MOTM

You can get this indirectly with a Kenton Control Freak + a MIDI-to-CV
converter. 8 sliders, 8 switches,
all assignable.

Paul S.

----- Original Message -----
From: David Bivins <dbivins@...>
To: MOTM <motm@onelist.com>
Sent: Monday, November 29, 1999 6:19 PM
Subject: [motm] Controllers for modulars


> From: "David Bivins" <dbivins@...>
>
> It's been a while since anyone's mentioned Tannerins, ribbon controllers,
> etc. I fantasize about a knob/slider/whatever box that I can use with my
> modular. Basically it would be a box with some big, weighted knobs (like
the
> size of the rotary encoder on the Moog Source), some sliders, some
buttons,
> two or three joysticks, etc. and a bunch of CV and gate outputs on the
back
> for interfacing to the modular.
>
> 1) Is anything like this available?
> 2) Correct me if I'm wrong (like *that's* never happened on this list),
but

> wouldn't such a controller be relatively easy to build given that I'm not
> trying to scale or anything so precise?
>
> Thanks,
>
> David (who really should be working)
>
> >

Kurzweil has a new fancy ribbon controller programmable out the wazoo. Mark
P., chime in here with the URL!

Dave Bradley
Principal Software Engineer
Engineering Animation, Inc.
daveb@...

> -----Original Message-----
> From: David Bivins [mailto:dbivins@...]
> Sent: Monday, November 29, 1999 6:19 PM
> To: MOTM
> Subject: [motm] Controllers for modulars
>
>
> From: "David Bivins" <dbivins@...>
>
> It's been a while since anyone's mentioned Tannerins, ribbon controllers,
> etc. I fantasize about a knob/slider/whatever box that I can use with my
> modular. Basically it would be a box with some big, weighted
> knobs (like the
> size of the rotary encoder on the Moog Source), some sliders,
> some buttons,
> two or three joysticks, etc. and a bunch of CV and gate outputs
> on the back
> for interfacing to the modular.
>
> 1) Is anything like this available?
> 2) Correct me if I'm wrong (like *that's* never happened on this
> list), but
> wouldn't such a controller be relatively easy to build given that I'm not
> trying to scale or anything so precise?
>
> Thanks,
>
> David (who really should be working)
>
> >

At 04:28 PM 11/29/99 -0600, "Paul Schreiber" <synth1@...> wrote:
>You can get this indirectly with a Kenton Control Freak + a MIDI-to-CV
>converter. 8 sliders, 8 switches,
>all assignable.
>
>Paul S.

Does anyone sell a MIDI controller (or even better, an analog controller -
I don't do MIDI) with joystick(s)?  Unfortunately, the manufacturer of that
other modular system I'm using doesn't sell the
two-joystick/two-button/voltmeter controller except as part of a system
package (fortunately, it does include 1/8"<->1/4" multiple jacks so I can
use it with my MOTM).  Joysticks rule (as any EMS owner will tell you), and
allow control possibilities that are impossible with knobs (at least
impossible to someone as uncoordinated as I).  I guess a Korg Kaoss Pad
could sort of do the "2-D" controller trick (for MIDI users, at least ...
actually, the designer of said other modular system was using a Kaoss Pad
for fx processing of his EMS when he jammed w/us in Chicago a couple months
back).

	-Doug (who can't believe that he hasn't hooked up a CV pedal to his MOTM yet)
	 ceres@...

>----- Original Message -----
>From: David Bivins <dbivins@...>
>To: MOTM <motm@onelist.com>
>Sent: Monday, November 29, 1999 6:19 PM
>Subject: [motm] Controllers for modulars
>
>
>> From: "David Bivins" <dbivins@...>
>>
>> It's been a while since anyone's mentioned Tannerins, ribbon controllers,
>> etc. I fantasize about a knob/slider/whatever box that I can use with my
>> modular. Basically it would be a box with some big, weighted knobs (like
>the
>> size of the rotary encoder on the Moog Source), some sliders, some
>buttons,
>> two or three joysticks, etc. and a bunch of CV and gate outputs on the
>back
>> for interfacing to the modular.
>>
>> 1) Is anything like this available?
>> 2) Correct me if I'm wrong (like *that's* never happened on this list),
>but
>> wouldn't such a controller be relatively easy to build given that I'm not
>> trying to scale or anything so precise?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> David (who really should be working)

There's nothing much easier in Synth-DIY land than taking a bunch of pots or
joysticks or buttons, sticking them in a box with a power supply and some
jacks, and wiring them up so that they output voltages when you twist or
poke them.

Piece of cake. Just keep the voltage levels down to MOTM specs.

Dave Bradley
Principal Software Engineer
Engineering Animation, Inc.
daveb@...

