The Yamaha AN1x Synthesizer mailing list

Shayne,
I love/need organized people in my life to help me make ideas happen.
(I'm more right-brained and stuff sorta reveals itself when I'm neither
prepared to make note of it nor able to immediately understand its
importance.)
Certainly a lot of the discernment of what "type" a patch might be
catagorized as is pretty subjective, especially with all of the
"morphability" of some of the sounds (I'm thinking of the EarthHorn patch
uploaded recently). But, the concept is excellent. Yamaha seems to have
provided an nice start with the patch types built into the AN1x.
I wouldn't worry about the upload speed from your home page for now.
After being zipped, the patches are quite small. You might provide a
request to have users finish their business as quickly as possible as a
front-end message for the download page. I can talk to you off-list about
hosting.
Please go for it. I know exactly the hassle you're talking about...
you're looking for "that sound" but there are lots of patch banks available,
and you have to load and listen to each sound to see if you can find that
'right one'. I'm not quite sure of how to break the individual patches out
of the banks and group them together outside of AN1x Edit.

My 2¢
Ed Edwards

> and you have to load and listen to each sound to see if you can find that
> 'right one'. I'm not quite sure of how to break the individual patches

out

> of the banks and group them together outside of AN1x Edit.

How about like this: One need to study the sysex dump format of AN1x and
then write a program that will read through all the pathces in the sysex
file and then make new sysex file for each patch (sysex bank that holds only
one patch) which will be then imported to database.

When browsing patches in database over internet. There should be possibility
to select patches (database entries) and then the service should generate
you one AN1x format sysex file which you can then download to your synth or
AN1xEdit.

Sounds simple ehh?

Yeah I would love to use application like that.

Cheers,
TimoS

I have a domainname of my own.. I would host it....for free.

let me know if you're interested.

----- Original Message -----
From: Shayne Hardesty
To: AN1x-list@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, September 05, 2002 11:29 PM
Subject: [AN1x] Online patch database ideas..


Hi group.. I've been lurking here as an AN1x owner but not much of a
musician for a couple of years now. I've downloaded and enjoyed
countless patches you guys have worked on, but since I've never really
jumped into synth programming I'm not able to contribute much of
anything back. BUT, I do online website database integration work for a
living, and I think the huge collection of GREAT patches we have in the
yahoo files section is just begging to be organized.. I'm willing to do
all of the programming to put it together. In my mind you would upload
an individual patch, categorize it based on type of sound (pad, bass,
percussion, sfx, etc) and we would store all of the info in a database
so you can search by sound name, sound category, most popular sounds,
creation/upload date, creator, etc. This would solve a need *I* have
(finding certain patches I've lost along the way), and I think would
make patch sharing and finding much easier.

So I guess basically I'm wondering if you guys are interested in
taking this approach, and if anyone has any further ideas or thoughts?
To begin with I could host it on my home server on a cable modem, but my
upstream bandwidth is capped off at 400k so it wouldn't take much to
overwhelm it. If it works we could either hope someone could donate a
place to host it, or take collections for a cheap webhosting provider
(you can find tons of them online for about $10USD per month).

Let me know what you guys think. Mostly I'm thinking outloud here..
Heck, there's really no point in limiting it to the AN1x, I could
abstract the engine to accept patches for any platform. I could
probably get a rough working version in a weekend of
marathon-beer-fueled coding. Once it is working I'll need some
volunteers to take the existing yahoo groups sounds, break them out of
the zip files and directories, and upload and categorize them one by one
making sure to give the original creator credit (so that we'll be able
to search for patches by a given creator). I'd also need a volunteer or
two who is good with photoshop to do some graphics, as I'm horrible with
that stuff.

Shayne


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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

oh, and I'm pretty good with photoshop too.

----- Original Message -----
From: Shayne Hardesty
To: AN1x-list@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, September 05, 2002 11:29 PM
Subject: [AN1x] Online patch database ideas..


Hi group.. I've been lurking here as an AN1x owner but not much of a
musician for a couple of years now. I've downloaded and enjoyed
countless patches you guys have worked on, but since I've never really
jumped into synth programming I'm not able to contribute much of
anything back. BUT, I do online website database integration work for a
living, and I think the huge collection of GREAT patches we have in the
yahoo files section is just begging to be organized.. I'm willing to do
all of the programming to put it together. In my mind you would upload
an individual patch, categorize it based on type of sound (pad, bass,
percussion, sfx, etc) and we would store all of the info in a database
so you can search by sound name, sound category, most popular sounds,
creation/upload date, creator, etc. This would solve a need *I* have
(finding certain patches I've lost along the way), and I think would
make patch sharing and finding much easier.

