MOTM

First, did anyone hear the little (10 minute) bit about Dave Borden & Mother 
Mallard today on All Things Considered? "First all electronic band in 1969." 
Early "work" with Bob Moog, helping to "idiot proof the machines," much as 
Larry and I do now for MOTM. Nice little mention about the resurgence of 
interest in analog.

In a message dated 4/26/2000 6:59:33 AM, aardvark-mi@... writes:

>In his book 'A Monkeys Tale', author Eric Lefcowitz mentions that Mickey
>Dolenz played "the first Moog sythesizer on a pop" album. The song was
>called 'Daily Nightly' recorded in 1967... I found a picture (attached)
>of Mickey with his Moog in the Monkeys boxed set booklet... We know that
>the Monkeys didn't record the first Moog on an album but on a 'pop' album,
>could be!!!

>Al (still like the Monkeys) Wagner


Wow! The Monkees and Wagner in the same sentence <g>! Actually, I 
occasionally still like the Monkees as well, that won't surprise anyone I 
guess. And thanks for the pic, Al. I guess we really do have to thank Dolenz 
for the first pop use (still not convinced about rock) in 67 (really quite 
early) as well as taking Hendrix (the other JH) out on the first US tour 
opening for The Monkees -- albeit abbreviated.


In a message dated 4/26/2000 11:48:44 AM, ceres@... writes:

>>> BTW, Harry Shearer had once mentioned on his radio show, that The
>Monkees had
>>> the first rock record use of a Moog -- this can't be literally true,
>but I
>>> did (do) wonder when "they" used one.
>>
>>Had to look that one up. The song was Daily/Nightly.
>>Recorded June 19,1967. A video clip was also made
>>and originally aired January 8, 1968.
>
>The song is on their fourth album, 'Pisces Aquarius Capricorn & Jones,
>ltd.'.  The album also includes the song "Star Collector" which has Paul
>Beaver playing the Moog (in a more "musicianly" manner - I actually prefer
>Dolenz's "amateur-twisting-knobs" performance on "Daily Nightly").  I'm
>not
>sure which of the two songs was recorded first.
>
>To the best of my knowledge, that *is* the first usage of any
>commercially-manufactured (Moog or otherwise) synthesizer on a pop/rock
>record.  The 50 Foot Hose album was recorded around the same time, but
>that
>was all homemade electronics (as were the electronics used by the United
>States of America, Silver Apples, etc.).


Very cool Doug! Thanks for looking this up! I'm more convinced of pop than 
rock (and Harry Shearer may have said pop as well). It seems that there 
would've been rock use of Moog with weirdoes like Zappa, Beefheart, Cale, 
etc. all having records out, and all knowing about the Avante Garde in music. 

As to your other references, I have to admit my ignorance here (big 
surprise). 1) I don't know the 50 Foot Hose album (let alone how/what it was 
recorded), 2) United States of America (?????), 3) I thought (probably just 
assumed) that Silver Apples used a Buchla -- is this not true?

>   -Doug
>    ceres@...
>
>>I can still remember the video, pretty cool actually.
>>I think Dolenz was playing an early Moog system IIIp.
>>Or at least I think there were 3 portable cabinets. I
>>was only 10 at the time. It left a lasting impression on
>>me though. "Psychedelic"

And finally I've been meaning to respond to many of the film score and 
historical EM things that were posted a week or two ago, but I wanted to add 
something about one of my favorite EM albums which I've only seen once (local 
library). In my memory, it was by Pierre Henry (maybe Schaeffer was there 
too) from maybe around 1968. It was musique concrete (naturally) and was an 
album length work where all the pieces were made from recordings of a saw, a 
squeak of a door hinge, and a human sigh. Again this is all from memory, I 
did tape the album, and last listened to the tape about 5 years ago, but now 
I can't find it <boo hoo!>. I spent a lot of time looking for it and will 
continue -- it may be called Hyperprism (now I'm really guessing). If anyone 
recognizes this piece from my poor description, please let me know.