> From: "David Bivins" <dbivins@...>
> 2) Correct me if I'm wrong (like *that's* never happened on this
> list), but
> wouldn't such a controller be relatively easy to build given that I'm not
> trying to scale or anything so precise?
>

If you look around a bit, you might find an Octave Electronics "CatStick"
controller.  Its a spring loaded joy stick with two LFOs and lots of
patching possibilities.  I'd like to have two; one with the springs removed
from the joystick so it doesn't always return to center.

Of course, Mr. Pulver has references on his site:
http://www.midiwall.com/synths/catstick.html

	Eric

At 02:43 PM 11/29/99 -0800, Doug Pearson wrote:

>From: Doug Pearson <ceres@...>
>
>Does anyone sell a MIDI controller (or even better, an analog controller -
>I don't do MIDI) with joystick(s)?

I am expecting to take delivery on one soon.  It is being customer built
for me by Tom Polk.  Tom built the Tannerin that Brian Wilson is using on
his current tour / album.  However, mine will be sans the internal
oscillator.  All I wanted was the control voltage.

As far as difficulty, it depends on how rugged and playable you want it to
be.  I think Tom has put a lot of efforts into a quality design.  If you
are interested, I will send you his URL for looking at some photos of a
couple he built.

I plan to take his basic design and modify it to do a little more.  Here is
my plan.  I want the slider to output the control voltage for the
oscillators (Tome's part).  I want to be able to tap a surface directly
below the slider with the thumb (or pinkie) of the same hand to generate
gate or gate/trigger outputs for the EGs.  And, I want to put a Big Briar
style upright Etherwave antenna on the left hand side that will output a
control voltage (will probably use the PAiA T-max circuit for that
function).  That control voltage would be used for modulations - for
example filter sweeps and such.  I think that would be a REAL expressive
controller.

Larry (stooged again) Hendry



> From: "David Bivins" <dbivins@...>
> 
> It's been a while since anyone's mentioned Tannerins, ribbon controllers,
> etc. I fantasize about a knob/slider/whatever box that I can use with my
> modular. Basically it would be a box with some big, weighted knobs (like
the
> size of the rotary encoder on the Moog Source), some sliders, some
buttons,
> two or three joysticks, etc. and a bunch of CV and gate outputs on the
back
> for interfacing to the modular.
> 
> 1) Is anything like this available?
> 2) Correct me if I'm wrong (like *that's* never happened on this list),
but

> wouldn't such a controller be relatively easy to build given that I'm not
> trying to scale or anything so precise?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> David (who really should be working)

It's been a while since anyone's mentioned Tannerins, ribbon controllers,
etc. I fantasize about a knob/slider/whatever box that I can use with my
modular. Basically it would be a box with some big, weighted knobs (like the
size of the rotary encoder on the Moog Source), some sliders, some buttons,
two or three joysticks, etc. and a bunch of CV and gate outputs on the back
for interfacing to the modular.

1) Is anything like this available?
2) Correct me if I'm wrong (like *that's* never happened on this list), but
wouldn't such a controller be relatively easy to build given that I'm not
trying to scale or anything so precise?

Thanks,

David (who really should be working)

Eh, still MIDI. I want pure voltage, baby!

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Dave Bradley [mailto:daveb@...]
> Sent: Monday, November 29, 1999 3:34 PM
> To: motm@onelist.com
> Subject: RE: [motm] Controllers for modulars
>
>
> From: "Dave Bradley" <daveb@...>
>
> Kurzweil has a new fancy ribbon controller programmable out the
> wazoo. Mark
> P., chime in here with the URL!
>
> Dave Bradley
> Principal Software Engineer
> Engineering Animation, Inc.
> daveb@...
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: David Bivins [mailto:dbivins@...]
> > Sent: Monday, November 29, 1999 6:19 PM
> > To: MOTM
> > Subject: [motm] Controllers for modulars
> >
> >
> > From: "David Bivins" <dbivins@...>
> >
> > It's been a while since anyone's mentioned Tannerins, ribbon
> controllers,
> > etc. I fantasize about a knob/slider/whatever box that I can use with my
> > modular. Basically it would be a box with some big, weighted
> > knobs (like the
> > size of the rotary encoder on the Moog Source), some sliders,
> > some buttons,
> > two or three joysticks, etc. and a bunch of CV and gate outputs
> > on the back
> > for interfacing to the modular.
> >
> > 1) Is anything like this available?
> > 2) Correct me if I'm wrong (like *that's* never happened on this
> > list), but
> > wouldn't such a controller be relatively easy to build given
> that I'm not
> > trying to scale or anything so precise?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > David (who really should be working)
> >
> > >
>
>

Right, there's that--but I want a voltage controller, not MIDI stuff. In the
last few months, I've gotten away from MIDI to a large extent--I still use
MIDI clock out of necessity, but that's about it. I sequence CVs, gates and
triggers mostly from a 303, a 606 and a FR-777. I'd like to keep it this way
if possible.

