2011-07-05 by sdavmor
On 07/05/2011 06:02 AM, Jack Younger wrote:
> Hello, All!
>
> So, I tend to frequent a particular flea market in Northern
> Massachusetts every Sunday and have found quite a few music-oriented
> things for short dough over the years. But this takes the cake. Allow
> me to set the scene:
>
> A producer friend of mine and I park the car and just as we are
> leaving the field to where the vendors are (it's outdoors), I notice a
> bench to a C3. I make a joke about where the organ is and think
> nothing further on it. We browse around, pick up some small things,
> see some friends and its time to go so we head back to the car. My
> friend decides he likes the bench (he recently got a CP70b and needs
> something to use with it) and the vendor gives it to him for $25, a
> sweet deal in and of itself. I quip "The organ is included in that
> price, right?" The guy says, "Well there IS an organ that goes with
> that, but you'd have to talk to the woman who owns it." They have no
> idea what model it could be, "...but it's a Hammond". We get her
> number and leave, excited by the mystery.
>
> Later in the day, I call her out of curiosity. Turns out, it was an
> estate item that didn't sell and she says, "We were going to smash it
> up and toss it in the dumpster. You can have it for the moving." !!!!
> I ask for pictures and model numbers. She sends them to my phone. Lo
> and behold...indeed, it's a C3! Purchased in 1959, it has sat in their
> living room, lightly used since then. Unfortunately, the tone cab was
> sold in the sale, but the organ remains. Apparently, it needs only one
> tube to function, but its mint, so even if there's more to be done,
> it's most certainly worth it.
>
> Long and short, I have movers grabbing it this week. So psyched! This
> will be an amazing addition to the studio and a nice friend for my
> Mellotron and recently purchased Rhodes 73 Suitcase.
>
> Now the questions for the B3/C3 folks out there....
>
> Obviously, I need a Leslie (which is why I'm not crying over the tone
> cab). I'm looking for a 122, 147, etc. and have a few local leads. My
> query is this:
>
> Do any of you prefer a Trek pedal to the half-moon switch? Tube or
> solid state? Pros and cons? There's a great tech here in MA that I'll
> have go through it, but I'd like to avoid any expensive
> experimentation. Any insight would be helpful.
>
> Thanks, and Cheers!
> -Jack
Wow! that is one hell of a find. Well done!
--
Cheers, SDM -- a 21st Century Schizoid Man
Systems Theory project website: http://systemstheory.net
find us on MySpace, GarageBand, Reverb Nation, Last FM, CDBaby
free MP3s of Systems Theory, Mike Dickson & Greg Amov music at
http://mikedickson.org.uk
2011-07-05 by John Hammaren
I too have a modular - Synthesizers.com 134 spaces, built up over three years and I still delete a module and add some of the more esoteric ones that pop up used. While I don't spend nearly enough time with it, particularly since Frank brought #525 back to life for me (man that little guy - the 525, not you Frank- is a joy, even with it's ideosyncracies). Anyway, the Dotcom is an incredible box for the price. Is it a Moog? Hell no. My Voyager kills it when it comes to the big sounds, but there's plenty more than just that. A real Dotcommer might disagree with that last statement. I have not found that sweet spot though. What I wanted to point out, which seems to be the biggest issue ultimately for all micro-sized industry buyers is support. I can't speak for the Vostok other than what I read in SOS
http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jan03/articles/ansvostok.asp
I have never, and I mean never experienced support like I have with the Dotcom. Misplug a module and eff it up? Send it back, and get a new one. One note on the VC keyboard goes bad after 5 years? Send it back. Fixed it up no-charge. Now that's service. The one negative is that the modules do tend to be more generic, although there is the Moog 960/61/62/63 clone and a really nice Qunatizer that came out a while back. The quarter inch Moog format is a plus for me but not for some. It might be a stretch to put the portable format in a suitcase. MU format seems to have gained immense popularity. With that said, if you are in Europe, then the Vostok makes a bit more sense due to the usual exchange/duty issues. DotCom is NOT ROHS last I heard, although that might have changed, so shipment of new to the continent is a problem. Finally, if you want the best of a lot of worlds, get a Moog Voyager XL, if you have the sheckcles. Or a Buchla 200e. Okay, just kidding on that one.
RegaRDS,
John
From: newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com<mailto:newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com> [mailto:newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com]<mailto:[mailto:newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com]> On Behalf Of Tom Doncourt
Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2011 4:31 PM
To: newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com<mailto:newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: Re: [newmellotrongroup] Re: Somewhat off topic.... Hammond C3 story....question or two....
Thanks Tony,I will !
