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Re: Cabinet Power - How to do it.

Re: Cabinet Power - How to do it.

2002-08-31 by paulhaneberg

Okay,  I'm going to make my suggestion of how to do this relatively 
safely (Note the use of the word relatively).  This is still not as 
safe as not doing it at all, and I'd like to point out this is not 
how I did it on my synth.  I have a completely external rack mounted 
supply which has its own power switch on the front (But I did build 
it and I did wire my own mains.)  
The reason I am going to tell you how to do this is because I fear 
someone is going to try it anyway and get hurt, so if your going to 
muck about with mains wiring you might as well do it right.
Get a switch with large lugs with large holes in each lug.
Assuming one wire of the mains is hot, one is neutral and one ground 
(as is the case here in the states) run the hot wire to one lug of 
the switch, stick the stripped wire through the hole in the switch 
lug and twist it back on itself.  Solder the wire to the lug and to 
itself.  Now put a length of heat shrink tubing over the lug and the 
wire so that the entire lug and the entire exposed portion of wire 
is covered.  Repeat with a second piece of heat shrink again make 
sure the entire exposed portion of switch and wire is covered.  You 
might even repeat this a third time with the heat shrink.  The idea 
is to make sure the thickness of the heat shrink exceeds the 
thickness of the original insulation of the wire.
You want to make sure there is no exposed metal which could be 
touched under any circumstances.
Also be very careful that the wire (if it is stranded) remains 
twisted together prior to soldering so that the is not a loose 
strand which might either penetrate the heat shrink or remain 
exposed.
Repeat for the second lug with the return wire.
Now get a large piece of heat shrink big enough to partially cover 
the body of the switch itself.  Run the large heat shrink tubing 
over both wires and the body of the switch and shrink.
Test with an ohmeter to make sure the switch operates properly and 
the wires are not shorted together.
Obviously some types of switches will require mounting before the 
wires are attached.
Be sure and use a switch which has a high enough voltage and current 
rating for your application.
I use led type indicators on my plus and minus DC supplies, I think 
this is more useful than an indicator on the mains.
Hope this helps.
Please be careful.
I feel obliged to add a legal disclaimer.
You do this at your own risk.
I'm a degreed engineer and have worked for a utility company as have 
several of the members of this list.  I have worked with voltages 
close to a million volts.  I still try to be very careful when 
messing about with 110 or 220.  
One other note please be sure your power cord is unplugged before 
trying this.
Paul Haneberg

Re: [motm] Re: Cabinet Power - How to do it.

2002-08-31 by Adam Schabtach

> I'm a degreed engineer and have worked for a utility company as have
> several of the members of this list.  I have worked with voltages
> close to a million volts.  I still try to be very careful when
> messing about with 110 or 220.

Is there any truth to the story that 110V is more likely to kill you than
really big voltages? The story goes that if you bridge a large potential
with some part of your body, the physiological reaction is likely to blow
you right out of the circuit fairly quickly; whereas if you insert yourself
as a conductor of 110V, you'll twitch around a bit but will stay in the
circuit long enough for your heart to fibrillate and shut down, your flesh
start to cook, etc.?

--Adam
(who really doesn't like messing with AC, and kept the AC wiring in his
cabinet as simple as possible: two wires between the power supply and an
integrated switch/fuse/AC power cord receptacle, mounted on the rear. Big
wires, nicely shrink-wrapped.)

Re: [motm] Re: Cabinet Power - How to do it.

2002-08-31 by J. Larry Hendry

----- Original Message -----
Show quoted textHide quoted text
From: Adam Schabtach <adam@...>
Is there any truth to the story that 110V is more likely to kill you than
really big voltages?

No, wives tale.  BUT, what is true is that low secondary voltage cause most
of the electrocutions statistically.  That is because of frequency of
contact.  While, I do not have any data to give you (nor does it likely
exist), I can say that fatality from 120 volts is not the norm from contact.
We assume that many 120 volt contacts go unreported.  Anyone here ever shock
themselves?

However, contact with what we call primary voltages (2400 VAC and above) are
always reported because someone is going to the hospital.  The most common
distribution voltage used in the US varies around 13 KV phase to phase and
7500 volts phase to ground.  What what I have seen over 28 years of
following such things is that well over 50% of contacts are fatal.  Those
that are not fatal usually result in severe disability (loss of body parts
at the entrance and exit points for the current). Severe burns are the
normal in all cases.

Larry Hendry




 The story goes that if you bridge a large potential
with some part of your body, the physiological reaction is likely to blow
you right out of the circuit fairly quickly; whereas if you insert yourself
as a conductor of 110V, you'll twitch around a bit but will stay in the
circuit long enough for your heart to fibrillate and shut down, your flesh
start to cook, etc.?

--Adam
(who really doesn't like messing with AC, and kept the AC wiring in his
cabinet as simple as possible: two wires between the power supply and an
integrated switch/fuse/AC power cord receptacle, mounted on the rear. Big
wires, nicely shrink-wrapped.)






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RE: [motm] Re: Cabinet Power - How to do it.

