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Some CGS75 (VCS) clarifications

Some CGS75 (VCS) clarifications

2009-10-17 by Guy

Started doing the panel for the VCS, and wanted to be sure about some things. Sorry if this has been asked before.


- The output signals - is this correct :

http://www.guyd2.com/stuff/VCS_signals.gif

(not sure about the bias of AC Out)


- Are the Rise/Fall CV input pots wired for both negative & positive CV amount ?

- As far as I understand, the Exp. CV In (1V/Oct) does not affect the rate of Rise/Fall, but merely 'transposes' the signal ?

- The optional Processor section is simply a unity gain amp with either inverted or non-inverted output, right ? How can this be hard-wired to the VCS in- or outs for most effectiveness, ie. how can it be most useful when I don't bring it out to the frontpanel ?


thanks,
_g

Re: Some CGS75 (VCS) clarifications

2009-10-17 by Richard Brewster

I haven't built a CGS 75 yet. I am waiting to see what the Bridechamber
MOTM format panel looks like first. And I'm waiting for the CGS-75 PCB
boards to become available from Ken Stone again. But I can give some
answers.

The AC output is ground-centered - it has zero bias.

The Rise/Fall CV pots are reversible attenuators, with the center
position being the minimal amount.

Exponential CV affects both rise and fall equally in an exponential
manner. If cycling, it works similar to a 1V/oct CV input on a VCO, but
not accurate to 1V/oct.

I designed a Front Panel Express panel for the CGS 75 Serge VCS. It's
available in this directory on Yahoo Groups:

<http://launch.groups.yahoo.com/group/ModularSynthPanels/files/Richard%20Brewster%20Designs/>

On my panel design I put input and output jacks for the Processor, so
that it can be patched in wherever you want it. I think the best option
for hard-wiring it would be in front of the Both CV input.


Richard Brewster
http://pugix.com


Guy wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> Started doing the panel for the VCS, and wanted to be sure about some things. Sorry if this has been asked before.
>
>
> - The output signals - is this correct :
>
> http://www.guyd2.com/stuff/VCS_signals.gif
>
> (not sure about the bias of AC Out)
>
>
> - Are the Rise/Fall CV input pots wired for both negative & positive CV amount ?
>
> - As far as I understand, the Exp. CV In (1V/Oct) does not affect the rate of Rise/Fall, but merely 'transposes' the signal ?
>
> - The optional Processor section is simply a unity gain amp with either inverted or non-inverted output, right ? How can this be hard-wired to the VCS in- or outs for most effectiveness, ie. how can it be most useful when I don't bring it out to the frontpanel ?
>
>
> thanks,
> _g
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> The CGS Modular Synth home page: http://www.cgs.synth.net/
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>

Re: Some CGS75 (VCS) clarifications

2009-10-18 by Guy

Hey Richard, thanks for replying !

The funny thing is, just 5 minutes before I checked in here, I saw Scott's VCS design over at the MSP group...
Show quoted textHide quoted text
--- In cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com, Richard Brewster <pugix@...> wrote:
>
> I haven't built a CGS 75 yet. I am waiting to see what the Bridechamber
> MOTM format panel looks like first. And I'm waiting for the CGS-75 PCB
> boards to become available from Ken Stone again. But I can give some
> answers.
>
> The AC output is ground-centered - it has zero bias.

So it will indeed go from 0V to -2.5V before it starts Rising, and from -2.5V to 0V at the end of Fall ? That'll give for a rather different sound/waveshape than the other outputs...

>
> The Rise/Fall CV pots are reversible attenuators, with the center
> position being the minimal amount.

As I thought, yes. Very cool.


> Exponential CV affects both rise and fall equally in an exponential
> manner. If cycling, it works similar to a 1V/oct CV input on a VCO, but
> not accurate to 1V/oct.

So, the Exp.CV In is in fact the same as the Both CV In (when responses are switched to exponential), but always "full on". Right ?

