Doepfer

Hi, I am new to modular but I grew up from the Arp era.

How can I calculate the amount of space a system will need?

I welcome case suggestions.  

The system would have to fit into a home office.

Are the Doepfer cases a little expensive or are they good value?

Are there any cases that a a little more like furniture on the out side?

Are there any plans I can down load?

Thanks for your suggestions

Wow, thanks Zoe For replying in English. Typically it is the only European language I know.


I am still working on my specification.

I want a sequencer centred system with some polyphony.

I would like to have some FM synthesis too using VCOs modulating one another.

Do you have any module suggestions?

Regards From Anoop



--- In Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com, Zoë Blade <zoe@...> wrote:

>
> > Hi, I am new to modular but I grew up from the Arp era.
> 
> Welcome!
> 
> > How can I calculate the amount of space a system will need?
> 
> Eurorack modules are all measured in HP.  I believe they're all an even number too.  There are a few online tools you can use to try out new configurations and see how they'd look.  Check out http://www.modularplanner.co.uk/ and http://www.modulargrid.net/ for two examples.
> 
> > I welcome case suggestions.  
> > 
> > The system would have to fit into a home office.
> > 
> > Are the Doepfer cases a little expensive or are they good value?
> 
> Personally I get the Doepfer version of anything I can (cases, any given type of module), but it's a very personal thing.  You can get some very fancy looking ones from http://www.goike.com/ and other individual makers.
> 
> > Are there any cases that a a little more like furniture on the out side?
> 
> You could always get the rackmountable G6 case, and a desk with a built-in rack..?
> 
> > Are there any plans I can down load?
> > 
> > Thanks for your suggestions 
> 
> Definitely check out http://www.doepfer.de/a100_cases_e.htm to see the cases available from Doepfer, and http://www.modulargrid.net/ for ideas on how to fill it. :)
> 
> All the best,
> Zoë.
>

> Hi, I am new to modular but I grew up from the Arp era.

Welcome!

> How can I calculate the amount of space a system will need?

Eurorack modules are all measured in HP.  I believe they're all an even number too.  There are a few online tools you can use to try out new configurations and see how they'd look.  Check out http://www.modularplanner.co.uk/ and http://www.modulargrid.net/ for two examples.

> I welcome case suggestions.  
> 
> The system would have to fit into a home office.
> 
> Are the Doepfer cases a little expensive or are they good value?

Personally I get the Doepfer version of anything I can (cases, any given type of module), but it's a very personal thing.  You can get some very fancy looking ones from http://www.goike.com/ and other individual makers.

> Are there any cases that a a little more like furniture on the out side?

You could always get the rackmountable G6 case, and a desk with a built-in rack..?

> Are there any plans I can down load?
> 
> Thanks for your suggestions 

Definitely check out http://www.doepfer.de/a100_cases_e.htm to see the cases available from Doepfer, and http://www.modulargrid.net/ for ideas on how to fill it. :)

All the best,
Zoë.

> Wow, thanks Zoe For replying in English. Typically it is the only European language I know.

You're quite welcome!  Just between you, me, and the rest of the list, I'm British too, so replying in English isn't that tricky for me. ;)

> I am still working on my specification.
> 
> I want a sequencer centred system with some polyphony.
> 
> I would like to have some FM synthesis too using VCOs modulating one another.
> 
> Do you have any module suggestions?
> 
> Regards From Anoop

Well for a basic, analogue implementation of FM synthesis, I gather the A-111-1 is much better than the A-110 as it has a linear FM input for just such an occasion.  As the A-110 doesn't, FM synthesis using an A-110 is exponential rather than linear, which generally doesn't sound as pleasant.  At least, that's what I hear people say.  I need to set aside some time to experiment with FM synthesis properly.  The chip the A-111-1 uses is becoming scarce though, so if you do get one of those, it'll need to be fairly soon.

For sequencing, are you talking about the simple analogue kind, or the much fancier computer controlled kind?  For the simple kind, check out the A-5XX range of modules over at http://www.doepfer.de/a100.htm or even the MAQ 16/3.  I'm more into the 80s/90s synth era than the 60s/70s one, so I haven't really looked into these myself, but for space music type affairs, they should be pretty good!