So I guess basically I'm wondering if you guys are interested in
taking this approach, and if anyone has any further ideas or thoughts?
To begin with I could host it on my home server on a cable modem, but my
upstream bandwidth is capped off at 400k so it wouldn't take much to
overwhelm it. If it works we could either hope someone could donate a
place to host it, or take collections for a cheap webhosting provider
(you can find tons of them online for about $10USD per month).

Let me know what you guys think. Mostly I'm thinking outloud here..
Heck, there's really no point in limiting it to the AN1x, I could
abstract the engine to accept patches for any platform. I could
probably get a rough working version in a weekend of
marathon-beer-fueled coding. Once it is working I'll need some
volunteers to take the existing yahoo groups sounds, break them out of
the zip files and directories, and upload and categorize them one by one
making sure to give the original creator credit (so that we'll be able
to search for patches by a given creator). I'd also need a volunteer or
two who is good with photoshop to do some graphics, as I'm horrible with
that stuff.

Shayne


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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Online patch database seems a good idea.Hope it includes sw1000xg patches too.
Oh if u r not a musician an u have a an1x ,what do u do then?im just curious.Im not much of a musician but I like messin with interesting sounds,and if its any good,I have a go of producing somthing.How ever u can listen to my latest track as an mp3 on line.Its called 'Tranzotika'. go to
http://stage.vitaminic.co.uk/dmanx

Regards
DMANX

Regards Dmanx.

> Hi group.. I've been lurking here as an AN1x owner but not much of a
>musician for a couple of years now. I've downloaded and enjoyed
>countless patches you guys have worked on, but since I've never really
>jumped into synth programming I'm not able to contribute much of
>anything back. BUT, I do online website database integration work for a
>living, and I think the huge collection of GREAT patches we have in the
>yahoo files section is just begging to be organized.. I'm willing to do
>all of the programming to put it together. In my mind you would upload
>an individual patch, categorize it based on type of sound (pad, bass,
>percussion, sfx, etc) and we would store all of the info in a database
>so you can search by sound name, sound category, most popular sounds,
>creation/upload date, creator, etc. This would solve a need *I* have
>(finding certain patches I've lost along the way), and I think would
>make patch sharing and finding much easier.
>
> So I guess basically I'm wondering if you guys are interested in
>taking this approach, and if anyone has any further ideas or thoughts?
>To begin with I could host it on my home server on a cable modem, but my
>upstream bandwidth is capped off at 400k so it wouldn't take much to
>overwhelm it. If it works we could either hope someone could donate a
>place to host it, or take collections for a cheap webhosting provider
>(you can find tons of them online for about $10USD per month).
>
> Let me know what you guys think. Mostly I'm thinking outloud here..
> Heck, there's really no point in limiting it to the AN1x, I could
>abstract the engine to accept patches for any platform. I could
>probably get a rough working version in a weekend of
>marathon-beer-fueled coding. Once it is working I'll need some
>volunteers to take the existing yahoo groups sounds, break them out of
>the zip files and directories, and upload and categorize them one by one
>making sure to give the original creator credit (so that we'll be able
>to search for patches by a given creator). I'd also need a volunteer or
>two who is good with photoshop to do some graphics, as I'm horrible with
>that stuff.
>
>Shayne
>
>
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Ed Edwards wrote:

> Shayne,

[...]

> Please go for it. I know exactly the hassle you're talking about...
> you're looking for "that sound" but there are lots of patch banks available,
> and you have to load and listen to each sound to see if you can find that
> 'right one'.

Yes, exactly.. They way they are organized now (by user) really
doesn't lend itself to finding anything quickly.. You have to download
each user's sounds then go through all of them.. If you know you're
looking for a "brass-type" sound, this way you could search through all
sounds classified as brass and hopefully atleast get close in a
reasonable amount of time.

The other problem I have is in only being able to have 128 patches at
a time in my an1x, there are sounds I remember using and liking that
I've forgotten where they are (like 'Illusion' and 'Church Bell'). This
way you could look the sound up by name and find it.

As you said classifications will be a bit tough, but we can take the
defaults to start with and go from there. We could also allow a sound
to fall under multiple categories if it lends itself to that.

> I'm not quite sure of how to break the individual patches out
> of the banks and group them together outside of AN1x Edit.

