Homebrew PCBs

I just made my very first PCB at home!!!  Hooray!

http://www.instructables.com/id/Easy-to-build-CNC-Mill-Stepper-Motor-and-Driver-ci/
I made the "Easy Stepper" board from Instructables, and could not easily get etchant out where I live, so I used the toilet bowl cleaner/peroxide mix.  Worked quite well, actually.

And, I did it as LASER toner transfer, using magazine paper.  Talk about low tech!

Apparently it really *is* possible to make boards, at home, and affordably.  Next step is going to be drilling them out.

I have 1/16" drill bits that would fit my drill press, or my Dremel...and I have a 0.7mm solid carbide bit that fits either as well.  My concern is runout and precision...carbide is very VERY brittle, and I have only one bit.

Any hints for a first timer?

THANKS!

Chuck

Great work on that first board, can you send pics for us to see? I would
suggest using a quality drill press that does not flex much when the
drilling. I also switched to the thinner FR-4 to make it easier to drill.
Does not help you with your first board, but think about. I use a micromark
single-speed drill. I was not successful in using a dremel + dremel stand to
drill my boards without breaking a least a few carbide bits.


Again, great to hear about your success!

Chris


On Sat, Oct 15, 2011 at 9:13 PM, Chuck <c.knight@...> wrote:

> **
>
>
> I just made my very first PCB at home!!! Hooray!
>
>
> http://www.instructables.com/id/Easy-to-build-CNC-Mill-Stepper-Motor-and-Driver-ci/
> I made the "Easy Stepper" board from Instructables, and could not easily
> get etchant out where I live, so I used the toilet bowl cleaner/peroxide
> mix. Worked quite well, actually.
>
> And, I did it as LASER toner transfer, using magazine paper. Talk about low
> tech!
>
> Apparently it really *is* possible to make boards, at home, and affordably.
> Next step is going to be drilling them out.
>
> I have 1/16" drill bits that would fit my drill press, or my Dremel...and I
> have a 0.7mm solid carbide bit that fits either as well. My concern is
> runout and precision...carbide is very VERY brittle, and I have only one
> bit.
>
> Any hints for a first timer?
>
> THANKS!
>
> Chuck
>
>  
>



-- 
Chris Kleeschulte
KK4DYJ


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Chuck
If you are only doing a few PCBs then HSS drills are cheap enough to throw away after each board drilled.
I use a Missed Hole drill I made from a 12V DC motor and a pin chuck for the odd hole, or you could build one of your own. Photos in my album MParker-Lisberg:
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Homebrew_PCBs/photos/album/783475915/pic/list> 
and video at:
<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AhlRkO0EcFo>

You need a low run out and no spindle feed backlash to use carbide drills..

Malcolm

I don't suffer from insanity I enjoy it!

--- On Sun, 10/16/11, Chuck <c.knight@...> wrote:

From: Chuck <c.knight@...>
Subject: [Homebrew_PCBs] VERY FIRST PCB -- SUCCESSFUL!!!
To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
Date: Sunday, October 16, 2011, 2:13 AM








 



  


    
      
      
      I just made my very first PCB at home!!!  Hooray!



http://www.instructables.com/id/Easy-to-build-CNC-Mill-Stepper-Motor-and-Driver-ci/

I made the "Easy Stepper" board from Instructables, and could not easily get etchant out where I live, so I used the toilet bowl cleaner/peroxide mix.  Worked quite well, actually.



And, I did it as LASER toner transfer, using magazine paper.  Talk about low tech!



Apparently it really *is* possible to make boards, at home, and affordably.  Next step is going to be drilling them out.



I have 1/16" drill bits that would fit my drill press, or my Dremel...and I have a 0.7mm solid carbide bit that fits either as well.  My concern is runout and precision...carbide is very VERY brittle, and I have only one bit.



Any hints for a first timer?



THANKS!



Chuck





    
     

    
    






  





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

when i visit the dentist i ask for all his used drills, they make some quite small.



________________________________

From: Chuck <c.knight@...>
To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, October 15, 2011 8:13 PM
Subject: [Homebrew_PCBs] VERY FIRST PCB -- SUCCESSFUL!!!


  
I just made my very first PCB at home!!!  Hooray!

http://www.instructables.com/id/Easy-to-build-CNC-Mill-Stepper-Motor-and-Driver-ci/
I made the "Easy Stepper" board from Instructables, and could not easily get etchant out where I live, so I used the toilet bowl cleaner/peroxide mix.  Worked quite well, actually.

