Homebrew PCBs

Hi

I am considering buying a laser printer for use in making PCBs with the 
toner transfer method.  I would like to know if anyone has experience 
with any Brother models as they are currently on sale at Office Depot.

Is there a noticible difference between laser printers or more 
specifically the toner used in different brands of printers?  Does the 
toner used for recycled cartridges have the same properties as the 
new "branded" cartridges?

Any help/comments is appreciated?

Thanks in advance.

Regards
Ed AD5JV

On Mon, 26 Nov 2007 03:46:29 -0000, you wrote:

>Hi
>
>I am considering buying a laser printer for use in making PCBs with the 
>toner transfer method.  I would like to know if anyone has experience 
>with any Brother models as they are currently on sale at Office Depot.

I *think* that I have heard things about the brother series that
indicates that they are not the best for toner transfer.  IIRC, the
best seems to be HP, which can also be inexpensive.  How good the
inexpensive ones are, that's another matter.  I have an HP 2200D,
which was not cheap, even as a closeout.  I would recommend 1200 DPI,
though.

>
>Is there a noticible difference between laser printers or more 
>specifically the toner used in different brands of printers?  Does the 
>toner used for recycled cartridges have the same properties as the 
>new "branded" cartridges?

For 600 DPI, I think that the toner is probably close to the same. For
the 1200 DPI, HP makes a big deal about "microfine" toner and suggests
that you not use any other variety.  Big surprise there.

On the other hand, I found an Office Depot remanufactured cartridge to
be noisy and of lower quality.  I've also had an Office Depot Ink
cartridge (black, yet) remanufactured for the HP to be bone dry
clogged out of the box.

If you *do* go with HP, be aware that there is on the 2200 and 2300
series, and some of the other LaserJet series, a density control in
software.  It's a separate program, not part of the driver.  Normally
the density is set to about 2.5, for boards, I set it to 5 (maximum).

YMMV, especially with other machines, but these are my opinions.

Harvey

>
>Any help/comments is appreciated?
>
>Thanks in advance.
>
>Regards
>Ed AD5JV
>
>

In my experience it is not the same toner, at least for the very cheap
remanufactured ones.

ST

On Nov 26, 2007 4:46 AM, Ed Laughery <laughery@...> wrote:
> Hi
>
> I am considering buying a laser printer for use in making PCBs with the
> toner transfer method.  I would like to know if anyone has experience
> with any Brother models as they are currently on sale at Office Depot.
>
> Is there a noticible difference between laser printers or more
> specifically the toner used in different brands of printers?  Does the
> toner used for recycled cartridges have the same properties as the
> new "branded" cartridges?
>
> Any help/comments is appreciated?
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
> Regards
> Ed AD5JV
>
>
>

I am using kitchen baking paper. Works great for me, down to 5 mils with 
  peach laminator:

http://shrani.si/f/N/Dw/4St0u0SF/breskvica.jpg

MP

Stefan Trethan wrote:

> 
> 
> In my experience it is not the same toner, at least for the very cheap
> remanufactured ones.
> 
> ST
> 
> On Nov 26, 2007 4:46 AM, Ed Laughery <laughery@bellsouth. net 
> <mailto:laughery%40bellsouth.net>> wrote:
>  > Hi
>  >
>  > I am considering buying a laser printer for use in making PCBs with the
>  > toner transfer method. I would like to know if anyone has experience
>  > with any Brother models as they are currently on sale at Office Depot.
>  >
>  > Is there a noticible difference between laser printers or more
>  > specifically the toner used in different brands of printers? Does the
>  > toner used for recycled cartridges have the same properties as the
>  > new "branded" cartridges?
>  >
>  > Any help/comments is appreciated?
>  >
>  > Thanks in advance.
>  >
>  > Regards
>  > Ed AD5JV
>  >
>  >
>  >
> 
>

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Ed Laughery" <laughery@...> 
wrote:
>
> Hi
> 
> I am considering buying a laser printer for use in making PCBs with 
the 
> toner transfer method.  I would like to know if anyone has experience 
> with any Brother models as they are currently on sale at Office Depot.
... stuff deleted ... 
> Regards
> Ed AD5JV
>

Ed, 
I have an older HL-5040 and have had little success getting TT to work 
with it. I've tried on numerous occasions, with a variety of recomended 
papers, and have had only disapointing results. 