>
> I designed a Front Panel Express panel for the CGS 75 Serge VCS. It's
> available in this directory on Yahoo Groups:
> <http://launch.groups.yahoo.com/group/ModularSynthPanels/files/Richard%20Brewster%20Designs/
>
I'll fire up WIndows on my Mac, and have a look. Thanks !

> On my panel design I put input and output jacks for the Processor, so
> that it can be patched in wherever you want it. I think the best option
> for hard-wiring it would be in front of the Both CV input.

Okay, that makes sense. I think I'll include the Processor too - it's too useful to leave it out.


thanks again !
_g


>
>
> Richard Brewster
> http://pugix.com
>
>
> Guy wrote:
> > Started doing the panel for the VCS, and wanted to be sure about some things. Sorry if this has been asked before.
> >
> >
> > - The output signals - is this correct :
> >
> > http://www.guyd2.com/stuff/VCS_signals.gif
> >
> > (not sure about the bias of AC Out)
> >
> >
> > - Are the Rise/Fall CV input pots wired for both negative & positive CV amount ?
> >
> > - As far as I understand, the Exp. CV In (1V/Oct) does not affect the rate of Rise/Fall, but merely 'transposes' the signal ?
> >
> > - The optional Processor section is simply a unity gain amp with either inverted or non-inverted output, right ? How can this be hard-wired to the VCS in- or outs for most effectiveness, ie. how can it be most useful when I don't bring it out to the frontpanel ?
> >
> >
> > thanks,
> > _g
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > The CGS Modular Synth home page: http://www.cgs.synth.net/
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>

Re: Some CGS75 (VCS) clarifications

2009-10-18 by Richard Brewster

I've now seen Scott's panel design, and it's got all the features I put
on my panel. I'll be ordering panels from Scott, because I like his
designs and they are so much less expensive than Front Panel Express.

About the Exponential CV input, I couldn't say if it's the equivalent of
the Rise/Fall CV inputs in exponential mode. But yes, it's full on.
With Scott's panel, the processor output has a normalized connection
into the Both CV input. I would put a wire between both of the jacks'
switch lugs. That way, if the processor out jack has a plug in it, it
will be disconnected from the Both CV input. That's how I'd want it to
work, so that it could be patched to the Exponential CV input,
automatically disconnecting from the Both CV input, if you follow that.
Plugging into the Both CV input also disconnects it from the Processor
out with this normalizing scheme.

About the AC out, it's got a capacitor in series that limits the low
frequency response. Very slow changes won't pass through. It's
probably good down to a few Hz, before falling off. This output is best
used for audio frequencies.

