Synth-DIY Yahoo! Groups Archives

Thread

Polysix service checklist for the amateur ;)

2012-06-05 by analoglove

I'm planning on doing some basic maintenance on my old Polysix. I've been reading threads and manuals found here on this group, excellent tips, thanks!

I thought I'd like to make a 'basics' checklist, not about solving specific problems but just best practice for the owner who wants to take care of the synth, and keep it sounding fresh and strong.

1) Electrolytic capacitors: My synth is sounding quite dusty and a bit dull at this point, so I'll put in new electrolytic capacitors, a reasonable thing to do after 30 years. I'm going with mainly Vishay 517Ds available at Mouser.

2) I'm putting in all new 4000-series ICs, as recommended here (Old Crow): http://www.oldcrows.net/~oldcrow/synth/tips.txt
I'm getting TI's series with the CD4xxxBE or CD4xxxBEE4 part numbers. 

Is there anything else that you would do without hesitation? I mean, I know that there may be some tuning work involved also, but I'm thinking about whether there's more hardware that should be replaced?

Would you take the time to swap all the old resistors, or at least those made of carbon?
Would you bother to swap the mylar and ceramic caps, or are you thinking that they will keep on trucking for years to come?

Hope to hear your inputs before I start operating, and I'm hoping not to fix what really, really doesn't need fixing ;)

Thanks,
Analoglove

Re: Polysix service checklist for the amateur ;)

2012-06-05 by analoglove

I hasten to add that changing the battery if the old one is still there, is of course priority nr. 1 on the checklist!

;)

Re: [PolySix] Polysix service checklist for the amateur ;)

2012-06-05 by Peter Mörck

Hi,

You didn't mention the obvious point that should come _before_anything_else_ :
 - Replace the old crappy NiCd battery with a Li cell and do the charging mod.
It _will_ go bad, sooner or later.

But, since you mentioned reading threads and oldcrows site, I guess you already know about it.
In any case, if it's the original battery, get it out, even if it looks good.

I replaced the panel switches on my P6. They're regular PCB buttons you can buy new and cheap today (the actual switches that sit underneath the buttons). Mine needed replacing as some didn't respond easily.
Other than that I guess it might need some tuning/calibration after replacing components.
Though if it sounds good, don't touch the calibration. No point in it, and it can potentially screw things up :)

If your keyboard is working fine (triggers OK), then don't touch that either.
You can also get dust and stuff in there that may make things work worse than before.

But in general (battery and some caps excluded), I'd say: If it ain't broken... 

Also, I see you added the battery now, just before I was going to press send, but I'll leave my comment, as it can never be repeated enough :)

BR,
Peter

Show quoted textHide quoted text

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: analoglove 
  To: PolySix@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Tuesday, June 05, 2012 10:40 PM
  Subject: [PolySix] Polysix service checklist for the amateur ;)

  I'm planning on doing some basic maintenance on my old Polysix. I've been reading threads and manuals found here on this group, excellent tips, thanks!

  I thought I'd like to make a 'basics' checklist, not about solving specific problems but just best practice for the owner who wants to take care of the synth, and keep it sounding fresh and strong.

  1) Electrolytic capacitors: My synth is sounding quite dusty and a bit dull at this point, so I'll put in new electrolytic capacitors, a reasonable thing to do after 30 years. I'm going with mainly Vishay 517Ds available at Mouser.

  2) I'm putting in all new 4000-series ICs, as recommended here (Old Crow): http://www.oldcrows.net/~oldcrow/synth/tips.txt
  I'm getting TI's series with the CD4xxxBE or CD4xxxBEE4 part numbers. 

  Is there anything else that you would do without hesitation? I mean, I know that there may be some tuning work involved also, but I'm thinking about whether there's more hardware that should be replaced?

  Would you take the time to swap all the old resistors, or at least those made of carbon?
  Would you bother to swap the mylar and ceramic caps, or are you thinking that they will keep on trucking for years to come?

  Hope to hear your inputs before I start operating, and I'm hoping not to fix what really, really doesn't need fixing ;)

  Thanks,
  Analoglove

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

RE: [PolySix] Polysix service checklist for the amateur ;)

2012-06-05 by backshall1

It sounds like you are already well on your way to "what really, really
doesn't need fixing". Spend some money on test equipment like an old
oscilloscope and a capacitance meter first.