Yeah, that was my thought.. Pull up the banks in an1x edit and save
them out as .an1 files. Tedious, but it would only have to be done
once. Maybe if Gary is still around he could write a quick utility to
extract individual .an1 files from a sound bank?

Shayne

Bas wrote:

> I have a domainname of my own.. I would host it....for free.
>
> let me know if you're interested.

Cool. There seems to be enough interest I'll get going on it this
weekend on my home server and see how it goes. Once it gets to a usable
state if a lot of folks like it and start using it I'll get with you
about finding a more suitable home for it.

Shayne

Timo Sandholm wrote:

> How about like this: One need to study the sysex dump format of AN1x
> and then write a program that will read through all the pathces in
> the sysex file and then make new sysex file for each patch (sysex
> bank that holds only one patch) which will be then imported to
> database.
>
> When browsing patches in database over internet. There should be
> possibility to select patches (database entries) and then the service
> should generate you one AN1x format sysex file which you can then
> download to your synth or AN1xEdit.
>
> Sounds simple ehh?

Although it sounds like a good idea, it's a bit out of my depth..
Unless Gary (is he still around?) could release details about the inner
workings of the banks and an1 files (though I suspect he's under an NDA
from yamaha preventing him from doing this), or could write a command
line utility that would break banks to individual patches and join
patches into banks.

The best I could to at this point would be to allow you to "mark"
individual patches you like for download, then once you've marked all
you want have the system zip them up and send them to you in one zip
file. It would be up to you to create your own banks from them.

Shayne

DMANX@... wrote:

> Online patch database seems a good idea.Hope it includes sw1000xg
> patches too.

Sure, no reason why it couldn't.

> Oh if u r not a musician an u have a an1x ,what do u do then?im just
> curious.Im not much of a musician but I like messin with interesting
> sounds,and if its any good,I have a go of producing somthing.

Basically just mess around with sounds.. I'm getting better at
coming up with hooks and pieces of songs, but up until now I've never
been good any putting them all together into finished songs.. Partly
because I have no formal music training, and partly because I've never
taken the time to fully learn my way around the gear I have. That's why
I say I'm not a musician.. It's just one of about 1000 other hobbies I
have. Sort of along the same lines as I have my own set of 1200's and I
can beatmatch records (well, most of the time - I still have my fair
share of trainwrecks), but I don't consider myself a DJ.. To me that's
something that implies you have gone beyond basic beatmatching and now
how to program a set, work a crowd, and have gotten paid for doing it at
least once. I only do it to put together mix CDs of records I like for
myself and friends.

> How ever u can listen to my latest track as an mp3 on line.Its called
> 'Tranzotika'. go to http://stage.vitaminic.co.uk/dmanx

Cool, I'll check it out.

Shayne

In article <3D78FD60.2050601@...>, Shayne Hardesty
<lists@...> writes

>Ed Edwards wrote:
>> Shayne,
>[...]
>> Please go for it. I know exactly the hassle you're talking about...
>> you're looking for "that sound" but there are lots of patch banks available,
>> and you have to load and listen to each sound to see if you can find that
>> 'right one'.
>
> Yes, exactly.. They way they are organized now (by user) really
>doesn't lend itself to finding anything quickly.. You have to download
>each user's sounds then go through all of them.. If you know you're
>looking for a "brass-type" sound, this way you could search through all
>sounds classified as brass and hopefully atleast get close in a
>reasonable amount of time.
>
> The other problem I have is in only being able to have 128 patches at
>a time in my an1x, there are sounds I remember using and liking that
>I've forgotten where they are (like 'Illusion' and 'Church Bell'). This
>way you could look the sound up by name and find it.
>
> As you said classifications will be a bit tough, but we can take the
>defaults to start with and go from there. We could also allow a sound
>to fall under multiple categories if it lends itself to that.
>
>> I'm not quite sure of how to break the individual patches out
>> of the banks and group them together outside of AN1x Edit.
>
> Yeah, that was my thought.. Pull up the banks in an1x edit and save
>them out as .an1 files. Tedious, but it would only have to be done
>once. Maybe if Gary is still around he could write a quick utility to
>extract individual .an1 files from a sound bank?

I thought that there was actually a definition of the AN1x file spec. in
the sites file section.......

--
See ya,

Reggie

> Although it sounds like a good idea, it's a bit out of my depth..
> Unless Gary (is he still around?) could release details about the inner
> workings of the banks and an1 files (though I suspect he's under an NDA
> from yamaha preventing him from doing this), or could write a command
> line utility that would break banks to individual patches and join
> patches into banks.

