MOTM

In a message dated 7/29/2000 5:29:59 PM, oldcrow@... writes:

>On Sat, 29 Jul 2000 davevosh@... wrote:
>
>> p.s. - does anyone know what the origins of this antipathy i see
>> between this list ( which i normally find very interesting ) and the
>> "ah" list ( not as consistently interesting but i`ve seen some good
>> stuff over the last week or so ) ? can`t we all just get along ?

Well Dave, you're right, we should "all just get along." And as one who often 
denigrates AH, I recognize the error of my ways! However ....

I strongly agree with Crow here, though for somewhat different reasons. The 
MOTM list was set up to deal with a very limited subject matter (the MOTM -- 
design, construction and use), and, with the exception of a few Stooges, does 
a very good job of that. Even when the subject drifts (or when the jokes fly) 
it quickly comes back to MOTM. 

I also think the (relatively small) size of the list helps too. When the list 
is quiet, and (for example) Ken starts posting about obscure electronic film 
scores, or Crow posts about Japanese animation scores, I really like to read 
and learn about these because of the "MOTM community" -- the way I feel I've 
come to know them, and respect their opinions.

One of my most vivid memories of AH was about two years ago, coming home to 
find 100 AH messages, 60 of which appeared to be about whether Donna Summer's 
big hit from 1977 (you'll forgive me for not remembering the title) was a 
pivotal moment in EM history.

I'd love to see a list similar to the "high S/N" of MOTM or diy about EM 
usage (patching and history for example), but my experience with AH hasn't 
given me encouragement that it's THE list -- I could easily be wrong, and I 
do appreciate the references that are made to that list when appropriate.

While my soldering in no way compares to Crow's, I also believe that most 
posts on this list (from those that don't "solder") are well reasoned 
insights about EM topics related to MOTM -- for example, Larry had almost no 
experience with modulars before MOTM, but his input to the MOTM line (as well 
as his diy type modules) have been to many list members benefit.

But I'll try to just get along!
JB

>  The schism for me lies in the fact that this list has a majority of
>people interested in doing some freestyle engineering on the hardware
>whereas AH (which I can never stand to join for more than 2 days per year)
>always seems to be all about attitudes and nothing about technology or
>even musical art.  No doubt something worthwhile ends up on AH from time
>to time, but I just don't have the time to filter out all the posturing
>and other variant crap to find it.
>
>  I like synthesizer *design*, not endless cycles of animosity over who's
>currently hippest in wrenching t3kn0 machine noise from their toys.  A
>list filled with folks that like to solder suggests a level of enthusiasm
>quite above the rwars on AH.
>
>  (And even for those who buy their MOTM stuff pre-built, it suggests to
>me that folks want quality stuff and I'm happy to be in such company).

In a message dated 00-07-29 22:40:25 EDT, you write:

<< But I'll try to just get along!
 JB >>



john,
both your points and crow`s are well taken. i`m relatively new to "ah" and 
while lots of stuff there is of no real interest to me, i experience the same 
thing with some other lists i`m on like for the amiga. i follow them for the 
good things that i do find of interest. 
best,
dave v.
p.s. - did you get the schematic ?

> From: <jwbarlow@...>
> Well Dave, you're right, we should "all just get along."
> And as one who often denigrates AH, I recognize the
> error of my ways! However ....

As simple as that sounds, even a Curley Stooge Like JWB makes a great point.
I find the lists like this one and mostly synth-diy where members typically
show respect to each other makes for a better list all around.

> I strongly agree with Crow here, though for somewhat different
> reasons. The MOTM list was set up to deal with a very limited
> subject matter (the MOTM -- design, construction and use),
> and, with the exception of a few Stooges,

Mr. Old Crow has some very good observations.  Not to mention some good
'lectronic stuff along the way.  Now, if we could just get him out of the
habit of collecting all that old PAiA modular stuff <snicker>.

> does a very good
> job of that. Even when the subject drifts (or when the jokes fly)
> it quickly comes back to MOTM.

> I also think the (relatively small) size of the list helps too. When
> the list is quiet, and (for example) Ken starts posting about
> obscure electronic film scores, or Crow posts about Japanese
> animation scores, I really like to read and learn about these
> because of the "MOTM community" -- the way I feel I've
> come to know them, and respect their opinions.

Ken, the list is quiet.  It must be your turn.  :)  And, where else could
you find this many synth-geeks in one location (well maybe s-diy)?

> about whether Donna Summer's big hit from 1977
> was a pivotal moment in EM history.

