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Thread

Giving Up

Giving Up

2006-01-07 by imperial_tee

So I guess the quest is over for a patch editor.. I can't seem to find anything on the net and
to be honest no one really cares... Thats ok guys,, keep programming your ex-800's with
those rediculous buttons...yes that will exploit the true sound capabilities,,, Better yet use
the presets,,

:(

T

Re: Giving Up

2006-01-11 by synthmdl76

I took am looking for a way to save my patches on a pc so I dont have
to use the tape in/out.. But I dont know anything about programming pc's.

--- In korgpolyex@yahoogroups.com, "imperial_tee" <imperial_tee@y...>
wrote:
>
> So I guess the quest is over for a patch editor.. I can't seem to
find anything on the net and
> to be honest no one really cares... Thats ok guys,, keep programming
your ex-800's with
> those rediculous buttons...yes that will exploit the true sound
capabilities,,, Better yet use
> the presets,,
>
> :(
>
> T
>

Re: [korgpolyex] Re: Giving Up

2006-01-11 by Marcus Wilson

midiquest XL is meant to talk to the poly, anyone used it?

http://www.squest.com/Windows/Instruments.html

lists support for poly 800 poly 800 II and librarian support for
EX800 only

I have a copy for pc, however all my midi stuff is mac attached
(cubase and the akai s2000, poly 800's and so forth)

JB over


On 11/01/2006, at 5:24 PM, synthmdl76 wrote:

> I took am looking for a way to save my patches on a pc so I dont have
> to use the tape in/out.. But I dont know anything about programming
> pc's.
>
> --- In korgpolyex@yahoogroups.com, "imperial_tee" <imperial_tee@y...>
> wrote:
>
>>
>> So I guess the quest is over for a patch editor.. I can't seem to
>>
> find anything on the net and
>
>> to be honest no one really cares... Thats ok guys,, keep programming
>>
> your ex-800's with
>
>> those rediculous buttons...yes that will exploit the true sound
>>
> capabilities,,, Better yet use
>
>> the presets,,
>>
>> :(
>>
>> T
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Re: [korgpolyex] Re: Giving Up

2006-01-17 by Garth

I'm actually considering writing a patch editor for
college credit. But I am a beginner programmer and am
starting from scratch so it will be a while.

Anyone know where to start with what I'll need to
learn? Like I mean I'm starting from SCRATCH.

Garth

--- synthmdl76 <synthmdl76@...> wrote:

> I took am looking for a way to save my patches on a
> pc so I dont have
> to use the tape in/out.. But I dont know anything
> about programming pc's.
>
> --- In korgpolyex@yahoogroups.com, "imperial_tee"
> <imperial_tee@y...>
> wrote:
> >
> > So I guess the quest is over for a patch editor..
> I can't seem to
> find anything on the net and
> > to be honest no one really cares... Thats ok
> guys,, keep programming
> your ex-800's with
> > those rediculous buttons...yes that will exploit
> the true sound
> capabilities,,, Better yet use
> > the presets,,
> >
> > :(
> >
> > T
> >
>
>
>
>
>


__________________________________________________
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Re: [korgpolyex] Re: Giving Up

2006-01-17 by Tim Bieniosek

What language are they teaching you? Java seems like a logical choice.
You'll need to find a MIDI library and a GUI library to use.

On Tue, 17 Jan 2006, Garth wrote:

> I'm actually considering writing a patch editor for
> college credit. But I am a beginner programmer and am
> starting from scratch so it will be a while.
>
> Anyone know where to start with what I'll need to
> learn? Like I mean I'm starting from SCRATCH.
>
> Garth
>
> --- synthmdl76 <synthmdl76@...> wrote:
>
> > I took am looking for a way to save my patches on a
> > pc so I dont have
> > to use the tape in/out.. But I dont know anything
> > about programming pc's.
> >
> > --- In korgpolyex@yahoogroups.com, "imperial_tee"
> > <imperial_tee@y...>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > So I guess the quest is over for a patch editor..
> > I can't seem to
> > find anything on the net and
> > > to be honest no one really cares... Thats ok
> > guys,, keep programming
> > your ex-800's with
> > > those rediculous buttons...yes that will exploit
> > the true sound
> > capabilities,,, Better yet use
> > > the presets,,
> > >
> > > :(
> > >
> > > T
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Re: [korgpolyex] Re: Giving Up

2006-01-18 by Mark Wynkoop

A patch editor will be an unpleasant introduction to
coding. C++ and Java and other so-called "AC97"
languages use a coding style that is difficult for
English speakers to begin with, unlike older English
syntax languages like Basic and Pascal.