And, I did it as LASER toner transfer, using magazine paper.  Talk about low tech!

Apparently it really *is* possible to make boards, at home, and affordably.  Next step is going to be drilling them out.

I have 1/16" drill bits that would fit my drill press, or my Dremel...and I have a 0.7mm solid carbide bit that fits either as well.  My concern is runout and precision...carbide is very VERY brittle, and I have only one bit.

Any hints for a first timer?

THANKS!

Chuck


 

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

i should have said drill BITS.



________________________________

From: Chuck <c.knight@...>
To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, October 15, 2011 8:13 PM
Subject: [Homebrew_PCBs] VERY FIRST PCB -- SUCCESSFUL!!!


  
I just made my very first PCB at home!!!  Hooray!

http://www.instructables.com/id/Easy-to-build-CNC-Mill-Stepper-Motor-and-Driver-ci/
I made the "Easy Stepper" board from Instructables, and could not easily get etchant out where I live, so I used the toilet bowl cleaner/peroxide mix.  Worked quite well, actually.

And, I did it as LASER toner transfer, using magazine paper.  Talk about low tech!

Apparently it really *is* possible to make boards, at home, and affordably.  Next step is going to be drilling them out.

I have 1/16" drill bits that would fit my drill press, or my Dremel...and I have a 0.7mm solid carbide bit that fits either as well.  My concern is runout and precision...carbide is very VERY brittle, and I have only one bit.

Any hints for a first timer?

THANKS!

Chuck


 

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I would suggest to drill before etching. This way less chance of a snag 
on the pad and pulling the copper off. Run the drill with a high speed 
and drill slowly.

There are places you can order up small drill bits as well - 
mcmaster.com for one.

Derek Koonce
DDK Interactive Consulting Services




On 10/17/2011 1:21 PM, pebo festus wrote:
>
> when i visit the dentist i ask for all his used drills, they make some 
> quite small.
>
> ________________________________
> From: Chuck <c.knight@... <mailto:c.knight%40juno.com>>
> To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com <mailto:Homebrew_PCBs%40yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Saturday, October 15, 2011 8:13 PM
> Subject: [Homebrew_PCBs] VERY FIRST PCB -- SUCCESSFUL!!!
>
>
> I just made my very first PCB at home!!! Hooray!
>
> http://www.instructables.com/id/Easy-to-build-CNC-Mill-Stepper-Motor-and-Driver-ci/
> I made the "Easy Stepper" board from Instructables, and could not 
> easily get etchant out where I live, so I used the toilet bowl 
> cleaner/peroxide mix. Worked quite well, actually.
>
> And, I did it as LASER toner transfer, using magazine paper. Talk 
> about low tech!
>
> Apparently it really *is* possible to make boards, at home, and 
> affordably. Next step is going to be drilling them out.
>
> I have 1/16" drill bits that would fit my drill press, or my 
> Dremel...and I have a 0.7mm solid carbide bit that fits either as 
> well. My concern is runout and precision...carbide is very VERY 
> brittle, and I have only one bit.
>
> Any hints for a first timer?
>
> THANKS!
>
> Chuck
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
> 


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I've only had that problem when I chose drill sizes too large for pads which were simply too small and should have been larger.

It's more likely the drill will break toner off and cause problems when etching.

If you print out your pads with the drill hole, that part is etched anyway, so when you drill you are actually only drilling the substrate and not copper.


Just my observations at least!


--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, Derek <derek@...> wrote:

>
> I would suggest to drill before etching. This way less chance of a snag 
> on the pad and pulling the copper off. Run the drill with a high speed 
> and drill slowly.
> 
> There are places you can order up small drill bits as well - 
> mcmaster.com for one.
> 
> Derek Koonce
> DDK Interactive Consulting Services
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On 10/17/2011 1:21 PM, pebo festus wrote:
> >
> > when i visit the dentist i ask for all his used drills, they make some 
> > quite small.
> >
> > ________________________________
> > From: Chuck <c.knight@... <mailto:c.knight%40juno.com>>
> > To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com <mailto:Homebrew_PCBs%40yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Saturday, October 15, 2011 8:13 PM
> > Subject: [Homebrew_PCBs] VERY FIRST PCB -- SUCCESSFUL!!!
> >
> >
> > I just made my very first PCB at home!!! Hooray!
> >
> > http://www.instructables.com/id/Easy-to-build-CNC-Mill-Stepper-Motor-and-Driver-ci/
> > I made the "Easy Stepper" board from Instructables, and could not 
> > easily get etchant out where I live, so I used the toilet bowl 
> > cleaner/peroxide mix. Worked quite well, actually.
> >
> > And, I did it as LASER toner transfer, using magazine paper. Talk 
> > about low tech!
> >
> > Apparently it really *is* possible to make boards, at home, and 
> > affordably. Next step is going to be drilling them out.
> >
> > I have 1/16" drill bits that would fit my drill press, or my 
> > Dremel...and I have a 0.7mm solid carbide bit that fits either as 
> > well. My concern is runout and precision...carbide is very VERY 
> > brittle, and I have only one bit.
> >
> > Any hints for a first timer?
> >
> > THANKS!
> >
> > Chuck
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> > 
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

If you have access to compressed air, a very good solution is to use an "air
micro die grinder" from, for example, Harbor Freight:

http://www.harborfreight.com/1-8-eighth-inch-air-micro-die-grinder-47869.htm
l

 

It runs at 56,000 RPM which is great for PCB drilling, it comes with a
collet for 1/8" which is perfect for the standard carbide bits.  The price
is right, $19 to $25 depending on if it is on sale or not.  I bought mine
about 20 years ago but they keep selling it or similar models.

Bertho



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Chuck" <c.knight@...> wrote:
>
> I just made my very first PCB at home!!!  Hooray!
> 
> http://www.instructables.com/id/Easy-to-build-CNC-Mill-Stepper-Motor-and-Driver-ci/
> I made the "Easy Stepper" board from Instructables, and could not easily get etchant out where I live, so I used the toilet bowl cleaner/peroxide mix.  Worked quite well, actually.


Neat! I've heard a couple of people say they had problems with that etchant... would you be willing to share the brand of cleaner and the strength of the peroxide and what ration you mixed them? I'd like to document that on the site at:
http://techref.massmind.org/techref/pcbetch.htm
all credit to you of course.


> And, I did it as LASER toner transfer, using magazine paper.  Talk about low tech!
> 
> Apparently it really *is* possible to make boards, at home, and affordably.  Next step is going to be drilling them out.
> 
> I have 1/16" drill bits that would fit my drill press, or my Dremel...and I have a 0.7mm solid carbide bit that fits either as well.  My concern is runout and precision...carbide is very VERY brittle, and I have only one bit.
> 
> Any hints for a first timer?
> 
> THANKS!
> 
> Chuck


It's just about impossible to hold one of those steady by hand, in my experience. It does ok going in, but then I always break them once the bit is through or when trying to back it out. I use a cheap small drill press (horrible runout) with long flexible drill bits (not carbide) which I sharpen and replace often. I also don't do many boards. Carbide would last longer, but are so brittle. 

Many people have reported good success with a home built "drill press" made from a few scraps of plywood or other thin bits which are hinged together or just long and thin enough to bend in a pantograph arrangement to keep the dremel stable and vertical. There is a (very) crude drawing at:
http://techref.massmind.org/techref/pcbholes.htm
which should make it clear. BTW: If anyone has a better picture or drawing, I'd love to replace that one!

In the end, expect a broken bit or two... order spares, they aren't expensive.

--
James.

DJ Delorie who posts here has an excellent page with pictures.

http://www.delorie.com/pcb/dremel-stand/

-- 
Erik L. Knise
Seattle, WA

On Tue, Oct 18, 2011 at 9:00 AM, James Newton
<jamesmichaelnewton@...> wrote:

> --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Chuck" <c.knight@...> wrote:
>
> Many people have reported good success with a home built "drill press" made from a few scraps of plywood or other thin bits which are hinged together or just long and thin enough to bend in a pantograph arrangement to keep the dremel stable and vertical. There is a (very) crude drawing at:
> http://techref.massmind.org/techref/pcbholes.htm
> which should make it clear. BTW: If anyone has a better picture or drawing, I'd love to replace that one!
>
> In the end, expect a broken bit or two... order spares, they aren't expensive.
>
> --
> James.

What was the magazine that you bought that worked for you?  I have been reading online and a lot of different people recommend different companies for the magazine paper.

