Best Printer for photo process ?
2011-12-28 by marc
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2011-12-28 by marc
HI i made lot of search on the forum and not find clear answer about the best printer for make photo process Transparency ? lot of talk but for toner transfer not photo my laser printer on mg chemical film was not dark egnof i see some epson laser jet whit black-max ink and rip software but i never see any post here about it ? sine i do this for semi professional i have bit of budget but look for cheaper that buy mega-uk photoploter Best regard Marc Lalonde
2011-12-28 by Leon Heller
On 28/12/2011 14:13, marc wrote: > HI > > i made lot of search on the forum > and not find clear answer about the best printer > for make photo process Transparency ? > lot of talk but for toner transfer not photo > > my laser printer on mg chemical film was not dark egnof > > i see some epson laser jet whit black-max ink and rip software > but i never see any post here about it ? > > sine i do this for semi professional i have bit of budget > but look for cheaper that buy mega-uk photoploter I get excellent results with an HP 5940 and Mega Electronics Premium JetStar film. It's a cheap printer. Leon -- Leon Heller G1HSM
2011-12-28 by Boman33
Hi Marc, I started testing different printers, inks, settings and media but ran out of time before finalizing the data. 3 printers * 5 media * varying ink settings = lots of data. Unfortunately work is interfering with my hobbies. I did create a carefully designed test chart that allowed me to properly measure the spectral density and resolution of the different combinations. See: http://www.vinland.com/USAF-1951.html Happy hunting and please let us know what you come up with. It would be interesting if people could mail me a sample of their best combination artwork printed using my test chart so I could measure it and include it in the final data and we would get a side by sided comparison of different systems. Bertho
From: marc Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2011 09:14 HI i made lot of search on the forum and not find clear answer about the best printer for make photo process Transparency ? lot of talk but for toner transfer not photo my laser printer on mg chemical film was not dark egnof i see some epson laser jet whit black-max ink and rip software but i never see any post here about it ? sine i do this for semi professional i have bit of budget but look for cheaper that buy mega-uk photoploter Best regard Marc Lalonde [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
2011-12-28 by MIKE DURKIN
Has any one in the states tried this stuff? http://export.rsdelivers.com/product/rs/erprp200/aerosol-photoresist-solution-200ml/1989651.aspx It's positive spray resist .... probably really expensive based on volume.. Mike KC7NOA To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
From: leon355@...
Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2011 20:50:03 +0000
Subject: Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Best Printer for photo process ?
On 28/12/2011 14:13, marc wrote:
> HI
>
> i made lot of search on the forum
> and not find clear answer about the best printer
> for make photo process Transparency ?
> lot of talk but for toner transfer not photo
>
> my laser printer on mg chemical film was not dark egnof
>
> i see some epson laser jet whit black-max ink and rip software
> but i never see any post here about it ?
>
> sine i do this for semi professional i have bit of budget
> but look for cheaper that buy mega-uk photoploter
I get excellent results with an HP 5940 and Mega Electronics Premium
JetStar film. It's a cheap printer.
Leon
--
Leon Heller
G1HSM
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]2011-12-28 by Roland Harriston
Marc: One trick that I have found useful is to make two copies of your work on laser transparency material. Then place one copy over the other and make sure that they line up perfectly, then tape them together on one or two edges. You now have a transparency that is twice as dense (black areas are twice as black) as you would have using only one transparency. Remember.....the two transparencies must line up perfectly to each other. HTH Roland F. Harriston, P.D. ******************* marc wrote: > > > HI > > i made lot of search on the forum > and not find clear answer about the best printer > for make photo process Transparency ? > lot of talk but for toner transfer not photo > > my laser printer on mg chemical film was not dark egnof > > i see some epson laser jet whit black-max ink and rip software > but i never see any post here about it ? > > sine i do this for semi professional i have bit of budget > but look for cheaper that buy mega-uk photoploter > > Best regard > Marc Lalonde > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
2011-12-29 by michael tenore
Hi All! I once had access to Xerox 4125 laser printer that could lay down very dense traces for toner transfer when the print density was turned up.. You may well try to find a used one on eBay or Craigs list... Regards Mike ________________________________
From: Leon Heller <leon355@btinternet.com> To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2011 8:50 PM Subject: Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Best Printer for photo process ? On 28/12/2011 14:13, marc wrote: > HI > > i made lot of search on the forum > and not find clear answer about the best printer > for make photo process Transparency ? > lot of talk but for toner transfer not photo > > my laser printer on mg chemical film was not dark egnof > > i see some epson laser jet whit black-max ink and rip software > but i never see any post here about it ? > > sine i do this for semi professional i have bit of budget > but look for cheaper that buy mega-uk photoploter I get excellent results with an HP 5940 and Mega Electronics Premium JetStar film. It's a cheap printer. Leon -- Leon Heller G1HSM [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
2011-12-29 by Robert
I thought I saw a recommendation for the Ricoh 7000 somewhere... it's around $900 (new) a less expensive and not as fine dpi but Kyocera 1320 looks pretty good, around $400 (new) I haven't tried either of these but looking at the specs I would guess they would do exeptionally well, especially the Ricoh. neither has a built in copier though. Robby --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, michael tenore <wb2lcw@...> wrote:
> > Hi All! > I once had access to Xerox 4125 laser printer that could lay down very dense traces for toner transfer when the print density was turned up.. > You may well try to find a used one on eBay or Craigs list... > Regards > Mike > > > > ________________________________ > From: Leon Heller <leon355@...> > To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2011 8:50 PM > Subject: Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Best Printer for photo process ? > > > Â > On 28/12/2011 14:13, marc wrote: > > HI > > > > i made lot of search on the forum > > and not find clear answer about the best printer > > for make photo process Transparency ? > > lot of talk but for toner transfer not photo > > > > my laser printer on mg chemical film was not dark egnof > > > > i see some epson laser jet whit black-max ink and rip software > > but i never see any post here about it ? > > > > sine i do this for semi professional i have bit of budget > > but look for cheaper that buy mega-uk photoploter > > I get excellent results with an HP 5940 and Mega Electronics Premium > JetStar film. It's a cheap printer. > > Leon > -- > Leon Heller > G1HSM > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >
2011-12-30 by marc
Hi Bertho and all for now my Dell 3010cn have good resolution on mg chemical paper but on bright lamp dark area look Gray but uniform i will try a epson NX400 soon (just need tu buy back ink cartrige) i have order some microfiche diazo duplicator film hope to be able to use laser transparency as master for the diazo and use diazo for my pcb exposure like in bigger shop but my final target was find printer that able to print quality transparency that was good and reliable for 6 mil trace/space Best regard Marc Lalonde --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Boman33" <boman33@...> wrote:
> > Hi Marc, > > I started testing different printers, inks, settings and media but ran out > of time before finalizing the data. 3 printers * 5 media * varying ink > settings = lots of data. Unfortunately work is interfering with my hobbies. > > > > I did create a carefully designed test chart that allowed me to properly > measure the spectral density and resolution of the different combinations. > See: > > http://www.vinland.com/USAF-1951.html > > > > Happy hunting and please let us know what you come up with. > > > > It would be interesting if people could mail me a sample of their best > combination artwork printed using my test chart so I could measure it and > include it in the final data and we would get a side by sided comparison of > different systems. > > Bertho > > > > From: marc Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2011 09:14 > > > > HI > i made lot of search on the forum > and not find clear answer about the best printer > for make photo process Transparency ? > lot of talk but for toner transfer not photo > > my laser printer on mg chemical film was not dark egnof > > i see some epson laser jet whit black-max ink and rip software > but i never see any post here about it ? > > sine i do this for semi professional i have bit of budget > but look for cheaper that buy mega-uk photoploter > Best regard > Marc Lalonde > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >
2011-12-30 by marc
HI Robby that look really nice think that sublimation printer may have good result even if i have some budget for have just selling all my lpkf equipment not sure that i will buy printer for be fist one to test it ;-) Best regard Marc Lalonde Alphatronique inc. --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Robert" <oceanartscasino@...> wrote:
> > I thought I saw a recommendation for the Ricoh 7000 somewhere... > > it's around $900 (new) > > > a less expensive and not as fine dpi but Kyocera 1320 looks pretty good, around $400 (new) > > > I haven't tried either of these but looking at the specs I would guess they would do exeptionally well, especially the Ricoh. > > > neither has a built in copier though. > > > Robby > > > > > > --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, michael tenore <wb2lcw@> wrote: > > > > Hi All! > > I once had access to Xerox 4125 laser printer that could lay down very dense traces for toner transfer when the print density was turned up.. > > You may well try to find a used one on eBay or Craigs list... > > Regards > > Mike > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > From: Leon Heller <leon355@> > > To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com > > Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2011 8:50 PM > > Subject: Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Best Printer for photo process ? > > > > > > Â > > On 28/12/2011 14:13, marc wrote: > > > HI > > > > > > i made lot of search on the forum > > > and not find clear answer about the best printer > > > for make photo process Transparency ? > > > lot of talk but for toner transfer not photo > > > > > > my laser printer on mg chemical film was not dark egnof > > > > > > i see some epson laser jet whit black-max ink and rip software > > > but i never see any post here about it ? > > > > > > sine i do this for semi professional i have bit of budget > > > but look for cheaper that buy mega-uk photoploter > > > > I get excellent results with an HP 5940 and Mega Electronics Premium > > JetStar film. It's a cheap printer. > > > > Leon > > -- > > Leon Heller > > G1HSM > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > >
2011-12-30 by Boman33
Marc, It sounds like we have been traveling down the same roads. I also used to use Diazo for the final artwork but like you, I am hoping for direct printing of the artwork. I normally send out the artwork and get commercial boards made but for test fixtures, RF striplines and other testing, a quick in-house setup would be desirable. Bertho
From: marc Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2011 21:43 Hi Bertho and all for now my Dell 3010cn have good resolution on mg chemical paper but on bright lamp dark area look Gray but uniform i will try a epson NX400 soon (just need tu buy back ink cartrige) i have order some microfiche diazo duplicator film hope to be able to use laser transparency as master for the diazo and use diazo for my pcb exposure like in bigger shop but my final target was find printer that able to print quality transparency that was good and reliable for 6 mil trace/space Best regard Marc Lalonde _,___ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