The sysex format is not proprietary in the AN1x, it's right in the back of
the data manual.
I am not a programmer, but I know enough to generally understand how
breaking out individual patches would be done. It's a fairly easy process
of searching for the correct data as the start point, counting out the
number of bytes a patch consists of, placing that data into memory and
adding the proper header and end-of-file strings to it and then saving it as
a file. Some programmers I know might be able to write a quick utility to
do this.

EdEdwards

--- In AN1x-list@y..., Shayne Hardesty <lists@s...> wrote:

> Bas wrote:
> > I have a domainname of my own.. I would host it....for free.
> >
> > let me know if you're interested.
>
> Cool. There seems to be enough interest I'll get going on it

this

> weekend on my home server and see how it goes. Once it gets to a

usable

> state if a lot of folks like it and start using it I'll get with

you

> about finding a more suitable home for it.
>
> Shayne

Hey, Shane, I've been a lurker for a while, mainly cuz I'm an EX5
owner (which can emulate an AN1X).

I'd be more than willing to house a patch database. In fact I've
been thinking of doing just that. I've been looking at JSynthLib (a
Java Swing librarian/patch editor. It would be trivial to add JDBC
to it and have a few databases one could hit. It can load patch
banks (although nobody's written an AN1X librarian yet) and save out
individual SYX files. I think we should think about housing SYX
files with columns that identify synth, creator, and a few columns
for proprietary notes, etc. and then verbal descriptions, reviews?

I'd recommend we do something like write a librarian to that spec and
then whip up a quick JDBC facility. I run an artist web site that's
got plenty of MySQL space.

http://netnewmusic.net
http://parnasse.com
http://jeffharrington.org

Anyways, sounds like an interesting project and I'd be happy to house
the patch library and contribute a little programming time. FWIW, I
recently translated the entire AN1X patch library (99 banks) to EX5
format thanks to a utility that a fellow EX5 owner wrote, exFactory
3.0. So the user base for this library has rapidly expanded. Plus
I'd like to support my other synths, FS1R and SY77 and DX7, etc...

Jeff Harrington
http://jeffharrington.org

--- In AN1x-list@y..., "idealordid" <yahoo@p...> wrote:

> Anyways, sounds like an interesting project and I'd be happy to

house

> the patch library and contribute a little programming time.

FWIW, I

> recently translated the entire AN1X patch library (99 banks) to

EX5

> format thanks to a utility that a fellow EX5 owner wrote,

exFactory

> 3.0. So the user base for this library has rapidly expanded.

Plus

> I'd like to support my other synths, FS1R and SY77 and DX7,

etc...

>
> Jeff Harrington
> http://jeffharrington.org

Hi Jeff,

How considerate of the EX5 community to take our work without
asking. How and when did they plan to ask permission or
express their thanks for our efforts? I can't say I'm happy that
nobody thought to at least inquire if anybody objected to their
data being repackaged and distrubuted in a format other than
what it was intended.

Where are these EX5 converted Voices hosted? I'd like to speak
with whomever is hosting my work. Please cease distributing
any converted archives which contain any voices from my AN1x
Voice banks. My voice banks can be easily identified by the
leading characters JDLX.

Thanks in advance for your cooperation.

regards,

Jon

--- In AN1x-list@y..., "jondl_2000" <jondl_2000@y...> wrote:

> --- In AN1x-list@y..., "idealordid" <yahoo@p...> wrote:
> > Anyways, sounds like an interesting project and I'd be happy

to

> house
> > the patch library and contribute a little programming time.
> FWIW, I
> > recently translated the entire AN1X patch library (99 banks) to
> EX5
> > format thanks to a utility that a fellow EX5 owner wrote,
> exFactory
> > 3.0. So the user base for this library has rapidly expanded.
> Plus
> > I'd like to support my other synths, FS1R and SY77 and DX7,
> etc...
> >
> > Jeff Harrington
> > http://jeffharrington.org
>
> Hi Jeff,
>
> How considerate of the EX5 community to take our work

without

> asking. How and when did they plan to ask permission or
> express their thanks for our efforts? I can't say I'm happy that
> nobody thought to at least inquire if anybody objected to their
> data being repackaged and distrubuted in a format other than
> what it was intended.
>
> Where are these EX5 converted Voices hosted? I'd like to

speak

> with whomever is hosting my work. Please cease distributing
> any converted archives which contain any voices from my AN1x
> Voice banks. My voice banks can be easily identified by the
> leading characters JDLX.
>
> Thanks in advance for your cooperation.
>
> regards,
>
> Jon