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Chuck" <c.knight@...> wrote:

>
> I just made my very first PCB at home!!!  Hooray!
> 
> http://www.instructables.com/id/Easy-to-build-CNC-Mill-Stepper-Motor-and-Driver-ci/
> I made the "Easy Stepper" board from Instructables, and could not easily get etchant out where I live, so I used the toilet bowl cleaner/peroxide mix.  Worked quite well, actually.
> 
> And, I did it as LASER toner transfer, using magazine paper.  Talk about low tech!
> 
> Apparently it really *is* possible to make boards, at home, and affordably.  Next step is going to be drilling them out.
> 
> I have 1/16" drill bits that would fit my drill press, or my Dremel...and I have a 0.7mm solid carbide bit that fits either as well.  My concern is runout and precision...carbide is very VERY brittle, and I have only one bit.
> 
> Any hints for a first timer?
> 
> THANKS!
> 
> Chuck
>

Okay, in answer to the questions people have asked:

The recipe was simple.  2:1 ratio of H2O2 to HCL.  The HCl was 20% concentration, in a toilet bowl cleaner called "The Works" that I purchased at WalMart for $0.94.  The H2O2 was also from WalMart, from the pharmaceuticals section.  Whatever they had...

The etchant works impossibly slow at first...threw in a sacrificial bit of copper wire, and let it dissolve all night.  Once it turned from blue to emerald green, it worked beautifully for 4 boards.  Took several hours to etch the boards.  It did, however, turn into an ugly olive green that needed to be refreshed with a capful of H2O2, 3/4 of the way through the process.

The paper was high gloss ad paper, with as little black printing on it as possible.  I used whatever I had lying around, "Family Circle" magazine, I believe.  The ads were full color glossy, and the paper was dreadfully cheap.

LASER printer is a Samsung...and no I've not been able to get the toner off.  It sticks that well.  Acetone doesn't touch it...don't know what's in their toner, but it did transfer very well.  I just set it to print extra-dark, and had more than enough present.

Even so I had issues with getting it to stick...that seems to be a learned skill.  I got better at it by board 3 and 4.

As to posting photos...I don't know how to upload photos to the group...any suggestions?

Thanks for all the kind words, guys.  But, remember, this is basically a one-off.  I do have a drill press, but when you're talking about runout on a regular press, a 0.7mm carbide bit is a delicate thing.  Mine would wreck it.  And, while I don't want to build my own press for a one-off,  I may end up doing it.  Got a short length of THK linear rail, and may just attach to that.

Chuck



--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Chuck" <c.knight@...> wrote:

>
> I just made my very first PCB at home!!!  Hooray!
> 
> http://www.instructables.com/id/Easy-to-build-CNC-Mill-Stepper-Motor-and-Driver-ci/
> I made the "Easy Stepper" board from Instructables, and could not easily get etchant out where I live, so I used the toilet bowl cleaner/peroxide mix.  Worked quite well, actually.
> 
> And, I did it as LASER toner transfer, using magazine paper.  Talk about low tech!
> 
> Apparently it really *is* possible to make boards, at home, and affordably.  Next step is going to be drilling them out.
> 
> I have 1/16" drill bits that would fit my drill press, or my Dremel...and I have a 0.7mm solid carbide bit that fits either as well.  My concern is runout and precision...carbide is very VERY brittle, and I have only one bit.
> 
> Any hints for a first timer?
> 
> THANKS!
> 
> Chuck
>

At 20% concentration of HCL and 3% (standard over the counter
pharmacy) H2O2 you should have a ratio of ~1:3 by weight (volume is
about the same).  So you would need 3 times as much H2O2 to HCL.  The
board should have etched within a few minutes.

I wrote a calculator a while ago for Cupric Chloride ratios.
http://www.totse2.com/easy-e/cupricchloride.html  It's a bit on the
confusing side and I plan to re-write it eventually but I hope it's
helpful to some people.

I've never tried The Works because I use regular HCL I bought from a
pool supply store.  I have more than enough to last me thousands of
boards.

-- 
Erik L. Knise
Seattle, WA

On Wed, Oct 19, 2011 at 9:04 AM, Chuck <chuckknight2003@...> wrote:
> Okay, in answer to the questions people have asked:
>
> The recipe was simple.  2:1 ratio of H2O2 to HCL.  The HCl was 20% concentration, in a toilet bowl cleaner called "The Works" that I purchased at WalMart for $0.94.  The H2O2 was also from WalMart, from the pharmaceuticals section.  Whatever they had...
>
> Chuck
>