2011-12-30 by Robert
LPKF is some good stuff I read about, kinda pricey for me though, about as close to the machine/router as I want to spend (time and $) is a RepRap for plastic parts (I could make my own stand offs for mounting boards). I figure the photo process has a chance for much finer detail (with the right set up) and there's no need to convert files for milling (drilling though I guess the LPKF would come in handy). anything would be an improvement for for me considering my antiquated and tedious mostly manual hand tracing/scribing etch pen and carbon paper technique. one thing about it though, when you put that much work into a board it really becomes a thing of pride. several boards like that I made from the August 1980 Radio-Electronics 11 part/month construction article series "Build Your Own Robot For Under $400" or Unicorn-1 Robot as it was titled within the article's text. the first few sections of the series are on scribd here: http://www.scribd.com/doc/3231860/Unicorn1-Robot-Articles-in-Radio-Electronics- another link with lots of photos here: http://www.theoldrobots.com/Unicorn.html the most challenging board I remember was a double sided DTMF decoder circuit with 8 trimmer pots for tuning the frequencies of the 16 tones. the circuit was then connected to a simple fm receiver for 16 different on-off controls, a pair could be combined to have forward/reverse switching for the 12v Dc motors. pretty basic and the FCC has changed the rules since the article was originally published regarding the fm frequency used (just change to a legal public use frequency), but the DTMF decoder is still one heck of a nice circuit because of the old analog trimmer pots! you can tune the MF custom for almost no chance of interference (at least from stray wandering DTMF tones, however unlikely). this board was finished and all the parts soldered (with sockets for all ICs, I still have to buy the chips, hopefully I can find) some 25 or more years ago: http://casino13.deviantart.com/art/DTMF-decoder-pc-board-102262741 sorry about the poor focus (I really need a tripod), and the photo was taken after so many years so the board traces show a little tarnish (along with dust particles on the components), I really should desolder everything and clean the board with a scotch pad and maybe think about trying to make some kind of simple plating bath. anyway I'm a little exited this evening because I just took delivery of a Motorola R1150E Code Synthesizer II in perfect minty condition! and was able to download the manual, unit powered on and passed all tests as outlined in the book! the 1150 can produce just about any tone or combination of tone, custom tones, etc., that can really help when tuning this old board (after 25 years! if I can find the chips, can't remember but I think they're just 555 timers, common, and 7400 logic series, not sure which exactly, misplaced the article but I'll find it at some point.) I may be slow but I'm not a quitter... Robby --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "marc" <mlalonde@...> wrote:
> > HI Robby > > that look really nice > think that sublimation printer may have good result > > even if i have some budget for have just selling all my lpkf equipment > not sure that i will buy printer for be fist one to test it ;-) > > > Best regard > Marc Lalonde > Alphatronique inc. > > --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Robert" <oceanartscasino@> wrote: > > > > I thought I saw a recommendation for the Ricoh 7000 somewhere... > > > > it's around $900 (new) > > > > > > a less expensive and not as fine dpi but Kyocera 1320 looks pretty good, around $400 (new) > > > > > > I haven't tried either of these but looking at the specs I would guess they would do exeptionally well, especially the Ricoh. > > > > > > neither has a built in copier though. > > > > > > Robby > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, michael tenore <wb2lcw@> wrote: > > > > > > Hi All! > > > I once had access to Xerox 4125 laser printer that could lay down very dense traces for toner transfer when the print density was turned up.. > > > You may well try to find a used one on eBay or Craigs list... > > > Regards > > > Mike > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > > From: Leon Heller <leon355@> > > > To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com > > > Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2011 8:50 PM > > > Subject: Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Best Printer for photo process ? > > > > > > > > > Â > > > On 28/12/2011 14:13, marc wrote: > > > > HI > > > > > > > > i made lot of search on the forum > > > > and not find clear answer about the best printer > > > > for make photo process Transparency ? > > > > lot of talk but for toner transfer not photo > > > > > > > > my laser printer on mg chemical film was not dark egnof > > > > > > > > i see some epson laser jet whit black-max ink and rip software > > > > but i never see any post here about it ? > > > > > > > > sine i do this for semi professional i have bit of budget > > > > but look for cheaper that buy mega-uk photoploter > > > > > > I get excellent results with an HP 5940 and Mega Electronics Premium > > > JetStar film. It's a cheap printer. > > > > > > Leon > > > -- > > > Leon Heller > > > G1HSM > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > >
2011-12-30 by marc
Hi Robby buy my lpkf in 2004 (milling,plating,multilayer press) and yes it very expensive cost price of a nice car ;-) i find quickly that for be reliable it need to stay 8 mil and more even if lpkf rate it for 4 mil trace ,it doable but tool was out of price 25$ for bit that last 3 linear meter !! ,if do 8mil tool was 7$ and do near 30 linear meter ,and not talk about copper dust even if milling was reliable it take time and have vaccum cleaner for dust removal running so big noise on shop for ~8 hour per board and you not have solder mask ,this become problem Whit QFN ,BGA so i find that it was time to move to photo process open possibility to etch solder-past stencil in house and have Proto pcb whit mask so it may made whit past /reflow for now seem that my limitation for photo was film printer and find way to not etch my via ;-) my target was reliable 6 mil trace/space whit under 2000$ invesment you boar look nice for hand draft and 20 year old Best regard Marc Lalonde Alphatronique inc. --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Robert" <oceanartscasino@...> wrote:
> > LPKF is some good stuff I read about, > > kinda pricey for me though, about as close to the machine/router as I want to spend (time and $) is a RepRap for plastic parts (I could make my own stand offs for mounting boards). > > I figure the photo process has a chance for much finer detail (with the right set up) and there's no need to convert files for milling (drilling though I guess the LPKF would come in handy). > > anything would be an improvement for for me considering my antiquated and tedious mostly manual hand tracing/scribing etch pen and carbon paper technique. > > one thing about it though, when you put that much work into a board it really becomes a thing of pride. several boards like that I made from the August 1980 Radio-Electronics 11 part/month construction article series "Build Your Own Robot For Under $400" or Unicorn-1 Robot as it was titled within the article's text. the first few sections of the series are on scribd here: > > http://www.scribd.com/doc/3231860/Unicorn1-Robot-Articles-in-Radio-Electronics- > > another link with lots of photos here: > > http://www.theoldrobots.com/Unicorn.html > > > the most challenging board I remember was a double sided DTMF decoder circuit with 8 trimmer pots for tuning the frequencies of the 16 tones. the circuit was then connected to a simple fm receiver for 16 different on-off controls, a pair could be combined to have forward/reverse switching for the 12v Dc motors. pretty basic and the FCC has changed the rules since the article was originally published regarding the fm frequency used (just change to a legal public use frequency), but the DTMF decoder is still one heck of a nice circuit because of the old analog trimmer pots! you can tune the MF custom for almost no chance of interference (at least from stray wandering DTMF tones, however unlikely). this board was finished and all the parts soldered (with sockets for all ICs, I still have to buy the chips, hopefully I can find) some 25 or more years ago: > > http://casino13.deviantart.com/art/DTMF-decoder-pc-board-102262741 > > sorry about the poor focus (I really need a tripod), and the photo was taken after so many years so the board traces show a little tarnish (along with dust particles on the components), I really should desolder everything and clean the board with a scotch pad and maybe think about trying to make some kind of simple plating bath. > > anyway I'm a little exited this evening because I just took delivery of a Motorola R1150E Code Synthesizer II in perfect minty condition! > > and was able to download the manual, unit powered on and passed all tests as outlined in the book! > > the 1150 can produce just about any tone or combination of tone, custom tones, etc., that can really help when tuning this old board (after 25 years! if I can find the chips, can't remember but I think they're just 555 timers, common, and 7400 logic series, not sure which exactly, misplaced the article but I'll find it at some point.) > > I may be slow but I'm not a quitter... > > Robby > > > > --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "marc" <mlalonde@> wrote: > > > > HI Robby > > > > that look really nice > > think that sublimation printer may have good result > > > > even if i have some budget for have just selling all my lpkf equipment > > not sure that i will buy printer for be fist one to test it ;-) > > > > > > Best regard > > Marc Lalonde > > Alphatronique inc. > > > > --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Robert" <oceanartscasino@> wrote: > > > > > > I thought I saw a recommendation for the Ricoh 7000 somewhere... > > > > > > it's around $900 (new) > > > > > > > > > a less expensive and not as fine dpi but Kyocera 1320 looks pretty good, around $400 (new) > > > > > > > > > I haven't tried either of these but looking at the specs I would guess they would do exeptionally well, especially the Ricoh. > > > > > > > > > neither has a built in copier though. > > > > > > > > > Robby > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In Homebrew_PCBs@...m, michael tenore <wb2lcw@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Hi All! > > > > I once had access to Xerox 4125 laser printer that could lay down very dense traces for toner transfer when the print density was turned up.. > > > > You may well try to find a used one on eBay or Craigs list... > > > > Regards > > > > Mike > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > > > From: Leon Heller <leon355@> > > > > To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com > > > > Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2011 8:50 PM > > > > Subject: Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Best Printer for photo process ? > > > > > > > > > > > > Â > > > > On 28/12/2011 14:13, marc wrote: > > > > > HI > > > > > > > > > > i made lot of search on the forum > > > > > and not find clear answer about the best printer > > > > > for make photo process Transparency ? > > > > > lot of talk but for toner transfer not photo > > > > > > > > > > my laser printer on mg chemical film was not dark egnof > > > > > > > > > > i see some epson laser jet whit black-max ink and rip software > > > > > but i never see any post here about it ? > > > > > > > > > > sine i do this for semi professional i have bit of budget > > > > > but look for cheaper that buy mega-uk photoploter > > > > > > > > I get excellent results with an HP 5940 and Mega Electronics Premium > > > > JetStar film. It's a cheap printer. > > > > > > > > Leon > > > > -- > > > > Leon Heller > > > > G1HSM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > >
2011-12-31 by clausundercover
Has anyone tried making negatives with medical imaging printers? Those that print out x-rays. I was watching some kodak dryview on e-bay and they are around 250-750 and maybe there are others, and I think maybe these printers may compete with lkpf and pro products since they print on photo film. Then if it works there is a question of films, chemicals, etc... --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Robert" <oceanartscasino@...> wrote: >[snip]
2011-12-31 by marc
HI
Medical film printer i see was limited to 325DPI
it use kind of thermal film so good process but lack of resolution ..