I've found the entire AN1x User Voice archive from thist list has
been repackaged and redistrubuted at EX5Tech.
http://www.ex5tech.com/

I've written EX5Tech expressing my displeasure and request
they remove my JDLX Voice banks from their web site. I made it
clear that I was speaking only for myself and not any other AN1x
user.

regards,

Jon

--- In AN1x-list@y..., "jondl_2000" <jondl_2000@y...> wrote:

> --- In AN1x-list@y..., "jondl_2000" <jondl_2000@y...> wrote:
> > --- In AN1x-list@y..., "idealordid" <yahoo@p...> wrote:
> > > Anyways, sounds like an interesting project and I'd be happy
> to
> > house
> > > the patch library and contribute a little programming time.
> > FWIW, I
> > > recently translated the entire AN1X patch library (99 banks) to
> > EX5
> > > format thanks to a utility that a fellow EX5 owner wrote,
> > exFactory
> > > 3.0. So the user base for this library has rapidly expanded.
> > Plus
> > > I'd like to support my other synths, FS1R and SY77 and DX7,
> > etc...
> > >
> > > Jeff Harrington
> > > http://jeffharrington.org
> >
> > Hi Jeff,
> >
> > How considerate of the EX5 community to take our work
> without
> > asking. How and when did they plan to ask permission or
> > express their thanks for our efforts? I can't say I'm happy that
> > nobody thought to at least inquire if anybody objected to their
> > data being repackaged and distrubuted in a format other than
> > what it was intended.
> >
> > Where are these EX5 converted Voices hosted? I'd like to
> speak
> > with whomever is hosting my work. Please cease distributing
> > any converted archives which contain any voices from my AN1x
> > Voice banks. My voice banks can be easily identified by the
> > leading characters JDLX.
> >
> > Thanks in advance for your cooperation.
> >
> > regards,
> >
> > Jon
>
> I've found the entire AN1x User Voice archive from thist list has
> been repackaged and redistrubuted at EX5Tech.
> http://www.ex5tech.com/
>
> I've written EX5Tech expressing my displeasure and request
> they remove my JDLX Voice banks from their web site. I made it
> clear that I was speaking only for myself and not any other AN1x
> user.
>
> regards,
>
> Jon

Hi, this is Jeff Harrington the guy who did most of the translation.
As a member of the AN1X list, I acted in good faith in my
legitimately given right (your permission to AN1X list members) to
use the AN1X patch library.

I regret that you're pissed off by my actions. I had no idea this
would happen - as I'm sure nobody at EX5Tech did and ask for your
permission and apologize after the fact.

We appreciate your hard work and have enjoyed immenselely the
entirety of the patch library. From one Yamaha user to another I can
only say, "Bravo!".

Jeff Harrington

--- In AN1x-list@y..., "idealordid" <yahoo@p...> wrote:

> --- In AN1x-list@y..., "jondl_2000" <jondl_2000@y...> wrote:
> > --- In AN1x-list@y..., "jondl_2000" <jondl_2000@y...> wrote:
> > > --- In AN1x-list@y..., "idealordid" <yahoo@p...> wrote:
> > > > Anyways, sounds like an interesting project and I'd be

happy

> > to
> > > house
> > > > the patch library and contribute a little programming time.
> > > FWIW, I
> > > > recently translated the entire AN1X patch library (99

banks) to

> > > EX5
> > > > format thanks to a utility that a fellow EX5 owner wrote,
> > > exFactory
> > > > 3.0. So the user base for this library has rapidly

expanded.

> > > Plus
> > > > I'd like to support my other synths, FS1R and SY77 and

DX7,

> > > etc...
> > > >
> > > > Jeff Harrington
> > > > http://jeffharrington.org
> > >
> > > Hi Jeff,
> > >
> > > How considerate of the EX5 community to take our work
> > without
> > > asking. How and when did they plan to ask permission or
> > > express their thanks for our efforts? I can't say I'm happy

that

> > > nobody thought to at least inquire if anybody objected to

their

> > > data being repackaged and distrubuted in a format other

than

> > > what it was intended.
> > >
> > > Where are these EX5 converted Voices hosted? I'd like to
> > speak
> > > with whomever is hosting my work. Please cease