Polyphony's a bit trickier.  You can either get several of everything, or some kind of multitrack.  Computers are so fast these days that you can happily record dozens of tracks over the top of each other before having to bounce them down to a single channel, so a single monosynth is enough to make some great music on if you have enough patience.  (It also means you can do things like portamento up on one channel and portamento down on another at the same time, when playing chords.)

Sorry I couldn't be more helpful, I think I use my Doepfer A-100 in a different way to most people here... :)

Hope that helps,
Zoë.

Thank you for all your advice Zoë, I'm embarrassed,  when I saw the umlaut over the "e" in your name I assumed you were from mainland Europe! I am in Manchester,  Aiyaaw,  as we say up here

I did not even consider linear vs log scale controls, need to think about this point. FM programming of the DX7 was very difficult and not intuitive at all, have you ever tried it?

I am bored with computer sequencers they are over featured and I find them difficult to programme. I like the feature compactness of a modular sequencer.I have considered the A5xx and Maq types too and I may put in the Maq later on. 

I wondered if implementing polyphony was just getting more VCO's ADSRs and VFC's?. 

I am still saving up and so I have plenty of time to finalise my order.

Zoë, I will listen to your tracks. 

I am stuck in Krautrock mode at the moment so your music will be a welcome comparison.


--- In Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com, Zoë Blade <zoe@...> wrote:

>
> > Wow, thanks Zoe For replying in English. Typically it is the only European language I know.
> 
> You're quite welcome!  Just between you, me, and the rest of the list, I'm British too, so replying in English isn't that tricky for me. ;)
> 
> > I am still working on my specification.
> > 
> > I want a sequencer centred system with some polyphony.
> > 
> > I would like to have some FM synthesis too using VCOs modulating one another.
> > 
> > Do you have any module suggestions?
> > 
> > Regards From Anoop
> 
> Well for a basic, analogue implementation of FM synthesis, I gather the A-111-1 is much better than the A-110 as it has a linear FM input for just such an occasion.  As the A-110 doesn't, FM synthesis using an A-110 is exponential rather than linear, which generally doesn't sound as pleasant.  At least, that's what I hear people say.  I need to set aside some time to experiment with FM synthesis properly.  The chip the A-111-1 uses is becoming scarce though, so if you do get one of those, it'll need to be fairly soon.
> 
> For sequencing, are you talking about the simple analogue kind, or the much fancier computer controlled kind?  For the simple kind, check out the A-5XX range of modules over at http://www.doepfer.de/a100.htm or even the MAQ 16/3.  I'm more into the 80s/90s synth era than the 60s/70s one, so I haven't really looked into these myself, but for space music type affairs, they should be pretty good!
> 
> Polyphony's a bit trickier.  You can either get several of everything, or some kind of multitrack.  Computers are so fast these days that you can happily record dozens of tracks over the top of each other before having to bounce them down to a single channel, so a single monosynth is enough to make some great music on if you have enough patience.  (It also means you can do things like portamento up on one channel and portamento down on another at the same time, when playing chords.)
> 
> Sorry I couldn't be more helpful, I think I use my Doepfer A-100 in a different way to most people here... :)
> 
> Hope that helps,
> Zoë.
>

Thanks,Florian and Thanks Zoe,

You may have saved me from chasing rainbows by warning me of the limitations of FM synthesis.

Would a ring modulator with multiple inputs and multiple ADSR's do a better job than simple phase interaction?

I read on wikipedia that the  DX 7  really had a phase distortion mechanism like the Casio synths. Now that was a cool whacky system, whoever thought of varying the rate of read out of a sine wave from a ROM!

By the way does Doepfer have German reliability like my Golf, Waldorf and 50 year old Grundig reel to reel?