I just but a new xerox solid-ink "Wax" printer
1-) True 2400DPI resolution
2-) ink was wax so it etch and for sure developer resist to
i see on this forum many user use very thin pcb on that printer
for direct pcb printing whit good result
but my idea was use a exposed DIAZO film (microfiche)
then develop it ,wax will serve as developer resist
so result will be 2400 DPI diazo film just like real pcb shop ;-)
3-) this printer use full length printing head so dot registration
was perfect ,it actually print image on rotating drum then
transfer it to the paper ,this was made a quite low temperature
(65DeG c) so this may not pose problem of film shrink
4-) it quite easy to transform it in all back printer by loading
Black ink block on all 4 tray ,so by manipulate the postscrip image it possible to have 4 wax dot think by pixel ,so in theory 3 time more opaque dark
5-)if all above fail A4 size drum will make a perfect drum for
a DIY protoplotter ,since it well balanced ,have servo motor for drive it and knot it precise position
will post result when i receive/test the printer
if some one was interested this was in deep explanation of how this printer work , that reading tell me that it may make real nice artwork printer for pcb ..
http://www.imaging.org/ist/resources/tutorials/solid_ink.cfm
Best regard
Marc Lalonde
Alphatronique inc.
--- In Homebrew_PCBs@...m, "clausundercover" <cclaus@...> wrote:> > Has anyone tried making negatives with medical imaging printers? Those that print out x-rays. > I was watching some kodak dryview on e-bay and they are around 250-750 and maybe there are others, and I think maybe these printers may compete with lkpf and pro products since they print on photo film. > Then if it works there is a question of films, chemicals, etc... > > --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Robert" <oceanartscasino@> wrote: > >[snip] >
2012-01-01 by DJ Delorie
I've had excellent results with my Epson R280 (Claria black) and Jetstar Premium film. However, the printer quality is now high enough that the software's efforts to deal with low quality paper is the limiting factor, so I ended up writing my own software. Here's a sample 5/5 board I did with inkjet: http://www.delorie.com/pcb/inkjet/insanity_II.html and some other photos: http://www.delorie.com/pcb/inkjet/inkmask-via-f.html http://www.delorie.com/electronics/sdram/sdram-toppcb.html (6/6)
2012-01-01 by MIKE DURKIN
Software? Share it? I have a R300 ... To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
From: dj@...
Date: Sun, 1 Jan 2012 12:53:49 -0500
Subject: Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Best Printer for photo process ?
I've had excellent results with my Epson R280 (Claria black) and Jetstar
Premium film. However, the printer quality is now high enough that the
software's efforts to deal with low quality paper is the limiting
factor, so I ended up writing my own software.