I hear of others having some success with other Brother models though, 
so YMMV.

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "art_lammoglia"
<art_lammoglia@...> wrote:
>
> --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Ed Laughery" <laughery@> 
> wrote:
> >
> > Hi
> > 
> > I am considering buying a laser printer for use in making PCBs with 
> the 
> > toner transfer method.  I would like to know if anyone has experience 
> > with any Brother models as they are currently on sale at Office Depot.
> ... stuff deleted ... 
> > Regards
> > Ed AD5JV
> >
> 
> Ed, 
> I have an older HL-5040 and have had little success getting TT to work 
> with it. I've tried on numerous occasions, with a variety of recomended 
> papers, and have had only disapointing results. 
> 
> I hear of others having some success with other Brother models though, 
> so YMMV.
>


I bought a refurb HL5270DN a few months back. I just did a
single-sided board with it this weekend using staples basic photo
paper. The trace sizes were 16mil and 24mil, and it turned out pretty
good. The topside "silkscreen" with much smaller features turned out
very good.

Mickey

> 
> I bought a refurb HL5270DN a few months back. I just did a
> single-sided board with it this weekend using staples basic photo
> paper. The trace sizes were 16mil and 24mil, and it turned out pretty
> good. The topside "silkscreen" with much smaller features turned out
> very good.
> 
> Mickey

Mickey,
Did it come with a Brother toner cartridge or third party toner? and 
did you use a laminater or iron?
TIA

Hello Ed...and all

For YEARS I've been using a first generation 1200dpi model (HL-
1050DX) with great success. Just 2 weeks ago it decided to "bite the 
biscuit" so I may be taking advantage of the Office Depot sale too.

Keep one thing in mind. You MAY have to take "I've had no luck with 
my Brother Laser" comments from others with a grain of salt. There 
are many variables involved in succesful transfer which have been 
discussed to death in this group (Paper used, laminator vs. iron, 
heat, pressure, Brand named toner vs. no-Name/generic toner ,etc. 
etc.) 

You can't neccesarily blame Brother for bad results. You could try 
taking a file to Office Depot and asking for a "Test print because 
you're shopping for a new Laser". If you get a nice enough 
salesperson they may oblige. You could then bring the "test" home 
and give it a try (this again assuming you've already had success 
with the TT Method and have the other variables sorted out).

My two cents worth.

Cheers....Dean.

P.S. I use(or rather used till it died) A Brother HL-1050DX with 
Brother toner on magazine paper run about 6 times through a 
laminator and etched using the "wipe softly with a sponge" method in 
Ferric Chloride. I can get consistant results of one trace between 
DIP IC pads (Not sure how many mils that would be). Good enough for 
me !



--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Ed Laughery" <laughery@...> 
wrote:
>
> Hi
> 
> I am considering buying a laser printer for use in making PCBs 
with the 
> toner transfer method.  I would like to know if anyone has 
experience 
> with any Brother models as they are currently on sale at Office 
Depot.
> 
> Is there a noticible difference between laser printers or more 
> specifically the toner used in different brands of printers?  Does 
the 

> toner used for recycled cartridges have the same properties as the 
> new "branded" cartridges?
> 
> Any help/comments is appreciated?
> 
> Thanks in advance.
> 
> Regards
> Ed AD5JV
>

On Monday 26 November 2007 00:53, Harvey White wrote:
> On Mon, 26 Nov 2007 03:46:29 -0000, you wrote:
> If you *do* go with HP, be aware that there is on the 2200 and 2300
> series, and some of the other LaserJet series, a density control in
> software.  It's a separate program, not part of the driver.  Normally
> the density is set to about 2.5, for boards, I set it to 5 (maximum).
>
> YMMV, especially with other machines, but these are my opinions.
>
> Harvey
>

I've been looking a bit at LaserJets lately, especially the 1018/1020/1022. 
One thing I noticed is that the 1018 and 1020 seem to come with 
an "introductory cartridge" that is only good for 1000 pages. The 1022 comes 
with a 2000 page cartridge. They all seem to use the HP12 cartridge which 
seems to go for around $68, so you start out $34 in the hole with the 
1018/102020. They also are 600x600 dpi, while the 1022 is 1200x1200.

