Homebrew PCBs

any pics of your tank and holder that you mention?

tnx
jtm

On Tue, 10 Aug 2004 16:42:45 -0400, Jim Miller <jim@...> wrote:

> any pics of your tank and holder that you mention?
>
> tnx
> jtm

no pics, no camera.

ST

Put the tank in the scanner   :-)  :-)  :-)

I too want to see a photo of your tank !!!



At 05:08 p.m. 10-08-2004, you wrote:

>On Tue, 10 Aug 2004 16:42:45 -0400, Jim Miller <jim@...> wrote:
>
> > any pics of your tank and holder that you mention?
> >
> > tnx
> > jtm
>
>no pics, no camera.
>
>ST
>
>
>
>
>Be sure to visit the group home and check for new Bookmarks and files:
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Homebrew_PCBs
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>

On Tue, 10 Aug 2004 17:45:51 -0400, Esteban Arias <earias@...>  
wrote:

> Put the tank in the scanner   :-)  :-)  :-)
>
> I too want to see a photo of your tank !!!
>
>

sure.. i needn't scan then. just take my word for it: "blur".

It's really just a couple of glass plates, a plastic lid, a clamp.
If you foce me i'll make a few sketches.

ST

I think that there are several of us that would appreciate a sketch or two,
Stefan.

And to the rest of the group -
I'd also appreciate some more info on the HCl + H2O2 etchant - I hadn't run
across that one before.  Proportions? Temperature? Etch time? etc.?

Norm

Hello,

You may want to have a look at Markus Zingg's THP setup. He has nice 
board holding clamp which sounds similar to what Stefan has 
described...

Three rods, with half their ends cut/filed away for a short distance, 
and "slider" with three rod-sized holes. With the slider at the top, 
the rods "spring apart to grip the board. pushing the slider down 
towards the board increases this pressure.

If a hole were made in the tank "lid" from which these three rods 
project, then the slider could be actuated without touching any "wet" 
parts...

Just some thoughts on a full moon night<G> 

Ballendo

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Norman Stewart" 
<normstewart@a...> wrote:
> I think that there are several of us that would appreciate a sketch 
or two,
> Stefan.
> 
> And to the rest of the group -
> I'd also appreciate some more info on the HCl + H2O2 etchant - I 
hadn't run

> across that one before.  Proportions? Temperature? Etch time? etc.?
> 
> Norm

On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 11:27:53 -0000, ballendo <ballendo@...> wrote:

>
> Three rods, with half their ends cut/filed away for a short distance,
> and "slider" with three rod-sized holes. With the slider at the top,
> the rods "spring apart to grip the board. pushing the slider down
> towards the board increases this pressure.
> If a hole were made in the tank "lid" from which these three rods
> project, then the slider could be actuated without touching any "wet"
> parts...
> Just some thoughts on a full moon night<G>
> Ballendo


Mine is a bit different, it uses two "plates" which clamp the pcb, and
a round rod pushed from top between the plates opens them.
a rubber closes them.
the pushrod is sprung-load so you can use one hand to hold the lid and  
operate it.

ST

On Tue, 10 Aug 2004 22:29:32 -0700, Norman Stewart <normstewart@...>  
wrote:

> I think that there are several of us that would appreciate a sketch or  
> two,
> Stefan.
>
> And to the rest of the group -
> I'd also appreciate some more info on the HCl + H2O2 etchant - I hadn't  
> run
> across that one before.  Proportions? Temperature? Etch time? etc.?
>
> Norm

look in the links section of the group, CuCl etchant.

For the sketches, i'll see what i can do.

ST

You not only need photos, you need a web site with all your information for 
make pcb's in house !!!