Richard


Guy wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> Hey Richard, thanks for replying !
>
> The funny thing is, just 5 minutes before I checked in here, I saw Scott's VCS design over at the MSP group...
>
> --- In cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com, Richard Brewster <pugix@...> wrote:
>
>> I haven't built a CGS 75 yet. I am waiting to see what the Bridechamber
>> MOTM format panel looks like first. And I'm waiting for the CGS-75 PCB
>> boards to become available from Ken Stone again. But I can give some
>> answers.
>>
>> The AC output is ground-centered - it has zero bias.
>>
>
> So it will indeed go from 0V to -2.5V before it starts Rising, and from -2.5V to 0V at the end of Fall ? That'll give for a rather different sound/waveshape than the other outputs...
>
>
>> The Rise/Fall CV pots are reversible attenuators, with the center
>> position being the minimal amount.
>>
>
> As I thought, yes. Very cool.
>
>
>
>> Exponential CV affects both rise and fall equally in an exponential
>> manner. If cycling, it works similar to a 1V/oct CV input on a VCO, but
>> not accurate to 1V/oct.
>>
>
> So, the Exp.CV In is in fact the same as the Both CV In (when responses are switched to exponential), but always "full on". Right ?
>
>
>> I designed a Front Panel Express panel for the CGS 75 Serge VCS. It's
>> available in this directory on Yahoo Groups:
>> <http://launch.groups.yahoo.com/group/ModularSynthPanels/files/Richard%20Brewster%20Designs/
>>
>>
> I'll fire up WIndows on my Mac, and have a look. Thanks !
>
>
>> On my panel design I put input and output jacks for the Processor, so
>> that it can be patched in wherever you want it. I think the best option
>> for hard-wiring it would be in front of the Both CV input.
>>
>
> Okay, that makes sense. I think I'll include the Processor too - it's too useful to leave it out.
>
>
> thanks again !
> _g
>
>
>
>> Richard Brewster
>> http://pugix.com
>>
>>
>> Guy wrote:
>>
>>> Started doing the panel for the VCS, and wanted to be sure about some things. Sorry if this has been asked before.
>>>
>>>
>>> - The output signals - is this correct :
>>>
>>> http://www.guyd2.com/stuff/VCS_signals.gif
>>>
>>> (not sure about the bias of AC Out)
>>>
>>>
>>> - Are the Rise/Fall CV input pots wired for both negative & positive CV amount ?
>>>
>>> - As far as I understand, the Exp. CV In (1V/Oct) does not affect the rate of Rise/Fall, but merely 'transposes' the signal ?
>>>
>>> - The optional Processor section is simply a unity gain amp with either inverted or non-inverted output, right ? How can this be hard-wired to the VCS in- or outs for most effectiveness, ie. how can it be most useful when I don't bring it out to the frontpanel ?
>>>
>>>
>>> thanks,
>>> _g
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------------
>>>
>>> The CGS Modular Synth home page: http://www.cgs.synth.net/
>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>

Re: Some CGS75 (VCS) clarifications

2009-10-19 by Jon Nensén

The end out is high as long as the trigger input is low.

Rise and fall input CV is center 0, and -1 ccw and +1 cw.
So you can invert incomming CV.

The exp. cv in does affect the rate of the rise and fall, as it makes
it go faster?

The cv processor is ment to be for the both input. So you can invert
the CV controlling both rise and fall - making it all go a wee bit
faster then it's supposed to.
And then it stops cycling.
But that's just like a real DSG.
So no worries.

Cheers,
//Jon

17 okt 2009 kl. 12.53 skrev Guy:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> Started doing the panel for the VCS, and wanted to be sure about
> some things. Sorry if this has been asked before.
>
> - The output signals - is this correct :
>
> http://www.guyd2.com/stuff/VCS_signals.gif
>
> (not sure about the bias of AC Out)
>
> - Are the Rise/Fall CV input pots wired for both negative & positive
> CV amount ?
>
> - As far as I understand, the Exp. CV In (1V/Oct) does not affect
> the rate of Rise/Fall, but merely 'transposes' the signal ?
>
> - The optional Processor section is simply a unity gain amp with
> either inverted or non-inverted output, right ? How can this be hard-
> wired to the VCS in- or outs for most effectiveness, ie. how can it
> be most useful when I don't bring it out to the frontpanel ?
>
> thanks,
> _g
>
>
>



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: Some CGS75 (VCS) clarifications

2009-10-19 by sasami@hotkey.net.au

>And then it stops cycling.
>But that's just like a real DSG.

Replace the 10. in series with the cycle switch with a 1n, and the lock-up
should be avoided. I did the mod to some genuine DUSG with success.