 

Don Backshall

 

  _____

Show quoted textHide quoted text

From: PolySix@yahoogroups.com [mailto:PolySix@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
analoglove
Sent: Tuesday, June 05, 2012 4:40 PM
To: PolySix@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PolySix] Polysix service checklist for the amateur ;)

I'm planning on doing some basic maintenance on my old Polysix. I've been
reading threads and manuals found here on this group, excellent tips,
thanks!

I thought I'd like to make a 'basics' checklist, not about solving specific
problems but just best practice for the owner who wants to take care of the
synth, and keep it sounding fresh and strong.

1) Electrolytic capacitors: My synth is sounding quite dusty and a bit dull
at this point, so I'll put in new electrolytic capacitors, a reasonable
thing to do after 30 years. I'm going with mainly Vishay 517Ds available at
Mouser.

2) I'm putting in all new 4000-series ICs, as recommended here (Old Crow):
http://www.oldcrows.net/~oldcrow/synth/tips.txt
I'm getting TI's series with the CD4xxxBE or CD4xxxBEE4 part numbers. 

Is there anything else that you would do without hesitation? I mean, I know
that there may be some tuning work involved also, but I'm thinking about
whether there's more hardware that should be replaced?

Would you take the time to swap all the old resistors, or at least those
made of carbon?
Would you bother to swap the mylar and ceramic caps, or are you thinking
that they will keep on trucking for years to come?

Hope to hear your inputs before I start operating, and I'm hoping not to fix
what really, really doesn't need fixing ;)

Thanks,
Analoglove

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: Polysix service checklist for the amateur ;)

2012-06-05 by syntegrator

Peter, do you have a DigiKey, Farnell or Mouser part number for the Polysix tact switches? I believe the originals are ALPS, but the details elude me right now.

I am overhauling 3 Polysixes right now on my YouTube channel, so this information would be most helpful... ;-)

Syntegrator

--- In PolySix@yahoogroups.com, Peter Mörck <peterm@...> wrote:

Show quoted textHide quoted text

>
> Hi,
> 
> You didn't mention the obvious point that should come _before_anything_else_ :
>  - Replace the old crappy NiCd battery with a Li cell and do the charging mod.
> It _will_ go bad, sooner or later.
> 
> But, since you mentioned reading threads and oldcrows site, I guess you already know about it.
> In any case, if it's the original battery, get it out, even if it looks good.
> 
> I replaced the panel switches on my P6. They're regular PCB buttons you can buy new and cheap today (the actual switches that sit underneath the buttons). Mine needed replacing as some didn't respond easily.
> Other than that I guess it might need some tuning/calibration after replacing components.
> Though if it sounds good, don't touch the calibration. No point in it, and it can potentially screw things up :)
> 
> If your keyboard is working fine (triggers OK), then don't touch that either.
> You can also get dust and stuff in there that may make things work worse than before.
> 
> But in general (battery and some caps excluded), I'd say: If it ain't broken... 
> 
> Also, I see you added the battery now, just before I was going to press send, but I'll leave my comment, as it can never be repeated enough :)
> 
> BR,
> Peter
> 
>   ----- Original Message ----- 
>   From: analoglove 
>   To: PolySix@yahoogroups.com 
>   Sent: Tuesday, June 05, 2012 10:40 PM
>   Subject: [PolySix] Polysix service checklist for the amateur ;)
> 
> 
>     
>   I'm planning on doing some basic maintenance on my old Polysix. I've been reading threads and manuals found here on this group, excellent tips, thanks!
> 
>   I thought I'd like to make a 'basics' checklist, not about solving specific problems but just best practice for the owner who wants to take care of the synth, and keep it sounding fresh and strong.
> 
>   1) Electrolytic capacitors: My synth is sounding quite dusty and a bit dull at this point, so I'll put in new electrolytic capacitors, a reasonable thing to do after 30 years. I'm going with mainly Vishay 517Ds available at Mouser.
> 
>   2) I'm putting in all new 4000-series ICs, as recommended here (Old Crow): http://www.oldcrows.net/~oldcrow/synth/tips.txt
>   I'm getting TI's series with the CD4xxxBE or CD4xxxBEE4 part numbers. 
> 
>   Is there anything else that you would do without hesitation? I mean, I know that there may be some tuning work involved also, but I'm thinking about whether there's more hardware that should be replaced?
> 
>   Would you take the time to swap all the old resistors, or at least those made of carbon?
>   Would you bother to swap the mylar and ceramic caps, or are you thinking that they will keep on trucking for years to come?
> 
>   Hope to hear your inputs before I start operating, and I'm hoping not to fix what really, really doesn't need fixing ;)
> 
>   Thanks,
>   Analoglove
> 
> 
> 
>   
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Re: [PolySix] Re: Polysix service checklist for the amateur ;)