2002-09-01 by Tony Karavidas

Yes, 2 or 3 times in the past 24 years. It sucks. I've been hit with
around 600 volts 1 time, but it was from hand to arm (same limb) and it
only hurt, didn't do any real damage. That sucked too.
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> -----Original Message-----
> From: J. Larry Hendry [mailto:jlarryh@...] 
> Sent: Saturday, August 31, 2002 2:36 PM
> To: MOTM List
> Subject: Re: [motm] Re: Cabinet Power - How to do it.
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Adam Schabtach <adam@...>
> Is there any truth to the story that 110V is more likely to 
> kill you than really big voltages?
> 
> No, wives tale.  BUT, what is true is that low secondary 
> voltage cause most of the electrocutions statistically.  That 
> is because of frequency of contact.  While, I do not have any 
> data to give you (nor does it likely exist), I can say that 
> fatality from 120 volts is not the norm from contact. We 
> assume that many 120 volt contacts go unreported.  Anyone 
> here ever shock themselves?
> 
> However, contact with what we call primary voltages (2400 VAC 
> and above) are always reported because someone is going to 
> the hospital.  The most common distribution voltage used in 
> the US varies around 13 KV phase to phase and 7500 volts 
> phase to ground.  What what I have seen over 28 years of 
> following such things is that well over 50% of contacts are 
> fatal.  Those that are not fatal usually result in severe 
> disability (loss of body parts at the entrance and exit 
> points for the current). Severe burns are the normal in all cases.
> 
> Larry Hendry
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  The story goes that if you bridge a large potential
> with some part of your body, the physiological reaction is 
> likely to blow you right out of the circuit fairly quickly; 
> whereas if you insert yourself as a conductor of 110V, you'll 
> twitch around a bit but will stay in the circuit long enough 
> for your heart to fibrillate and shut down, your flesh start 
> to cook, etc.?
> 
> --Adam
> (who really doesn't like messing with AC, and kept the AC 
> wiring in his cabinet as simple as possible: two wires 
> between the power supply and an integrated switch/fuse/AC 
> power cord receptacle, mounted on the rear. Big wires, nicely 
> shrink-wrapped.)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to 
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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>

RE: [motm] Re: Cabinet Power - How to do it.

2002-09-01 by Les Mizzell

> and it only hurt, didn't do any real
> damage. That sucked too.

I was really stupid once and cut the power cord of my skillsaw.  The lights
in the house went weird so my brother came outside to see what was going on.
I was just standing there doing this weird "shaky dance" and holding the
thing and I couldn't let go of it.

He actually stood there a second laughing at me before he figured what was
really going on and pulled the plug out.

What a rush!

Guess I'm lucky I'm not dead right now...

Les

Re: [motm] Re: Cabinet Power - How to do it.

2002-09-01 by groovyshaman@snet.net

Alright guys, Les's "shaky dance" put an exclamation point on this thread
for me. :)

George

----- Original Message -----
From: Les Mizzell <lesmizz@...>
To: <tony@...>; 'J. Larry Hendry' <jlarryh@...>;
'MOTM List' <motm@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, August 31, 2002 11:38 PM
Subject: RE: [motm] Re: Cabinet Power - How to do it.


> > and it only hurt, didn't do any real
> > damage. That sucked too.
>
> I was really stupid once and cut the power cord of my skillsaw.  The
lights
> in the house went weird so my brother came outside to see what was going
on.
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> I was just standing there doing this weird "shaky dance" and holding the
> thing and I couldn't let go of it.
>
> He actually stood there a second laughing at me before he figured what was
> really going on and pulled the plug out.
>
> What a rush!
>
> Guess I'm lucky I'm not dead right now...
>
> Les

Re: [motm] Re: Cabinet Power - How to do it.

2002-09-01 by ixqy@aol.com

Well, since we're sharing stories, :)
 I once was "hit" by 30KV while working on a 19" color monitor. I know this was more of an electrostatic shock, but here's what happened. I reached around the unit (it was sprawled out on a test mockup) for some tools that were behind it. I took notice of where the high voltage lead was and kept my distance, but the arc jumped out and nailed me on the head! Hurt like the dickens, but I'm still around. 

 Just not the same ;)
  Andrew


In a message dated Sat, 31 Aug 2002 10:38:49 PM Eastern Standard Time, lesmizz@... writes:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> > and it only hurt, didn't do any real
> > damage. That sucked too.
> 
> I was really stupid once and cut the power cord of my skillsaw.  The lights
> in the house went weird so my brother came outside to see what was going on.
> I was just standing there doing this weird "shaky dance" and holding the
> thing and I couldn't let go of it.
> 
> He actually stood there a second laughing at me before he figured what was
> really going on and pulled the plug out.
> 
> What a rush!
> 
> Guess I'm lucky I'm not dead right now...
> 
> Les

Re: [motm] Re: Cabinet Power - How to do it.

2002-09-01 by gareII@aol.com

OWWWWW.
After reading all these repsonses,I think I'll be placing an order to Paul 
shortly for a 900 ps,mount it in the back of the cabinet,and just reach 
around for the switch. Which seems far more practical now than trying to put 
my own power supply together. 
Like most people,I've been zapped by 120..well..I just don't look good in 
curly hair :O
I'd also like to be around to actually play this machine when I get it all 
together.
Thanks to all for the informative and helpful notes on this topic.

Gary Spieker

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