Actually, pivotal BM moment I think (that's # 2 for those that didn't "get"
it). :)

> I'd love to see a list similar to the "high S/N" of MOTM or diy about EM
> usage (patching and history for example),

Oh, I agree JWB.  In fact, we have seen a little of that on this list.
Certainly that is an area where my knowledge is almost nil.  I enjoy hearing
more about "classic" patching methods as much as anything.  I enjoy starting
from scratch.  But, I find myself migrating toward things I know and get in
a rut.  Those of you guys more modular "savvy" than I (that includes just
about everyone) have a lot to share.  I for one enjoy hearing it and it is
certainly ON topic.

Re: AH
> I do appreciate the references that are made to that list when
appropriate.

Me too.  It's kind of like someone else wading through the crap for the one
or two intersting posts out of 100.  Sorry to "use" anyone like that.  But,
after a few months of AH, I had all I could take.  That is not intended to
be anything negative toward the AH list (remember, we should all get along).
It's just that the subject matter is mostly not interesting to me.  However,
it was either AH or S-DIY where I first met Paul and got started with MOTM.
So, there is something good in everything.

> While my soldering in no way compares to Crow's, I also
> believe that most posts on this list (from those that don't
> "solder") are well reasoned insights about EM topics
> related to MOTM

I enjoy the fact that some percentage of the MOTM list are not DIY type
folks.  They keep those of us that inhale too many solder fumes from turning
this into another DIY list.

> -- for example, Larry had almost no
> experience with modulars before MOTM,
> but his input to the MOTM line (as well
> as his diy type modules) have been to many
> list members benefit.

Well, that is almost correct JWB.  Take out the "almost" part.  I am a total
newbie to modular.  I contribute my meager DIY stuff when I have it as that
is about all I have of significance to contribute.  I will be the first to
admit, I take more than I give here.  What I have learned here and from my
MOTM experience has rekindled some very old education and interest in
thinking below the level of Kilovolts and Megawatts again.  Thanks to all
that have been a part of that (especially Paul for answers to simple
electronics e-mail question # 101).

Larry (still just a stooge) Hendry

In a message dated 00-07-30 06:57:28 EDT, you write:

<< where members typically
 show respect to each other makes for a better list all around. >>


larry,
i`d very much have to agree with this ! even if i don`t agree with something, 
i try not to take it personally and respect the other persons point of view 
as being valid, just not for me. the courtesy everyone has shown me  (and to 
each other ) on this list always makes it a pleasurable experience.
best,
dave v.

On Sun, 30 Jul 2000, J. Larry Hendry wrote:

> Mr. Old Crow has some very good observations.  Not to mention some good
> 'lectronic stuff along the way.  Now, if we could just get him out of the
> habit of collecting all that old PAiA modular stuff <snicker>.

  Collecting old Paia modular stuff?  I have the one I built from the kit
in 1980, that's it!  I cloned some of the modules in the mid-80s for my
own use.  I had to do a lot of restoration to the original modules and
keyboard as well; those blue circuit boards loved to get all green on the
copper-side.  I have not turned on any of that gear in at least a decade,
heh heh heh.. (The Paia modular sits on a shelf in my office at work as a
conversation piece.  I'd love to use an MOTM system for that purpose, but
then again I actually like to *use* my MOTM gear on an almost-daily basis.
;)


Crow

/**/

My mistake.  Someone using the ID "Old Crow" has recently bid on some old
PAiA stuff on e-bay.  Silly stooge me.  I assumed it was you. <foolish
embarrassed grin>
LH


----- Original Message -----
From: The Old Crow <oldcrow@...>
Collecting old Paia modular stuff?  I have the one
I built from the kit in 1980, that's it!

On Sun, 30 Jul 2000, J. Larry Hendry wrote:

> My mistake.  Someone using the ID "Old Crow" has recently bid on some old
> PAiA stuff on e-bay.  Silly stooge me.  I assumed it was you. <foolish
> embarrassed grin>

  Well, I did bid on a couple things, mainly items I could hack into other
things.  I never did win any of the auctions, except for the Oz, which I
turned into a tiny MIDI controller.  Paia stuff goes for ridiculous
amounts of money on ebay, but then again so do other things.  I sold six
$1 coffee cans for over $50 each on ebay.  Absurd.

  These days I find it easier to bid on something like a Korg Poly61 for
$100 or so to obtain a platform for building my own synthesizers. Buy old
poly61, remove front panel and synth voice circuitry, and you have a wood
case, a keyboard that doubtless needs contact cleaning and a power supply,
as well as a joystick (though I would prefer a pair of wheels) all ready
for working into a new machine.

Crow

/**/