Here's a sample 5/5 board I did with inkjet:
http://www.delorie.com/pcb/inkjet/insanity_II.html
and some other photos:
http://www.delorie.com/pcb/inkjet/inkmask-via-f.html
http://www.delorie.com/electronics/sdram/sdram-toppcb.html (6/6)
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]2012-01-01 by Boman33
Happy New Year to All! Very, very nice DJ! Is the software available? Is it a Gerber driver or does it take a TIFF file? Either one is OK. Bertho
From: DJ Delorie Sent: Sunday, January 01, 2012 12:54 I've had excellent results with my Epson R280 (Claria black) and Jetstar Premium film. However, the printer quality is now high enough that the software's efforts to deal with low quality paper is the limiting factor, so I ended up writing my own software. Here's a sample 5/5 board I did with inkjet: http://www.delorie.com/pcb/inkjet/insanity_II.html and some other photos: http://www.delorie.com/pcb/inkjet/inkmask-via-f.html http://www.delorie.com/electronics/sdram/sdram-toppcb.html (6/6) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
2012-01-01 by bebx2000
You might try fuse-on-foil http://www.ctgraphic.com/info/brochure/Foil%20Fuser%20Q&A.pdf http://www.papilio.com/includes/pdf/other/MTF.pdf I came across a forum link (long since lost) advocating the silver foil to make black toner areas absolutely opaque on transparencies.I bought some and it works just like Pulsar Green Foil to seal toner on PCBs to eliminate etching pinhole problems. Baxter --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "marc" <mlalonde@...> wrote: > my laser printer on mg chemical film was not dark egnof >
2012-01-02 by DJ Delorie
I've shared it before... http://www.delorie.com/pcb/pbm2escp2.zip Converts PBM files to raw ESCP2 files. If you're a windows user, you'll have to figure out how to dump that binary file to your printer without windows "interpreting" it.
2012-01-02 by Boman33
Thanks!!
From: DJ Delorie Sent: Sunday, January 01, 2012 20:33 I've shared it before... http://www.delorie.com/pcb/pbm2escp2.zip Converts PBM files to raw ESCP2 files. If you're a windows user, you'll have to figure out how to dump that binary file to your printer without windows "interpreting" it. __ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
2012-01-02 by gulick_steve
Hi Is their metallic films actually conductive? If so, it might provide a start for direct printing of circuitry on paper or film. If too thin on not conductive enough, maybe it could be used further electroplate copper on the transferred foil traces Steve --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "bebx2000" <bebx2000@...> wrote:
> > > > > > > You might try fuse-on-foil > > http://www.ctgraphic.com/info/brochure/Foil%20Fuser%20Q&A.pdf > > http://www.papilio.com/includes/pdf/other/MTF.pdf > > I came across a forum link (long since lost) advocating the silver foil to make black toner areas absolutely opaque on transparencies.I bought some and it works just like Pulsar Green Foil to seal toner on PCBs to eliminate etching pinhole problems. > > Baxter > > > --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "marc" <mlalonde@> wrote: > > > my laser printer on mg chemical film was not dark egnof > > >
2012-01-03 by bebx2000
Hi Steve, I don't think it is conductive. The areas over the laser print actually fuse into the toner so it is some form of plastic that has an affinity for toner. After you run a piece of foil taped to your laser print through your laminator, the piece of foil will have clear areas where it stuck to the toner. Baxter --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "gulick_steve" <sgulick@...> wrote:
> > Hi > Is their metallic films actually conductive? If so, it might provide a start for direct printing of circuitry on paper or film. If too thin on not conductive enough, maybe it could be used further electroplate copper on the transferred foil traces > > Steve
2012-01-04 by marc
HI just make my first test on the Xerox solid ink printer (collor-cube 8570n) that was shame , noting close to 2400dip claimed by xerox this was same pcb image print wit dell laser printer (600DPI) and whit the Xerox for comparaison (transparency over white sheet).. http://www.alphatronique.com/XEROX.JPG http://www.alphatronique.com/dell.JPG only good thing is that black was really black this was also image from Xerox print on paper of a QFN 0.5mm pitch http://www.alphatronique.com/tqfp.JPG some trace close up ... http://www.alphatronique.com/trace.JPG so i still need to find a better printer once again Best regard Marc Lalonde Alphatronique inc. --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "marc" <mlalonde@...> wrote:
> > HI > > Medical film printer i see was limited to 325DPI > > it use kind of thermal film so good process but lack of resolution .. > > > > I just but a new xerox solid-ink "Wax" printer > > 1-) True 2400DPI resolution > > 2-) ink was wax so it etch and for sure developer resist to > i see on this forum many user use very thin pcb on that printer > for direct pcb printing whit good result > but my idea was use a exposed DIAZO film (microfiche) > then develop it ,wax will serve as developer resist > so result will be 2400 DPI diazo film just like real pcb shop ;-) > > 3-) this printer use full length printing head so dot registration > was perfect ,it actually print image on rotating drum then > transfer it to the paper ,this was made a quite low temperature > (65DeG c) so this may not pose problem of film shrink > > 4-) it quite easy to transform it in all back printer by loading > Black ink block on all 4 tray ,so by manipulate the postscrip image it possible to have 4 wax dot think by pixel ,so in theory 3 time more opaque dark > > 5-)if all above fail A4 size drum will make a perfect drum for > a DIY protoplotter ,since it well balanced ,have servo motor for drive it and knot it precise position > > will post result when i receive/test the printer > > if some one was interested this was in deep explanation of how this printer work , that reading tell me that it may make real nice artwork printer for pcb .. > > http://www.imaging.org/ist/resources/tutorials/solid_ink.cfm > > > Best regard > Marc Lalonde > Alphatronique inc. > > --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "clausundercover" <cclaus@> wrote: > > > > Has anyone tried making negatives with medical imaging printers? Those that print out x-rays. > > I was watching some kodak dryview on e-bay and they are around 250-750 and maybe there are others, and I think maybe these printers may compete with lkpf and pro products since they print on photo film. > > Then if it works there is a question of films, chemicals, etc... > > > > --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Robert" <oceanartscasino@> wrote: > > >[snip] > > >
2012-01-04 by MIKE DURKIN
What image was sent to the printer? I need to make some QFN .5 TOO... IM still going to try a R300, Maybe 4 passes and 4 bakes .... don't know. To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
From: mlalonde@...
Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2012 18:57:16 +0000
Subject: [Homebrew_PCBs] Solid ink printer follow-up ...
HI
just make my first test on the Xerox solid ink printer
(collor-cube 8570n)
that was shame , noting close to 2400dip claimed by xerox
this was same pcb image print wit dell laser printer (600DPI)
and whit the Xerox for comparaison (transparency over white sheet)..
http://www.alphatronique.com/XEROX.JPG
http://www.alphatronique.com/dell.JPG
only good thing is that black was really black
this was also image from Xerox print on paper of a QFN 0.5mm pitch
http://www.alphatronique.com/tqfp.JPG
some trace close up ...
http://www.alphatronique.com/trace.JPG
so i still need to find a better printer once again
Best regard
Marc Lalonde
Alphatronique inc.
--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "marc" <mlalonde@...> wrote:
>
> HI
>
> Medical film printer i see was limited to 325DPI
>
> it use kind of thermal film so good process but lack of resolution ..
>
>
>
> I just but a new xerox solid-ink "Wax" printer
>
> 1-) True 2400DPI resolution
>
> 2-) ink was wax so it etch and for sure developer resist to
> i see on this forum many user use very thin pcb on that printer
> for direct pcb printing whit good result
> but my idea was use a exposed DIAZO film (microfiche)
> then develop it ,wax will serve as developer resist
> so result will be 2400 DPI diazo film just like real pcb shop ;-)
>
> 3-) this printer use full length printing head so dot registration
> was perfect ,it actually print image on rotating drum then
> transfer it to the paper ,this was made a quite low temperature
> (65DeG c) so this may not pose problem of film shrink
>
> 4-) it quite easy to transform it in all back printer by loading
> Black ink block on all 4 tray ,so by manipulate the postscrip image it possible to have 4 wax dot think by pixel ,so in theory 3 time more opaque dark
>
> 5-)if all above fail A4 size drum will make a perfect drum for
> a DIY protoplotter ,since it well balanced ,have servo motor for drive it and knot it precise position
>
> will post result when i receive/test the printer
>
> if some one was interested this was in deep explanation of how this printer work , that reading tell me that it may make real nice artwork printer for pcb ..
>
> http://www.imaging.org/ist/resources/tutorials/solid_ink.cfm
>
>
> Best regard
> Marc Lalonde
> Alphatronique inc.
>
> --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "clausundercover" <cclaus@> wrote:
> >
> > Has anyone tried making negatives with medical imaging printers? Those that print out x-rays.
> > I was watching some kodak dryview on e-bay and they are around 250-750 and maybe there are others, and I think maybe these printers may compete with lkpf and pro products since they print on photo film.
> > Then if it works there is a question of films, chemicals, etc...
> >
> > --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Robert" <oceanartscasino@> wrote:
> > >[snip]
> >
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]2012-01-04 by marc
HI image was print direct from my Cad Software (P-CAD 2006) trough the xerox postscript print driver if print in PDF then print the pdf seem to have bit better image but still not usable for any 0.5 pitch smt on microscope look like printer use kind of dithering that look good on color picture (photo print) but for pcb my old Dell 3010CN laser was far better i see futureshop have sale on epson nx625 for 50$ so this time it will less expensive test ;-) Best regard Marc Lalonde --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, MIKE DURKIN <Patriot121@...> wrote:
> > What image was sent to the printer? > I need to make some QFN .5 TOO... > > IM still going to try a R300, Maybe 4 passes and 4 bakes .... don't know. > > To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com > From: mlalonde@... > Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2012 18:57:16 +0000 > Subject: [Homebrew_PCBs] Solid ink printer follow-up ... > > > >
2012-01-04 by MIKE DURKIN
Wonder if dithering can be turned off in my R300 .... To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
From: mlalonde@...
Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2012 20:49:20 +0000
Subject: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: Solid ink printer follow-up ...
HI
image was print direct from my Cad Software (P-CAD 2006)
trough the xerox postscript print driver
if print in PDF then print the pdf seem to have bit better
image but still not usable for any 0.5 pitch smt
on microscope look like printer use kind of dithering
that look good on color picture (photo print)
but for pcb my old Dell 3010CN laser was far better
i see futureshop have sale on epson nx625 for 50$
so this time it will less expensive test ;-)
Best regard
Marc Lalonde
--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, MIKE DURKIN <Patriot121@...> wrote:
>
> What image was sent to the printer?