On Jul 5, 2011, at 3:36 PM, Tony wrote:
Hey Tom, I love both of mine, just missed a 3rd (seller unposted, suspicious), oh well.
I'm going modular, in a major way.
I'll bet you'd like it, and I was an ARP tech in the 80's (good times), as well as an Oberheim and Sequential tech too.
Feel free to consult me, if you like.
Best,
Tony
----- Original Message -----
From: Tom Doncourt<mailto:tomdcour@amnh.org>
To: newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com<mailto:newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2011 2:39 PM
Subject: Re: [newmellotrongroup] Re: Somewhat off topic.... Hammond C3 story....question or two....
Tony, I thought surviving marriage gave a person more soul!! I'll bet its in there germinating somewhere! I am curious how you like your 2600. I have been thinking about putting together a modular system , looked at vintage stuff and am looking at the new modular stuff- its's a little bewildering. I like the idea of a "suitcase" synth like the 2600 and also the new Vostok by Analogue Solutions.
On Jul 5, 2011, at 2:27 PM, Tony wrote:
Same here Gary, played guitar, 6 yrs of nothing for the lack of soul (too young I suspect), heard Tangerine Dream in college, and figured it out with my 2600, never recorded a minute of it.
100% improvised several times a day, got married 3 times, and each time it took a little bit of my soul with it.
Been "clean" lol for 3 1/2 yrs, and starting to feel the flow again.
Sounds like a load of crap, but you guys uundersand, and you're the only ones who's opinion I care about.
Isn't for lack of instrumemtation, that's for sure :-)
Tony
----- Original Message -----
From: Gary Brumm<mailto:gabru@comsec.net>
To: newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com<mailto:newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2011 1:50 PM
Subject: RE: [newmellotrongroup] Re: Somewhat off topic.... Hammond C3 story....question or two....
Yeah Tony, I am that way with the piano. I grew up playing organs and synths with non-velocity keyboards
and I just don't have the "touch" for the piano. Although I have been told that I don't play the organ like a
piano player so I guess that may be a sideways complement :).
Gary
From: newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com<mailto:newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com> [mailto:newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com]<mailto:[mailto:newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com]> On Behalf Of Tony
Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2011 9:33 AM
To: newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com<mailto:newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: Re: [newmellotrongroup] Re: Somewhat off topic.... Hammond C3 story....question or two....
Great growling beasts!
I just don't have the "touch" for them.
Guess I could work on it, huh?
Congrats on your deal man, it musta been meant to be!
Tony
----- Original Message -----
From: tron400<mailto:tron400@yahoo.com>
To: newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com<mailto:newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2011 12:27 PM
Subject: [newmellotrongroup] Re: Somewhat off topic.... Hammond C3 story....question or two....
Two 122's and a 3-position half-moon switch.
...and congratulations!!
Bernie
--- In newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com<mailto:newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com>, Jack Younger <e4103s@...<mailto:e4103s@...>> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
> Hello, All!
> So, I tend to frequent a particular flea market in Northern Massachusetts every Sunday and have found quite a few music-oriented things for short dough over the years. But this takes the cake. Allow me to set the scene:
> A producer friend of mine and I park the car and just as we are leaving the field to where the vendors are (it's outdoors), I notice a bench to a C3. I make a joke about where the organ is and think nothing further on it. We browse around, pick up some small things, see some friends and its time to go so we head back to the car. My friend decides he likes the bench (he recently got a CP70b and needs something to use with it) and the vendor gives it to him for $25, a sweet deal in and of itself. I quip "The organ is included in that price, right?" The guy says, "Well there IS an organ that goes with that, but you'd have to talk to the woman who owns it." They have no idea what model it could be, "...but it's a Hammond". We get her number and leave, excited by the mystery.
> Later in the day, I call her out of curiosity. Turns out, it was an estate item that didn't sell and she says, "We were going to smash it up and toss it in the dumpster. You can have it for the moving." !!!! I ask for pictures and model numbers. She sends them to my phone. Lo and behold...indeed, it's a C3! Purchased in 1959, it has sat in their living room, lightly used since then. Unfortunately, the tone cab was sold in the sale, but the organ remains. Apparently, it needs only one tube to function, but its mint, so even if there's more to be done, it's most certainly worth it.
> Long and short, I have movers grabbing it this week. So psyched! This will be an amazing addition to the studio and a nice friend for my Mellotron and recently purchased Rhodes 73 Suitcase.
> Now the questions for the B3/C3 folks out there....
