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Kinda OT/King Crimson's use of calliope on ITCOTCK

Kinda OT/King Crimson's use of calliope on ITCOTCK

2008-09-14 by Rick Blechta

Okay, here's the scuttlebutt.

As some of you know, my wife, Vicki, is a very fine classical flutist.
On a trip to NY to visit the relatives, a trip was arranged to go down
to the city and see Ian (who had been the Special Guest at the second
Tronto Clambake in 2001). They were going to spend some time playing
duet (he really is a good flute player, too). I brought my brother
along because he wanted to meet Ian and get some albums signed.

My brother, a former audio engineer, has always been fascinated on how
they got such huge gain (and no distortion) on that massive pitch
sweep in "Epitaph", so naturally, he start asking Ian questions about
that and the rest of the album. So here are some tidbits from that
conversation.

There was a calliope in a corner of the studio and naturally the boys
started fooling around with it. Only problem was, it was really flat.
That's why the calliope part in ITCOTCK is in a different key. Not
being keyboard players, I guess they were not good at transposing or
just decided to go with the flow. Anyway, the section was played by
McDonald on the top end with Giles playing the sustained notes on the
bottom on the second time through. Ian played the calliope the rest of
the way by himself.

For "Schizoid Man", that is the calliope at the beginning, too. It's
McDonald and Giles again, just sweeping the flats of their hands over
the keys. Being air driven and with a pretty poor air supply to begin
with, the instrument would just sort of whistle and groan. They
thought this sounded cool for the beginning of the album -- and I
think they were right.

Some other things of interest:

* "Schizoid Man" was done in one take, live off the floor and then the
second sax solo overdubbed in one. Pretty impressive!

* "Epitaph", on the other hand took 16 hours to record. They couldn't
get the sound and feel right. It was also recorded last which is why
the mellotron sounds different than the other two songs on the album
that use it. They found a way to make it sound better. It was recorded
from a HiWatt amp (not a direct line to the board) and then run
through a plate reverb. The sweep part was played by McDonald and
Fripp and the mellotron was double-tracked pretty well throughout.

* The album was done on an 8-track machine with numerous bounce downs,
a la the method used by the Beatles.

There you have it!

Rick

RE: [newmellotrongroup] Kinda OT/King Crimson's use of calliope on ITCOTCK

2008-09-14 by David Jacques

Thanks for the great and interesting info!

From: newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com [mailto:newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Rick Blechta
Sent: Sunday, September 14, 2008 5:39 AM
To: newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [newmellotrongroup] Kinda OT/King Crimson's use of calliope on ITCOTCK

Okay, here's the scuttlebutt.

As some of you know, my wife, Vicki, is a very fine classical flutist.
On a trip to NY to visit the relatives, a trip was arranged to go down
to the city and see Ian (who had been the Special Guest at the second
Tronto Clambake in 2001). They were going to spend some time playing
duet (he really is a good flute player, too). I brought my brother
along because he wanted to meet Ian and get some albums signed.

My brother, a former audio engineer, has always been fascinated on how
they got such huge gain (and no distortion) on that massive pitch
sweep in "Epitaph", so naturally, he start asking Ian questions about
that and the rest of the album. So here are some tidbits from that
conversation.

There was a calliope in a corner of the studio and naturally the boys
started fooling around with it. Only problem was, it was really flat.
That's why the calliope part in ITCOTCK is in a different key. Not
being keyboard players, I guess they were not good at transposing or
just decided to go with the flow. Anyway, the section was played by
McDonald on the top end with Giles playing the sustained notes on the
bottom on the second time through. Ian played the calliope the rest of
the way by himself.

For "Schizoid Man", that is the calliope at the beginning, too. It's
McDonald and Giles again, just sweeping the flats of their hands over
the keys. Being air driven and with a pretty poor air supply to begin
with, the instrument would just sort of whistle and groan. They
thought this sounded cool for the beginning of the album -- and I
think they were right.

Some other things of interest:

* "Schizoid Man" was done in one take, live off the floor and then the
second sax solo overdubbed in one. Pretty impressive!

* "Epitaph", on the other hand took 16 hours to record. They couldn't
get the sound and feel right. It was also recorded last which is why
the mellotron sounds different than the other two songs on the album
that use it. They found a way to make it sound better. It was recorded
from a HiWatt amp (not a direct line to the board) and then run
through a plate reverb. The sweep part was played by McDonald and
Fripp and the mellotron was double-tracked pretty well throughout.

* The album was done on an 8-track machine with numerous bounce downs,
a la the method used by the Beatles.

There you have it!

Rick

Re: [newmellotrongroup] Kinda OT/King Crimson's use of calliope on ITCOTCK

2008-09-14 by zappaboggs

Rick,

Always fun to read your stuff!!!!!!

