Homebrew PCBs

OK ..  before I start this .. 
Its something new I was playing with this A.M.
and wanted others views .. 
I cant search the archives from work .. 
So if it has come up before .. apologies.

I did a toner transfer of a small GDO circuit
this morning and was using a scalpel to clean
up some of the traces that were too close together 
or with paper in between.

Seemed like the toner was coming off to easily .. 
And had an issue earlier that morning trying the
direct etch method of rubbing the etchant onto
the another board with toner coming off.

Yes .. I realize .  heat and pressure may not have been correct.

That aside .. I thought .. well I have use my oven to bake
on dry transfers before .. in fact .. it worked so well
that I had a hell of a time scrubbing them off after etching.
But it was the best darn board I had ever made with dry
transfers.

I also saw a recent article on direct etchant transfer via
inkjet printer. In that article, it mentions curing the toner
after .  Along with another article where a fellow feeds
his pcbs directly thru a laserjet I want to say, and said it works
well if he cures the toner as well .. 

So .. I thought .. I have nothing to lose by trying .. 
So I cranked up the over to 260 ish degrees .. 
Put the board in for about 30 minutes .. 
( all the time I had before leaving for work today )

Quenched the board in cold water and dried.
Took it into my shop and pecked at it with the scalpel
again.  All I can say is wow .. that seemed to have made a difference.
Was a lot more difficult to scrap away any toner .. 

I Did this all kind of quickly and will try some more test boards this weekend 
to be 

sure of the results .. 

Anyone tried this before ? or has it been brought up before? 

I guess .. for those that have questionable results on the toner bonding to the
board fairly often, that perhaps this would help them out .. 
From what I can see so far, seems to work, and what can it hurt.
Other then wasting some energy heating the oven .. 
Could be my imagination, but it also seemed to " cleanup or sharpen"
the existing traces. Maybe a cohesion thing going on there?

Thoughts ? Ideas ? no flaming me pse LOL

Randy - N2CUA

On Sat, Mar 5, 2011 at 1:30 PM, Randy S. <rj3819@...> wrote:
> I also saw a recent article on direct etchant transfer via
> inkjet printer. In that article, it mentions curing the toner
> after .  Along with another article where a fellow feeds
> his pcbs directly thru a laserjet I want to say,

I'd guess it was an inkjet. Isn't there a problem with laserjet
(xerographic) printing to conductive surfaces?

> and said it works
> well if he cures the toner as well ..
>
> So .. I thought .. I have nothing to lose by trying ..
> So I cranked up the over to 260 ish degrees ..
> Put the board in for about 30 minutes ..
> ( all the time I had before leaving for work today )
>
> Quenched the board in cold water and dried.

Why quench in cold water? Just waving the board in the air would cool
it down in a few seconds.

> Took it into my shop and pecked at it with the scalpel
> again.  All I can say is wow .. that seemed to have made a difference.
> Was a lot more difficult to scrap away any toner ..

Well anyway, it makes some sense to me to heat up the board after
doing the toner transfer. It would drive out moisture and, I would
think, make the toner stick better to the copper.

Maybe a hot air gun would also work, although the temperature couldn't
be controlled very well. It might be OK to heat up the board well
beyond the melting point of the toner. Just don't burn the board or
damage the adhesive that sticks the copper to the board.

Thanks for this report, Randy. I've also been having problems getting
the toner to stick well to the copper, so this idea may help.

> Thoughts ? Ideas ? no flaming me pse LOL

Why on earth would anyone flame you for passing on a possibly useful tip? :-)

- Jan

**Why on earth would anyone flame you for passing on a possibly useful tip? :-)

- Jan  **

* very quietly whispers to Jan .. pssst .. " because I didnt do a simple google 
search first "





________________________________

From: Jan Kok <jan.kok.5y@...>
To: Homebrew_PCBs@...m
Sent: Sat, March 5, 2011 5:40:11 PM
Subject: Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Toner curing

  
On Sat, Mar 5, 2011 at 1:30 PM, Randy S. <rj3819@...> wrote:
> I also saw a recent article on direct etchant transfer via
> inkjet printer. In that article, it mentions curing the toner
> after .  Along with another article where a fellow feeds
> his pcbs directly thru a laserjet I want to say,

I'd guess it was an inkjet. Isn't there a problem with laserjet
(xerographic) printing to conductive surfaces?

> and said it works
> well if he cures the toner as well ..
>
> So .. I thought .. I have nothing to lose by trying ..
> So I cranked up the over to 260 ish degrees ..
> Put the board in for about 30 minutes ..
> ( all the time I had before leaving for work today )
>
> Quenched the board in cold water and dried.

Why quench in cold water? Just waving the board in the air would cool
it down in a few seconds.

> Took it into my shop and pecked at it with the scalpel
> again.  All I can say is wow .. that seemed to have made a difference.
> Was a lot more difficult to scrap away any toner ..

Well anyway, it makes some sense to me to heat up the board after
doing the toner transfer. It would drive out moisture and, I would
think, make the toner stick better to the copper.

Maybe a hot air gun would also work, although the temperature couldn't
be controlled very well. It might be OK to heat up the board well
beyond the melting point of the toner. Just don't burn the board or
damage the adhesive that sticks the copper to the board.

Thanks for this report, Randy. I've also been having problems getting
the toner to stick well to the copper, so this idea may help.

> Thoughts ? Ideas ? no flaming me pse LOL

Why on earth would anyone flame you for passing on a possibly useful tip? :-)

- Jan




      

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Update ... 
I etched the board from this mornings cure in the oven.
I would say that it was also more difficult to clean the
toner off the board after etching.  I didnt use acetone ..
Used a scouring pad.  But that is what I have been using 
so I wanted the same reference point.

Curing 2 more that way now .. 
Will see how that goes .. 

Jan .. hope it helps you ...

Randy




________________________________

From: Jan Kok <jan.kok.5y@...>
To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sat, March 5, 2011 5:40:11 PM
Subject: Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Toner curing

   
On Sat, Mar 5, 2011 at 1:30 PM, Randy S. <rj3819@...> wrote:
> I also saw a recent article on direct etchant transfer via
> inkjet printer. In that article, it mentions curing the toner
> after .  Along with another article where a fellow feeds
> his pcbs directly thru a laserjet I want to say,

I'd guess it was an inkjet. Isn't there a problem with laserjet
(xerographic) printing to conductive surfaces?

> and said it works
> well if he cures the toner as well ..
>
> So .. I thought .. I have nothing to lose by trying ..
> So I cranked up the over to 260 ish degrees ..
> Put the board in for about 30 minutes ..
> ( all the time I had before leaving for work today )
>
> Quenched the board in cold water and dried.

Why quench in cold water? Just waving the board in the air would cool
it down in a few seconds.

> Took it into my shop and pecked at it with the scalpel
> again.  All I can say is wow .. that seemed to have made a difference.
> Was a lot more difficult to scrap away any toner ..

Well anyway, it makes some sense to me to heat up the board after
doing the toner transfer. It would drive out moisture and, I would
think, make the toner stick better to the copper.

Maybe a hot air gun would also work, although the temperature couldn't
be controlled very well. It might be OK to heat up the board well
beyond the melting point of the toner. Just don't burn the board or
damage the adhesive that sticks the copper to the board.

Thanks for this report, Randy. I've also been having problems getting
the toner to stick well to the copper, so this idea may help.

> Thoughts ? Ideas ? no flaming me pse LOL

Why on earth would anyone flame you for passing on a possibly useful tip? :-)

- Jan

 


      

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]