--- In Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com, Zoë Blade <zoe@...> wrote:

>
> Yeah, I'm afraid Florian's right.
> 
> To broaden the discussion a bit, modular synthesisers aren't particularly well suited for FM synthesis and polyphony.  FM synthesis is usually implemented digitally because making another oscillator consists of writing a few more lines of code and getting a slightly faster chip, rather than spending another £200 or so on a tangible oscillator (not to mention the cost of the envelope generator, VCA, etc).
> 
> But before you get put off analogue modulars, there's a whole bunch of things you can do with them that you can't do so well in the digital domain.  All the tiny imperfections add up to sound more quirky and interesting.  You can touch physical knobs and leads to make changes, giving your eyes a rest from the screen and your hand a rest from the mouse.  The inability to save a patch means you can't ever quite recreate anything you made before, but you will instead discover new sounds each time, and hone your patching skills faster.  You will be forced to make the sounds of each track sound at least slightly different from the last, something everyone should be doing anyway.  Negative points have a strange way of becoming plus points in this respect.  And when you start throwing things like spring reverbs into the mix, and all those filters, you really get a completely different world of sound to what you can get from a DX-7 or software.  Gritty, unstable, untamed beasts of sound that you're struggling to keep under your control, that sound powerful, strange and alien.
> 
> Now, if you want to make Krautrock, you probably only need a fairly basic A-100 system and maybe some Mellotron or Orchestron samples, and you'll be set for at least half a dozen albums or so. :)
> 
> I'd recommend reading Gordon Reid's Synth Secrets: http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/allsynthsecrets.htm  (The list's in reverse order.)  It's a great guide to patching sounds together, and will give you plenty of ideas about which modules you'll suddenly "need". :)
> 
> Anyway, I'd recommend making clean, clinical music in software, and gritty, organic music using something like the A-100.  While both can do both, it's much easier to play up to each instrument's strengths.
> 
> All the best,
> Zoë.
>

Hello Anoop


> Thank you for all your advice Zoë, I'm embarrassed,  when I saw the
> umlaut over the "e" in your name I assumed you were from mainland
> Europe! I am in Manchester,  Aiyaaw,  as we say up here

I think you don't have to be embarrassed - I'd expect an "Anoop" more in 
Mumbay than in Manchester... ;-) (and many Germans expect Florians to be 
from Austria :-))) )

> I did not even consider linear vs log scale controls, need to think
> about this point. FM programming of the DX7 was very difficult and
> not intuitive at all, have you ever tried it?
I am sorry, if I have to disappoint you, but I have to tell you, that FM 
with VCOs like the A110 or even A111 is not what FM in a DX7 is. 
Soundwise you will never get results like from a DX7. It is quite 
complicated to explain; it has to do with the waveform of the oscillator 
core (which is FM'ed in fact) and what the waveform converter makes from 
this signal.
As a simple example you may imagine, that the rectangle converter is an 
extreme fuzzbox circuit. Now imagine a monophonic TX81Z sound through a 
fuzzbox. It will be still an interesting sound, but it has nothing to do 
with the FM, that you are expecting.


> I wondered if implementing polyphony was just getting more VCO's
> ADSRs and VFC's?.
Polyphony especially means getting more credit at you bank.

Do you mean "polyphony" in the musical sense (like Johann Sebastian 
Bach), or in a technical sense (like a six voice Jupiter-8). If you 
think of Bach with several single synth voices, then you need for each 
voice at least one VCO, VCF, VCA and an envelope, but they may (and 
should) consist of different kind of modules - like different filters, 
VCOs from different brands. As "bread and butter" modules like ADSR and 
LFO you may use the A-143-2 and A-143-3.
If you think of a modular Jupiter-8, then get a used Clavia Nord Modular 
and an old Laptop for the editor (sorry, Mr Doepfer for spoiling the 
business ;-) ).


Florian

Yeah, I'm afraid Florian's right.

To broaden the discussion a bit, modular synthesisers aren't particularly well suited for FM synthesis and polyphony.  FM synthesis is usually implemented digitally because making another oscillator consists of writing a few more lines of code and getting a slightly faster chip, rather than spending another £200 or so on a tangible oscillator (not to mention the cost of the envelope generator, VCA, etc).

