Homebrew_PCBs

> i thought of manual drill press, moving the pcb with your hand.
>
> i know there are such devices sold especially for this task and they are qite expensive.
> but i'm sure it is possible to get a drill press working properly without these special bearings.
> if you limit the minimum diameter to 0,8 or 0,6 millimeter.
>
>
> i was wondering how the guys here do the drilling which don't hava a x/y drill cnc machine.
>
> regards
> stefan
>

>I made a pivoting type manual drill press. The drill motor is
>fixed to the end of 500 mm long arm which pivots at its end by
>two thrust bearings (from an old car clutch) that sandwich the
>50x50mm (3 mm wall) square aluminium arm. The difficult part is
>mounting the motor to the end of the arm, because you want it
>adjustable for alignment of the vertical feed and get it
>perfectly parallel. If anyone is interested I will get some
>photos and make them available online.
>
>The advantage of this technique is almost zero side to side play
>without the need of precision linear bearings. You can safely use
> 0.45mm carbide drill bits, the smallest size drill I own.
>
>The disadvantage is the extra bench space required for the long
>arm, which is fixed to a large heavy base like a slab of 18 mm
>MDF particle board. I usually have the habit of over engineering
>my home brew stuff and probably could of made it half the size.
>
>Adam
>
>Stefan Trethan wrote:
>> i thought of manual drill press, moving the pcb with your hand.
>>
>> i know there are such devices sold especially for this task and they are qite expensive.
>> but i'm sure it is possible to get a drill press working properly without these special bearings.
>> if you limit the minimum diameter to 0,8 or 0,6 millimeter.
>>
>>
>> i was wondering how the guys here do the drilling which don't hava a x/y drill cnc machine.
>>
>> regards
>> stefan
>>
>
>
>
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>
>
>

----- Original Message -----
From: "Stefan Trethan" <stefan_trethan@...>
To: <Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, May 19, 2003 9:51 AM
Subject: Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] How I make my PCBs -> manual drilling


). i don't exacty know what thrust bearings are. my dictionary provides
various
> translations meaning everything or nothing..
>
> is it a simple bearing with two concentric rings (one smaller, one bigger)
and balls between the two?
> like the most "ball bearings". or is it of some special type?

No. It's basically two similar rings, one above the other, with rollers
between.

Leon
--
Leon Heller, G1HSM
leon_heller@...
http://www.geocities.com/leon_heller

>From: "Leon Heller" <leon_heller@...>
>Reply-To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
>To: <Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com>
>Subject: Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] How I make my PCBs -> manual drilling
>Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 11:27:31 +0100
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Stefan Trethan" <stefan_trethan@...>
>To: <Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com>
>Sent: Monday, May 19, 2003 9:51 AM
>Subject: Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] How I make my PCBs -> manual drilling
>
>
>). i don't exacty know what thrust bearings are. my dictionary provides
>various
> > translations meaning everything or nothing..
> >
> > is it a simple bearing with two concentric rings (one smaller, one
>bigger)
>and balls between the two?
> > like the most "ball bearings". or is it of some special type?
>
>No. It's basically two similar rings, one above the other, with rollers
>between.
>
>Leon
>--
>Leon Heller, G1HSM
>leon_heller@...
>http://www.geocities.com/leon_heller
>
>
>
>Be sure to visit the group home and check for new Bookmarks and files:
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Homebrew_PCBs
>
>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>Homebrew_PCBs-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

> has anyone this model at home?
> may it somebody inspect for pcb printing possibilities?

