Homebrew PCBs

Anyone using the Micro-Mark 83213 MINI METAL SHEAR / BRAKE to cut 1/16" 
FR4? The shear is at 
http://www.micromark.com/MINI-METAL-SHEAR-and-BRAKE,8395.html

What has been your experience with it? Easy to use? Clean cuts? Problems 
or deficiencies?

A search of the group archives turned up two references to this tool, 
but no comments regarding its usefulness for cutting PCB material.

Thanks.

Steve K8JQ

-- 
Read The Patriot   It's Right -- It's Free
http://PatriotPost.US/subscribe/ Veritas vos Liberabit

I use this one at a buddies house.

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=90757

It's generic, but it works great. He got his on sale for $99. I'm checking
the specials every week till I see it for that price again. I've thought
about going to eBay for a used one, but I'm more concerned about a sharp,
nick free shear blade than anything else. They all look like they're built
about the same as far as the rigidity is concerned  since it's going to be
used for PCBs most of the time, and not thicker metal stock.

When cutting 1oz single sided pcbs, it leaves a nice clean sharp edge. In
fact, it's almost too sharp, and I always take a small piece of 1000P or
1500 wet-dry sandpaper to the edge to soften it up a bit and avoid those
papercut type slices. Not jagged or saw blade, it's a sharp square edge,
like on a really nice pair of steel hand shears.

I bought the little hand nibbler they sell. It was <$10 and works great for
cutting intricate shapes for tiny board mounting solutions, but a real PITA
for long straight cuts.

On Sun, Apr 12, 2009 at 10:04 AM, Steve <steve65@...> wrote:

>
>
> Anyone using the Micro-Mark 83213 MINI METAL SHEAR / BRAKE to cut 1/16"
> FR4? The shear is at
> http://www.micromark.com/MINI-METAL-SHEAR-and-BRAKE,8395.html
>
> What has been your experience with it? Easy to use? Clean cuts? Problems
> or deficiencies?
>
> A search of the group archives turned up two references to this tool,
> but no comments regarding its usefulness for cutting PCB material.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Steve K8JQ
>
> --
> Read The Patriot It's Right -- It's Free
> http://PatriotPost.US/subscribe/ Veritas vos Liberabit
>
>  
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Thanks Mike.

Micro-Mark occasionally has theirs on sale for about the  regular cost 
of the Harbor Freight unit. So the HF shear on sale would be an even 
better deal. There is a Harbor Freight nearby, I'll see if they stock 
it. I'd like to see it before buying if I can.

Do you cut 1/16" FR4 with it?

What's the part number of the nibbler?

Thanks.

Steve K8JQ

Mike Oyama wrote:
> I use this one at a buddies house.
>
> http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=90757
>
> It's generic, but it works great. He got his on sale for $99. I'm checking
> the specials every week till I see it for that price again. I've thought
> about going to eBay for a used one, but I'm more concerned about a sharp,
> nick free shear blade than anything else. They all look like they're built
> about the same as far as the rigidity is concerned  since it's going to be
> used for PCBs most of the time, and not thicker metal stock.
>
> When cutting 1oz single sided pcbs, it leaves a nice clean sharp edge. In
> fact, it's almost too sharp, and I always take a small piece of 1000P or
> 1500 wet-dry sandpaper to the edge to soften it up a bit and avoid those
> papercut type slices. Not jagged or saw blade, it's a sharp square edge,
> like on a really nice pair of steel hand shears.
>
> I bought the little hand nibbler they sell. It was <$10 and works great for
> cutting intricate shapes for tiny board mounting solutions, but a real PITA
> for long straight cuts.
>
> On Sun, Apr 12, 2009 at 10:04 AM, Steve <steve65@...> wrote:
>
>   
>> Anyone using the Micro-Mark 83213 MINI METAL SHEAR / BRAKE to cut 1/16"
>> FR4? The shear is at
>> http://www.micromark.com/MINI-METAL-SHEAR-and-BRAKE,8395.html
>>
>> What has been your experience with it? Easy to use? Clean cuts? Problems
>> or deficiencies?
>>
>> A search of the group archives turned up two references to this tool,
>> but no comments regarding its usefulness for cutting PCB material.
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> Steve K8JQ
>>     
-- 
Read The Patriot   It's Right -- It's Free
http://PatriotPost.US/subscribe/ Veritas vos Liberabit

Yup, FR4. I think the normal stuff is around .6mm give or take. (Once I used
this .35mm board. Man, cuts like butter). I've only used the shear with
single sided copper board, so I'm not sure how it'll perform with the double
sided stuff. It shouldn't really be a problem. The rake is pretty low, so I
wouldn't try to cut anything thicker than 20GA.