But before you get put off analogue modulars, there's a whole bunch of things you can do with them that you can't do so well in the digital domain.  All the tiny imperfections add up to sound more quirky and interesting.  You can touch physical knobs and leads to make changes, giving your eyes a rest from the screen and your hand a rest from the mouse.  The inability to save a patch means you can't ever quite recreate anything you made before, but you will instead discover new sounds each time, and hone your patching skills faster.  You will be forced to make the sounds of each track sound at least slightly different from the last, something everyone should be doing anyway.  Negative points have a strange way of becoming plus points in this respect.  And when you start throwing things like spring reverbs into the mix, and all those filters, you really get a completely different world of sound to what you can get from a DX-7 or software.  Gritty, unstable, untamed beasts of sound that you're struggling to keep under your control, that sound powerful, strange and alien.

Now, if you want to make Krautrock, you probably only need a fairly basic A-100 system and maybe some Mellotron or Orchestron samples, and you'll be set for at least half a dozen albums or so. :)

I'd recommend reading Gordon Reid's Synth Secrets: http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/allsynthsecrets.htm  (The list's in reverse order.)  It's a great guide to patching sounds together, and will give you plenty of ideas about which modules you'll suddenly "need". :)

Anyway, I'd recommend making clean, clinical music in software, and gritty, organic music using something like the A-100.  While both can do both, it's much easier to play up to each instrument's strengths.

All the best,
Zoë.

No, the dx range is wrongly known as frequency modulation wheras its is really phase modulation. fm synthesis is done digitially because it uses groups of sine waves in which strict frequency and phase relationships are required, which you cant easily have with analog. You modulate one oscillator with another oscillator. The casio cz range is phase distortion not phase modulation. Close but different.

Reliability is mostly down to the owner. Keep it in a good environment and maintain properly then yes, its a golf




On 17 Jun 2013, at 15:42, "anoop.sahal" <draks@apollo111.demon.co.uk> wrote:

> 
> 
> Thanks,Florian and Thanks Zoe,
> 
> You may have saved me from chasing rainbows by warning me of the limitations of FM synthesis.
> 
> Would a ring modulator with multiple inputs and multiple ADSR's do a better job than simple phase interaction?
> 
> I read on wikipedia that the DX 7 really had a phase distortion mechanism like the Casio synths. Now that was a cool whacky system, whoever thought of varying the rate of read out of a sine wave from a ROM!
> 
> By the way does Doepfer have German reliability like my Golf, Waldorf and 50 year old Grundig reel to reel?
> 
> --- In Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com, Zoë Blade <zoe@...> wrote:
> >
> > Yeah, I'm afraid Florian's right.
> > 
> > To broaden the discussion a bit, modular synthesisers aren't particularly well suited for FM synthesis and polyphony. FM synthesis is usually implemented digitally because making another oscillator consists of writing a few more lines of code and getting a slightly faster chip, rather than spending another £200 or so on a tangible oscillator (not to mention the cost of the envelope generator, VCA, etc).
> > 
> > But before you get put off analogue modulars, there's a whole bunch of things you can do with them that you can't do so well in the digital domain. All the tiny imperfections add up to sound more quirky and interesting. You can touch physical knobs and leads to make changes, giving your eyes a rest from the screen and your hand a rest from the mouse. The inability to save a patch means you can't ever quite recreate anything you made before, but you will instead discover new sounds each time, and hone your patching skills faster. You will be forced to make the sounds of each track sound at least slightly different from the last, something everyone should be doing anyway. Negative points have a strange way of becoming plus points in this respect. And when you start throwing things like spring reverbs into the mix, and all those filters, you really get a completely different world of sound to what you can get from a DX-7 or software. Gritty, unstable, untamed beasts of sound that you're struggling to keep under your control, that sound powerful, strange and alien.
> > 
> > Now, if you want to make Krautrock, you probably only need a fairly basic A-100 system and maybe some Mellotron or Orchestron samples, and you'll be set for at least half a dozen albums or so. :)
> > 
> > I'd recommend reading Gordon Reid's Synth Secrets: http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/allsynthsecrets.htm (The list's in reverse order.) It's a great guide to patching sounds together, and will give you plenty of ideas about which modules you'll suddenly "need". :)
> > 
> > Anyway, I'd recommend making clean, clinical music in software, and gritty, organic music using something like the A-100. While both can do both, it's much easier to play up to each instrument's strengths.
> > 
> > All the best,
> > Zoë.
> >
> 
> 


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