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is a CNC drill worth the money/effort ?

is a CNC drill worth the money/effort ?

2002-04-11 by Adam Seychell

I'm curious why there is so much interest in hobbyists who make no more
than couple of PCBs per week would need a CNC drilling machine to drill
the holes. I found hand drilling is not that big a deal when you have a
good drill press. There is a prototype place near my area and I noticed
they hand drill the holes even though they have a small CNC drilling
machine. The owner of the shop told me by time they setup the machine
its quicker to hand drill. So, anyone thought about building a really
good drill press ?

The drill press I made couple of years ago is still working very well
and I'm happy with it. The basic design uses a straight grinder mounted
to the end of a long arm (400mm) which pivots at the opposite end. This
is mounted on a wooden base.


___
| |
o__________|_| straight grinder
| |
_|____________________ wooden base (18 mm MDF)


The arm is made from a piece of 50 x 50 mm aluminum square. The pivot is
made from two thrust bearings (from car clutch) that clamp on opposite
sides of the square aluminum arm. This is then fixed to the wooden base
with two pieces of aluminum right angles. In the diagram, thrust
bearings are "2", the arm is "3". Threaded bar, "4", goes through the
right angles , the thrust bearings and square arm so everything is
tightly clamped.


_ ____ _
| || | | || |
4=== | |2 | 3 | 2| | ===4
| || |____| || |
|----- | | -----|
-----------------------------------
----------------------------------- <-- wooden base


This setup gives stable and extremely smooth vertical movement of the
drill. There is of course an inherent arc movement of the drill bit.
This does not cause a problem when the drilling depth is only a few
millimeters. The most difficult part for me was mounting the straight
grinder to the end of the arm. This fixture needs to be adjustable to
allow slight alignment of the drill so it has perfect vertical feed. I
choose a straight grinder (BOSCH GGS27) because it was the only thing
around that came with a precision hardened steel ground collet and also
in my price range. The roundout is acceptable for carbide bits, (haven't
broken my 0.45 mm bit yet). The Dremel I first tried was useless because
of the sever round out. Luckily I got my money back. Major problem with
this machine is it can take up a bit of space. It compromises low
complexity for size. One improvement to the design would be to add a
stepper motor control for the down feed. That way both hands can be used
to position the PCB and a food pedal to operate the drill feed. Any
thoughts ?

Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] is a CNC drill worth the money/effort ?

2002-04-11 by JanRwl@AOL.COM

Adam: For a board with more than, oh, 30 or 40 holes, I can actually do it
FASTER by typing-in coordinates and then letting the machine do the "work"!
Repeatable, too! For larger than the size-#57 bit I normally have in the
machine, I just "ream" with a larger bit on a drill-press, as there are only
a very few, when/if.

See my home-brew machine in PHOTOS (or is it "Files"??). PET-controlled!!!!!


Jan Rowland

RE: [Homebrew_PCBs] is a CNC drill worth the money/effort ?

2002-04-11 by Tim Goldstein

To me the #1 thing that makes it worth the effort to drill a board on a
CNC machine is being able to drop the parts straight into the homes and
having all the pins line right up. When I drill boards on my Bridgeport
with a 40K rpm spindle attached everything fits perfect. That alone is
worth it.

Tim
[Denver, CO]

Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] is a CNC drill worth the money/effort ?

2002-04-11 by Adam Seychell

Hi Tim,

The CNC will give you accuracy and repeatability without effort on
your behalf. My question was is it worth money and effort building one
of these machines to gain that accuracy in hobbyists quantities ? I had
the opinion that a good hand press can make the job a lot easier and
better. To help drill a set of straight holes (e.g. a DIP or PCB header)
I guide one side of the board along a straight edge. Because the
platform of my drill press is fairly large (450x450 mm) there is plenty
of space to do this. To make the job easy as possible the straight edge
is made from a aluminum strip (3x30mm) which is pivoted to one corner of
the table. The straight edge swings about to the required position. I'm
also thinking of fitting one of those cheaply laser diodes to shine a
point exactly where the hole will get drilled. This might make it easier
still. The single biggest problem with manual machining is missing
holes, or drilling a wrong size hole. Of course none of this compares to
the accuracy from a CNC machine.


Tim Goldstein wrote:

>To me the #1 thing that makes it worth the effort to drill a board on a
>CNC machine is being able to drop the parts straight into the homes and
>having all the pins line right up. When I drill boards on my Bridgeport
>with a 40K rpm spindle attached everything fits perfect. That alone is
>worth it.
>
>Tim
>[Denver, CO]
>
>

Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] is a CNC drill worth the money/effort ?

2002-04-11 by Tony Jeffree

At 16:44 11/04/2002 +1000, you wrote:
>The CNC will give you accuracy and repeatability without effort on
>your behalf. My question was is it worth money and effort building one
>of these machines to gain that accuracy in hobbyists quantities ?

For me, it isn't so much accuracy & repeatability that is the issue
(although for some purposes, that is important too) - I just can't work up
enough enthusiasm to hand drill 30+ holes when the alternative is to feed a
drawing into my CNC mill & hit the "GO" button.