You have to take care not to nick the blade, or you'll get the jagged edge
where the nicks are. My friend has taken the blades to a machine shop once
to have them ground flat. He's had it about a year and only did that
recently. I only cut boards on it every now and then, but he uses it for
other things, so I've experienced a sharp, and a nicked up blade. It's not
hard to care for, if you're not in a big hurry. When I get one of my own,
I'll probably make an HDPE cover for it so that dropped stock doesn't bounce
off the exposed lower blade.


This is the nibbler I picked up.
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=97636

It has a slightly wider kerf than this other one,
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=65895
at the same price, but looked more accurate for straight lines.

I had used both types in the past, and found that for straight lines, and
nice corners, the first type, with a flat area for leveling the work, is
best. The second type is much better for curves and circles. In fact, the
first of is really hard to make nice circles with, without tons of practice,
and even then, you can't put the nibbled bit back on. lol

Both would be nice to have for general touch up work too, like making boards
fit around standoffs and connectors and such.


On Sun, Apr 12, 2009 at 6:02 PM, Steve <steve65@...> wrote:

>
>
> Thanks Mike.
>
> Micro-Mark occasionally has theirs on sale for about the regular cost
> of the Harbor Freight unit. So the HF shear on sale would be an even
> better deal. There is a Harbor Freight nearby, I'll see if they stock
> it. I'd like to see it before buying if I can.
>
> Do you cut 1/16" FR4 with it?
>
> What's the part number of the nibbler?
>
> Thanks.
>
> Steve K8JQ
>
>
> Mike Oyama wrote:
> > I use this one at a buddies house.
> >
> > http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=90757
> >
> > It's generic, but it works great. He got his on sale for $99. I'm
> checking
> > the specials every week till I see it for that price again. I've thought
> > about going to eBay for a used one, but I'm more concerned about a sharp,
> > nick free shear blade than anything else. They all look like they're
> built
> > about the same as far as the rigidity is concerned since it's going to be
> > used for PCBs most of the time, and not thicker metal stock.
> >
> > When cutting 1oz single sided pcbs, it leaves a nice clean sharp edge. In
> > fact, it's almost too sharp, and I always take a small piece of 1000P or
> > 1500 wet-dry sandpaper to the edge to soften it up a bit and avoid those
> > papercut type slices. Not jagged or saw blade, it's a sharp square edge,
> > like on a really nice pair of steel hand shears.
> >
> > I bought the little hand nibbler they sell. It was <$10 and works great
> for
> > cutting intricate shapes for tiny board mounting solutions, but a real
> PITA
> > for long straight cuts.
> >
> > On Sun, Apr 12, 2009 at 10:04 AM, Steve <steve65@...<steve65%40suddenlink.net>>
> wrote:
> >
> >
> >> Anyone using the Micro-Mark 83213 MINI METAL SHEAR / BRAKE to cut 1/16"
> >> FR4? The shear is at
> >> http://www.micromark.com/MINI-METAL-SHEAR-and-BRAKE,8395.html
> >>
> >> What has been your experience with it? Easy to use? Clean cuts? Problems
> >> or deficiencies?
> >>
> >> A search of the group archives turned up two references to this tool,
> >> but no comments regarding its usefulness for cutting PCB material.
> >>
> >> Thanks.
> >>
> >> Steve K8JQ
> >>
> --
> Read The Patriot It's Right -- It's Free
> http://PatriotPost.US/subscribe/ Veritas vos Liberabit
>
>  
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, Steve <steve65@...> wrote:
>
> Anyone using the Micro-Mark 83213 MINI METAL SHEAR / BRAKE to cut 1/16" 
> FR4? The shear is at 
> http://www.micromark.com/MINI-METAL-SHEAR-and-BRAKE,8395.html

I have one of these.  I'm not sure whether I bought it from Micro Mark or from Harbor Freight.  I think that I did pay more than $140.  It has been worth every penny to me.  

I prefer .030 and thinner FR4 for many things, and my boards seem to get dimensionally smaller rather than larger over time.  But this handles everything I've needed.

Just like cutting paper in an old-style paper cutter, you have to be careful with wider pieces that the cutting action does not pull the board, causing a non-square cut.

-- Dave

Mike Oyama wrote:

> This is the nibbler I picked up.
> http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=97636


Hey it's slightly off-topic but I would need to cut rectangular holes in
steel chassis to mount panel connectors. Would a tool like that help me?
I am really concerned about how straight the cut can be.

If it is ok, I think I'll visit the nearest harbor freight very soon :)

bye
as

This tool is excellent for rectangular holes in metals and plastic as
long as the material is not too thick, the cut is very clean.

