PLAN B analog blog

thinking this over there may be a way to synthesize shifting of an
external signal.  Haven't tried this yet, hypothetically if you set
the frequency of one of the VCOs routed to the FS to it's lowest point
and FM it with an external VCO, this should be sufficient to replicate
to some degree the presence of that ext VCO into the internal FS
architecture.

more when I am able.

- P

You're welcome, Tom!  Thanks for the support.

Your conjecture on replicating the overtone structure of an external
audio band ac signal is spot on, however won't do the trick here. 
Once you see the basic flow of the M30 you'll see the VCAs come after
the processing.  SO while you could get a digitized rendering if you
will of an external waveform that way, it would come after the
Frequency Shifter.  Here is the basic M30 flow diagram, it'll make it
much clearer:

http://www.ear-group.net/m30block.jpg


SO the only way to do it is how I mentioned earlier, and yes there
will be some harmonic distortion due to scaling of the VC Freq inputs.

in as far as M32, thanks for your enthusiasm.  I will post some sound
samples which will explain how cool the Kinetic gates are. Until you
'see' them in action it's hard o put your arms around the concept.

- P



--- In PLAN_B_analog_blog@yahoogroups.com, tomas everaert
<teveraer@...> wrote:
>
> Maybe this would only work if the FM inputs were linear? Or am I wrong 
> about this?
> Another idea: maybe if you modulate the *level* of the slow oscillator 
> with an external signal, would this not bring that signal into the 
> model 30? If the level input is linear (is it?) then I'd guess the 
> oscillator would output the external signal, albeit with an unavoidable 
> tremolo determined by the rate of the slow oscillator. Or am I talking 
> nonsense here?
> 
> By the way, maybe I should introduce myself to the community, this is 
> only my second post to this list :-)
> I am new to the modular synth world (although I have been looking from 
> a distance for some time now) and have just started configuring my 
> first Eurorack system, which should consist mostly of Plan B and 
> Livewire modules. Just recently, I ordered the first ones: two Livewire 
> AFG's.
> 
> (Although, according to it's subject, tis post should be about the 
> model 30, I would like to mention that among the newly announced Plan B 
> modules I was particularly happy to see the model 32. Since I want to 
> be able to use my---still unexistant---modular as a standalone 
> instrument with no need for external controllers, a joystick module is 
> pretty essential for me. My first thought was Dieter Doepfer's joystick 
> together with his manual gate, but now that I have seen the model 32 on 
> photo, this is no longer an option: I want the model 32! :-) At last, a 
> joystick module that has everything I think should be standard: a 
> manual gate, external inputs for crossfading, ergonomics, and, of 
> course, an unsprung joystick! The kinetic gates seem like a very nice 
> bonus (I am curious as to how 'playable' this feature will turn out to 
> be. I expect it to be lots of fun.) Thanks, Mr. Grenader!)
> 
> Best to all,
> 
> Tomas Everaert.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On 23 Apr 2008, at 20:58, (i think you can figure that out) wrote:
> 
> > thinking this over there may be a way to synthesize shifting of an
> >  external signal. Haven't tried this yet, hypothetically if you set
> >  the frequency of one of the VCOs routed to the FS to it's lowest
point
> >  and FM it with an external VCO, this should be sufficient to
replicate

> >  to some degree the presence of that ext VCO into the internal FS
> >  architecture.
>

Maybe this would only work if the FM inputs were linear? Or am I wrong 
about this?
Another idea: maybe if you modulate the *level* of the slow oscillator 
with an external signal, would this not bring that signal into the 
model 30? If the level input is linear (is it?) then I'd guess the 
oscillator would output the external signal, albeit with an unavoidable 
tremolo determined by the rate of the slow oscillator. Or am I talking 
nonsense here?

By the way, maybe I should introduce myself to the community, this is 
only my second post to this list :-)
I am new to the modular synth world (although I have been looking from 
a distance for some time now) and have just started configuring my 
first Eurorack system, which should consist mostly of Plan B and 
Livewire modules. Just recently, I ordered the first ones: two Livewire 
AFG's.

(Although, according to it's subject, tis post should be about the 
model 30, I would like to mention that among the newly announced Plan B 
modules I was particularly happy to see the model 32. Since I want to 
be able to use my---still unexistant---modular as a standalone 
instrument with no need for external controllers, a joystick module is 
pretty essential for me. My first thought was Dieter Doepfer's joystick 
together with his manual gate, but now that I have seen the model 32 on 
photo, this is no longer an option: I want the model 32! :-) At last, a 
joystick module that has everything I think should be standard: a 
manual gate, external inputs for crossfading, ergonomics, and, of 
course, an unsprung joystick! The kinetic gates seem like a very nice 
bonus (I am curious as to how 'playable' this feature will turn out to 
be. I expect it to be lots of fun.) Thanks, Mr. Grenader!)

Best to all,

Tomas Everaert.

On 23 Apr 2008, at 20:58, (i think you can figure that out) wrote:

> thinking this over there may be a way to synthesize shifting of an
>  external signal. Haven't tried this yet, hypothetically if you set
>  the frequency of one of the VCOs routed to the FS to it's lowest point
>  and FM it with an external VCO, this should be sufficient to replicate
>  to some degree the presence of that ext VCO into the internal FS
>  architecture.

Thanks Peter, for clarifying this!

So, if I understand it right, then the model 30 is much further from 
the DX7 than I would have thought. The whole point of the DX7 is to 
dynamically alter the FM indexes which, if I have it right, is not 
possible on the model 30 (since the VCA's come after the FM-processing, 
in the FM-modes)?

So the way to approach the model 30 is to choose a particular patch and 
then to alter the waveshapes of the three VCO's to attain timbrel 
variations? So in some sense, the waveshapers of the model 30 have 
taken the place of the FM-indexes of the DX7.

This is very cool. I just tried to do something like this on the Nord 
Modular G2 demo I have on my Mac: two oscillators with continuously 
variable waveshapes, one frequency modulating the other with a fixed 
index (and in a second example, one 'ring modulating' the other), and 
then modulating the oscillator waveshapes with an envelope. It sounded 
great!

Btw. what is the use of the select buttens? Maybe this is to select 
which of the VCO's will be affected by the waveshape CV in?

Thanks!

Tomas.

Btw. It is of course no big deal if the model 30 doesn't do frequency 
shifting of external signals perfectly, since it is clearly designed as 
a sound source, rather than a processor...

On 24 Apr 2008, at 01:12, (i think you can figure that out) wrote:

> You're welcome, Tom! Thanks for the support.
>
>  Your conjecture on replicating the overtone structure of an external
>  audio band ac signal is spot on, however won't do the trick here.
>  Once you see the basic flow of the M30 you'll see the VCAs come after
>  the processing. SO while you could get a digitized rendering if you
>  will of an external waveform that way, it would come after the
>  Frequency Shifter. Here is the basic M30 flow diagram, it'll make it
>  much clearer:
>
> http://www.ear-group.net/m30block.jpg
>
>  SO the only way to do it is how I mentioned earlier, and yes there
>  will be some harmonic distortion due to scaling of the VC Freq inputs.
>
>  in as far as M32, thanks for your enthusiasm. I will post some sound
>  samples which will explain how cool the Kinetic gates are. Until you
>  'see' them in action it's hard o put your arms around the concept.
>
>  - P