Synth-DIY Yahoo! Groups Archives

Poor guys like me who have to work with VSTs and Samples

2015-02-06 by xp_sucks@hotmail.com

On The Edge Of Forever

This is the second track from the Quantum Vistas Album. It tells of the places we go to in our dreams.

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I've been pretty quiet up until now. I'm a hobby DAW writer and also play bass guitar.

I cant afford a real Tron and nor do I currently have a space to put it (sob)!

However this is one of my songs made with DVI Mellotron and Redtron. I hope I am not being too vulgar of mentioning those names amoungst purists.

Regards to all feel free to comment if you wish, good bad or the other.

Cheers Tee

Re: [newmellotrongroup] Poor guys like me who have to work with VSTs and Samples

2015-02-06 by Bryant Jones

If you do get extra cash check this out. It's only 5" tall and sounds great. I just got one. M4000D Digital Mellotron - $2,799.00 : Big City Music, Vintage and New Music Equipment

M4000D Digital Mellotron - $2,799.00 : Big City Music, V...

Big City Music M4000D Digital Mellotron - Currently out of stock. More will be coming in a few weeks. You can pre-order now if you'd like. The M4000D Digital Mellot...

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On Friday, February 6, 2015 4:48 AM, "xp_sucks@hotmail.com [newmellotrongroup]" <newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

On The Edge Of Forever

This is the second track from the Quantum Vistas Album. It tells of the places we go to in our dreams.

View on soundcloud.com

Preview by Yahoo

I've been pretty quiet up until now. I'm a hobby DAW writer and also play bass guitar.

I cant afford a real Tron and nor do I currently have a space to put it (sob)!

However this is one of my songs made with DVI Mellotron and Redtron. I hope I am not being too vulgar of mentioning those names amoungst purists.

Regards to all feel free to comment if you wish, good bad or the other.

Cheers Tee

Re: Poor guys like me who have to work with VSTs and Samples

2015-02-07 by Berington Van Campen

Hey Tee,

I'm sure no one here has their noses that high in the air. The fact that you even KNOW about Mellotrons, and want one, is the Awareness we all want to foster, anyway. It was a number of years after I'd learned what Mellotrons REALLY could do (The Beatles, definitely, but King Crimson #1 was the one that really dropped MY jaw, & I know I'm not alone there!), before the planets lined up & I was able to find a super-clean, used M400, around 1976. I later ordered custom tapes for a 2nd frame, & to customize the originals VERY slightly, adding tymps & percussion to the lowest 3 keys. It literally DID change my life, no doubt.

A couple of years ago I played the M4000D as mentioned below, & it's a magnificent instrument. Still a bit pricey, but it actually brings you 100 (or more) of the sounds available in the Mellotron library. Obviously, more details could be had for the asking. Lots of online stuff about it. Further, the 4000D shows pictures of the 'Trons you're using, so it adds a hint of warm fuzziness, anyway. And you can pick it up under your arm & take it anywhere... something a LITTLE tougher with a full-size instrument.

True, most people are so used to samplers & plug-ins, etc, that none of them have the "panache" or mystique of a real, "open-the-lid-&-show-people-the-tapes" Mellotron, but the M4000D is an awesome, well-sanctioned starting point, with no "euphemistic" or suggestive name on it! In fact, I'm sure LOTS of us would like one to take out for easier stage use.

There are many who ask "Why a Mellotron, even a 4000D, instead of M-tron Pro?", etc. well, there ARE differences, in how they play, & yes, how they sound. (I have M-tron Pro, too, so I speak from 'sperience). Even just to use the volume pedal - not possible with software - is a HUGE part of playing Mellotron, which the 4000D does allow. And if you ever did go live, to hook up a whole computer system, keyboard, etc, to play your M-tron, may end up being less reliable than an old, crotchety, out-of-sorts 400 with dirty tapes! (-:

Good luck to you!

Cheers,

Berington

Berington Van Campen
Van Campen Productions / V.C.MusiCorp Scoring Services
VCMusiCorp1@yahoo.com
The BEATUNES - Beatles Tribute Band
www.TheBeatunes.com
(626) 458-4474 Home/Office
www.facebook.com/berington

Re: [newmellotrongroup] Re: Poor guys like me who have to work with VSTs and Samples

2015-02-08 by HammondB3

Try an M300 for a wonky instrument.... I love mine.