Ken

>So no worries.
>
>Cheers,
>//Jon
>
>17 okt 2009 kl. 12.53 skrev Guy:
>
>> Started doing the panel for the VCS, and wanted to be sure about
>> some things. Sorry if this has been asked before.
>>
>> - The output signals - is this correct :
>>
>> http://www.guyd2.com/stuff/VCS_signals.gif
>>
>> (not sure about the bias of AC Out)
>>
>> - Are the Rise/Fall CV input pots wired for both negative & positive
>> CV amount ?
>>
>> - As far as I understand, the Exp. CV In (1V/Oct) does not affect
>> the rate of Rise/Fall, but merely 'transposes' the signal ?
>>
>> - The optional Processor section is simply a unity gain amp with
>> either inverted or non-inverted output, right ? How can this be hard-
>> wired to the VCS in- or outs for most effectiveness, ie. how can it
>> be most useful when I don't bring it out to the frontpanel ?
>>
>> thanks,
>> _g
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>------------------------------------
>
>The CGS Modular Synth home page: http://www.cgs.synth.net/
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
_______________________________________________________________________
Ken Stone sasami@... otherunicorn@...
Modular Synth PCBs for sale <http://www.cgs.synth.net/>
Australian Miniature Horses & Ponies <http://www.blaze.net.au/~sasami/>

Re: Some CGS75 (VCS) clarifications

2009-10-19 by sasami@hotkey.net.au

I'll try that again.
Replace the 10n in series with the cycle switch with a 1n, and the lock-up
should be avoided. I did the mod to some genuine DUSG with success.
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
>>And then it stops cycling.
>>But that's just like a real DSG.
>
>Replace the 10. in series with the cycle switch with a 1n, and the lock-up
>should be avoided. I did the mod to some genuine DUSG with success.
>
>Ken
>
>>So no worries.
>>
>>Cheers,
>>//Jon
>>
>>17 okt 2009 kl. 12.53 skrev Guy:
>>
>>> Started doing the panel for the VCS, and wanted to be sure about
>>> some things. Sorry if this has been asked before.
>>>
>>> - The output signals - is this correct :
>>>
>>> http://www.guyd2.com/stuff/VCS_signals.gif
>>>
>>> (not sure about the bias of AC Out)
>>>
>>> - Are the Rise/Fall CV input pots wired for both negative & positive
>>> CV amount ?
>>>
>>> - As far as I understand, the Exp. CV In (1V/Oct) does not affect
>>> the rate of Rise/Fall, but merely 'transposes' the signal ?
>>>
>>> - The optional Processor section is simply a unity gain amp with
>>> either inverted or non-inverted output, right ? How can this be hard-
>>> wired to the VCS in- or outs for most effectiveness, ie. how can it
>>> be most useful when I don't bring it out to the frontpanel ?
>>>
>>> thanks,
>>> _g
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>
>>
>>
>>------------------------------------
>>
>>The CGS Modular Synth home page: http://www.cgs.synth.net/
>>Yahoo! Groups Links
>>
>>
>>
>>
>_______________________________________________________________________
>Ken Stone sasami@... otherunicorn@...
>Modular Synth PCBs for sale <http://www.cgs.synth.net/>
>Australian Miniature Horses & Ponies <http://www.blaze.net.au/~sasami/>
>
>
>
>------------------------------------
>
>The CGS Modular Synth home page: http://www.cgs.synth.net/
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
_______________________________________________________________________
Ken Stone sasami@... otherunicorn@...
Modular Synth PCBs for sale <http://www.cgs.synth.net/>
Australian Miniature Horses & Ponies <http://www.blaze.net.au/~sasami/>

CGS41 Diatonic Converter 2 questions for now (Daft)

2009-10-26 by lief codianni

Hi Folks,
Im putting together this Diatonic Converter now. I know I will have other questions later but for now I have two questions about substutions.
1) Can I replace the 3V9 ZD with 5V1?
2) Can I use 22R resistors in place of the beads?

bonus questions
3) What about 4K 1% instead on 3.9K resistors
4) What about 100K 5% instead of 1%
I assume these last two questions are no
Thanks, Lief
"If we don't believe in freedom of expression for
people we despise, we don't believe in it at all."
-Noam Chomsky


"Sell not virtue to purchase wealth, nor Liberty to purchase power."
-Benjamin Franklin




________________________________
Show quoted textHide quoted text
From: "sasami@..." <sasami@...>
To: cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Mon, October 19, 2009 6:40:18 PM
Subject: Re: [cgs_synth] Some CGS75 (VCS) clarifications


I'll try that again.
Replace the 10n in series with the cycle switch with a 1n, and the lock-up
should be avoided. I did the mod to some genuine DUSG with success.