At 05:48 p.m. 10-08-2004, you wrote:

>On Tue, 10 Aug 2004 17:45:51 -0400, Esteban Arias <earias@...>
>wrote:
>
> > Put the tank in the scanner   :-)  :-)  :-)
> >
> > I too want to see a photo of your tank !!!
> >
> >
>
>sure.. i needn't scan then. just take my word for it: "blur".
>
>It's really just a couple of glass plates, a plastic lid, a clamp.
>If you foce me i'll make a few sketches.
>
>ST
>
>
>
>
>Be sure to visit the group home and check for new Bookmarks and files:
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Homebrew_PCBs
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>

I found couple of pics that might give an idea how it can be done 
outside US, ie, for people on a budget and/or with access to diffrent 
materials:
http://www.emling-online.de/digital/aetzen.html

http://www.emling-online.de/digital/kuevette.html

A side note: a larger tank requires a larger amount of etchant.  Mike






-- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Stefan Trethan" 
<stefan_trethan@g...> wrote:
> On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 11:27:53 -0000, ballendo <ballendo@y...> wrote:
> 
> >
> > Three rods, with half their ends cut/filed away for a short 
distance,
> > and "slider" with three rod-sized holes. With the slider at the 
top,
> > the rods "spring apart to grip the board. pushing the slider down
> > towards the board increases this pressure.
> > If a hole were made in the tank "lid" from which these three rods
> > project, then the slider could be actuated without touching 
any "wet"
> > parts...
> > Just some thoughts on a full moon night<G>
> > Ballendo
> 
> 
> Mine is a bit different, it uses two "plates" which clamp the pcb, 
and
> a round rod pushed from top between the plates opens them.
> a rubber closes them.
> the pushrod is sprung-load so you can use one hand to hold the lid 
and  

> operate it.
> 
> ST

On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 16:35:37 -0000, mikezcnc <eemikez@...> wrote:

> I found couple of pics that might give an idea how it can be done
> outside US, ie, for people on a budget and/or with access to diffrent
> materials:
> http://www.emling-online.de/digital/aetzen.html
>
> http://www.emling-online.de/digital/kuevette.html
>
> A side note: a larger tank requires a larger amount of etchant.  Mike
>

I find it highly amusing that both of the links you provide use a homebrew
tank. Who did say there is no need to build one ;-).

Thanks for the side note, i hadn't considered that so far ;-)

ST

Another side note: make the tank very narrow, mine is about 2cm, just  
enough to let
the hydrometer float.
Also make the tank higher than it is wide (which i didn't). you add dead  
"safety headroom"
space if you make it wider than high. (but then i have a lot of "strip"  
cutoffs which
fit nicely horizontally now if i need a giant pcb.

On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 10:03:08 -0400, Esteban Arias <earias@...>  
wrote:

> You not only need photos, you need a web site with all your information  
> for
> make pcb's in house !!!
>

I know that Esteban, and i plan to do it.
But i have a tight schedule and i don't exactly get paid for doing that  
stuff.
And you must consider not all appreciate help as much as you did.

ST

Yes, I know, the main problem is the time. I have the same problem.

If you accept this,  I can work to make the information over your fuser 
driver: schema, photos, website.

Esteban Arias
earias@...


At 02:24 p.m. 11-08-2004, you wrote:

>On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 10:03:08 -0400, Esteban Arias <earias@...>
>wrote:
>
> > You not only need photos, you need a web site with all your information
> > for
> > make pcb's in house !!!
> >
>
>I know that Esteban, and i plan to do it.
>But i have a tight schedule and i don't exactly get paid for doing that
>stuff.
>And you must consider not all appreciate help as much as you did.
>
>ST
>
>
>
>
>Be sure to visit the group home and check for new Bookmarks and files:
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Homebrew_PCBs
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>

On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 15:16:31 -0400, Esteban Arias <earias@...>  
wrote:

> Yes, I know, the main problem is the time. I have the same problem.
>
> If you accept this,  I can work to make the information over your fuser
> driver: schema, photos, website.
>
> Esteban Arias
> earias@...

Would be great.

I have a 100Mb university webspace ready for the stuff but you know..  
time..
Anyone knowing a reliable and free URL redirector?
The university webspace will not be permanent and after a few years  
changing the url is nasty.
I have one at active.ws (st.such.info) but active.ws seems not to be very  
reliable.
(It went out of order several times in just a few months).

Esteban, would be great if you could make the fuser stuff.
I'll mail you privately 'cause this is no group stuff (but the search for  
a url redirector is).

ST

Stefan,

I still think that tank is not neccesasary since a regular tray will 
do, for me at least (no, I never like ferric chloride).
However, since you didn't have time and a person asked for pictures, 
that's why I showed the links. I have quite a few etching tanks built 
by people that were never used.