> if anyone has it, please have a look at the paper transport path,

> feed flat materialy through, which thickness is possible (maybe with

> how is the paper transported? are the rollers which apply the

> thanks
> stefan
>
> image would be here if anyone isn'z sure if he knows this model:
> http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3416464904

> hi
>
> i also thought of that initially.
> but i discarded it because i thought this moves the drill in a rotrary way not straight (i know this is
> nothing with 50cm arm and 1,5mm pcb with.
> you have used it - it is no problem?
>
> how do you operate it (how is that arm moved by you?).
>
> a picture would be very nice, to see the motor mount, and maybe the overall machine to see how it is
> operated.
> also a look at your bearings would be fine, i have never dismanteled a car clutch (but have a lot of
> spare bearings). i don't exacty know what thrust bearings are. my dictionary provides various
> translations meaning everything or nothing..
>
> is it a simple bearing with two concentric rings (one smaller, one bigger) and balls between the two?
> like the most "ball bearings". or is it of some special type?
>
> regards
> st
>
>
>
>
>
> 19.05.2003 09:40:28, Adam Seychell <adam_seychell@...> wrote:
>
>
>>I made a pivoting type manual drill press. The drill motor is
>>fixed to the end of 500 mm long arm which pivots at its end by
>>two thrust bearings (from an old car clutch) that sandwich the
>>50x50mm (3 mm wall) square aluminium arm. The difficult part is
>>mounting the motor to the end of the arm, because you want it
>>adjustable for alignment of the vertical feed and get it
>>perfectly parallel. If anyone is interested I will get some
>>photos and make them available online.
>>
>>The advantage of this technique is almost zero side to side play
>>without the need of precision linear bearings. You can safely use
>> 0.45mm carbide drill bits, the smallest size drill I own.
>>
>>The disadvantage is the extra bench space required for the long
>>arm, which is fixed to a large heavy base like a slab of 18 mm
>>MDF particle board. I usually have the habit of over engineering
>>my home brew stuff and probably could of made it half the size.
>>
>>Adam
>>
>>Stefan Trethan wrote:
>>
>>>i thought of manual drill press, moving the pcb with your hand.
>>>
>>>i know there are such devices sold especially for this task and they are qite expensive.
>>>but i'm sure it is possible to get a drill press working properly without these special bearings.
>>>if you limit the minimum diameter to 0,8 or 0,6 millimeter.
>>>
>>>
>>>i was wondering how the guys here do the drilling which don't hava a x/y drill cnc machine.
>>>
>>>regards
>>>stefan
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>Be sure to visit the group home and check for new Bookmarks and files:
>>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Homebrew_PCBs
>>
>>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>>Homebrew_PCBs-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>>
>>
>>
>>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Be sure to visit the group home and check for new Bookmarks and files:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Homebrew_PCBs
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> Homebrew_PCBs-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

>Stefan,
>
>http://howstuffworks.lycoszone.com/bearing3.htm
>
>This URL shows the basic idea of the thrust bearing. All I know
>is that the bearing used in car clutches use a thrust type , but
>the ones on clutches are fully enclosed, unlike shown in the
>diagram. These bearings are fairly cheap and widely available.
>You could even use the old clutch bearings which car mechanics
>routinely throw away.
>
>If I get home from work at a reasonable hour today, then I'll try
>make create a quick web page showing the construction of my drill
>press. This drill machine was designed from only cheap common
>materials, except actual drill motor, which I had set be back
>AU$240. See;
>
>http://www.bosch.com.au/productcatalogue/spt3/products/ggs27.htm
>
>After months of searching for a good PCB drill spindle this was
>the cheapest and most practical thing I could find that came with
>precision ground collets. I also had to buy the 1/8" collet for
>use with PCB carbide drill bits.
>
>
>Adam.
>