>
>>And then it stops cycling.
>>But that's just like a real DSG.
>
>Replace the 10. in series with the cycle switch with a 1n, and the lock-up
>should be avoided. I did the mod to some genuine DUSG with success.
>
>Ken
>
>>So no worries.
>>
>>Cheers,
>>//Jon
>>
>>17 okt 2009 kl. 12.53 skrev Guy:
>>
>>> Started doing the panel for the VCS, and wanted to be sure about
>>> some things. Sorry if this has been asked before.
>>>
>>> - The output signals - is this correct :
>>>
>>> http://www.guyd2 com/stuff/ VCS_signals. gif
>>>
>>> (not sure about the bias of AC Out)
>>>
>>> - Are the Rise/Fall CV input pots wired for both negative & positive
>>> CV amount ?
>>>
>>> - As far as I understand, the Exp. CV In (1V/Oct) does not affect
>>> the rate of Rise/Fall, but merely 'transposes' the signal ?
>>>
>>> - The optional Processor section is simply a unity gain amp with
>>> either inverted or non-inverted output, right ? How can this be hard-
>>> wired to the VCS in- or outs for most effectiveness, ie. how can it
>>> be most useful when I don't bring it out to the frontpanel ?
>>>
>>> thanks,
>>> _g
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>
>>
>>
>>---------- --------- --------- --------
>>
>>The CGS Modular Synth home page: http://www.cgs synth.net/
>>Yahoo! Groups Links
>>
>>
>>
>>
>___________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ __
>Ken Stone sasami@hotkey. net.au otherunicorn@ virginbroadband. com.au
>Modular Synth PCBs for sale <http://www.cgs synth.net/>
>Australian Miniature Horses & Ponies <http://www.blaze net.au/~sasami/>
>
>
>
>----------- --------- --------- -------
>
>The CGS Modular Synth home page: http://www.cgs synth.net/
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _
Ken Stone sasami@hotkey. net.au otherunicorn@ virginbroadband. com.au
Modular Synth PCBs for sale <http://www.cgs synth.net/>
Australian Miniature Horses & Ponies <http://www.blaze net.au/~sasami/>







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: CGS41 Diatonic Converter 2 questions for now (Daft)

2009-10-26 by sasami@hotkey.net.au

>1) Can I replace the 3V9 ZD with 5V1?
Possibly, but if you overdrive it, I am not sure what will happen.

>2) Can I use 22R resistors in place of the beads?
Yes.

>bonus questions
>3) What about 4K 1% instead on 3.9K resistors
Yes.

>4) What about 100K 5% instead of 1%
No.

Ken
_______________________________________________________________________
Ken Stone sasami@... otherunicorn@...
Modular Synth PCBs for sale <http://www.cgs.synth.net/>
Australian Miniature Horses & Ponies <http://www.blaze.net.au/~sasami/>

Re: CGS41 Diatonic Converter 2 questions for now (Daft)

2009-10-26 by lief codianni

Thanks!




________________________________
Show quoted textHide quoted text
From: "sasami@..." <sasami@...>
To: cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Mon, October 26, 2009 5:16:39 AM
Subject: Re: [cgs_synth] CGS41 Diatonic Converter 2 questions for now (Daft)



>1) Can I replace the 3V9 ZD with 5V1?
Possibly, but if you overdrive it, I am not sure what will happen.

>2) Can I use 22R resistors in place of the beads?
Yes.

>bonus questions
>3) What about 4K 1% instead on 3.9K resistors
Yes.

>4) What about 100K 5% instead of 1%
No.

Ken
____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _
Ken Stone sasami@hotkey. net.au otherunicorn@ virginbroadband. com.au
Modular Synth PCBs for sale <http://www.cgs synth.net/>
Australian Miniature Horses & Ponies <http://www.blaze net.au/~sasami/>







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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