Homebrew PCBs

Group,
I gave a presentation to a group on toner transfer over the weekend. 
One of the guys has a high-end Epson inkjet printer that uses pigment
instead of dye; it's the type used for very long term archive images,
and does gigle printing as well.  There is a straight feed-through on
his printer for up to 1/16" inch media.

The question is, will this pigment-based inkjet ink stand up to
etchant if the image is printed directly on the copper?

Regards,
Ted

On Tue, 11 Apr 2006 00:37:00 +0200, kilocycles <kilocycles@...>  
wrote:

> Group,
>
> I gave a presentation to a group on toner transfer over the weekend.
>
> One of the guys has a high-end Epson inkjet printer that uses pigment
>
> instead of dye; it's the type used for very long term archive images,
>
> and does gigle printing as well.  There is a straight feed-through on
>
> his printer for up to 1/16" inch media.
>
>
> The question is, will this pigment-based inkjet ink stand up to
>
> etchant if the image is printed directly on the copper?
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Ted


The question is, can it be printed directly on copper so that it a) sticks  
b) forms a continous layer and c) acts enough as a resist.

Why not try?
If copper foil is not available a piece of aluminum foil taped to a sheet  
of paper should be a close enough substitute for testing a) and b).

ST

>There is a straight feed-through on
>his printer for up to 1/16" inch media.

Sounds like a 2200 or 2400. But 1.3 mm isn't quite 1/16".

>The question is, will this pigment-based inkjet ink stand up to
>etchant if the image is printed directly on the copper?

The 2200 uses Ultrachrome pigment based ink. Epson doesn't even 
recommend it for use with their own transparencies. I've used it 
with transparencies and it doesn't take much to rub the ink off when 
dried. Doubt whether any Epson ink will wet and adhere to copper, 
it'll probably just bead up.

But even if you get it to work, you're talking single sided boards 
done easy. What about double sided boards? Furthermore, you waste 
ink when you have to do the same board more than once. Go the photo 
etching route with an inkjet printer. Both sides of double sided 
boards are perfectly aligned and you reuse the same aligned 
transparencies over and over.

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "kilocycles" <kilocycles@...> 
wrote:
>

On Tue, 11 Apr 2006 01:56:54 +0200, derekhawkins <eldata@...> wrote:

> But even if you get it to work, you're talking single sided boards
>
> done easy. What about double sided boards? Furthermore, you waste
>
> ink when you have to do the same board more than once. Go the photo
>
> etching route with an inkjet printer. Both sides of double sided
>
> boards are perfectly aligned and you reuse the same aligned
>
> transparencies over and over.


If it would work i think the advantages are undisputed.

The thing is - it doesn't work, yet, so ...

ST

>If it would work i think the advantages are undisputed.

For someone unsatisfied with their current process perhaps. Whatever, 
an inkjet printer with a straight path able to handle 1/16" media isn't 
exactly cheap. The Epson 2400 costs over $800.00. So it's a pipe dream 
in more ways than one.


--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Stefan Trethan" 
<stefan_trethan@...> wrote:
>

On Tue, 11 Apr 2006 16:19:38 +0200, derekhawkins <eldata@...> wrote:

> For someone unsatisfied with their current process perhaps. Whatever,
>
> an inkjet printer with a straight path able to handle 1/16" media isn't
>
> exactly cheap. The Epson 2400 costs over $800.00. So it's a pipe dream
>
> in more ways than one.
>


conversion of almost any printer, even a wrap-around one, would for many  
of us be no more than an afternoons job.

The tricky bit is the ink... If you deliver a ink that works as resist in  
normal printheads i will send you a printer convertet to accept 1.5mm  
boards for free.

ST

>If you deliver a ink that works as resist in
>normal printheads i will send you a printer convertet to accept 1.5mm
>boards for free.

Not that desperate, already have a 2200. Not interested in a flatbed 
plotter either.

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Stefan Trethan" 
<stefan_trethan@...> wrote:
>

On 11/04/06, derekhawkins <eldata@...> wrote:
> >If you deliver a ink that works as resist in
> >normal printheads i will send you a printer convertet to accept 1.5mm
> >boards for free.
>

Epson 900 has a flat path from back to front for its a4 cd tray, but
the ink is useless.

Now if a replacement ink / soluble wax could be put in the cartridges......

OK, since I started this thread, I have now read the 100 or so posts
on the subject (a bit late, since I was in the hospital for 6 days),
and I have condensed the information to send it to my friend with the
Epson pigment-based printer.

I will recommend that he prepare a board properly, print and dry the
board, and report back with results.  I will also get the specific
information on which model Epson he is using, and the ink cartridge
info as well.

I've left my original post and Stefan's reply unedited as a
benchmark/reminder of how the thread started.

Regards,
Ted

 
--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Stefan Trethan"
<stefan_trethan@...> wrote:
>
> On Tue, 11 Apr 2006 00:37:00 +0200, kilocycles <kilocycles@...>  
> wrote:
> 
> > Group,
> >
> > I gave a presentation to a group on toner transfer over the weekend.
> >
> > One of the guys has a high-end Epson inkjet printer that uses pigment
> >
> > instead of dye; it's the type used for very long term archive images,
> >
> > and does gigle printing as well.  There is a straight feed-through on
> >
> > his printer for up to 1/16" inch media.
> >
> >
> > The question is, will this pigment-based inkjet ink stand up to
> >
> > etchant if the image is printed directly on the copper?
> >
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > Ted
> 
> 
> The question is, can it be printed directly on copper so that it a)
sticks  
> b) forms a continous layer and c) acts enough as a resist.
> 
> Why not try?
> If copper foil is not available a piece of aluminum foil taped to a
sheet  

> of paper should be a close enough substitute for testing a) and b).
> 
> ST