> Obviously, I need a Leslie (which is why I'm not crying over the tone cab). I'm looking for a 122, 147, etc. and have a few local leads. My query is this:
> Do any of you prefer a Trek pedal to the half-moon switch? Tube or solid state? Pros and cons? There's a great tech here in MA that I'll have go through it, but I'd like to avoid any expensive experimentation. Any insight would be helpful.
> Thanks, and Cheers!-Jack
>
2011-07-06 by tron400
Up until a year ago (or less) I had an 88-space Dotcom with several 3rd party modules. Dotcom is a great foundation and with all the 3rd party manufacturers supporting it now, you can build quite a versatile system.
Now my modular is down to a 22-space portable after selling off most of it so I could give my stepdaughter some cash for college. She started at MIT last month, so hopefully in the future when she gets a job, she'll remember
Bernie
--- In newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com, John Hammaren wrote:
>
> I too have a modular - Synthesizers.com 134 spaces, built up over three years and I still delete a module and add some of the more esoteric ones that pop up used. While I don't spend nearly enough time with it, particularly since Frank brought #525 back to life for me (man that little guy - the 525, not you Frank- is a joy, even with it's ideosyncracies). Anyway, the Dotcom is an incredible box for the price. Is it a Moog? Hell no. My Voyager kills it when it comes to the big sounds, but there's plenty more than just that. A real Dotcommer might disagree with that last statement. I have not found that sweet spot though. What I wanted to point out, which seems to be the biggest issue ultimately for all micro-sized industry buyers is support. I can't speak for the Vostok other than what I read in SOS
> http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jan03/articles/ansvostok.asp
>
> I have never, and I mean never experienced support like I have with the Dotcom. Misplug a module and eff it up? Send it back, and get a new one. One note on the VC keyboard goes bad after 5 years? Send it back. Fixed it up no-charge. Now that's service. The one negative is that the modules do tend to be more generic, although there is the Moog 960/61/62/63 clone and a really nice Qunatizer that came out a while back. The quarter inch Moog format is a plus for me but not for some. It might be a stretch to put the portable format in a suitcase. MU format seems to have gained immense popularity. With that said, if you are in Europe, then the Vostok makes a bit more sense due to the usual exchange/duty issues. DotCom is NOT ROHS last I heard, although that might have changed, so shipment of new to the continent is a problem. Finally, if you want the best of a lot of worlds, get a Moog Voyager XL, if you have the sheckcles. Or a Buchla 200e. Okay, just kidding on that one.
>
> RegaRDS,
>
> John
>
>; From: newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com On Behalf Of Tom Doncourt
> Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2011 4:31 PM
> To: newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: [newmellotrongroup] Re: Somewhat off topic.... Hammond C3 story....question or two....
>
>
>
> Thanks Tony,I will !
> On Jul 5, 2011, at 3:36 PM, Tony wrote:
>
>
>
>
> Hey Tom, I love both of mine, just missed a 3rd (seller unposted, suspicious), oh well.
> I'm going modular, in a major way.
> I'll bet you'd like it, and I was an ARP tech in the 80's (good times), as well as an Oberheim and Sequential tech too.
>
> Feel free to consult me, if you like.
>
> Best,
> Tony
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Tom Doncourt> To: newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2011 2:39 PM
> Subject: Re: [newmellotrongroup] Re: Somewhat off topic.... Hammond C3 story....question or two....
>
>
>
> Tony, I thought surviving marriage gave a person more soul!! I'll bet its in there germinating somewhere! I am curious how you like your 2600. I have been thinking about putting together a modular system , looked at vintage stuff and am looking at the new modular stuff- its's a little bewildering. I like the idea of a "suitcase" synth like the 2600 and also the new Vostok by Analogue Solutions.
>
> On Jul 5, 2011, at 2:27 PM, Tony wrote:
>
>
>
>
> Same here Gary, played guitar, 6 yrs of nothing for the lack of soul (too young I suspect), heard Tangerine Dream in college, and figured it out with my 2600, never recorded a minute of it.
> 100% improvised several times a day, got married 3 times, and each time it took a little bit of my soul with it.
>
> Been "clean" lol for 3 1/2 yrs, and starting to feel the flow again.
> Sounds like a load of crap, but you guys uundersand, and you're the only ones who's opinion I care about.
>
> Isn't for lack of instrumemtation, that's for sure :-)
> Tony
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Gary Brumm> To: newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2011 1:50 PM
> Subject: RE: [newmellotrongroup] Re: Somewhat off topic.... Hammond C3 story....question or two....
>
>
>
> Yeah Tony, I am that way with the piano. I grew up playing organs and synths with non-velocity keyboards
> and I just don't have the "touch" for the piano. Although I have been told that I don't play the organ like a
> piano player so I guess that may be a sideways complement :).
