Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] what is sulfate of zinc and acidulated water andsaturated copper sulfate crystals ?
2017-01-17 by chuck richards
>See Daniel Cell and Gravity Cell.They are great cells to make and to experiment with.
As a young boy, I was at home in the basement making
wet cells of all various kinds, while the rest of the
children were still coloring with crayons.
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>
>---- Original Message ----
>From: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
>To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] what is sulfate of zinc and acidulated
>water andsaturated copper sulfate crystals ?
>Date: Mon, 16 Jan 2017 21:13:18 -0500
>
>>I stumbled on this perfect answer:
>>
>>What Happens in a Battery if Zinc Sulfate Is Mixed With Copper
>Sulfate?
>>by Serm Murmson
>>
>>Chemical reactions can generate electrical energy from the exchange
>of
>>electrons. A cell that uses the electrical current from a
>spontaneous
>>chemical reaction is called a galvanic or voltaic cell. A battery is
>an
>>example of such a cell. A battery is specifically constructed to
>ensure
>>that its chemical reactions occur in a controlled and reliable
>manner.
>>
>>The Nature of the Chemical Reaction
>>Batteries generate electrical current due to the exchange of
>electrons
>>in a spontaneous reduction-oxidation, or redox, reaction. In a redox
>
>>reaction, one element loses electrons: it is oxidized. Another
>element
>>gains these electrons: it is reduced. The elements used in a battery
>are
>>selected due to the difference in their oxidation and reduction
>>potentials. For example, zinc loses electrons more readily than
>copper.
>>A redox reaction will be spontaneous if the difference in the
>relevant
>>cell potentials is positive: the system will move to release energy.
>>The Construction of a Battery
>>
>>The cathode is the site at which reduction occurs in a battery. The
>>anode is the site at which oxidation occurs. In many voltaic cells,
>the
>>cathode and anode are made of the respective solid metals involved
>in
>>the redox reaction. In order to provide ions necessary for the
>chemical
>>reaction to take place, the anode and cathode are suspended in
>solutions
>>containing the respective metal ions. These two solutions, called
>>electrolytes, are connected via a membrane or barrier. In some cells
>
>>this is called a salt bridge. The function of the salt bridge is to
>>allow some ions to move while keeping others isolated in the
>respective
>>electrolytic solutions. Once the anode and cathode are connected via
>a
>>wire, the electrical potential difference will cause the reaction to
>
>>occur. Electrons will flow over the wire.
>>The Zinc and Copper Battery
>>
>>In a zinc-and-copper battery, the chemical reaction involves the
>>transfer of electrons from solid zinc to copper ions. The zinc is
>>therefore the anode; solid zinc is oxidized. The copper is the
>cathode;
>>copper ions are reduced. The electrolytic solutions can be zinc
>sulfate
>>and copper sulfate. When the zinc is oxidized, new zinc ions fall
>into
>>the solution. When the copper is reduced, copper ions are displaced
>out
>>of the solution onto the cathode. The negative sulfate ions in the
>>copper sulfate solution can flow across the bridge to account for
>the
>>creation of positive zinc ions.
>>The Importance of the Salt Bridge
>>
>>If the salt bridge were not present, copper ions could come into
>contact
>>with solid zinc. If this were to happen, both reduction and
>oxidation
>>would take place at the solid zinc. Copper would build up at the
>anode,
>>and the electrons would not be able to be harnessed for electrical
>work.
>>Depending on the extent of the mixture of electrolytes, this could
>>diminish the life of the battery, or even make it completely
>unusable
>>for electrical work.
>>
>>
>>On 01/16/2017 02:04 PM, Jean-Paul Louis louijp@...
>[Homebrew_PCBs]
>>wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi Rob,
>>>
>>> Beside having fun experimenting, what would be the use of such
>awfully
>>> low performance battery? the article claims high internal
>resistance
>>> and 0.25V capabilty.
>>>
>>> It looks like this battery uses zinc and copper ions to work. I
>think
>>> that there are other ways to make a much better battery with these
>
>>> parameters. But picking those two metallic ions does not explain
>the
>>> low voltage of said battery.
>>> According to the website at
>>> http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/electrode-potential-d_482.html,
>Zinc
>>> potential is -0.76V and Copper is +0.34V, so a good battery with
>those
>>> elements should have a max of 1.1V, with an average probably
>around
>>> 1V, which is a lot better than the 0.25V advertized.
>>>
>>> Just because you find articles on the Internet, thats not a proof
>of
>>> good engineering practices.
>>> There is a lot of garbage in the Internet, but there is also a lot
>of
>>> good stuff. It is just not easy to find the right ones.
>>>
>>> As a side note, you can see on the table that lithium has a
>potential
>>> of -3.04V, which explains why lithium ion batteries are the hot
>topic.
>>>
>>> Just a few thoughts,
>>> Jean-Paul
>>> N1JPL
>>>
>>> > On Jan 16, 2017, at 2:22 AM, Rob roomberg@...
>[Homebrew_PCBs]
>>> <Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>>> >
>>> > what is sulfate of zinc and acidulated water and saturated
>copper
>>> sulfate crystals ?
>>> > Do we have any chemists out there?
>>> >
>>> > I found an old time article how to make a battery and it
>specified
>>> >
>>> > sulfate of zinc and acidulated water and saturated copper
>sulfate
>>> crystals
>>> >
>>> > http://www.learnmorsecode.com/regen2/battery02.jpg
>>> >
>>> > The article said to use ZINC SULFATE
>>> > or
>>> > ACIDULATED water.
>>> >
>>> > So I got look up ZINC SULFATE on the web and is says we can buy
>>> 220mg zinc sulfate capsules...to eat.
>>> > huh?!!??
>>> > edible batteries?
>>> >
>>> > Zinc Sulfate (220mg) - 100 Capsules
>>> > Zinc sulfate is an inorganic compound and dietary supplement. As
>a
>>> supplement it is used to treat zinc deficiency
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > but hey...it did say "OR"
>>> > and when I look up acidulated water it said
>>> >
>>> > wiki:
>>> > Acidulated water is water that an acid has been added to it,
>usually
>>> lemon juice, lime juice or vinegar. Citric acid and ascorbic acid
>can
>>> also be used.
>>> >
>>> > Acidulated water can be made by combining 1.5 tablespoons
>vinegar or
>>> 3 tablespoons lemon juice.
>>> >
>>> > sooooo...... OK... this doesn't sound real toxic or dangerous to
>
>>> show and tell kids battery chemistry....
>>> >
>>> > AND THEN
>>> > there is the saturated copper sulfate....
>>> > which is readily available at th eharware store
>>> > ROOT KILL copper sulfate pentahydrate 99%
>>> > and instructions on the web say:
>>> >
>>> > First, you need a saturated copper sulfate solution so the
>crystals
>>> can form as the liquid evaporates. All you need to do to make the
>>> solution is to stir copper sulfate into very hot water until no
>more
>>> will dissolve. There are two ways to grow the crystals.Apr 26,
>2014
>>> > How To Grow Blue Copper Sulfate Crystals - Science Notes and
>Projects
>>> >
>https://sciencenotes.org/how-to-grow-blue-copper-sulfate-crystals/
>>> >
>>> > OR
>>> > just buy 10 pounds of crystals from a seed supply house for $32.
>>> >
>>> > So is this feasible or would parents be pissed if they knew
>their
>>> kids were near these chemicals?
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