Mike

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Stefan Trethan" 
<stefan_trethan@g...> wrote:
> On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 16:35:37 -0000, mikezcnc <eemikez@c...> wrote:
> 
> > I found couple of pics that might give an idea how it can be done
> > outside US, ie, for people on a budget and/or with access to 
diffrent
> > materials:
> > http://www.emling-online.de/digital/aetzen.html
> >
> > http://www.emling-online.de/digital/kuevette.html
> >
> > A side note: a larger tank requires a larger amount of etchant.  
Mike
> >
> 
> I find it highly amusing that both of the links you provide use a 
homebrew
> tank. Who did say there is no need to build one ;-).
> 
> Thanks for the side note, i hadn't considered that so far ;-)
> 
> ST
> 
> Another side note: make the tank very narrow, mine is about 2cm, 
just  
> enough to let
> the hydrometer float.
> Also make the tank higher than it is wide (which i didn't). you add 
dead  
> "safety headroom"
> space if you make it wider than high. (but then i have a lot 
of "strip"  
> cutoffs which
> fit nicely horizontally now if i need a giant pcb.

Hi,

again the same topic.
Last time i asked someone suggested glycerine and IPA.
(sorry for forgetting your name)
Tried it, in varying ratios of glycerine/ipa -> always bad results.
As soon as i mix _anything_ into the paste, regardless of how little it  
might be,
the components literally jump off the board as soon as i heat it. It also  
doesn't
matter how slow i heat it.

It almost makes you cry when you have just placed 30 or so SMD components,  
heat
up and all start jumping like popcorn at a certain temperature.

The paste is rather dry, and it is impossible to dispense because it just  
isn't tacky
enough to stick to the board (it sticks to the syringe tip). I'm VERY sure  
i'll NEVER
EVER again buy smd paste at ebay. Well it did only cost 1 or 2eur instead  
of 10 but
it isn't worth the bother at all.

I admit i didn't store it in the fridge, and it was slightly better when i  
got it.

What do you think, is there anything i could try to thin it?

Is it vital to keep it in the fridge? What are your experiences with that?

I'd really hate throwing away this almost full syringe, but if it doesn't  
work out
i'll have to.

I'm more and more into SMD now, and i MUST get that working.
I have seen it work when i got the paste, and it was tacky enough to work  
with it.
Ii is so much easier than hand soldering and looks nicer too.

well, ideas welcome.

ST

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Stefan Trethan" 
<stefan_trethan@g...> wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> again the same topic.
> Last time i asked someone suggested glycerine and IPA.
> (sorry for forgetting your name)
> Tried it, in varying ratios of glycerine/ipa -> always bad results.
> As soon as i mix _anything_ into the paste, regardless of how 
little it  
> might be,
> the components literally jump off the board as soon as i heat it. 
It also  
> doesn't
> matter how slow i heat it.
> 
> It almost makes you cry when you have just placed 30 or so SMD 
components,  
> heat
> up and all start jumping like popcorn at a certain temperature.
> 
> The paste is rather dry, and it is impossible to dispense because 
it just  
> isn't tacky
> enough to stick to the board (it sticks to the syringe tip). I'm 
VERY sure  
> i'll NEVER
> EVER again buy smd paste at ebay. Well it did only cost 1 or 2eur 
instead  
> of 10 but
> it isn't worth the bother at all.
> 
> I admit i didn't store it in the fridge, and it was slightly better 
when i  
> got it.
> 
> What do you think, is there anything i could try to thin it?
> 
> Is it vital to keep it in the fridge? What are your experiences 
with that?
> 
> I'd really hate throwing away this almost full syringe, but if it 
doesn't  
> work out
> i'll have to.
> 
> I'm more and more into SMD now, and i MUST get that working.
> I have seen it work when i got the paste, and it was tacky enough 
to work  
> with it.
> Ii is so much easier than hand soldering and looks nicer too.
> 
> well, ideas welcome.
> 
> ST

If you have a production board, considder etching a thin piece of 
sheet metal and using that as a solder stencil and then like silk 
screeen, squeegee it on.

Dave

> If you have a production board, considder etching a thin piece of
> sheet metal and using that as a solder stencil and then like silk
> screeen, squeegee it on.
>
> Dave
>


don't have production boards, only one-offs.

also etched stancils are known to be problematic with paste release (rough  
edges).

ST