> Gary
> From: newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com On Behalf Of Tony
> Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2011 9:33 AM
> To: newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: [newmellotrongroup] Re: Somewhat off topic.... Hammond C3 story....question or two....
>
> Great growling beasts!
> I just don't have the "touch" for them.
> Guess I could work on it, huh?
> Congrats on your deal man, it musta been meant to be!
> Tony
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: tron400> To: newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2011 12:27 PM
> Subject: [newmellotrongroup] Re: Somewhat off topic.... Hammond C3 story....question or two....
>
>
> Two 122's and a 3-position half-moon switch.
>
> ...and congratulations!!
>
> Bernie
>
> --- In newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com wrote:
> >
> > Hello, All!
> > So, I tend to frequent a particular flea market in Northern Massachusetts every Sunday and have found quite a few music-oriented things for short dough over the years. But this takes the cake. Allow me to set the scene:
> > A producer friend of mine and I park the car and just as we are leaving the field to where the vendors are (it's outdoors), I notice a bench to a C3. I make a joke about where the organ is and think nothing further on it. We browse around, pick up some small things, see some friends and its time to go so we head back to the car. My friend decides he likes the bench (he recently got a CP70b and needs something to use with it) and the vendor gives it to him for $25, a sweet deal in and of itself. I quip "The organ is included in that price, right?" The guy says, "Well there IS an organ that goes with that, but you'd have to talk to the woman who owns it." They have no idea what model it could be, "...but it's a Hammond". We get her number and leave, excited by the mystery.
> > Later in the day, I call her out of curiosity. Turns out, it was an estate item that didn't sell and she says, "We were going to smash it up and toss it in the dumpster. You can have it for the moving." !!!! I ask for pictures and model numbers. She sends them to my phone. Lo and behold...indeed, it's a C3! Purchased in 1959, it has sat in their living room, lightly used since then. Unfortunately, the tone cab was sold in the sale, but the organ remains. Apparently, it needs only one tube to function, but its mint, so even if there's more to be done, it's most certainly worth it.
> > Long and short, I have movers grabbing it this week. So psyched! This will be an amazing addition to the studio and a nice friend for my Mellotron and recently purchased Rhodes 73 Suitcase.
> > Now the questions for the B3/C3 folks out there....
> > Obviously, I need a Leslie (which is why I'm not crying over the tone cab). I'm looking for a 122, 147, etc. and have a few local leads. My query is this:
> > Do any of you prefer a Trek pedal to the half-moon switch? Tube or solid state? Pros and cons? There's a great tech here in MA that I'll have go through it, but I'd like to avoid any expensive experimentation. Any insight would be helpful.
> > Thanks, and Cheers!-Jack
> >
>
2011-07-08 by william Beith
One other pre amp consideration is to wire a phone jack/plug after the pre amp
and before the signal goes to t eh Leslie. Then take your favorite effects box
and run the Hammond through it sending the output to the Leslie via the phone
plug/jack insert point. The sound of a long dense reverb tail with a Leslie on
slow is quite a sound. Lets you play the precussion with all drawbars off like a
conga.
Bill
________________________________
From: Mark Wallis <markstuartwallis@hotmail.com>
To: new trongroup <newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Fri, July 8, 2011 4:59:12 PM
Subject: RE: [newmellotrongroup] Somewhat off topic.... Hammond C3
story....question or two....
Well done there on the C3! Hopefully the following may be helpful:
Most Leslies can be used with this providing a suitable connector box is
supplied with the Leslie you go for. All rotary speakers are in their own way
cool yet the old favourites still tend to be the 122/147 series. The 147 is also
the least hassle to connect, and you don't necessarily need any kind of
connector box as signal and power can be tapped straight from the organ, a six
pin Amphenol socket can be substituted for an existing 5-pin in the
brown-painted output box that lives in the bottom of the case, connect up the
switch of your choice and wail..
Do you already have a half-moon switch fitted, or even two? If so, then chances
are that you'll a six pin socket lurking on the output box and if you have a
switch marked MAIN ENSEMBLE ECHO then you should have an output for at least 1
Leslie and either one of Hammonds tone cabs (5 pin, mains supply + balanced
pre-amped signal) or another Leslie. Even if switches have been removed most of
the wiring might still remain and hopefully the Leslie sockets. Feel for screw
holes along the underside of the front lip of the organ.
There's a bit more involved in connecting a 122 owing to different switching
arrangements. 122s respond slightly differently when speeds are switched and the
balanced signal makes for less susceptibility to interference from stage lights.