It also appears the HP online store is offering free shipping and an instant 
rebate on all three. At the time I was checking the WEB. I believe HP was 
cheaper than Office Depot; of course that changes by the minute 8o). 

-- 
Keith Bowers - Thomasville, NC

On Wed, 28 Nov 2007 13:15:01 -0500, you wrote:

>On Monday 26 November 2007 00:53, Harvey White wrote:
>> On Mon, 26 Nov 2007 03:46:29 -0000, you wrote:
>> If you *do* go with HP, be aware that there is on the 2200 and 2300
>> series, and some of the other LaserJet series, a density control in
>> software.  It's a separate program, not part of the driver.  Normally
>> the density is set to about 2.5, for boards, I set it to 5 (maximum).
>>
>> YMMV, especially with other machines, but these are my opinions.
>>
>> Harvey
>>
>
>I've been looking a bit at LaserJets lately, especially the 1018/1020/1022. 
>One thing I noticed is that the 1018 and 1020 seem to come with 
>an "introductory cartridge" that is only good for 1000 pages. 

Translation:  GOTCHA!

Happens lots.

>The 1022 comes 
>with a 2000 page cartridge. They all seem to use the HP12 cartridge which 
>seems to go for around $68, so you start out $34 in the hole with the 
>1018/102020. They also are 600x600 dpi, while the 1022 is 1200x1200.

The 96A cart runs for over 100 dollars, I think about 120.  68 dollars
may sound good here....

The 2200D (got it because it was double sided, needed it, love the
feature) is 1200 by 1200...

>
>It also appears the HP online store is offering free shipping and an instant 
>rebate on all three. At the time I was checking the WEB. I believe HP was 
>cheaper than Office Depot; of course that changes by the minute 8o). 

sure does....

Luck, though

Harvey

I personally use brother hl-2040 laser with telstra glossy junk mail as 
the transfer paper, I find it is the best out of all the junk papers as 
you can freely collect it at a shopping center.

I have recently found a hp laserjet 1200 thrown out with some water 
damage, after a good clean up it performs far superior because the toner 
is more durable, the brother toner is brittle when on the copper.
A second hand printer is a great way to go as you can find them 
literally thrown out and its not a great loss to experiment with.

I gave the hp 1200 baking paper, plastic transparency, glad wrap on 
paper (melted disaster), aluminium foil, graphite dusted paper, all in 
an attempt to get the toner to transfer easily, and it still prints as 
good as my new brother after all the abuse.

Cheers,
Michael.


Harvey White wrote:
> On Wed, 28 Nov 2007 13:15:01 -0500, you wrote:
>
>   
>> On Monday 26 November 2007 00:53, Harvey White wrote:
>>     
>>> On Mon, 26 Nov 2007 03:46:29 -0000, you wrote:
>>> If you *do* go with HP, be aware that there is on the 2200 and 2300
>>> series, and some of the other LaserJet series, a density control in
>>> software.  It's a separate program, not part of the driver.  Normally
>>> the density is set to about 2.5, for boards, I set it to 5 (maximum).
>>>
>>> YMMV, especially with other machines, but these are my opinions.
>>>
>>> Harvey
>>>
>>>       
>> I've been looking a bit at LaserJets lately, especially the 1018/1020/1022. 
>> One thing I noticed is that the 1018 and 1020 seem to come with 
>> an "introductory cartridge" that is only good for 1000 pages. 
>>     
>
> Translation:  GOTCHA!
>
> Happens lots.
>
>   
>> The 1022 comes 
>> with a 2000 page cartridge. They all seem to use the HP12 cartridge which 
>> seems to go for around $68, so you start out $34 in the hole with the 
>> 1018/102020. They also are 600x600 dpi, while the 1022 is 1200x1200.
>>     
>
> The 96A cart runs for over 100 dollars, I think about 120.  68 dollars
> may sound good here....
>
> The 2200D (got it because it was double sided, needed it, love the
> feature) is 1200 by 1200...
>
>   
>> It also appears the HP online store is offering free shipping and an instant 
>> rebate on all three. At the time I was checking the WEB. I believe HP was 
>> cheaper than Office Depot; of course that changes by the minute 8o). 
>>     
>
> sure does....
>
> Luck, though
>
> Harvey
>
>
> Be sure to visit the group home and check for new Links, Files, and Photos:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Homebrew_PCBs 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>   


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