Surely your college offers an introduction to Visual
Basic, or better yet, Borland Delphi (which is really
Object-Oriented Pascal, a good building block when you
move on to C++). There are already robust midi
routines and Windows API's available for both
languages.

You will have to write a midi syxex receive, and then
convert hex dump into some sort of data structure,
(parsing it into discreet patches, as the Poly only
works in banks, not individual patches)then perform
your "voice edits" on the data structure, convert it
back into poly 800 sysex bank dump format, and
transmit sysex back to the synth.

It would be much easier to develop a simple Poly
800-specific dump utility, to send and receive patch
banks with no editing capability. Then build on this
framework to create an editor/librarian after you
decide if you enjoy the process or not.


--- Garth <gplinko@...> wrote:

> I'm actually considering writing a patch editor for
> college credit. But I am a beginner programmer and
> am
> starting from scratch so it will be a while.
>
> Anyone know where to start with what I'll need to
> learn? Like I mean I'm starting from SCRATCH.
>
> Garth
>
> --- synthmdl76 <synthmdl76@...> wrote:
>
> > I took am looking for a way to save my patches on
> a
> > pc so I dont have
> > to use the tape in/out.. But I dont know anything
> > about programming pc's.
> >
> > --- In korgpolyex@yahoogroups.com, "imperial_tee"
> > <imperial_tee@y...>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > So I guess the quest is over for a patch
> editor..
> > I can't seem to
> > find anything on the net and
> > > to be honest no one really cares... Thats ok
> > guys,, keep programming
> > your ex-800's with
> > > those rediculous buttons...yes that will exploit
> > the true sound
> > capabilities,,, Better yet use
> > > the presets,,
> > >
> > > :(
> > >
> > > T
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam
> protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>


__________________________________________________
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Re: Giving Up

2006-01-21 by imperial_tee

Garth,

I think you are taking up a good cause. If it helps any, Pheobe October posted up a link to
a java based editor program with source code that might be of help to you.

http://www.jsynthlib.org/

best regards,


T



--- In korgpolyex@yahoogroups.com, Garth <gplinko@y...> wrote:
>
> I'm actually considering writing a patch editor for
> college credit. But I am a beginner programmer and am
> starting from scratch so it will be a while.
>
> Anyone know where to start with what I'll need to
> learn? Like I mean I'm starting from SCRATCH.
>
> Garth
>
> --- synthmdl76 <synthmdl76@y...> wrote:
>
> > I took am looking for a way to save my patches on a
> > pc so I dont have
> > to use the tape in/out.. But I dont know anything
> > about programming pc's.
> >
> > --- In korgpolyex@yahoogroups.com, "imperial_tee"
> > <imperial_tee@y...>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > So I guess the quest is over for a patch editor..
> > I can't seem to
> > find anything on the net and
> > > to be honest no one really cares... Thats ok
> > guys,, keep programming
> > your ex-800's with
> > > those rediculous buttons...yes that will exploit
> > the true sound
> > capabilities,,, Better yet use
> > > the presets,,
> > >
> > > :(
> > >
> > > T
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>

Re: [korgpolyex] Re: Giving Up

2006-01-21 by Garth

Well, I've had 2 semesters of C++ already - I had
assumed that Java would be the best choice (which I
haven't learned yet but have heard that it's a pretty
easy transition). I will look into Borland Delphi
though for sure.

I feel like I may have bitten off more than I can chew
by even thinking this might be a good idea. I mean I
don't even know jack XXXX other than hooking my Radium
into the EX and using a MIDI librarian program to
reload the factory presets.

Where do I even start with something like this?

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Re: [korgpolyex] Re: Giving Up

2006-01-21 by Garth

Thanks, I don't know if I'll be able to pull this off,
but I'm going to investigate into it as much as
possible.

Anyone with any suggestions for starting points would
be appreiated. My knowledge is limited to:
- 2 semesters of C++ programming
- I successfully figured out how to use midi librarian
with my mac to restore the factory presets on my EX
800.

That's it.