Boggs...
"But when you think of me tune in the frequency, Come out and play come out and play"
...Gandalf Murphy and The Slambovian Circus of Dreams

"Nothing can change the shape of things to come."
...Max Frost
"Any talent that we are born with eventually surfaces as a need"
...Marsha Sinetar


----- Original Message ----
From: Rick Blechta <rick@rickblechta.com>
To: newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, September 14, 2008 8:38:51 AM
Subject: [newmellotrongroup] Kinda OT/King Crimson's use of calliope on ITCOTCK

Okay, here's the scuttlebutt.

As some of you know, my wife, Vicki, is a very fine classical flutist.
On a trip to NY to visit the relatives, a trip was arranged to go down
to the city and see Ian (who had been the Special Guest at the second
Tronto Clambake in 2001). They were going to spend some time playing
duet (he really is a good flute player, too). I brought my brother
along because he wanted to meet Ian and get some albums signed.

My brother, a former audio engineer, has always been fascinated on how
they got such huge gain (and no distortion) on that massive pitch
sweep in "Epitaph", so naturally, he start asking Ian questions about
that and the rest of the album. So here are some tidbits from that
conversation.

There was a calliope in a corner of the studio and naturally the boys
started fooling around with it. Only problem was, it was really flat.
That's why the calliope part in ITCOTCK is in a different key. Not
being keyboard players, I guess they were not good at transposing or
just decided to go with the flow. Anyway, the section was played by
McDonald on the top end with Giles playing the sustained notes on the
bottom on the second time through. Ian played the calliope the rest of
the way by himself.

For "Schizoid Man", that is the calliope at the beginning, too. It's
McDonald and Giles again, just sweeping the flats of their hands over
the keys. Being air driven and with a pretty poor air supply to begin
with, the instrument would just sort of whistle and groan. They
thought this sounded cool for the beginning of the album -- and I
think they were right.

Some other things of interest:

* "Schizoid Man" was done in one take, live off the floor and then the
second sax solo overdubbed in one. Pretty impressive!

* "Epitaph", on the other hand took 16 hours to record. They couldn't
get the sound and feel right. It was also recorded last which is why
the mellotron sounds different than the other two songs on the album
that use it. They found a way to make it sound better. It was recorded
from a HiWatt amp (not a direct line to the board) and then run
through a plate reverb. The sweep part was played by McDonald and
Fripp and the mellotron was double-tracked pretty well throughout.

* The album was done on an 8-track machine with numerous bounce downs,
a la the method used by the Beatles.

There you have it!

Rick


Re: Kinda OT/King Crimson's use of calliope on ITCOTCK

2008-09-14 by Paul Jones

Fascinating stuff, Rick. Thanks a lot.
Agree about Ian's flute playing. Have seen Schizoid Band twice, and
him and Mel Collins were amazing together.
Paul


--- In newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com, Rick Blechta <rick@...>
wrote:
>
> Okay, here's the scuttlebutt.
>
> As some of you know, my wife, Vicki, is a very fine classical
flutist.
> On a trip to NY to visit the relatives, a trip was arranged to go
down
> to the city and see Ian (who had been the Special Guest at the
second
> Tronto Clambake in 2001). They were going to spend some time
playing
> duet (he really is a good flute player, too). I brought my brother
> along because he wanted to meet Ian and get some albums signed.
>
> My brother, a former audio engineer, has always been fascinated on
how
> they got such huge gain (and no distortion) on that massive pitch
> sweep in "Epitaph", so naturally, he start asking Ian questions
about
> that and the rest of the album. So here are some tidbits from that
> conversation.
>
> There was a calliope in a corner of the studio and naturally the
boys
> started fooling around with it. Only problem was, it was really
flat.
> That's why the calliope part in ITCOTCK is in a different key. Not
> being keyboard players, I guess they were not good at transposing
or
> just decided to go with the flow. Anyway, the section was played
by
> McDonald on the top end with Giles playing the sustained notes on
the
> bottom on the second time through. Ian played the calliope the rest
of
> the way by himself.
>
> For "Schizoid Man", that is the calliope at the beginning, too.
It's
> McDonald and Giles again, just sweeping the flats of their hands
over
> the keys. Being air driven and with a pretty poor air supply to
begin
> with, the instrument would just sort of whistle and groan. They
> thought this sounded cool for the beginning of the album -- and I
> think they were right.
>
> Some other things of interest:
>
> * "Schizoid Man" was done in one take, live off the floor and then
the
> second sax solo overdubbed in one. Pretty impressive!
>
> * "Epitaph", on the other hand took 16 hours to record. They
couldn't
> get the sound and feel right. It was also recorded last which is
why
> the mellotron sounds different than the other two songs on the
album
> that use it. They found a way to make it sound better. It was
recorded
> from a HiWatt amp (not a direct line to the board) and then run
> through a plate reverb. The sweep part was played by McDonald and
> Fripp and the mellotron was double-tracked pretty well throughout.
>
> * The album was done on an 8-track machine with numerous bounce
downs,
> a la the method used by the Beatles.
>
> There you have it!
>
> Rick
>