John (still looking for the tape ) Barlow

In a message dated 00-04-26 22:45:13 EDT, you write:

<< Dave Borden & Mother 
 Mallard  >>



john,
as in "like a duck to water" ?  didn`t hear the broadcast and haven`t thought 
of the group in years. they were into it pretty early on.
best,
dave v.

>First, did anyone hear the little (10 minute) bit about Dave Borden & Mother
>Mallard today on All Things Considered? "First all electronic band in 1969."
>Early "work" with Bob Moog, helping to "idiot proof the machines," much as
>Larry and I do now for MOTM. Nice little mention about the resurgence of
>interest in analog.
>
Dang, missed that one! But I did catch Moog on both Fresh Air and
Performance Today within the last month or so. There does seem to be a
resurgence goin' on.

BTW, Moog was on Performance Toady (and an interview w/Moog is one of the
few things that will get me to sit through an hour of that show!) to
promote a new compilation CD called "Ohm: Early Gurus of Electronic Music
1948-1980." I picked this up yesterday, and, while I've only listened to
the first disc thus far, it's a wonderful collection. Mostly focussed on
"classical" EM: Messian, Stockhausen, Steve Reich, Terry Riley, etc. I have
some of the stuff on the discs already, but there's a fair amount I'd never
heard before. Great notes & beautiful packaging too.


>
>And finally I've been meaning to respond to many of the film score and
>historical EM things that were posted a week or two ago, but I wanted to add
>something about one of my favorite EM albums which I've only seen once (local
>library). In my memory, it was by Pierre Henry (maybe Schaeffer was there
>too) from maybe around 1968. It was musique concrete (naturally) and was an
>album length work where all the pieces were made from recordings of a saw, a
>squeak of a door hinge, and a human sigh. Again this is all from memory, I
>did tape the album, and last listened to the tape about 5 years ago, but now
>I can't find it <boo hoo!>. I spent a lot of time looking for it and will
>continue -- it may be called Hyperprism (now I'm really guessing). If anyone
>recognizes this piece from my poor description, please let me know.
>
It's "Variations for a Door and a Sigh" (aptly named!), and it is an
incredible piece. It's on CD, on if I remember rightly, Harmonia Mundi.

____________________________________________
Dave Trenkel : improv@...
Minus Web Site: http://listen.to/minusmusic
Minus MP3's: http://www.mp3.com/-minus-
____________________________________________

In a message dated 4/26/2000 11:42:06 PM, improv@... writes:

>>First, did anyone hear the little (10 minute) bit about Dave Borden &
>Mother
>>Mallard today on All Things Considered?  Nice little mention about the 
resurgence
>of
>>interest in analog.
>>
>Dang, missed that one! But I did catch Moog on both Fresh Air and
>Performance Today within the last month or so. There does seem to be a
>resurgence goin' on.


On that ATC piece they had an interview with an English guy (who was the one 
mentioning the analog resurgence) who'd written a book about EM named Trevor 
Page -- do I recognize that name from the diy list?

>BTW, Moog was on Performance Toady (and an interview w/Moog is one of the
>few things that will get me to sit through an hour of that show!) to
>promote a new compilation CD called "Ohm: Early Gurus of Electronic Music
>1948-1980." I picked this up yesterday, and, while I've only listened to
>the first disc thus far, it's a wonderful collection. Mostly focussed on
>"classical" EM: Messian, Stockhausen, Steve Reich, Terry Riley, etc. I
>have
>some of the stuff on the discs already, but there's a fair amount I'd never
>heard before. Great notes & beautiful packaging too.


We don't get Performance Today here, but I'd like to hear that one. The Early 
Guru's does look like a good CD.


 by Pierre Henry (maybe Schaeffer was there
>>too) from maybe around 1968. It was musique concrete (naturally) and was
>an
>>album length work where all the pieces were made from recordings of a
>saw, a
>>squeak of a door hinge, and a human sigh. 