--- imperial_tee <imperial_tee@...> wrote:

> Garth,
>
> I think you are taking up a good cause. If it helps
> any, Pheobe October posted up a link to
> a java based editor program with source code that
> might be of help to you.
>
> http://www.jsynthlib.org/
>
> best regards,
>
>
> T
>
>
>
> --- In korgpolyex@yahoogroups.com, Garth
> <gplinko@y...> wrote:
> >
> > I'm actually considering writing a patch editor
> for
> > college credit. But I am a beginner programmer
> and am
> > starting from scratch so it will be a while.
> >
> > Anyone know where to start with what I'll need to
> > learn? Like I mean I'm starting from SCRATCH.
> >
> > Garth
> >
> > --- synthmdl76 <synthmdl76@y...> wrote:
> >
> > > I took am looking for a way to save my patches
> on a
> > > pc so I dont have
> > > to use the tape in/out.. But I dont know
> anything
> > > about programming pc's.
> > >
> > > --- In korgpolyex@yahoogroups.com,
> "imperial_tee"
> > > <imperial_tee@y...>
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > So I guess the quest is over for a patch
> editor..
> > > I can't seem to
> > > find anything on the net and
> > > > to be honest no one really cares... Thats ok
> > > guys,, keep programming
> > > your ex-800's with
> > > > those rediculous buttons...yes that will
> exploit
> > > the true sound
> > > capabilities,,, Better yet use
> > > > the presets,,
> > > >
> > > > :(
> > > >
> > > > T
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> > Do You Yahoo!?
> > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam
> protection around
> > http://mail.yahoo.com
> >
>
>
>
>
>


__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

Re: Giving Up

2006-01-22 by Phoebe October

--- In korgpolyex@yahoogroups.com, Garth <gplinko@y...> wrote:
>
> Thanks, I don't know if I'll be able to pull this off,
> but I'm going to investigate into it as much as
> possible.

I'm sure it can be done with java...the x0xb0x (diy tb-303)
editor/librarian is written in java, I don't see why something similar
couldn't be done for the poly800.

But then again, I know nothing about programming, so you may want to
take this with a grain of salt ;-)

btw, you can check out the x0xb0x project here:

http://www.ladyada.net/make/x0xb0x/index.html

Re: [korgpolyex] Giving Up

2006-02-13 by Bill Thompson

I don't have the time right now to write an editor/librarian, it is a
remarkably large undertaking!

For anyone who wants to purchase an appliance, MIDIQuest9 does support
the EX-800, and therefore I would assume it will also handle the
Poly-800MKii, and modified Poly-800s.

For anyone who wants to tackle programming, here are a handful of pretty
useful links:

http://www.maxmidi.com/index.html - the bible when I was learning to
write code for MIDI

http://www.codeguru.com/vb/gen/vb_multimedia/article.php/c1097/ - can't
make heads nor tails of this, but it is certainly worth looking at I guess.

http://www.borg.com/~jglatt/ - the site that got me hooked!

http://nosuchmedia.com/mostly-midi/archive/index.html - an amazing
archive of old code!!!!

http://home.modemss.brisnet.org.au/~mlevoi/midi.html - a more recent
site with lots of good info

http://www.midi.org/ - the horses mouth...

There also used to be a Nutshell book that had a lot of info on both
MIDI and digital audio programming, but their site frustrates me more
often than not, and tonight I gave up rather quickly!

And a couple of thoughts for the poster who was thinking about tackling
this with a couple of years of C++ under their belt: go for it. It is
NOT rocket science, though some things we did with previous operating
environments have become more obfuscated recently. In a nutshell, your
program needs to be able to do the following:
1) get a sysex dump from the target machine
2) send a sysex dump to the target machine
3) convert a sysex dump into some kind of human readable format, and
since you are the programmer, you define what is human readable... some
people think hex is human readable<G>!
4) apply user changes to the data and convert it back to the sysex format.

Really, that's all there is to it and you could do it in Java (C without
pointers), Perl, VB, and probably half a dozen other languages! C++
might be a good choice since there are already libraries to handle the
MIDI I/O, file I/O, and a lot of the UI widgets you'll need/want for
almost any operating environment!

There is a ton of open source code for MIDI data processing in the Linux
community, so that's another place to look for ideas.