I had several sent to me from the US, because you can't find that type
of nibbling pliers here.

Rectangular punches may be another option if you need a large number
of holes the same size.

ST

On Tue, Apr 14, 2009 at 10:18 AM, Alessio Sangalli <alesan@...> wrote:
> Mike Oyama wrote:
>
>> This is the nibbler I picked up.
>> http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=97636
>
>
> Hey it's slightly off-topic but I would need to cut rectangular holes in
> steel chassis to mount panel connectors. Would a tool like that help me?
> I am really concerned about how straight the cut can be.
>
> If it is ok, I think I'll visit the nearest harbor freight very soon :)
>
> bye
> as
>

Gentlemen
There is another supplier of a similar tool.

http://www.adelnibbler.com/Purchase_The_Adel_Nibbling_Tool.htm

I have three of these and they are in constant use.

I received two as presents for my 21 Birthday!! (44Years ago) and 
they are still in use today.

Would highly recommend them. The have done an enormous amount of work.

The price has fallen. They cost double what they are today and that 
was in 1960's dollars.

David

  At 06:50 PM 14/04/2009, you wrote:


>This tool is excellent for rectangular holes in metals and plastic as
>long as the material is not too thick, the cut is very clean.
>
>I had several sent to me from the US, because you can't find that type
>of nibbling pliers here.
>
>Rectangular punches may be another option if you need a large number
>of holes the same size.
>
>ST
>
>On Tue, Apr 14, 2009 at 10:18 AM, Alessio Sangalli 
><<mailto:alesan%40manoweb.com>alesan@...> wrote:
> > Mike Oyama wrote:
> >
> >> This is the nibbler I picked up.
> >> 
> <http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=97636>http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=97636
> >
> >
> > Hey it's slightly off-topic but I would need to cut rectangular holes in
> > steel chassis to mount panel connectors. Would a tool like that help me?
> > I am really concerned about how straight the cut can be.
> >
> > If it is ok, I think I'll visit the nearest harbor freight very soon :)
> >
> > bye
> > as
> >
>
>
>No virus found in this incoming message.
>Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>Version: 8.0.238 / Virus Database: 270.11.55/2057 - Release Date: 
>04/13/09 17:56:00

David G. Hopkins (VK4ZF)
CAPALABA QLD.
AUSTRALIA
S27 32.191 E153 11.867

On Tue, 14 Apr 2009 01:18:25 -0700, you wrote:

>Mike Oyama wrote:
>
>> This is the nibbler I picked up.
>> http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=97636
>
>
>Hey it's slightly off-topic but I would need to cut rectangular holes in
>steel chassis to mount panel connectors. Would a tool like that help me?
>I am really concerned about how straight the cut can be.

Your best bet is a mill for the holes.  Otherwise, you end up
drilling, sawing, and filing to fit.  That will work as well, but
tends to be tedious.

Mills can be a considerable investment, but are well worth it.  HF has
several varieties, stay away from the 3 in 1 machine, it's a
compromise and does poorly at most everything.  

HF has an X1 (micromill), which is suitable for light work, drilling,
and the like.  Uses an MT2 spindle, screw drive for the Z axis with a
quill.  It's cheaper than the X2, (mini-mill), which has a rack and
pinion Z axis setup.  

Compare the x and y travel extents to figure out what the best one is
for you, if you want to go this way.  Better to have a machine with a
square column than round, since you lose your XY when you move the
head up and down.

Other companies sell much the same machine with a few variations (main
one is collet in the mini-mill R8 vs MT3).

Harvey

>
>If it is ok, I think I'll visit the nearest harbor freight very soon :)
>
>bye
>as

From time to time, there have been threads on this list regarding how 
to cut PCB material. Thought I'd pass along my experience with one 
particular tool.

Earlier this year, I acquired a Micro-Mark 83213 MINI METAL SHEAR / 
BRAKE. The spec clearly states that the shear will cut 1/16in PCB 
material in its almost 8-inch jaw.

I first tried cutting relatively short pieces of 1/16in PCB material. It 
seemed to me that the shear was challenged with 2in and 3in cuts. I 
spoke with customer support at Micro-Mark to confirm that the shear 
could be expected to make such short cuts as well as up to its 7.87in 
limit. They assured me it would.

I have a number of 6in X 6in pieces of 1/16in FR4 and eventually needed 
to cut one of these. The shear failed to make the 6in cut. A pin 
securing a gear to its shaft failed.

Micro-Mark was helpful in determining what happened and offered to send 
a replacement pin. After further discussion with Micro-Mark, I decided 
to return the shear/brake for a refund. My thinking was that I will want 
to make 6in cuts of 1/16in FR4 somewhat frequently and that this shear 
would be unable to meet that need.

