Hi Tony, and Tony, and MOTM list,
I hope I didn't step on anyone's toes here. I think I've posted more
than once that I really like my Kenton Pro-2, and I got excellent
troubleshooting by email from Kenton as well. So, don't take it
as complaint. (The only Midi interfaces I ever complained about
come from a company that starts with "D" and ends with "öpfer".)
I haven't any experience with an Encore interface yet.
> You mentioned the high note priority of the Pro2 but then follow up
with
> your special modes. If it was actually high note priority, why would
it
jump
> to lower values? How do they differ? Maybe I'm not reading you
correctly.
> You are talking about a mono channel right? (not a polyphonic group
of
CVs?)
This was only an example that there are other useful monophonic modes,
as an addition to the necessary standard high/low/last priority modes.
This example I mentioned came from an attempt to get ordinary high
and low note priority monophonic CVs out of the 4 polyphonic CVs
of a Yamaha CS-50. For those who are interested, the circuits for
this are online at
http://home.debitel.net/user/jhaible/jh_pm_interface_part1.psand
http://home.debitel.net/user/jhaible/jh_pm_interface_part2.psand
http://home.debitel.net/user/jhaible/jh_pm_interface_part3.psand
http://home.debitel.net/user/jhaible/jh_pm_interface_part4.psDon't be frightened - this should be easy in software, when your
input is a Midi stream. With the four linear V/Hz CVs of a
CS-50 it needs some tweaking to get V/Oct, and a gate retrigger
option derived from CV steps.
What I found is that it didn't exactly work as I intended.
When I play a 4-voice-chord on the CS-50, the High Note CV
will also go to the high note. But if I release the top
note of the chord, the Voice isn's assigned on the CS-50
anymore, but the CV for this voice is still valid (no new
value assigned), so my High Note CV still holds the previous
value.
While this is not what I ∗always∗ want, I found that it can be quite
usefull as an option. Ordinary Hing Note Priority would
jump back to the highes remaining note - even if this is
a bass note I'm just holding to control another synthesizer
(over the Low Note CV output, of course.) So with ordinary
High Note Priority I have to play strictly legato if I want to
prevent my melody line from temporarily glitching down to
another held note. With the "sustained High Note Mode" which
I created by accident, this problem does not occur.
(Of course ∗now∗ I must temporarily release ∗all∗ keys when
I want the melody to step down again - there is no free lunch
here.)
Please understand that this is just one other option I find usefull,
to show that the three standard modes are not all there is.
And here we are at my next argument: As each of these modes has
its own drawbacks, I want to switch between them on the fly.
No menues here - either you have switches, or it's next to useless.
As every uses will have other priorities, your idea of software
defined switch functions makes sense. As long as there are
enough of them. Ideally, each switch should also have a jack for a
remote footswitch.
> The world's greatest MIDI->CV would probably be the world's most
expensive.
I see that providing a lot of switches and jacks is more of a problem
for the manufacturer of a complete product with enclosure and all the
mechanical hardware. I guess one switch + jack combination + pcb space
+ MUX channel + front panel space adds 3 Dollars costs if its minijacks
and quite a bit more if its MOTM grade 1/4" jacks - take this x4 for
additional cost for the end user. This ∗does∗ sum up to a certain
amount when you add 10 such switch / jack channels, no doubt.
BUT my initial mail was directed at "the other" Tony who is basically
offering a pcb and firmware and not a self contained box. (Apart
from the current activities to integrate it to MOTM.)
And ∗here∗, the additional costs should really be low. A mux and a
multipin connector and 5cm∗∗2 increased pcb space doesn't cost that
much (oh, and pull up resistors (;->) ), and the end user could
decide how many switches he wants to connect.
I'm aware that we're talking about two very different products
here. In case of the MidiDac, my whish was for the standard
low priority mode, and my whish for ∗all∗ manufacturers was to
think bigger than they did so far - there such a lot of usefull
functions, and (even with the valid cost argument), forgive me,
but Midi Controllers still look more like a part of a DX-7
than like part of a Modular system from their user interfaces.
The Modular user expects switches and jacks, not menues.
> Very few people are willing to pay for that. Compromise is something
that
> needs to be assessed all along the product path but most importantly
in
the
> product definition stage. Who says key assign modes are the most
useful
> parameter to attach to switches? That may be the best use for you,
but
what
> about hundreds of other uses?
Very true. For polyphony, I favor the Oberheim FVS key assigner (I
think
the Kenton Pro-4 comes close to that, but has it really all of the
Oberheim's possibilities? And can I switch them on the fly ?). But
I would wholehartedly encourage a manufacturer to also include the
nice Unison/Share Modes from the Korg Mono/Poly and the Roland JP-6.
I think the polyphonic models are already in a price range where
you think twice before you buy them, so a product with more features
will have a certain advantage on the market.
I have the impression that today's Midi Interfaces are just that:
∗interfaces∗ - you set them up and hopefully forget them when they
do their job - but they ∗could∗ be a human interface to interact
during the performance as well. I don't have a specific manufacturer
in mind, but you see things like this: Interfaces where certain
outputs can be used ∗either∗ for controllers ∗or∗ for polyphonic
CVs. This looks quite flexible on first sight, but if you want to
play in polyphonic mode and then switch to monophonic or duophonic
mode for solo playing, the now disabled extra outputs are not free
for modulations - you would have to change connections on a patchbay
- hardly possible in the midst of a performance.
> Why not use patch programs to store little
> configuration changes like that, and simply change patches? Many of
our
> (Encore, Kenton, JKJ, Doepfer, etc) CV boxes have that. You can then
> configure things anyway you want to and change them with a panel
operation
> or from MIDI.
I have no experience with the newer and bigger boxes. So far, the Pro-2
is what I have. I've only checked specs of the polyphonic boxes, not
actuall yplayed them. So be patient with me if the following is
implemented
already. This switching of patches requires the following:
(1) All the desired modes must be implemented of course - I can
onl yswitch between what is already there.
(2) Switching from one patch to another must work seamlessly, in
the midst of playing, while notes are being held. I play a chord,
and while I'm holding it, I decide that for the next keystroke
I'll split the polyphony into a duophonic upper / lower group,
or into an usison/share mode, or from Emu's reassign mode
mode to a cycle mode, and so on.
This has become a long mail, especially as it started from a simple
question about adding a low note priority mode to a monophonic
little interface. I hope it gives some food for thought. I'm not
qualified to help define new Midi/CV interfaces. Just spoilt from
the possibilities of modular synths, and dreaming of a Interface
that comes with a similar "parallel options - immediate access"
spirit. (So far, I'm also doing some key assign stuff with the
modular in combination with my Kenton Pro-2: Keyboard splits
done with Comparators and Sample&Hold's, or with the Serge-inspired
Analogue Shift Register that helps to create polyphonic chords
from a stream of monophonic notes.)
JH.