The C3 is designed to output a balanced signal, fairly heftily pre-amped, which
needs to be attenuated (simple job) if you want to wire in a jack socket for use
with your favourite amp. This is always a handy way of getting around the lack
of reverb on most Leslies, simply have a small guitar amp there just for reverb
or any other effects you fancy. Reverb model valve Leslies have stationary
reverb speakers anyway. You'll have fun playing STUPIDLY loud Hammond through
the Big Rock Guitar Wall Of Doom for a while but Leslies are more fun. They
breathe.
Mechanically, 147 and 122 are identical. 145 ! and 142 are, respectively, 147
and 122 in shorter cabinets. A 145's amp will be marked '147'.
Important: If you're wired for a 122 NEVER plug a 147 in and vice-versa, even
though they both use the 6-pin connection. Just don't. Always check when you get
the opportunity to try other Leslies, or are borrowing or lending Hammond/Leslie
stuff.
If the Leslie's lost it's labels there's an easy way to tell- A 122 amp has 2
identical small valves (12AU7) at the front end and 1 volume pot, a 147/145 has
just 1 12AU7, a volume control and a rotary switch for impedance matching (these
amps were designed to be used with unbalanced signals, making them easier to use
with non-Hammond organs.)
Valve vs solid state...
solid state Leslies are cool. They're Leslies, and all Leslies are cool.
Valve ones sound nicer. Transistor ones are handy for the motor stacks so don't
be afraid of tatty cheap 760s once you get your 122/147/145.
You don't need a pre-amp pedal. You have a perfectly splendid valve preamp in
the C3. Use the RCA jack on the 'conning tower' of the preamp (the AO-28) and
you also have a valve Leslie preamp that you can run guitars into. ..that
happens to be C3 shaped.
Also, benefiting as you do in the USA from lower mains voltage you get to switch
at 110v instead of 240, so straight away your connection issues are simplified.
now, if you can get TWO 147s, or 122s... that's a sound to die for.
Best whooshes,
MSW
________________________________
To: newmellotrongroup@yahoogroups.com
From: unobtainiumkeys@gmail.com
Date: Wed, 6 Jul 2011 09:59:46 +0900
Subject: Re: [newmellotrongroup] Somewhat off topic.... Hammond C3
story....question or two....
The closest I ever got to this was buying an M3 (no tubes in it) for $5.00 at a
Goodwill. They had it alongside other junky organs at the time.
Show quoted textHide quoted text
On Tue, Jul 5, 2011 at 10:02 PM, Jack Younger <e4103s@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>Hello, All!
>
>
>So, I tend to frequent a particular flea market in Northern Massachusetts every
>Sunday and have found quite a few music-oriented things for short dough over the
>years. But this takes the cake. Allow me to set the scene:
>
>
>
>A producer friend of mine and I park the car and just as we are leaving the
>field to where the vendors are (it's outdoors), I notice a bench to a C3. I
>make a joke about where the organ is and think nothing further on it. We browse
>around, pick up some small things, see some friends and its time to go so we
>head back to the car. My friend decides he likes the bench (he recently got a
>CP70b and needs something to use with it) and the vendor gives it to him for
>$25, a sweet deal in and of itself. I quip "The organ is included in that
>price, right?" The guy says, "Well there IS an organ that goes with that, but
>you'd have to talk to the woman who owns it." They have no idea what model it
>could be, "...but it's a Hammond". We get her number and leave, excited by the
>mystery.
>
>
>Later in the day, I call her out of curiosity. Turns out, it was an estate item
>that didn't sell and she says, "We were going to smash it up and toss it in the
>dumpster. You can have it for the moving." !!!! I ask for pictures and model
>numbers. She sends them to my phone. Lo and behold...indeed, it's a C3!
> Purchased in 1959, it has sat in their living room, lightly used since then.
> Unfortunately, the tone cab was sold in the sale, but the organ remains.
> Apparently, it needs only one tube to function, but its mint, so even if
>there's more to be done, it's most certainly worth it.
>
>
>Long and short, I have movers grabbing it this week. So psyched! This will be
>an amazing addition to the studio and a nice friend for my Mellotron and
>recently purchased Rhodes 73 Suitcase.
>
>
>Now the questions for the B3/C3 folks out there....
>
>
>Obviously, I need a Leslie (which is why I'm not crying over the tone cab). I'm
>looking for a 122, 147, etc. and have a few local leads. My query is this:
>
>
>Do any of you prefer a Trek pedal to the half-moon switch? Tube or solid state?
> Pros and cons? There's a great tech here in MA that I'll have go through it,
>but I'd like to avoid any expensive experimentation. Any insight would be
>helpful.
>
>
>Thanks, and Cheers!
>-Jack
>
>
>
>