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matte paper dmax with the 2400/4800

matte paper dmax with the 2400/4800

2005-08-03 by dfaprinting

I'm trying to help someone else out. They are getting what I consider 
very low dmax with the 2400 and Epson matte black ink on just about 
every matte paper tried. Values like 1.6 - 1.65 for papers like 
Hahnemuhle Photo Rag and German Etching, trying both the "normal" RGB 
color mode and ABW mode with several different paper types and driver 
settings. He's measuring with a brand new i1 spectro (i1 photo), and 
from everything I've read, all the settings are correct. I searched the 
archives to see if I could find a typical set of values for any of the 
more common matte papers, but either chose the wrong keywords or didn't 
find any. So if anyone has either density or Lab values for papers like 
the above two or EEM/EAM (any other Epson paper) we would be grateful.

One of the next tests is to have him send me a printed profile target 
(probably on an Epson paper so he can call Epson with the results) that 
he measured, and then I'll measure it and we'll compare the results, 
though I don't really expect to see much difference between our 
respective i1 spectro's. Thanks, Greg.

Re: matte paper dmax with the 2400/4800

2005-08-03 by Louis Dina

Greg,

On EEM, you should be able to get a Dmax in the range of 1.68 to 
maybe 1.74, depending on the profile, dpi, dithering, etc.  I find I 
can usually hit 1.7 with EEM, and depending on the profile, I often 
hit 1.72 or a little higher.  This is with MK ink on a 2200 or a 
4000.  Can't speak directly for the 2400 or 4800, but I wouldn't 
expect much better than that on EEM.  

Lou

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "dfaprinting" 
<dfaprinting@y...> wrote:
> I'm trying to help someone else out. They are getting what I 
consider 
> very low dmax with the 2400 and Epson matte black ink on just about 
> every matte paper tried. Values like 1.6 - 1.65 for papers like 
> Hahnemuhle Photo Rag and German Etching, trying both the "normal" 
RGB 
> color mode and ABW mode with several different paper types and 
driver 
> settings. He's measuring with a brand new i1 spectro (i1 photo), 
and 
> from everything I've read, all the settings are correct. I searched 
the 
> archives to see if I could find a typical set of values for any of 
the 
> more common matte papers, but either chose the wrong keywords or 
didn't 
> find any. So if anyone has either density or Lab values for papers 
like 
> the above two or EEM/EAM (any other Epson paper) we would be 
grateful.
> 
> One of the next tests is to have him send me a printed profile 
target 
> (probably on an Epson paper so he can call Epson with the results) 
that 
> he measured, and then I'll measure it and we'll compare the 
results, 
> though I don't really expect to see much difference between our 
> respective i1 spectro's. Thanks, Greg.

Re: [Digital BW] matte paper dmax with the 2400/4800

2005-08-03 by Steve Kale

Doesn't sound too far off if he is using Epson MK ink
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> From: dfaprinting <dfaprinting@...>
> Reply-To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 13:46:51 -0000
> To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: [Digital BW] matte paper dmax with the 2400/4800
> 
> I'm trying to help someone else out. They are getting what I consider
> very low dmax with the 2400 and Epson matte black ink on just about
> every matte paper tried. Values like 1.6 - 1.65 for papers like
> Hahnemuhle Photo Rag and German Etching, trying both the "normal" RGB
> color mode and ABW mode with several different paper types and driver
> settings. He's measuring with a brand new i1 spectro (i1 photo), and
> from everything I've read, all the settings are correct. I searched the
> archives to see if I could find a typical set of values for any of the
> more common matte papers, but either chose the wrong keywords or didn't
> find any. So if anyone has either density or Lab values for papers like
> the above two or EEM/EAM (any other Epson paper) we would be grateful.
> 
> One of the next tests is to have him send me a printed profile target
> (probably on an Epson paper so he can call Epson with the results) that
> he measured, and then I'll measure it and we'll compare the results,
> though I don't really expect to see much difference between our
> respective i1 spectro's. Thanks, Greg.
>

Re: [Digital BW] matte paper dmax with the 2400/4800

2005-08-03 by Steve Kale

Epson MK performs well on Epson paper like EEM/EAM.  The numbers you are
quoting for HPR etc sound about right.  He will get a small pick up by
switching to MIS Eboni ink in place of Epson MK.
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> From: Steve Kale <stevekale@...>
> Reply-To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 15:18:33 +0100
> To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: Re: [Digital BW] matte paper dmax with the 2400/4800
> 
> Doesn't sound too far off if he is using Epson MK ink
> 
> 
>> From: dfaprinting <dfaprinting@...>
>> Reply-To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
>> Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 13:46:51 -0000
>> To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
>> Subject: [Digital BW] matte paper dmax with the 2400/4800
>> 
>> I'm trying to help someone else out. They are getting what I consider
>> very low dmax with the 2400 and Epson matte black ink on just about
>> every matte paper tried. Values like 1.6 - 1.65 for papers like
>> Hahnemuhle Photo Rag and German Etching, trying both the "normal" RGB
>> color mode and ABW mode with several different paper types and driver
>> settings. He's measuring with a brand new i1 spectro (i1 photo), and
>> from everything I've read, all the settings are correct. I searched the
>> archives to see if I could find a typical set of values for any of the
>> more common matte papers, but either chose the wrong keywords or didn't
>> find any. So if anyone has either density or Lab values for papers like
>> the above two or EEM/EAM (any other Epson paper) we would be grateful.
>> 
>> One of the next tests is to have him send me a printed profile target
>> (probably on an Epson paper so he can call Epson with the results) that
>> he measured, and then I'll measure it and we'll compare the results,
>> though I don't really expect to see much difference between our
>> respective i1 spectro's. Thanks, Greg.

Re: [Digital BW] matte paper dmax with the 2400/4800

2005-08-03 by dfaprinting

OK, thanks. I'll let him know that maybe he's not that far off the mark 
then. Just seemed strange that the third party inks which are all 
pigment would do better than the OEM ink with its portion of dye. When 
I compared it to what I get with a matte similar to Eboni, it seemed 
real low, I get 1.72 to 1.73 on GE depending on how the spectro reads 
that single patch. If I run the printer at the real full output, this 
ink achieves the 1.7x at about 50%, and holds it all the way to the 
end. Which is one thing Eboni would never do for me, a few steps past 
maximum and the density started to drop again.

Re: [Digital BW] matte paper dmax with the 2400/4800

2005-08-03 by Steve Kale

Check what he gets on EEM.  It should be around your numbers below.  But
Epson MK does not perform that well on other thicker paper (HPR, PJA etc).
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> From: dfaprinting <dfaprinting@...>
> Reply-To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 19:08:23 -0000
> To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: Re: [Digital BW] matte paper dmax with the 2400/4800
> 
> OK, thanks. I'll let him know that maybe he's not that far off the mark
> then. Just seemed strange that the third party inks which are all
> pigment would do better than the OEM ink with its portion of dye. When
> I compared it to what I get with a matte similar to Eboni, it seemed
> real low, I get 1.72 to 1.73 on GE depending on how the spectro reads
> that single patch. If I run the printer at the real full output, this
> ink achieves the 1.7x at about 50%, and holds it all the way to the
> end. Which is one thing Eboni would never do for me, a few steps past
> maximum and the density started to drop again.
>

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