distributing

> > > any converted archives which contain any voices from my

AN1x

> > > Voice banks. My voice banks can be easily identified by the
> > > leading characters JDLX.
> > >
> > > Thanks in advance for your cooperation.
> > >
> > > regards,
> > >
> > > Jon
> >
> > I've found the entire AN1x User Voice archive from thist list

has

> > been repackaged and redistrubuted at EX5Tech.
> > http://www.ex5tech.com/
> >
> > I've written EX5Tech expressing my displeasure and request
> > they remove my JDLX Voice banks from their web site. I

made it

> > clear that I was speaking only for myself and not any other

AN1x

> > user.
> >
> > regards,
> >
> > Jon
>
> Hi, this is Jeff Harrington the guy who did most of the

translation.

> As a member of the AN1X list, I acted in good faith in my
> legitimately given right (your permission to AN1X list members)

to

> use the AN1X patch library.
>
> I regret that you're pissed off by my actions. I had no idea this
> would happen - as I'm sure nobody at EX5Tech did and ask for

your

> permission and apologize after the fact.
>
> We appreciate your hard work and have enjoyed immenselely

the

> entirety of the patch library. From one Yamaha user to another

I can

> only say, "Bravo!".
>
> Jeff Harrington

Hi Jeff,

Now that I've had an opportunity to throw my little tantrum and
subsequently chill out maybe we can put this into perspective.

First of all, as a subscribing member of AN1x-list you certainly
are entitled to make use of the contributed AN1x User Voices.

Second, I should have taken a moment longer to realize
translating the user Voices from .an1 format to a format suitable
for the EX* series is analogous to the proprietary sample format
translation efforts of after market vendors. To pretend otherwise
would be hypocritical - particularly since I'm actively involved as a
beta tester in such developments.

Third, it would have been considerate to have been consulted by
EX5Tech before hand but what's done is done - I'm glad there
are apparently so many users who find our efforts worthwhile.

So that my ranting and raving is better understood, I've actively
encouraged and participated in Voice contributions in this
community with two ambitions: 1) That somebody smarter than
me will step up and let me know how I might improve my own
programming and 2) that my efforts may help somebody new to
synthesis say "I didn't know you could that!" I wrongly interpreted
the EX5Tech effort as siphoning off our work without some
contribution in return. Having reviewed your own web site and
EX5Tech I see that you do indeed give back to the community.

I'm willing to write this off as a misunderstanding and hope we
all can take a lesson away from this.

Apologies.

Jon

Don't feel bad. I discovered sometime ago that I was listed in the
songs url. The problem is that isn't me or my song. A 30 sec blip
of something I never did. I've wrote twice asking for it to be taken
down. My real name is up there with a bogus link or something. I
joined the EX5tech in it's infancy and did upload a demo song, but
not the one there. This just reminded me of that. I'll have to
check again as it was still there(my bogus song) the last time I was
looked

--- In AN1x-list@y..., "jondl_2000" <jondl_2000@y...> wrote:

> --- In AN1x-list@y..., "idealordid" <yahoo@p...> wrote:
> > Hi, this is Jeff Harrington the guy who did most of the
> translation.
> > As a member of the AN1X list, I acted in good faith in my
> > legitimately given right (your permission to AN1X list members)
> to
> > use the AN1X patch library.
> >
> > I regret that you're pissed off by my actions. I had no idea

this

> > would happen - as I'm sure nobody at EX5Tech did and ask for
> your
> > permission and apologize after the fact.
> >
> > We appreciate your hard work and have enjoyed immenselely
> the
> > entirety of the patch library. From one Yamaha user to another
> I can
> > only say, "Bravo!".
> >
> > Jeff Harrington
>
> Hi Jeff,
>
> Now that I've had an opportunity to throw my little tantrum and
> subsequently chill out maybe we can put this into perspective.
>
> First of all, as a subscribing member of AN1x-list you certainly
> are entitled to make use of the contributed AN1x User Voices.
>
> Second, I should have taken a moment longer to realize
> translating the user Voices from .an1 format to a format suitable
> for the EX* series is analogous to the proprietary sample format
> translation efforts of after market vendors. To pretend otherwise
> would be hypocritical - particularly since I'm actively involved as

a

> beta tester in such developments.

Hi, I've done a few of these types of translations and I've always
been at a loss as to how to approach the patch author. I moved the
whole UCSD DX7 patch library to the SY77 back in 1993 and never
uploaded the library out of fear of stepping on somebody's toes.
(10,000 patches). Some of the patches had readme's and the email
would bounce. So I did nothing but use it myself - which was a loss
to the SY77/99 community.

