SergeModular

> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
> Von: John Papiewski [SMTP:johnp299792@...]
> Gesendet am: Dienstag, 24. September 2002 04:39
> An: SergeModular@yahoogroups.com
> Betreff: Re: [SergeModular] Re: DIGI-TRIX --- good grief ----
>
> That's all well and good. Getting back to the nub of it though ... is
> it useful to have a non-variable unity mixer to cpmbine several outputs
> into an input?
> Bananas have fan-out covered, but not fan-in. If I want to combine
> several outputs to an input I use a mixer....
> Serge outputs are usually fixed, not variable, and usually I need to
> adjust different input amounts to achieve a result, or to open up
> experimentation.
> A multiple is NOT a mixer but rather a fan-out tool for patching methods
> that don't stack.
>
> The Synthi matrix system does add the outputs going across into a
> vertical input column, right? As in delivering the arithmetic sum of
> the outputs? Or does it do something else?
>
> My exposure to the matrix stuff is very limited, but I remember there
> being some inherent inaccuracies associated with the matrix patching..
> crosstalk etc... which makes for interesting chaos/noise patches if
> that's what you're after but limits other uses of the system.
>
> In other words, if the matrix system was so hot then why didn't anybody
> else use it?
> Didn't the ARP2500 also suffer from flaky patching problems?
>
> JP
>
> Ben Vehorn wrote:
>
> > FWIW, "that guy" has probably laid his hands on more EMS equipment
> > than any of us will see in our lifetimes and probably has more matrix
> > patching experience as well. Not trying to take sides, but I think he
> > does know what he's talking about.
> > See: Spacemen 3
> > Spectrum
> > Experimental Audio Research
> >
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> SergeModular-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Keep on Patchin'!
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>
>>> Rentenanstalt/Swiss Life - Official Partner Expo.02 <<<

--- In SergeModular@y..., Bill Sequeira <bill@a...> wrote:
>
> > From: Junger Joerg <Joerg.Junger@s...>
> > Reply-To: SergeModular@y...
> > Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 09:56:59 +0200
> > To: "'SergeModular@y...'" <SergeModular@y...>
> > Subject: AW: [SergeModular] Re: DIGI-TRIX --- good grief ----
> >
> > Hi John, hi list,
> >
> > it's right, the EMS synthis have variable outs. This could be
simulated by
> > having attenuators for the inputs of the matrix. At least one of
the reasons
> > why matricses are not so widely used, is cost. A good matrix is
_very_
> > expensive. But a good matrix also allows one to add/remove a pin
without the
> > noise that is often genereated if a plug is inserted or removed.
This was a
> > feature that I really enjoyed on the Synthi (apart from the size,
ease of
> > transportation, look... ;)).
> > A stand alone matrix with the same quality as was used in a good
EMS
> > Synthi/VCS3: I think it would be a good addition for my
Serge/Fenix.
>
> I used to enjoy the same about my VCS3 when I had it, and have to
agree
> that I find the idea of such matrix coupled with a Fenix attractive.
>
> My focus is to find specific applications for my Serge, and to
understand
> the limitations of the approach. The Fenix is a lovely self-
contained
> system - has concrete boundaries, hence more accessible to a matrix
method.
> The Serge on the other hand, with custom panels and potentially
large
> configurations, is an issue to me, as I would have to dedicate a
matrix
> (or multiples of them) to very specific applications. It would not
be
> the general-purpose-save-all-your-patches-and-recall-on-a-whim
solution.
>
> And then there is the issue of knob positioning, voltage trimming
and scale,
> grounding, i/o attenuation, jack formats, physical packaging,
interformat
> connectivity (if possible), etc.
>
> These issues do not render the approach useless or without merit -
just
> have to understand how it would work in my setup with respect to
these
> constraints.
>
> Regards,
>
> Bill
>
______________________________________________________________________
> Bill Sequeira, Ph.D.
> Principal, Axon Hillock

> Hi John, hi list,
>
> it's right, the EMS synthis have variable outs. This could be

> having attenuators for the inputs of the matrix. At least one of

> why matricses are not so widely used, is cost. A good matrix is

> expensive. But a good matrix also allows one to add/remove a pin

> noise that is often genereated if a plug is inserted or removed.