2012-06-06 by Peter Mörck

Hi,

Sorry, no.
I was thinking of finding them, but lazyness won again :)
I just ordered a set from vintageplanet.nl
Since I just did 1 P6 I didn't really care if I didn't get the lowest price. Convenience can cost a bit as well ;)
If you're doing 3 it may be better for you to buy from regular suppliers, like the ones you mentioned.
Just remove a switch and you will see what they look like and you can make measurements.
There's a photo of them on vintageplanet.nl as well I think.
I'm think they're 12x12mm and that's pretty standard. Just make sure they're flat :)
The Matrix-6 for instance, uses 12x12 mm switches, but they have a little mounting thing on top to allow mounting a button top on it.

BR,
Peter

Show quoted textHide quoted text

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: syntegrator 
  To: PolySix@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Wednesday, June 06, 2012 12:32 AM
  Subject: [PolySix] Re: Polysix service checklist for the amateur ;)


    


  Peter, do you have a DigiKey, Farnell or Mouser part number for the Polysix tact switches? I believe the originals are ALPS, but the details elude me right now.

  I am overhauling 3 Polysixes right now on my YouTube channel, so this information would be most helpful... ;-)

  Syntegrator

  --- In PolySix@yahoogroups.com, Peter Mörck <peterm@...> wrote:
  >
  > Hi,
  > 
  > You didn't mention the obvious point that should come _before_anything_else_ :
  > - Replace the old crappy NiCd battery with a Li cell and do the charging mod.
  > It _will_ go bad, sooner or later.
  > 
  > But, since you mentioned reading threads and oldcrows site, I guess you already know about it.
  > In any case, if it's the original battery, get it out, even if it looks good.
  > 
  > I replaced the panel switches on my P6. They're regular PCB buttons you can buy new and cheap today (the actual switches that sit underneath the buttons). Mine needed replacing as some didn't respond easily.
  > Other than that I guess it might need some tuning/calibration after replacing components.
  > Though if it sounds good, don't touch the calibration. No point in it, and it can potentially screw things up :)
  > 
  > If your keyboard is working fine (triggers OK), then don't touch that either.
  > You can also get dust and stuff in there that may make things work worse than before.
  > 
  > But in general (battery and some caps excluded), I'd say: If it ain't broken... 
  > 
  > Also, I see you added the battery now, just before I was going to press send, but I'll leave my comment, as it can never be repeated enough :)
  > 
  > BR,
  > Peter
  > 
  > ----- Original Message ----- 
  > From: analoglove 
  > To: PolySix@yahoogroups.com 
  > Sent: Tuesday, June 05, 2012 10:40 PM
  > Subject: [PolySix] Polysix service checklist for the amateur ;)
  > 
  > 
  > 
  > I'm planning on doing some basic maintenance on my old Polysix. I've been reading threads and manuals found here on this group, excellent tips, thanks!
  > 
  > I thought I'd like to make a 'basics' checklist, not about solving specific problems but just best practice for the owner who wants to take care of the synth, and keep it sounding fresh and strong.
  > 
  > 1) Electrolytic capacitors: My synth is sounding quite dusty and a bit dull at this point, so I'll put in new electrolytic capacitors, a reasonable thing to do after 30 years. I'm going with mainly Vishay 517Ds available at Mouser.
  > 
  > 2) I'm putting in all new 4000-series ICs, as recommended here (Old Crow): http://www.oldcrows.net/~oldcrow/synth/tips.txt
  > I'm getting TI's series with the CD4xxxBE or CD4xxxBEE4 part numbers. 
  > 
  > Is there anything else that you would do without hesitation? I mean, I know that there may be some tuning work involved also, but I'm thinking about whether there's more hardware that should be replaced?
  > 
  > Would you take the time to swap all the old resistors, or at least those made of carbon?
  > Would you bother to swap the mylar and ceramic caps, or are you thinking that they will keep on trucking for years to come?
  > 
  > Hope to hear your inputs before I start operating, and I'm hoping not to fix what really, really doesn't need fixing ;)
  > 
  > Thanks,
  > Analoglove
  > 
  > 
  > 
  > 
  > 
  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
  >