A sysex file, by the way, is pretty darned simple. It consists of a
preamble that includes the header as required for MIDI communications
and possibly some proprietary information, and then some number of
blocks of data, where each block of data represents a discrete patch.
Within that block of data are the parameter values, for example the
first byte might describe the first oscillator pitch. Some of the older
synths packed data, so that the first byte might include pitch and
waveform for the first oscillator. You get the idea.

OK, a very poorly organized reply, but it's late, and half of me is
watching the Olympics - the downside of laptops!!!

Let me know if more info is needed!

--
Take care,

Bill Thompson
Audio Enterprise
KB3KJF

Re: Giving Up

2007-01-02 by adam

I'm about to give up too.

I've found one that is an open source project that must have worked at
one time. The author of the software had released it as though it
functioned. However, when i run the program it doesnt work. The
trouble is, it was written in old C. so, not even C++ (where I have
at least SOME exposure). Debugging it is sure to be a nightmare.

I may try to alter it in such a way that it runs without errors, but
there's no promising that it will work with any poly800, mk1, mk2 or
the EX version.

if anyone wants the code, i'd be happy to send it to them.

-adam, new member and owner of two poly800s (one mk1, and one mk2)



--- In korgpolyex@yahoogroups.com, "imperial_tee" <imperial_tee@...>
wrote:
>
> So I guess the quest is over for a patch editor.. I can't seem to
find anything on the net and
> to be honest no one really cares... Thats ok guys,, keep programming
your ex-800's with
> those rediculous buttons...yes that will exploit the true sound
capabilities,,, Better yet use
> the presets,,
>
> :(
>
> T
>

Re: Giving Up

2007-01-02 by adam

Honestly, if someone could write something to simply dump the patches
we have now, that would be something. we could exchange banks via the
web by simply sending the files to one another. So much better than
punching in each parameter, one button at a time and hoping that the
internal battery has a few more months of life in it!

-adam

--- In korgpolyex@yahoogroups.com, Mark Wynkoop <markwynkoop@...> wrote:
>
> It would be much easier to develop a simple Poly
> 800-specific dump utility, to send and receive patch
> banks with no editing capability. Then build on this
> framework to create an editor/librarian after you
> decide if you enjoy the process or not.
>
>
> --- Garth <gplinko@...> wrote:
>
> > I'm actually considering writing a patch editor for
> > college credit. But I am a beginner programmer and
> > am
> > starting from scratch so it will be a while.
> >
> > Anyone know where to start with what I'll need to
> > learn? Like I mean I'm starting from SCRATCH.
> >
> > Garth
> >
> > --- synthmdl76 <synthmdl76@...> wrote:
> >
> > > I took am looking for a way to save my patches on
> > a
> > > pc so I dont have
> > > to use the tape in/out.. But I dont know anything
> > > about programming pc's.
> > >
> > > --- In korgpolyex@yahoogroups.com, "imperial_tee"
> > > <imperial_tee@y...>
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > So I guess the quest is over for a patch
> > editor..
> > > I can't seem to
> > > find anything on the net and
> > > > to be honest no one really cares... Thats ok
> > > guys,, keep programming
> > > your ex-800's with
> > > > those rediculous buttons...yes that will exploit
> > > the true sound
> > > capabilities,,, Better yet use
> > > > the presets,,
> > > >
> > > > :(
> > > >
> > > > T
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> > Do You Yahoo!?
> > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam
> > protection around
> > http://mail.yahoo.com
> >
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>

Re: [korgpolyex] Re: Giving Up

2007-01-02 by Michael Hawkins

Adam and all,

As someone else on this forum had recommended using MIDI-OX (http://www.midiox.com/), I went ahead and downloaded it. It's great for the EX800 and Poly 800 MK2.

Using MIDI-OX you can send the Korg Poly 800 MKII and EX800 SYSEX dump command (F0 42 21 01 20 F7) and this will make your Poly 800 MKII and your EX800 send you a full sysex dump.

However, there are no SYSEX functions in the Poly 800 MK1 so apart from using the tape functions (which is 1980's vintage technology) there is simply no way you can exchange patches from a MK1 Poly 800. You can do a mod that takes a copy of the EX800 ROM and tacks it on top of the existing ROM. That mod let's you switch from one ROM to the other. But that is not as elegant as I would like.

That is just one of the reasons that I am writing a new ROM that will allow us to run our patch editor and run our own sysex. We'll lose the tape functions but that's no big deal if we have a strong patch editor.