> feature that I really enjoyed on the Synthi (apart from the size,

> transportation, look... ;)).
> A stand alone matrix with the same quality as was used in a good EMS
> Synthi/VCS3: I think it would be a good addition for my Serge/Fenix.
>

>
> Regards
>
> Joerg
>
> > -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
> > Von: John Papiewski [SMTP:johnp299792@a...]
> > Gesendet am: Dienstag, 24. September 2002 04:39
> > An: SergeModular@y...
> > Betreff: Re: [SergeModular] Re: DIGI-TRIX --- good grief ----
> >
> > That's all well and good. Getting back to the nub of it

> > it useful to have a non-variable unity mixer to cpmbine several

> > into an input?
> > Bananas have fan-out covered, but not fan-in. If I want to

> > several outputs to an input I use a mixer....
> > Serge outputs are usually fixed, not variable, and usually I need

> > adjust different input amounts to achieve a result, or to open up
> > experimentation.
> > A multiple is NOT a mixer but rather a fan-out tool for patching

> > that don't stack.
> >
> > The Synthi matrix system does add the outputs going across into a
> > vertical input column, right? As in delivering the arithmetic

> > the outputs? Or does it do something else?
> >
> > My exposure to the matrix stuff is very limited, but I remember

> > being some inherent inaccuracies associated with the matrix

> > crosstalk etc... which makes for interesting chaos/noise patches

> > that's what you're after but limits other uses of the system.
> >
> > In other words, if the matrix system was so hot then why didn't

> > else use it?
> > Didn't the ARP2500 also suffer from flaky patching problems?
> >
> > JP
> >
> > Ben Vehorn wrote:
> >
> > > FWIW, "that guy" has probably laid his hands on more EMS

> > > than any of us will see in our lifetimes and probably has more

> > > patching experience as well. Not trying to take sides, but I

> > > does know what he's talking about.
> > > See: Spacemen 3
> > > Spectrum
> > > Experimental Audio Research
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > SergeModular-unsubscribe@y...
> >
> > Keep on Patchin'!
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to

> >
> >
> >
> >
> >>> Rentenanstalt/Swiss Life - Official Partner Expo.02 <<<

> Interesting debate started here. I still think this sounds like a
> good idea, with the potential to be a great peripheral for the

> However, the comment about this list being used by uninformed

> is a little harsh. Don't make the mistakes that Paul Schreiber of
> MOTM has done in the past, which have kept haunting him 'till this
> day, guys. He is a highly-skilled engineer and designer, maker of a
> wonderful instrument, who made the mistake of badmouthing his
> competitors. You guys are doing worse: badmouthing potential
> customers. TSK TSK... Try again.
> cuari
>

>
> --- In SergeModular@y..., Bill Sequeira <bill@a...> wrote:
> >
> > > From: Junger Joerg <Joerg.Junger@s...>
> > > Reply-To: SergeModular@y...
> > > Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 09:56:59 +0200
> > > To: "'SergeModular@y...'" <SergeModular@y...>
> > > Subject: AW: [SergeModular] Re: DIGI-TRIX --- good grief ----
> > >
> > > Hi John, hi list,
> > >
> > > it's right, the EMS synthis have variable outs. This could be
> simulated by
> > > having attenuators for the inputs of the matrix. At least one

> the reasons
> > > why matricses are not so widely used, is cost. A good matrix is
> _very_
> > > expensive. But a good matrix also allows one to add/remove a

> without the
> > > noise that is often genereated if a plug is inserted or

> This was a
> > > feature that I really enjoyed on the Synthi (apart from the

> ease of
> > > transportation, look... ;)).
> > > A stand alone matrix with the same quality as was used in a

> EMS
> > > Synthi/VCS3: I think it would be a good addition for my
> Serge/Fenix.
> >
> > I used to enjoy the same about my VCS3 when I had it, and have to
> agree
> > that I find the idea of such matrix coupled with a Fenix

> >
> > My focus is to find specific applications for my Serge, and to
> understand
> > the limitations of the approach. The Fenix is a lovely self-
> contained
> > system - has concrete boundaries, hence more accessible to a

> method.
> > The Serge on the other hand, with custom panels and potentially
> large
> > configurations, is an issue to me, as I would have to dedicate a
> matrix
> > (or multiples of them) to very specific applications. It would

> be
> > the general-purpose-save-all-your-patches-and-recall-on-a-whim
> solution.
> >
> > And then there is the issue of knob positioning, voltage trimming
> and scale,
> > grounding, i/o attenuation, jack formats, physical packaging,
> interformat
> > connectivity (if possible), etc.
> >
> > These issues do not render the approach useless or without merit -

> just
> > have to understand how it would work in my setup with respect to
> these
> > constraints.
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > Bill
> >
>

> > Bill Sequeira, Ph.D.
> > Principal, Axon Hillock