>It's "Variations for a Door and a Sigh" (aptly named!), and it is an
>incredible piece. It's on CD, on if I remember rightly, Harmonia Mundi.


Trenkel, you are my man!!!! I got to check out HM CDs ti see if this is the 
case. I owe you a Three Stooges Beer -- if I can find one.

JB> "Hello, do you have Three Stooges in a bottle?"
Liquor store clerk> "Not since we got Prince Albert out of that can!" Click!
JB> "Hello? Hello?"

JB

>
>>BTW, Moog was on Performance Toady (and an interview w/Moog is one of the
>>few things that will get me to sit through an hour of that show!) to
>>promote a new compilation CD called "Ohm: Early Gurus of Electronic Music
>>1948-1980." I picked this up yesterday, and, while I've only listened to
>>the first disc thus far, it's a wonderful collection. Mostly focussed on
>>"classical" EM: Messian, Stockhausen, Steve Reich, Terry Riley, etc. I
>>have
>>some of the stuff on the discs already, but there's a fair amount I'd never
>>heard before. Great notes & beautiful packaging too.
>
>
>We don't get Performance Today here, but I'd like to hear that one. The Early
>Guru's does look like a good CD.
>
Got through the other 2 discs today, and it's a terrific collection of
music! Even though it's basically organised chronologically, the pieces
really flow together well. And there are some real surprises: a Paul Lansky
piece for computer-generated voices that is just absolutely beautiful, an
early Pauline Oliveros piece that sounds like DJ Spooky, etc...
>
> by Pierre Henry (maybe Schaeffer was there
>>>too) from maybe around 1968. It was musique concrete (naturally) and was
>>an
>>>album length work where all the pieces were made from recordings of a
>>saw, a
>>>squeak of a door hinge, and a human sigh.
>
>>It's "Variations for a Door and a Sigh" (aptly named!), and it is an
>>incredible piece. It's on CD, on if I remember rightly, Harmonia Mundi.
>
Harmonia Mundi HMC 905200. Was still available a couple of years ago, at least.
>
>Trenkel, you are my man!!!! I got to check out HM CDs ti see if this is the
>case. I owe you a Three Stooges Beer -- if I can find one.

Aw shucks, just doin'my job, spreadin' wierd music to the masses...
>
>JB> "Hello, do you have Three Stooges in a bottle?"
>Liquor store clerk> "Not since we got Prince Albert out of that can!" Click!
>JB> "Hello? Hello?"
>
*groan*

____________________________________________
Dave Trenkel : improv@...
Minus Web Site: http://listen.to/minusmusic
Minus MP3's: http://www.mp3.com/-minus-
____________________________________________

At 10:44 PM 04/26/2000 EDT, jwbarlow@... wrote:
>First, did anyone hear the little (10 minute) bit about Dave Borden & Mother 
>Mallard today on All Things Considered? "First all electronic band in 1969." 
>Early "work" with Bob Moog, helping to "idiot proof the machines," much as 
>Larry and I do now for MOTM. Nice little mention about the resurgence of 
>interest in analog.
>
>...
>
>Very cool Doug! Thanks for looking this up! 

Looked up?! That's off the top of my head! ;^)

>I'm more convinced of pop than 
>rock (and Harry Shearer may have said pop as well). It seems that there 
>would've been rock use of Moog with weirdoes like Zappa, Beefheart, Cale, 
>etc. all having records out, and all knowing about the Avante Garde in
music. 