> I need to make some QFN .5 TOO...
>
> IM still going to try a R300, Maybe 4 passes and 4 bakes .... don't know.
>
> To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
> From: mlalonde@...
> Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2012 18:57:16 +0000
> Subject: [Homebrew_PCBs] Solid ink printer follow-up ...
>
>
>
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]2012-01-05 by DJ Delorie
MIKE DURKIN <Patriot121@...> writes: > Wonder if dithering can be turned off in my R300 .... If the R300 is like my R280, the dithering is done by software on the PC. I use my own software which doesn't dither, and get "perfect" 2880 DPI prints (assuming the film can handle that much ink without smearing).
2012-01-05 by MIKE DURKIN
The one you shared ... I hope so ... Perhaps not a solid print ... bake then repeat to keep from smearing ... To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
From: dj@...
Date: Thu, 5 Jan 2012 00:05:22 -0500
Subject: Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: Solid ink printer follow-up ...
MIKE DURKIN <Patriot121@...> writes:
> Wonder if dithering can be turned off in my R300 ....
If the R300 is like my R280, the dithering is done by software on the
PC. I use my own software which doesn't dither, and get "perfect" 2880
DPI prints (assuming the film can handle that much ink without
smearing).
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]2012-01-05 by alex4459jopiklal44
try with red .. I had the same with a cannon. that claimed 2400 ..but they all have a smaller resolution in black when you read the specs. and they often have a lower resolution in the other direction.. that means, as I see it ,that it is the lowest resolution that count.. so I printet a B/W with my new cannon.. looked like yours.. but then with red it was better than my old HP 710. I can see it when it is etched.. the edges is much sharper. and red gives perfect stop from the UV.. yellow and blue did not stop as well. alex my printer is the cannon IP4850 and I print on transparancy and use precoated boards , expose with uv in 3 minutes .I can do 5 mil traces and clearance, at least over 5x2cm without any fault.
> > just make my first test on the Xerox solid ink printer > (collor-cube 8570n) > > that was shame , noting close to 2400dip claimed by xerox > this was same pcb image print wit dell laser printer (600DPI) > and whit the Xerox for comparaison (transparency over white sheet).. >
2012-01-05 by DJ Delorie
MIKE DURKIN <Patriot121@...> writes: > Perhaps not a solid print ... bake then repeat to keep from smearing ... When I got my latest films, I had to add a dithering option to reduce ink away from the edges to keep it from smearing. I'm not sure I could reprint with any hope of alignment accuracy. Perhaps you could do two films, the first with a clean dark edge and less ink in the middles, the second with the edges moved back (i.e. shrink everything) so it's less sensitive to misalignment. You'd of course put the shrunk one on top so the more accurate edge is closer to the copper.
2012-01-06 by AlienRelics
It is about blocking UV, too. Black is fairly light resistant and so does not really need UV blockers, whereas the colors have more sensitivity to it. Depending on the exact ink formulation, particular brands may put more UV inhibitors in different colors. In your Canon, apparently Magenta has more UV inhibitors. I've read of others having even more luck with 6 color CcMmYK printers, using light colored green prints because it uses the photo inks to print it, and the photo inks have a lot of UV inhibitors due to their increased sensitivity to fading. Steve Greenfield AE7HD --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "alex4459jopiklal44" <christiansen_alex@...> wrote:
> > > try with red .. > I had the same with a cannon. that claimed 2400 ..but they all have a smaller resolution in black when you read the specs. and they often have a lower resolution in the other direction.. that means, as I see it ,that it is the lowest resolution that count.. so I printet a B/W with my new cannon.. looked like yours.. but then with red it was better than my old HP 710. I can see it when it is etched.. the edges is much sharper. and red gives perfect stop from the UV.. yellow and blue did not stop as well. > alex > my printer is the cannon IP4850 and I print on transparancy and use precoated boards , expose with uv in 3 minutes .I can do 5 mil traces and clearance, at least over 5x2cm without any fault. > > > > > just make my first test on the Xerox solid ink printer > > (collor-cube 8570n) > > > > that was shame , noting close to 2400dip claimed by xerox > > this was same pcb image print wit dell laser printer (600DPI) > > and whit the Xerox for comparaison (transparency over white sheet).. > > >
2012-01-07 by DJ Delorie
"AlienRelics" <alienrelics@...> writes: > It is about blocking UV, too. Black is fairly light resistant and so > does not really need UV blockers, whereas the colors have more > sensitivity to it. I tested all six of my (Claria) inks. Black and Yellow blocked UV just fine, but yellow didn't dry fast enough (and was hard to see when you try to line it up on the board). The other four colors were completely transparent to UV. Black it is.