It seems reasonable to think the unit would be OK for 1/8in PCB 
material, although I had no board of that thickness to try. In my 
observation (for what it is worth), this shear is operating at its spec 
limit when cutting 1/16in FR4 at lengths of 6in or greater and should 
not be expected to provide long, trouble-free service. Even cutting 
shorter lengths of 1/16in FR4 is a challenge for it.

One guy's opinion and experience.

Steve

-- 
Read The Patriot Post
hppt://PatriotPost.US/Subscribe/ Vetitas vos Liberabit

Hi Steve,
I bought a larger 24" cheap Shear/Brake/Roll from Harbor Freight and had similar issues. the casting even broke at the base.

I repaired the base by mig welding( carefully ). Then I found that the problem was the angle of the blade was not enough to create the shearing action needed. I increased this by shimming up one side almost 3/16ths. I cuts thick PCB like a champ now. When I have time, I'm going to remove the shims and cut/mill the the other end down.
The shimming brought the blade too close and reduced the effective width of usable cutting.
-Lee 

Rant of the day:  Never listen to people who say you can't do something until you've tried and failed yourself. Many times they haven't either and are spouting stuff they've heard from others.


--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, Steve <steve65@...> wrote:

>  From time to time, there have been threads on this list regarding >how to cut PCB material. Thought I'd pass along my experience with one 
> particular tool.
>

Does your cut stay straight with the angle? I have some difficulty
with the cut always pulling toward one side using a lever shear (which
admittedly has an even greater angle).

The bungard PCB shear I know only has a very low angle or none at all.
But it is sturdy and you need quite some force to cut wide PCBs. (I
guess that is why the larger manual sheetmetal shears have heavy
weights on the end of the lever, to give it some intertia, or is it
just counterweight?)

ST

On Wed, Jul 15, 2009 at 10:59 PM, Lee Studley<indigo_red@...> wrote:
> Hi Steve,
> I bought a larger 24" cheap Shear/Brake/Roll from Harbor Freight and had similar issues. the casting even broke at the base.
>
> I repaired the base by mig welding( carefully ). Then I found that the problem was the angle of the blade was not enough to create the shearing action needed. I increased this by shimming up one side almost 3/16ths. I cuts thick PCB like a champ now. When I have time, I'm going to remove the shims and cut/mill the the other end down.
> The shimming brought the blade too close and reduced the effective width of usable cutting.
> -Lee
>
> Rant of the day:  Never listen to people who say you can't do something until you've tried and failed yourself. Many times they haven't either and are spouting stuff they've heard from others.
>

Hi Stefan,
Yes I did have that problem, but I clamp the board with a plate over top 
to keep that from happening.
the HF unit has a spring loaded bar that attempts it, but it needs to be 
made better. a future project :-)
-Lee

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, Lee Studley <indigo_red@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Stefan,
> Yes I did have that problem, but I clamp the board with a plate over top 
> to keep that from happening.
> the HF unit has a spring loaded bar that attempts it, but it needs to be 
> made better. a future project :-)
> -Lee
>

I have one of the old Kepro shears, has a 12" blade, it has a pretty good angle on the blade.  Boards that I normally cut are upto 1/16" FR-4 upto 8" wide.  I do have some trouble with nonstraight cuts.  I have to really hold the board, need to make some kind of clamp to hold it in place better would make it easier to use.  I got it used and it did not have a handle for it.  Made one from some 1/2" steel rod, made it longer so it has good leverage to cut.

The other method that I like to use is a bench size table saw with a Wet/Dry Diamond blade in it and Vac system to collect the dust.  Got straighter more consistant cuts with the table saw setup.  The dust does take its toll on the motor.  Putting a Filter around the motor helped.  Think I needed to refine the Dust Collection and filtering for the motor.  A wet Tile saw should work good too, water would keep the dust down.

Ben

Ben

Cool, I'll try that too. Might work for more than one board at a time 
if they are held together like in the sliding box that that guy in
the DIY channel does. He's vaguely similar to Norm from this old house, but strange. He has quirky but interesting ways of doing things.

When he brushes wood glue on a project, he makes it look like it's a 20minute procedure.
thanks, -Lee

> The other method that I like to use is a bench size table saw with a Wet/Dry Diamond blade in it and Vac system to collect the dust.  Got straighter more consistant cuts with the table saw setup.  The dust does take its toll on the motor.  Putting a Filter around the motor helped.  Think I needed to refine the Dust Collection and filtering for the motor.  A wet Tile saw should work good too, water would keep the dust down.
> 
> Ben
>