminding me of the correct terminology) just periodic buzzes, and a very very
slight stepping. When the slave is lower in pitch, the stepping up and down a
harmonic scale is very pronounced. For bass patterns, I prefer the result from
triggering a DSG over sync-ing a PCO. Maybe it's because I have more DSG's than
PCO's.

jmr

Show quoted textHide quoted text

--- In SergeModular@yahoogroups.com, John Papiewski <johnp299792@a...> wrote:
> The soft sync slave can be either higher or lower pitch than the master.
> I think usually you'd want a higher pitch.

Re: soft sync?

2003-05-28 by johnrichoux

Maybe I should correct myself a little.
I just ran an experiment with 2 PCOs. I tuned them, then swept the slave with a very
slow sine, and I must admit that when the slave is pitched above, there is more
happening than I thought would be. It definitely emphasizes certain harmonics and
locks up to a degree.

Also I tried Papiewski's suggestion of hard-sync with 2 DSG's and got some
interesting results. The effect sounds to me more like filtering or PW modulation
than hard sync, but fun nonetheless. I'm sure it depends on the application. But then
again, I didn't buy this monster to sound like any keyboard I've ever heard.

jmr

Show quoted textHide quoted text

--- In SergeModular@yahoogroups.com, "johnrichoux" <jrichoux@m...> wrote:
> I don't get anything useful when the slave is at a higher pitch than the master.
(thanks
> for reminding me of the correct terminology) just periodic buzzes, and a very very
> slight stepping. When the slave is lower in pitch, the stepping up and down a
> harmonic scale is very pronounced. For bass patterns, I prefer the result from
> triggering a DSG over sync-ing a PCO. Maybe it's because I have more DSG's than
> PCO's.
>
> jmr
>
> --- In SergeModular@yahoogroups.com, John Papiewski <johnp299792@a...>
wrote:
> > The soft sync slave can be either higher or lower pitch than the master.
> > I think usually you'd want a higher pitch.