The Yamaha AN1x Synthesizer mailing list

> Moog leads get used so often. When you've got a couple of guitars, a
> bass, and a drum set it's hard to cut through the mix.

That's why the 5 most essential words for a keyboardist to learn are:
"Turn that damn thing down!"
or
"Move the drums farther back!"

Ed Edwards
Leader: Ezekiel's Wheel      \ufffd\ufffd\ufffd\ufffdRetro-Progressive Rock\ufffd\ufffd\ufffd\ufffd
http://www.untiedmusic.com/ezekiel
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/227/ezekiels_wheel.html
\ufffd\ufffd.\ufffd\ufffd\ufffd.\ufffd\ufffd\ufffd.\ufffd\ufffd\ufffd.\ufffd\ufffd\ufffd.\ufffd\ufffd\ufffd.\ufffd\ufffd\ufffd.\ufffd\ufffd\ufffd.\ufffd\ufffd\ufffd.\ufffd\ufffd\ufffd.\ufffd\ufffd\ufffd.\ufffd\ufffd\ufffd.\ufffd\ufffd\ufffd.\ufffd\ufffd\ufffd.\ufffd\ufffd\ufffd.\ufffd\ufffd\ufffd.\ufffd\ufffd\ufffd.\ufffd\ufffd

--- In AN1x-list@y..., "Ed Edwards" <edward.edwards@v...> wrote:
> > Moog leads get used so often. When you've got a couple of 
guitars, a
> > bass, and a drum set it's hard to cut through the mix.

Yup, It's really context specific. The frequency plot of each group 
of musicians and each song is different. So "jutting out" enough that 
you can be heard but not enough that you sound screechy is a variable 
thing.

I do find that those moogy leads work too. Maybe because there is so 
much energy around the fundamental. My current favorite (very much 
like a classic moog patch) is a saw on the bottom, two pulse waves 
tuned a fifth above and a saw on top. It creates a ridge just above 
the fundamental before the overtones get softer. So you can keep it 
mellow (with the LPF) but it still has character. Also, when using 
oscillator sync I used to tune the synced oscillator above the other 
oscillator so I could play with those lovely high overtones, but 
lately I tune it below the other oscillator. Not as pretty, but much 
more useful in a band context.

Cheers,

Jerry

Thanks.

    I think you are right that the pad, reverb, basically all the things we
love to tweak and get to sound so fantastic often get lost.

   But also it helps to think about the right tool (sound) for the job. I
mean, if you are doing original music there are a lot of options...actually
even if you are doing covers there is always room for using arranging
creatively.

    Off the top of my head... If you have some great pad sounds, you wantto
feature, arrange the song so tha pad sounds starts it alone, with other
instruments coming in as it progresses. This helps on two fronts I think.
One, that once someone hears a sound, even when it gets somewhat masked I
think the brain remembers the other features of the sound and sort of fills
it in (sort of like...the telephone company only transmits a small part of
the freq spectrum, because of bandwidth limits...and our brain fills in some
of the spectrum out of memory) when you can't hear it all.
    Two, is that the other musicians will naturally be more considerate of
their volume....they will feel more like they have to fit into your musical
space. If a guitar starts the song, the first thing a guitarist will do is
turn up the volume :-) and then you have to somehow "top it", of course
after a few bars it might get lost again, but then you are back to point
one, that we remember the fullness of the sound.

    Another option, is to feature the sound somewhere in the song...arrange
it so that you start a pad, that essentially will not be heard much, while
the rest of the band is going strong, but have them stop....suddenly the pad
sound is uncovered, that can be startling.

    Still another is...and I have never done this, but only learned more
about mixing since I began recording alone in my home studio, work with the
other guys. Spend a whole day, or more, going over mixing theory and
tone/volume (remember volume changes tone, and tone changes volume) and
frequencies. Try to find out if you can get the guitar to notch, or set up
the amp so that there is space for the synth. Same with the bass guitar, get
a frequency range and try and find out what the others have to do on their
instruments and amps to leave that freq out. It can be really surpising
sometimes, to find that on my guitar I can cut actually quite a lot of
frequencies with no discernable change in tone on the guitar, but that
suddenly lets some other instrument come through much better. It takes
patience, and some planning. But it will make the whole band sound better to
all listeners.

    If you have a sound man, even better...then he alone can give you the
space you need I think.

Just some ideas!

Jim

=============================================================
Please check out my original music at my site http://home.online.no/~jacker
Or at http://www.soundclick.com/bands/jacker_music.htm
                              -James R. Acker-
----- Original Message -----

From: "spaceanimals" <alciere@...>
To: <AN1x-list@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, October 18, 2002 11:07 PM
Subject: [AN1x] re: AN1X volume


> Jim Acker brings up some good points. There's a reason the old Mini
> Moog leads get used so often. When you've got a couple of guitars, a
> bass, and a drum set it's hard to cut through the mix.
>
> My guess is the percussive sounds will cut through, and the
> sustaining pad like sounds will be lost completely.
>
> Rainbow Jimmy
> http://www.spaceanimals.com
> http://www.mp3.com/spaceanimals
>
>
>
> Community email addresses:
>   Post message: AN1x-list@yahoogroups.com
>   Subscribe:    AN1x-list-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
>   Unsubscribe:  AN1x-list-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>   List owner:   AN1x-list-owner@yahoogroups.com
>
> Shortcut URL to this page:
>    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AN1x-list
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>