  

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

RE: [PolySix] Polysix service checklist for the amateur ;)

2012-06-08 by backshall1

I haven't seen any more posts on this thread since I mentioned getting some
test equipment. I didn't mean to spoil your fun. It just sounded like you
were getting to the point where it would be cheaper and less time consuming
to start with a brand new bare board from Jed or Scott and start putting new
parts on it than to try and remove all those old parts from the existing
KLM-367 board.

This isn't like an automobile where basic maintenance is needed to prevent
catastrophic failure of some other parts, like changing the oil to prevent
engine damage. The only part of the Polysix where that might apply would be
the large electrolytic caps in the power supply. I've never needed to
replace any of the smaller electrolytics. Some other synth sites like to
propagate "the great Mylar scare", since old Mylar caps have been shown to
cause problems on some other synths. I haven't seen this problem in any
Polysix that has passed through my hands, but maybe somebody else on the
board has.

As Scott says on his Old Crow site, and I think Andy has mentioned it as
well, some old 4000 series chips seem to have a definite life span. I have
replaced some chips on various Polysixs over the years. Interestingly
enough, they were all 14051 chips that had either failed completely or had
gotten slow and sloppy. Maybe Korg just got a bad batch. I've never heard of
problems with the ceramic caps or resistors, unless they were damaged by a
battery leak.

In any case, it's your machine so have fun with it. If you like a hot
soldering iron in your hand, then go for it, but any improvement in sound
might be just wishful thinking if you are operating blindly without the
right tools to see what really needs to be fixed.

 

Don Backshall

 

  _____

Show quoted textHide quoted text

From: PolySix@yahoogroups.com [mailto:PolySix@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
backshall1
Sent: Tuesday, June 05, 2012 5:32 PM
To: PolySix@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [PolySix] Polysix service checklist for the amateur ;)

It sounds like you are already well on your way to "what really, really
doesn't need fixing". Spend some money on test equipment like an old
oscilloscope and a capacitance meter first.

Don Backshall

_____ 

From: PolySix@yahoogroups.com <mailto:PolySix%40yahoogroups.com>
[mailto:PolySix@yahoogroups.com <mailto:PolySix%40yahoogroups.com> ] On
Behalf Of
analoglove
Sent: Tuesday, June 05, 2012 4:40 PM
To: PolySix@yahoogroups.com <mailto:PolySix%40yahoogroups.com> 
Subject: [PolySix] Polysix service checklist for the amateur ;)

I'm planning on doing some basic maintenance on my old Polysix. I've been
reading threads and manuals found here on this group, excellent tips,
thanks!

I thought I'd like to make a 'basics' checklist, not about solving specific
problems but just best practice for the owner who wants to take care of the
synth, and keep it sounding fresh and strong.

1) Electrolytic capacitors: My synth is sounding quite dusty and a bit dull
at this point, so I'll put in new electrolytic capacitors, a reasonable
thing to do after 30 years. I'm going with mainly Vishay 517Ds available at
Mouser.

2) I'm putting in all new 4000-series ICs, as recommended here (Old Crow):
http://www.oldcrows.net/~oldcrow/synth/tips.txt
I'm getting TI's series with the CD4xxxBE or CD4xxxBEE4 part numbers. 

Is there anything else that you would do without hesitation? I mean, I know
that there may be some tuning work involved also, but I'm thinking about
whether there's more hardware that should be replaced?

Would you take the time to swap all the old resistors, or at least those
made of carbon?
Would you bother to swap the mylar and ceramic caps, or are you thinking
that they will keep on trucking for years to come?

Hope to hear your inputs before I start operating, and I'm hoping not to fix
what really, really doesn't need fixing ;)

Thanks,
Analoglove

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]