My style of writing music is performance-based. In fact, I rarely multitrack
anymore, instead rehearsing what I'm going to do to the point where I can
play it live to 2 tracks (stereo). I appreciate MIDI for what it is, but I
felt that it was a poor place whence to discover electronic music
composition techniques. I'm more enamored with the "old" stuff. When I use
the modular while recording, I have my hands all over the place, turning
knobs, repatching, etc. I really need to buy a couple of the dual VC routers
to help with the repatching business, but I'd love to basically pull some of
those knobs together into a central location, i.e. this "box."

So, my question still stands. Most importantly, is this a big deal to build?
Am I not just adjusting voltages using a wide range of variable resistors?
Am I an idiot (wait, don't answer that one)?

David.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Paul Schreiber [mailto:synth1@...]
> Sent: Monday, November 29, 1999 3:29 PM
> To: motm@onelist.com
> Subject: Re: [motm] Controllers for modulars
>
>
> From: "Paul Schreiber" <synth1@...>
>
> You can get this indirectly with a Kenton Control Freak + a MIDI-to-CV
> converter. 8 sliders, 8 switches,
> all assignable.
>
> Paul S.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: David Bivins <dbivins@...>
> To: MOTM <motm@onelist.com>
> Sent: Monday, November 29, 1999 6:19 PM
> Subject: [motm] Controllers for modulars
>
>
> > From: "David Bivins" <dbivins@...>
> >
> > It's been a while since anyone's mentioned Tannerins, ribbon
> controllers,
> > etc. I fantasize about a knob/slider/whatever box that I can use with my
> > modular. Basically it would be a box with some big, weighted knobs (like
> the
> > size of the rotary encoder on the Moog Source), some sliders, some
> buttons,
> > two or three joysticks, etc. and a bunch of CV and gate outputs on the
> back
> > for interfacing to the modular.
> >
> > 1) Is anything like this available?
> > 2) Correct me if I'm wrong (like *that's* never happened on this list),
> but
> > wouldn't such a controller be relatively easy to build given
> that I'm not
> > trying to scale or anything so precise?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > David (who really should be working)
> >
> > >
>
>

In a message dated 11/29/99 3:40:37 PM, dbivins@... writes:

>When I use
>the modular while recording, I have my hands all over the place, turning
>knobs, repatching, etc. I really need to buy a couple of the dual VC routers
>to help with the repatching business, but I'd love to basically pull some
>of
>those knobs together into a central location, i.e. this "box."

I really agree with this idea. I've been thinking about having a somewhat 
separate controller (or performance) "area" a bit removed from the modules 
them selves -- mainly so I don't keep hitting the modules with guitars (ouch).

>So, my question still stands. Most importantly, is this a big deal to build?
>Am I not just adjusting voltages using a wide range of variable resistors?
>Am I an idiot (wait, don't answer that one)?

As has been said by others, it is very easy to get some pots (100K) and put 
them into one of those LMB Keyboarder boxes and use them as attenuators or 
bias pots. Also, you can find old computer joysticks pretty readily at 
electronics surplus stores (and probably thrift shops as well), the ones I've 
found have been 150K.

Now we just need to convince Paul that there is a market for that MOTM ribbon 
controller. Hey Bradley, did you ever get that Moog ribbon working?

JB

In a message dated 99-11-29 17:40:44 EST, you write:

<<  Most importantly, is this a big deal to build?
 Am I not just adjusting voltages using a wide range of variable resistors? >>



david,
such a controller box built to motm type specs would be a bit of work 
although probably no new engineering would be required, stuff like sample 
/hold ( think analog kybd ),etc. are pretty well developed circuitry. if you 
wanted to go with a "hack" job just to get something to "feel" and decide 
about working on further, you are pretty much right, its all just voltages 
and resistances. even something as simple as a few batteries, a couple of 
slide pots, a few knobs and a cheap surplus joystick could be cobbled up 
quickly but could be surprisingly useful. not sophisticated, not elegant but 
it`ll work.......
best,
dave

In a message dated 99-11-29 17:52:18 EST, you write:

<< Tannerin  >>



larry,
let me trot out my ignorance once again and ask what this is supposed to be? 
i`ve never heard of it but you made it sound interesting!
best,
dave

Still staring at me reproachfully, with the ribbon broken at the far end.

Dave Bradley
Principal Software Engineer
Engineering Animation, Inc.
daveb@... 

> From: JWBarlow@...
> 
> Hey Bradley, did you ever get that Moog ribbon working?
>

> them into one of those LMB Keyboarder boxes and use them as 
> JB

Here is there product lineup so you won't have to go searching like I did:

	http://www.lmbheeger.com/products.htm

--Shemp