David Martin Jacques

On Feb 7, 2015, at 2:49 PM, Berington Van Campen vcmusicorp1@yahoo.com [newmellotrongroup] <newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Hey Tee,

I'm sure no one here has their noses that high in the air. The fact that you even KNOW about Mellotrons, and want one, is the Awareness we all want to foster, anyway. It was a number of years after I'd learned what Mellotrons REALLY could do (The Beatles, definitely, but King Crimson #1 was the one that really dropped MY jaw, & I know I'm not alone there!), before the planets lined up & I was able to find a super-clean, used M400, around 1976. I later ordered custom tapes for a 2nd frame, & to customize the originals VERY slightly, adding tymps & percussion to the lowest 3 keys. It literally DID change my life, no doubt.

A couple of years ago I played the M4000D as mentioned below, & it's a magnificent instrument. Still a bit pricey, but it actually brings you 100 (or more) of the sounds available in the Mellotron library. Obviously, more details could be had for the asking. Lots of online stuff about it. Further, the 4000D shows pictures of the 'Trons you're using, so it adds a hint of warm fuzziness, anyway. And you can pick it up under your arm & take it anywhere... something a LITTLE tougher with a full-size instrument.

True, most people are so used to samplers & plug-ins, etc, that none of them have the "panache" or mystique of a real, "open-the-lid-&-show-people-the-tapes" Mellotron, but the M4000D is an awesome, well-sanctioned starting point, with no "euphemistic" or suggestive name on it! In fact, I'm sure LOTS of us would like one to take out for easier stage use.

There are many who ask "Why a Mellotron, even a 4000D, instead of M-tron Pro?", etc. well, there ARE differences, in how they play, & yes, how they sound. (I have M-tron Pro, too, so I speak from 'sperience). Even just to use the volume pedal - not possible with software - is a HUGE part of playing Mellotron, which the 4000D does allow. And if you ever did go live, to hook up a whole computer system, keyboard, etc, to play your M-tron, may end up being less reliable than an old, crotchety, out-of-sorts 400 with dirty tapes! (-:

Good luck to you!

Cheers,
Berington

Berington Van Campen
Van Campen Productions / V.C.MusiCorp Scoring Services
VCMusiCorp1@yahoo.com
The BEATUNES - Beatles Tribute Band
www.TheBeatunes.com
(626) 458-4474 Home/Office
www.facebook.com/berington

Re: Poor guys like me who have to work with VSTs and Samples

2015-02-08 by tron400@yahoo.com

There's really no way to use a volume pedal with software? I'm not very MIDI knowledgeable, but I thought you could assign MIDI channels between a host and a MIDI keyboard.

Another option of a digital standalone is the Manikin Memotron. While not having the keyboard feel of a 4000D, there is the benefit of being able to load it with Streetly Mellotron samples, which, as far as I know, are the same high quality samples that are available for the M-Tron Pro.

Bernie

Re: [newmellotrongroup] Re: Poor guys like me who have to work with VSTs and Samples

2015-02-08 by fdoddy@aol.com

In general, it shouldn't be a big deal to assign a volume pedal to a MIDI fader/volume in your software instrument. In Kontakt, this is the default on nearly every instrument programmed for it and is the default for creating new patches. Often, I'll reassign

CC#1, mod wheel, to volume.

-----Original Message-----
From: tron400@yahoo.com [newmellotrongroup] <newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com>
To: newmellotrongroup <newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sun, Feb 8, 2015 6:29 am
Subject: [newmellotrongroup] Re: Poor guys like me who have to work with VSTs and Samples

There's really no way to use a volume pedal with software? I'm not very MIDI knowledgeable, but I thought you could assign MIDI channels between a host and a MIDI keyboard.

Another option of a digital standalone is the Manikin Memotron. While not having the keyboard feel of a 4000D, there is the benefit of being able to load it with Streetly Mellotron samples, which, as far as I know, are the same high quality samples that are available for the M-Tron Pro.

Bernie

Re: Poor guys like me who have to work with VSTs and Samples

2015-02-08 by seanlowrie.dinuba@gmail.com

I do a fair amount of gigging with M-tron and some other samples I've been gifted running off this very laptop. It's actually quite reliable. The VST is not likely to crash, the host is not likely to crash, and if your computer has its wifi card shut off during the gig, and you basically leave it alone and play, the computer is not likely to crash.

In three years I've had 1 computer crash live. However, I've had 4 volume pedals fail suddenly in the same amount of time. I do not recommend Ernie Ball volume pedals, though they're cheap and ubiquitous.

But you're certainly right about the volume pedal being part of the sound. I ride it all the time with the 'tron. And of course be careful to have my reverb unit last in chain!

I was actually amazed that the keyboardist who plays the sampled tron with The Moody Blues right now just ignores his volume pedal. I watched and listened at both concerts I was able to attend. It's there, at his feet, in chain. He just doesn't bother. Sounds.... wrong.