Re: [newmellotrongroup] Re: Kinda OT/King Crimson's use of calliope on ITCOTCK

2008-09-14 by Chris Dale

During the "Tronto" Mellotron convention we had the chance to sort of "interview" Ian. One of the attendees - Ches Cain - actually captured much (but not all) of the interview on videotape.
I have a copy of that tape somewhere and recall that Ian seemed very pleased that we asked about all the facets of his career, which shed much light on why he left Crimson, his work with Giles, Fireballet, Foreigner etc.
Later that night at the pub, our conversation turned to discussion about the present state of the music industry and how the major stores were carrying less jazz, blues, rock, and devoting more shelf space to the top 40 sellers. During the chat I had lamented an example to him that I couldn't find the special 30th anniversary edition of "Court" despite repeated trips to several stores.
The following night at the pub, at a private table, he brought up that topic again and asked me something like "So you never could find it??" And then - re-living my frustration with the search I answered "Yeah, I can't believe that these major stores aren't regularly carrying it!! They're telling me they aren't sure they can get it because they carry the previously released version with the orange and purple cover, and if I want it then I have to order that one!! It's truly disgusting!! They'll carry deluxe versions of Pearl Jam or Nickelback but it's almost like there's some conspiracy to not carry prog rock!!
And with that he was smiling slightly and slowly withdrew a copy of the 30th anniversary edition out of his jacket, and said "Well....this is for you Chris"!! It was signed "To Chris, With All Best Wishes"
Needless to say I was happily shocked!!
Ian is a true gentleman
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, September 14, 2008 2:23 PM
Subject: Re: [newmellotrongroup] Re: Kinda OT/King Crimson's use of calliope on ITCOTCK


On Sep 14, 2008, at 2:06 PM, Paul Jones wrote:

Agree about Ian's flute playing. Have seen Schizoid Band twice, and
him and Mel Collins were amazing together.

Yeah, Mel is no slouch either.

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG.
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.6.21/1669 - Release Date: 12/09/2008 2:18 PM

Re: [newmellotrongroup] Re: Kinda OT/King Crimson's use of calliope on ITCOTCK

2008-09-14 by Rick Blechta


On Sep 14, 2008, at 5:00 PM, Chris Dale wrote:

During the "Tronto" Mellotron convention we had the chance to sort of "interview" Ian. One of the attendees - Ches Cain - actually captured much (but not all) of the interview on videotape.
I have a copy of that tape somewhere and recall that Ian seemed very pleased that we asked about all the facets of his career, which shed much light on why he left Crimson, his work with Giles, Fireballet, Foreigner etc.
Later that night at the pub, our conversation turned to discussion about the present state of the music industry and how the major stores were carrying less jazz, blues, rock, and devoting more shelf space to the top 40 sellers. During the chat I had lamented an example to him that I couldn't find the special 30th anniversary edition of "Court" despite repeated trips to several stores.
The following night at the pub, at a private table, he brought up that topic again and asked me something like "So you never could find it??" And then - re-living my frustration with the search I answered "Yeah, I can't believe that these major stores aren't regularly carrying it!! They're telling me they aren't sure they can get it because they carry the previously released version with the orange and purple cover, and if I want it then I have to order that one!! It's truly disgusting!! They'll carry deluxe versions of Pearl Jam or Nickelback but it's almost like there's some conspiracy to not carry prog rock!!
And with that he was smiling slightly and slowly withdrew a copy of the 30th anniversary edition out of his jacket, and said "Well....this is for you Chris"!! It was signed "To Chris, With All Best Wishes"
Needless to say I was happily shocked!!
Ian is a true gentleman

Wait a minute! He said the exact same thing to me! But he also added to mine: "Chris Dale is a wanker" and that makes it more valuable!

;)

Re: Kinda OT/King Crimson's use of calliope on ITCOTCK

2008-09-15 by bayofkings7

Yes, Rick, thanks for the great info!