I wrote a DX7->Csound patch translator a few years later and ported
the whole thing to the virtual Csound system and this time I only
provided the tool, (kind of like Da'Cook did in developing the
translation device, exFactory 3.0). Even then I was erroneously
attacked by some students of the initial sound author over
attribution; that was quickly straightened out. (I'd already
received permission from the Dr. Pinkston - the initial Csound DX7
emulator author - and cooperation from Yamaha engineering).

I guess I went a little overboard when I realized the breadth of the
AN1X patch library and heard those sounds on my own synth and spent a
lunch hour converting 99 banks to the EX5 format. It was just a
thrilling experience and I got really quite obsessed about it. It
was stupid of me not to request permission as I'm a member of a few
of these groups and the sense of community and comradery in those
groups is paramount to the success as a resource.

We at the EX5 tech board are a little jealous of you AN1X members
(since our AN1X emulator is monophonic) and I am still not sure just
how accurately the patches translated never actually having heard an
AN1X playing the real patch!

>
> Third, it would have been considerate to have been consulted by
> EX5Tech before hand but what's done is done - I'm glad there
> are apparently so many users who find our efforts worthwhile.
>
> So that my ranting and raving is better understood, I've actively
> encouraged and participated in Voice contributions in this
> community with two ambitions: 1) That somebody smarter than
> me will step up and let me know how I might improve my own
> programming and 2) that my efforts may help somebody new to
> synthesis say "I didn't know you could that!" I wrongly interpreted
> the EX5Tech effort as siphoning off our work without some
> contribution in return. Having reviewed your own web site and
> EX5Tech I see that you do indeed give back to the community.
>

:)

FWIW, I wrote one of these first MIDI patch editors in 1986 on the
Amiga 1000 for the Roland MT32 module. It was a thrill seeing a
patch library develop over the Amiga BBS system resulting from my
giving away of the editor.

> I'm willing to write this off as a misunderstanding and hope we
> all can take a lesson away from this.
>

All I can say is thanks to you John and to the whole crew here and
pardon me while I go back into lurk mode. Glad to see this settled
in a musically harmonious fashion.

Jeff
http://jeffharrington.org

Just to put in my 2 cents....

This gets my nomination for the most grown-up and dignified response I have
ever seen on a list or newsgroup.

Not that it is worth all that much...but you sir, are a gentleman and have
earned my respect..

Actually BOTH you guys, understandable that one get's a little hot at what
was perceived to have happened, but both the first response and Jons'
response...well, I am awed.

Think what a great world this would be if other net denizens took a lesson!
For that matter, world leaders could learn a thing or two!

Okay, maybe I am stretching it, but It truly made my day to see such a great
resolution of a problem. How many times would the first post been the first
salvo over the bow of the other, and would have degenerated down to just
bickering...

Nice job!

Jim

=============================================================
Please check out my original music at my site http://home.online.no/~jacker
Or at http://www.soundclick.com/bands/jacker_music.htm
-James R. Acker-

----- Original Message -----
From: "jondl_2000" <jondl_2000@...>
To: <AN1x-list@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, September 09, 2002 4:37 PM
Subject: Really POed at EX5Tech (was Re: [AN1x] Online patch database
ideas..