What I have found since acquiring my desktop CNC mill (a Taig) is that the
number of uses I discover for it increases with each project I do. Sure, if
you are building or buying a CNC machine that can only ever cope with
milling traces & drilling PCB holes, then it is a lot of effort/cost for
relatively little gain (unless you do a lot of prototyping or short
production runs); however, if you build/buy a machine that is capable of
doing other stuff too, then you end up with a versatile and useful tool
that can be pressed into service for other jobs.

Also, for the hobbyist, don't underestimate the sheer
fun/interest/achievement aspect of designing, building, and running your
own CNC machine - it is a fascinating process in its own right.

Regards,
Tony

Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] is a CNC drill worth the money/effort ?

2002-04-11 by Adam Seychell

Tony Jeffree wrote:

> At 16:44 11/04/2002 +1000, you wrote:
> >The CNC will give you accuracy and repeatability without effort on
> >your behalf. My question was is it worth money and effort building one
> >of these machines to gain that accuracy in hobbyists quantities ?
>
> For me, it isn't so much accuracy & repeatability that is the issue
> (although for some purposes, that is important too) - I just can't work up
> enough enthusiasm to hand drill 30+ holes when the alternative is to feed a
> drawing into my CNC mill & hit the "GO" button.
>
> What I have found since acquiring my desktop CNC mill (a Taig) is that the
> number of uses I discover for it increases with each project I do. Sure, if
> you are building or buying a CNC machine that can only ever cope with
> milling traces & drilling PCB holes, then it is a lot of effort/cost for
> relatively little gain (unless you do a lot of prototyping or short
> production runs); however, if you build/buy a machine that is capable of
> doing other stuff too, then you end up with a versatile and useful tool
> that can be pressed into service for other jobs.
>
> Also, for the hobbyist, don't underestimate the sheer
> fun/interest/achievement aspect of designing, building, and running your
> own CNC machine - it is a fascinating process in its own right.
>

Fascinating, I bet.

You pretty much answered my question. If its going to be used as a general tool
then it could end up becoming indispensable for the home workshop. In this case
then it should be built for milling capability. For exclusive PCB hole drilling
then a well designed hand operated drill press does the job without a drama.

Adam

Re: is a CNC drill worth the money/effort ?

2002-04-11 by crankorgan

Hi Jan,
I have the milling process put a starter hole in each pad
during the milling process. Then I use a small drill press. I do
several boards a week. I like knowing when the drill bit is getting
dull. When the milling bit gets dull a burr shows up on the trace.
When a dull drill bit shows up in the middle of a drill sequence, you
have to stop and change the bit. That's if you are there to catch it!


John



--- In Homebrew_PCBs@y..., JanRwl@A... wrote:
> Adam: For a board with more than, oh, 30 or 40 holes, I can
actually do it
> FASTER by typing-in coordinates and then letting the machine do
the "work"!
> Repeatable, too! For larger than the size-#57 bit I normally have
in the
> machine, I just "ream" with a larger bit on a drill-press, as there
are only
> a very few, when/if.
>
> See my home-brew machine in PHOTOS (or is it "Files"??). PET-
controlled!!!!!
>
>
> Jan Rowland

Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: is a CNC drill worth the money/effort ?

2002-04-13 by JanRwl@AOL.COM

I just realized perhaps the photo of my home-brew CNC PCB-drill is not ON
this site, so here's a LINK to that photo, if anyone is interested:
<A HREF="http://photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/cad_cam_edm_dro/vwp?.dir=/Home-brew+CNC+lathe&.src=gr&.dnm=PET-Controlled+X-Y+PCB-Drill.jpg&.view=t&.done=http%3a//photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/cad_cam_edm_dro/lst%3f%26.dir=/Home-brew%2bCNC%2blathe%26.src=gr%26.view=t">Yahoo! Groups - View Photo</A>

(Hope this works!) Jan Rowland


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: is a CNC drill worth the money/effort ?

2002-04-13 by Steve Greenfield

It is there but in the Files section. I never really liked the
Photos section but I guess I can get over it. ;')

You guys should go look at it, it is pretty cool.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Homebrew_PCBs

Steve Greenfield

--- JanRwl@... wrote:
> I just realized perhaps the photo of my home-brew CNC PCB-drill
> is not ON
> this site, so here's a LINK to that photo, if anyone is
> interested:
> <A
>
HREF="http://photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/cad_cam_edm_dro/vwp?.dir=/Home-brew+CNC+lathe&.src=gr&.dnm=PET-Controlled+X-Y+PCB-Drill.jpg&.view=t&.done=http%3a//photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/cad_cam_edm_dro/lst%3f%26.dir=/Home-brew%2bCNC%2blathe%26.src=gr%26.view=t">Yahoo!
> Groups - View Photo</A>
>
> (Hope this works!) Jan Rowland


=====
Steve Greenfield // Digital photo scanning, retouching,
Polymorph Digital Photography // and photomorphing to your specs.
253/318-2473 voice // We use the best little computer in
polymorph@... // the world, the Amiga!
http://www.polyphoto.com/ // Based in Tacoma, WA, USA

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