Tom




--- In newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com, Rick Blechta <rick@...>
wrote:
>
> Okay, here's the scuttlebutt.
>
> As some of you know, my wife, Vicki, is a very fine classical
flutist.
> On a trip to NY to visit the relatives, a trip was arranged to go
down
> to the city and see Ian (who had been the Special Guest at the
second
> Tronto Clambake in 2001). They were going to spend some time
playing
> duet (he really is a good flute player, too). I brought my brother
> along because he wanted to meet Ian and get some albums signed.
>
> My brother, a former audio engineer, has always been fascinated on
how
> they got such huge gain (and no distortion) on that massive pitch
> sweep in "Epitaph", so naturally, he start asking Ian questions
about
> that and the rest of the album. So here are some tidbits from that
> conversation.
>
> There was a calliope in a corner of the studio and naturally the
boys
> started fooling around with it. Only problem was, it was really
flat.
> That's why the calliope part in ITCOTCK is in a different key. Not
> being keyboard players, I guess they were not good at transposing
or
> just decided to go with the flow. Anyway, the section was played
by
> McDonald on the top end with Giles playing the sustained notes on
the
> bottom on the second time through. Ian played the calliope the rest
of
> the way by himself.
>
> For "Schizoid Man", that is the calliope at the beginning, too.
It's
> McDonald and Giles again, just sweeping the flats of their hands
over
> the keys. Being air driven and with a pretty poor air supply to
begin
> with, the instrument would just sort of whistle and groan. They
> thought this sounded cool for the beginning of the album -- and I
> think they were right.
>
> Some other things of interest:
>
> * "Schizoid Man" was done in one take, live off the floor and then
the
> second sax solo overdubbed in one. Pretty impressive!
>
> * "Epitaph", on the other hand took 16 hours to record. They
couldn't
> get the sound and feel right. It was also recorded last which is
why
> the mellotron sounds different than the other two songs on the
album
> that use it. They found a way to make it sound better. It was
recorded
> from a HiWatt amp (not a direct line to the board) and then run
> through a plate reverb. The sweep part was played by McDonald and
> Fripp and the mellotron was double-tracked pretty well throughout.
>
> * The album was done on an 8-track machine with numerous bounce
downs,
> a la the method used by the Beatles.
>
> There you have it!
>
> Rick
>

Re: [newmellotrongroup] Re: Kinda OT/King Crimson's use of calliope on ITCOTCK

2008-09-15 by marabus

Chris,
Wonderful story!
Pete

Chris Dale wrote:
> During the "Tronto" Mellotron convention we had the chance to sort of
> "interview" Ian. One of the attendees - Ches Cain - actually captured
> much (but not all) of the interview on videotape.
>
> I have a copy of that tape somewhere and recall that Ian seemed very
> pleased that we asked about all the facets of his career, which shed
> much light on why he left Crimson, his work with Giles, Fireballet,
> Foreigner etc.
>
> Later that night at the pub, our conversation turned to discussion
> about the present state of the music industry and how the major stores
> were carrying less jazz, blues, rock, and devoting more shelf space
> to the top 40 sellers. During the chat I had lamented an example to
> him that I couldn't find the special 30th anniversary edition of
> "Court" despite repeated trips to several stores.
>
> The following night at the pub, at a private table, he brought up that
> topic again and asked me something like "So you never could find
> it??" And then - re-living my frustration with the search I
> answered "Yeah, I can't believe that these major stores aren't
> regularly carrying it!! They're telling me they aren't sure they can
> get it because they carry the previously released version with the
> orange and purple cover, and if I want it then I have to order /that/
> one!! It's truly disgusting!! They'll carry deluxe versions of Pearl
> Jam or Nickelback but it's almost like there's some conspiracy to not
> carry prog rock!!
>
> And with that he was smiling slightly and slowly withdrew a copy of
> the 30th anniversary edition out of his jacket, and said
> "Well....this is for you Chris"!! It was signed "To Chris, With All
> Best Wishes"
>
> Needless to say I was happily shocked!!
>
> Ian is a true gentleman
>

Re: [newmellotrongroup] Re: Kinda OT/King Crimson's use of calliope on ITCOTCK

2008-09-15 by Mike Dickson

Wow. No wonder you're broke.

Rick Blechta wrote:
>
>
> On Sep 14, 2008, at 10:05 PM, bayofkings7 wrote:
>
>> Yes, Rick, thanks for the great info!
>>
>> Tom
>
> Of course, you all know I write novels for a living (at least
> partially), so most of this is a pack of lies...
>
> ;)
>

--
Mike Dickson, Edinburgh

Free Music Project: http://www.last.fm/music/Mike+Dickson
Or http://www.mikedickson.org.uk/

Re: [newmellotrongroup] Re: Kinda OT/King Crimson's use of calliope on ITCOTCK

2008-09-15 by Steven Davies-Morris

Chris Dale wrote:
>
>
> During the "Tronto" Mellotron convention we had the chance to sort
> of "interview" Ian. One of the attendees - Ches Cain - actually
> captured much (but not all) of the interview on videotape.

[snip]

That's a very cool story!
--
Cheers, SDM -- a 21st Century Schizoid Man
Systems Theory internet music project: <www.systemstheory.net>
on MySpace: <www.myspace.com/systemstheory>
on Last FM: <www.last.fm/music/Systems+Theory>
get "Codetalkers" *free* at <www.mikedickson.org.uk/codetalkers>
NP: nothing