> --- In AN1x-list@y..., "idealordid" <yahoo@p...> wrote:
> > --- In AN1x-list@y..., "jondl_2000" <jondl_2000@y...> wrote:
> > > --- In AN1x-list@y..., "jondl_2000" <jondl_2000@y...> wrote:
> > > > --- In AN1x-list@y..., "idealordid" <yahoo@p...> wrote:
> > > > > Anyways, sounds like an interesting project and I'd be
> happy
> > > to
> > > > house
> > > > > the patch library and contribute a little programming time.
> > > > FWIW, I
> > > > > recently translated the entire AN1X patch library (99
> banks) to
> > > > EX5
> > > > > format thanks to a utility that a fellow EX5 owner wrote,
> > > > exFactory
> > > > > 3.0. So the user base for this library has rapidly
> expanded.
> > > > Plus
> > > > > I'd like to support my other synths, FS1R and SY77 and
> DX7,
> > > > etc...
> > > > >
> > > > > Jeff Harrington
> > > > > http://jeffharrington.org
> > > >
> > > > Hi Jeff,
> > > >
> > > > How considerate of the EX5 community to take our work
> > > without
> > > > asking. How and when did they plan to ask permission or
> > > > express their thanks for our efforts? I can't say I'm happy
> that
> > > > nobody thought to at least inquire if anybody objected to
> their
> > > > data being repackaged and distrubuted in a format other
> than
> > > > what it was intended.
> > > >
> > > > Where are these EX5 converted Voices hosted? I'd like to
> > > speak
> > > > with whomever is hosting my work. Please cease
> distributing
> > > > any converted archives which contain any voices from my
> AN1x
> > > > Voice banks. My voice banks can be easily identified by the
> > > > leading characters JDLX.
> > > >
> > > > Thanks in advance for your cooperation.
> > > >
> > > > regards,
> > > >
> > > > Jon
> > >
> > > I've found the entire AN1x User Voice archive from thist list
> has
> > > been repackaged and redistrubuted at EX5Tech.
> > > http://www.ex5tech.com/
> > >
> > > I've written EX5Tech expressing my displeasure and request
> > > they remove my JDLX Voice banks from their web site. I
> made it
> > > clear that I was speaking only for myself and not any other
> AN1x
> > > user.
> > >
> > > regards,
> > >
> > > Jon
> >
> > Hi, this is Jeff Harrington the guy who did most of the
> translation.
> > As a member of the AN1X list, I acted in good faith in my
> > legitimately given right (your permission to AN1X list members)
> to
> > use the AN1X patch library.
> >
> > I regret that you're pissed off by my actions. I had no idea this
> > would happen - as I'm sure nobody at EX5Tech did and ask for
> your
> > permission and apologize after the fact.
> >
> > We appreciate your hard work and have enjoyed immenselely
> the
> > entirety of the patch library. From one Yamaha user to another
> I can
> > only say, "Bravo!".
> >
> > Jeff Harrington
>
> Hi Jeff,
>
> Now that I've had an opportunity to throw my little tantrum and
> subsequently chill out maybe we can put this into perspective.
>
> First of all, as a subscribing member of AN1x-list you certainly
> are entitled to make use of the contributed AN1x User Voices.
>
> Second, I should have taken a moment longer to realize
> translating the user Voices from .an1 format to a format suitable
> for the EX* series is analogous to the proprietary sample format
> translation efforts of after market vendors. To pretend otherwise
> would be hypocritical - particularly since I'm actively involved as a
> beta tester in such developments.
>
> Third, it would have been considerate to have been consulted by
> EX5Tech before hand but what's done is done - I'm glad there
> are apparently so many users who find our efforts worthwhile.
>
> So that my ranting and raving is better understood, I've actively
> encouraged and participated in Voice contributions in this
> community with two ambitions: 1) That somebody smarter than
> me will step up and let me know how I might improve my own
> programming and 2) that my efforts may help somebody new to
> synthesis say "I didn't know you could that!" I wrongly interpreted
> the EX5Tech effort as siphoning off our work without some
> contribution in return. Having reviewed your own web site and
> EX5Tech I see that you do indeed give back to the community.
>
> I'm willing to write this off as a misunderstanding and hope we
> all can take a lesson away from this.
>
> Apologies.
>
> Jon
>
>
>
> Community email addresses:
> Post message: AN1x-list@yahoogroups.com
> Subscribe: AN1x-list-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Unsubscribe: AN1x-list-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> List owner: AN1x-list-owner@yahoogroups.com
>
> Shortcut URL to this page:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AN1x-list
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>

As an owner and user of both an AN1X and an EX5R I was happy to see
the files converted for the EX5. However, they don't really compare to
the sound on the AN1X.

idealordid wrote:

> We at the EX5 tech board are a little jealous of you AN1X members
> (since our AN1X emulator is monophonic) and I am still not sure just
> how accurately the patches translated never actually having heard an
> AN1X playing the real patch!

Not all of us... some of us have both an EX5 (the silver one, in my
case) and an AN1x. :)

Anyway, the air has been cleared now, or so it seems, but I'm a bit
surprised that this became an issue to begin with. After all, this list
is for all Yamaha AN modelling synths - and that includes the EX series.

- Peter

jsluszka wrote:

> As an owner and user of both an AN1X and an EX5R I was happy to see
> the files converted for the EX5. However, they don't really compare to
> the sound on the AN1X.

The AN1x has FreeEG and ten voices. The EX5 has better effects (are
those copied as well?) and is subjectively quieter.

I'm a happy man. :)

- Peter