Cale's pre-Velvet Underground "avant-garde" work (the Dream Syndicate
w/Lamonte Young, Tony Conrad & Angus MacLise) was entirely acoustic ... I
think his first electronic (not electric, that would have been with the VU)
work would have been his 'Church of Anthrax' collaboration with Terry Riley
c.1970.  Beefheart was coming from a blues (albeit very demented blues)
background, and didn't do any work with electronics.  Zappa I'm less
certain about - his first few albums include quite a bit of musique
concrete (esp. 'Lumpy Gravy'), and there's stuff on 'Freak Out' that sounds
like electronics (perhaps raw oscillators?) to me, but I've never heard
anything about him using synthesizers in the 60s (later on, he was one of
the first to extensively use samplers to make music, but that's another
animal entirely) ... the 'Freak Out' liner notes refer to $5000 worth of
rented percussion, but nothing about electronics ... which brings up the
point that in 1967, *only* a very popular band with large financial
resources (such as the Monkees, Beatles, Stones, and *very* few others)
could have afforded to use a real Moog modular.  That is, I'm sure, why the
three "pioneers" mentioned below all used homebrew gear.

>As to your other references, I have to admit my ignorance here (big 
>surprise). 1) I don't know the 50 Foot Hose album (let alone how/what it was 
>recorded), 

San Francisco late '67 - great hippie rock + weird electronics album (they
were contemporaries of and sounded somewhat like a jazzier Jefferson
Airplane & the album was recorded by Dan Healy, who went on to do sound for
the Grateful Dead).  Their electronics were entirely homemade by guitarist
Cork Marchesi.  Album: 'Cauldron'.

>2) United States of America (?????), 

LA '68, another band with female vocals, led by music student Joseph Byrd
(I don't recall the name of the guy who built the oscillators, ring
modulator & filters they used).  Byrd's follow-up, as Joe Byrd & the Field
Hippies is also very good; later on he recorded electronic versions of
American folk songs and the like.  If there was a recording before the
USofA album that included ring modulated violin, I'd love to hear about it!
 Album: 'United States of America'.

>3) I thought (probably just 
>assumed) that Silver Apples used a Buchla -- is this not true?

Morton Subotnick's piece, 'Silver Apples of the Moon' was recorded using a
Buchla.  The Silver Apples (who named themselves after that piece) were an
electronics/drums duo from New Jersey who recorded two LP's in the late
60s.  Electronics guru Simeon used a homemade device called "Simeon" which
apparently included an amazing user interface with foot/elbow/etc.
controllers.  Albums: 'Silver Apples', 'Contact'.

I consider these to be the three most important bands in the genesis of
electronic *rock* music, and I highly recommend them all.  Lothar and the
Hand People and the aforementioned Mother Mallard (the first ALL-electronic
band?) followed shortly thereafter.  Both 50 Foot Hose and Silver Apples
actually reformed in recent years owing to the resurgence of popularity in
both electronic music and 60s psychedelia.

>Another way to look at it 
>is, how do you describe a "pop album," does popularity enter into it?

By "pop/rock", I was refering any non-academic/classical/avant-garde usage
of synthesizers, or the usage of synthesizers within the format of a "band"
playing "songs".  Not to actual "popularity" since, for instance, 'Switched
On Bach' could be considered a "pop" album in terms of sales/popularity,
but a "classical" album in terms of musical style.

	-Doug
	 ceres@...

I was just looking through this album, the"simeon" setup was a bizarre
setup of what looks like Heathkit & Lafayette(???) oscilators, 2 maestro
tone controls, an echoplex, an AM/FM tuner, telegraph switches and a wah
pedal. I have a horrible block diagram of the "simeon" setup, I think the
switches just passed the oscillator output through to the amplifiers (no
envelope)  -Nate

>>3) I thought (probably just
>
>>assumed) that Silver Apples used a Buchla -- is this not true?
>
>
>
>Morton Subotnick's piece, 'Silver Apples of the Moon' was recorded using a
>
>Buchla.  The Silver Apples (who named themselves after that piece) were an
>
>electronics/drums duo from New Jersey who recorded two LP's in the late
>
>60s.  Electronics guru Simeon used a homemade device called "Simeon" which
>
>apparently included an amazing user interface with foot/elbow/etc.
>
>controllers.  Albums: 'Silver Apples', 'Contact'.