For patch editing, I am looking at http://www.jsynthlib.org/ since I am a fan of open source software.

So the only trick is going to be working out the exact parameter settings.

Also, while reworking the sysex functions in the EX800, I've discovered that Korg did not use a very good technique to handle the incoming sysex messages. I think that the processor is too busy handling sound generation to be able to keep up with a full sysex dump and run the sequencer and run the enevelopes etc. So what they did was to simple putting everything else on hold while the sysex download occurs. This makes sense when you do a entire patch dump but is a little annoying for a small sysex message. So when I send my new small sysex messages I get these annoying glitches in the sounds. A better way to do sysex would have been to simply buffer the entire sysex message in memory until the end of sysex message was received. Then the processor would slowly process the entire message with any spare time it might have. This would slow down the sysex message action but would not interfere with the sound generation of the instrument. But I understand Korg's reason for doing sysex the way they did because the Poly 800 only has 2K or RAM.

So as soon as I build the RAM expansion board I will be able to consider rewriting the entire sysex handling functions to operate in a buffered manner.

But one thing is for sure, for those of you patient enough to wait, there are going to be some great new functions and features available for the Poly 800.

Mike.


adam <spoolboyy@...> wrote:
Honestly, if someone could write something to simply dump the patches
we have now, that would be something. we could exchange banks via the
web by simply sending the files to one another. So much better than
punching in each parameter, one button at a time and hoping that the
internal battery has a few more months of life in it!

-adam

--- In korgpolyex@yahoogro ups.com, Mark Wynkoop <markwynkoop@ ...> wrote:
>
> It would be much easier to develop a simple Poly
> 800-specific dump utility, to send and receive patch
> banks with no editing capability. Then build on this
> framework to create an editor/librarian after you
> decide if you enjoy the process or not.
>
>
> --- Garth <gplinko@... > wrote:
>
> > I'm actually considering writing a patch editor for
> > college credit. But I am a beginner programmer and
> > am
> > starting from scratch so it will be a while.
> >
> > Anyone know where to start with what I'll need to
> > learn? Like I mean I'm starting from SCRATCH.
> >
> > Garth
> >
> > --- synthmdl76 <synthmdl76@ ...> wrote:
> >
> > > I took am looking for a way to save my patches on
> > a
> > > pc so I dont have
> > > to use the tape in/out.. But I dont know anything
> > > about programming pc's.
> > >
> > > --- In korgpolyex@yahoogro ups.com, "imperial_tee"
> > > <imperial_tee@ y...>
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > So I guess the quest is over for a patch
> > editor..
> > > I can't seem to
> > > find anything on the net and
> > > > to be honest no one really cares... Thats ok
> > > guys,, keep programming
> > > your ex-800's with
> > > > those rediculous buttons...yes that will exploit
> > > the true sound
> > > capabilities, ,, Better yet use
> > > > the presets,,
> > > >
> > > > :(
> > > >
> > > > T
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ __
> > Do You Yahoo!?
> > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam
> > protection around
> > http://mail. yahoo.com
> >
>
>
> ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ __
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail. yahoo.com
>


__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

Re: [korgpolyex] Re: Giving Up

2007-01-02 by Tim Bieniosek

Send it over, I'd be happy to take a look.

(Almost) every C program is a valid C++ program.

On Tue, 2 Jan 2007, adam wrote:

> I'm about to give up too.
>
> I've found one that is an open source project that must have worked at
> one time. The author of the software had released it as though it
> functioned. However, when i run the program it doesnt work. The
> trouble is, it was written in old C. so, not even C++ (where I have
> at least SOME exposure). Debugging it is sure to be a nightmare.
>
> I may try to alter it in such a way that it runs without errors, but
> there's no promising that it will work with any poly800, mk1, mk2 or
> the EX version.
>
> if anyone wants the code, i'd be happy to send it to them.
>
> -adam, new member and owner of two poly800s (one mk1, and one mk2)
>
>
>
> --- In korgpolyex@yahoogroups.com, "imperial_tee" <imperial_tee@...>
> wrote:
> >
> > So I guess the quest is over for a patch editor.. I can't seem to
> find anything on the net and
> > to be honest no one really cares... Thats ok guys,, keep programming
> your ex-800's with
> > those rediculous buttons...yes that will exploit the true sound
> capabilities,,, Better yet use
> > the presets,,
> >
> > :(
> >
> > T
> >
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>