Other than that haven't personally met anyone playing any form of Mellotron in a live setting whatsoever. A few guys playing Hammond via Nordwave or such (seems to be getting more common, so I'm itching to start lugging the A-100 around. I already lug the Leslie 860 and it's worlds of improvement), a few guys who lug Rhodes 73s around, some combo organ imitators, and an all girl novelty band that has a small chord organ. Never Mellotron though. Ever.

And everywhere I go, I get the same surprised commentary from the sound guy and club owner at soundcheck. ".... .Holy Crap are you playing Nights in White Satin??"

Makes me feel speeeshaaaallll.

-Sean

---In newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com, <vcmusicorp1@...> wrote :

Hey Tee,

I'm sure no one here has their noses that high in the air. The fact that you even KNOW about Mellotrons, and want one, is the Awareness we all want to foster, anyway. It was a number of years after I'd learned what Mellotrons REALLY could do (The Beatles, definitely, but King Crimson #1 was the one that really dropped MY jaw, & I know I'm not alone there!), before the planets lined up & I was able to find a super-clean, used M400, around 1976. I later ordered custom tapes for a 2nd frame, & to customize the originals VERY slightly, adding tymps & percussion to the lowest 3 keys. It literally DID change my life, no doubt.

A couple of years ago I played the M4000D as mentioned below, & it's a magnificent instrument. Still a bit pricey, but it actually brings you 100 (or more) of the sounds available in the Mellotron library. Obviously, more details could be had for the asking. Lots of online stuff about it. Further, the 4000D shows pictures of the 'Trons you're using, so it adds a hint of warm fuzziness, anyway. And you can pick it up under your arm & take it anywhere... something a LITTLE tougher with a full-size instrument.

True, most people are so used to samplers & plug-ins, etc, that none of them have the "panache" or mystique of a real, "open-the-lid-&-show-people-the-tapes" Mellotron, but the M4000D is an awesome, well-sanctioned starting point, with no "euphemistic" or suggestive name on it! In fact, I'm sure LOTS of us would like one to take out for easier stage use.

There are many who ask "Why a Mellotron, even a 4000D, instead of M-tron Pro?", etc. well, there ARE differences, in how they play, & yes, how they sound. (I have M-tron Pro, too, so I speak from 'sperience). Even just to use the volume pedal - not possible with software - is a HUGE part of playing Mellotron, which the 4000D does allow. And if you ever did go live, to hook up a whole computer system, keyboard, etc, to play your M-tron, may end up being less reliable than an old, crotchety, out-of-sorts 400 with dirty tapes! (-:

Good luck to you!

Cheers,

Berington

Berington Van Campen
Van Campen Productions / V.C.MusiCorp Scoring Services
VCMusiCorp1@...
The BEATUNES - Beatles Tribute Band
www.TheBeatunes.com
(626) 458-4474 Home/Office
www.facebook.com/berington

Re: Poor guys like me who have to work with VSTs and Samples

2015-02-09 by Tee Squared

Hi gents. Since I started this thread i would like to comment about thevolume pedal issue. Remember back in the day of the early 200 thru 400 machines there was no midi. Borrowed from electronic organs it was more akin to swell pedal in the audio line. The only time i had to try this live was for a rendition of Epitaph in a cover band I was in. From the audio out to the pa desk in I inserted a passive Boss volume pedal. It was crude but it worked a treat. Sorry im trying to compose this mail on va crowded Tokyo subway train.

Re: [newmellotrongroup] Re: Poor guys like me who have to work with VSTs and Samples

2015-02-09 by seanlowrie.dinuba@gmail.com

MIDI CC# 7 is standard for volume control in most anything.

And swell pedals that output midi cc information are made. However, I don't find them laying around at guitar center the way I find the usual 1/4" jack 100Kohm pedals.

One thing I don't know: Since CC only has 128 values (0-127) is there a noticeable step effect when it comes to volume changes? Never tried. I've always played and recorded in audio not midi maps.

Re: [newmellotrongroup] Re: Poor guys like me who have to work with VSTs and Samples

2015-02-10 by Steven Davies-Morris

On 02/09/2015 12:01 PM, seanlowrie.dinuba@gmail.com [newmellotrongroup]
wrote:

> MIDI CC# 7 is standard for volume control in most anything.
>
> And swell pedals that output midi cc information are made. However, I
> don't find them laying around at guitar center the way I find the usual
> 1/4" jack 100Kohm pedals.
>
> One thing I don't know: Since CC only has 128 values (0-127) is there a
> noticeable step effect when it comes to volume changes? Never tried.
> I've always played and recorded in audio not midi maps.

Sean. New album? When?

--
SDM a 21st century schizoid man in SoCal
Systems Theory website www.systemstheory.net
Through The Looking Glass radio show at www.deepnuggets.com