>I don't know specifically about the HP 400, but all the desktop HP
>inkjet printers I've seen pull the paper in the front from that bottom
>tray you can see, and wrap it 360 back out the front of the printer.
>
>Aha! Always use the resources available. HP still has the user manual
>in PDF format.
>
>http://www.hp.com/cposupport/manindex/dj400_eng_man.html
>
>Looks like you do have the option to feed paper through the back and
>have it come out the front. No idea just how straight the path is, though.
>
>The HP 310, 320, 330, and 340 Deskjet (parallel) and Deskwriter
>(serial) laptop printers have a very short straight through paper path
>but tend to cost a bit more because they are very small and portable.
>I have several of them myself, intending on testing one of them this way.
>
>I'm sorry to hear about the mishap with your printer.
>
>Steve Greenfield
>
>--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, Stefan Trethan
><stefan_trethan@g...> wrote:
>> has anyone this model at home?
>> may it somebody inspect for pcb printing possibilities?
>-snip-
>> if anyone has it, please have a look at the paper transport path,
>how it is driven, if it is possible to
>> feed flat materialy through, which thickness is possible (maybe with
>moving some axes).
>-snip-
>> how is the paper transported? are the rollers which apply the
>momentum under the paper?
>
>> thanks
>> stefan
>>
>> image would be here if anyone isn'z sure if he knows this model:
>> http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3416464904
>
>
>
>Be sure to visit the group home and check for new Bookmarks and files:
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Homebrew_PCBs
>
>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>Homebrew_PCBs-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>

>
> all collets i have ever seen here are brass ones. i guess made on a lathe.
> but there are also small adjustable drill jucks available.
> they are good precision, no scrap, but i fear not good enough for carbide bits.
> what do you think about that?
>

>I originally bought a Dremel, but it was so out of round, that
>the tip of the drill looked blurry when it was running. Well that
>just confirms you get what you pay for. The Dremal used cheap
>aluminium collets, because that's all what's needed for the
>indented purpose. The industrial die grinders, such as BOSCH
>GSS27 have hardened steel ground collets. The collets are
>constructed so they always seat precisely in position when
>tightened up. Another compact straight die grinder is the Matabo
>G500, but not sure of prices. The GSS27 cost me Australian $240 I
>think. So probably around $120 USD. It was my uncle who
>recommended the BOSCH grinder as a PCB drill, he has owned one of
>these for 20 years. So it should last me for ever and a day. Of
>course I can take it out of the drill press and use it as a die
>grinder if I every need too.
>
>Funny thing was that one day I visited this PCB manufacture who
>specialized in prototypes and small runs. At the corner of the
>shop I saw one of these GSS27 laying on the bench, and so I
>started talking to the owner about it. It turns out they use the
>exact same drill motor in their manual drilling machines as I had
>used.

>>I originally bought a Dremel, but it was so out of round, that
>>the tip of the drill looked blurry when it was running. Well that
>>just confirms you get what you pay for. The Dremal used cheap
>>aluminium collets, because that's all what's needed for the
>>indented purpose. The industrial die grinders, such as BOSCH
>>GSS27 have hardened steel ground collets. The collets are
>>constructed so they always seat precisely in position when
>>tightened up. Another compact straight die grinder is the Matabo
>>G500, but not sure of prices. The GSS27 cost me Australian $240 I
>>think. So probably around $120 USD. It was my uncle who
>>recommended the BOSCH grinder as a PCB drill, he has owned one of
>>these for 20 years. So it should last me for ever and a day. Of
>>course I can take it out of the drill press and use it as a die
>>grinder if I every need too.
>>
>>Funny thing was that one day I visited this PCB manufacture who
>>specialized in prototypes and small runs. At the corner of the
>>shop I saw one of these GSS27 laying on the bench, and so I
>>started talking to the owner about it. It turns out they use the
>>exact same drill motor in their manual drilling machines as I had
>>used.
>
>How about the Proxxon tools? I find them quite handy for various tasks
>when it comes to Homebrew PCBs'
>
>http://www.proxxon.com/ lists the products available. I'm using the
>Drillstand MB 140/S to drill the holes, and the "Bench Circular Saw KS
>230" to cut FR4 materials. There you need the "Solid carbide saw
>blade" of course but using this one cutting FR4 becomes fun.
>
>So far I'm quie happy with these but since I'm not that long in the
>business I would apreciate feedback from this list with regard to
>these.
>
>Markus
>
>
>Be sure to visit the group home and check for new Bookmarks and files:
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Homebrew_PCBs
>
>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>Homebrew_PCBs-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>

>>How about the Proxxon tools? I find them quite handy for various tasks
>>when it comes to Homebrew PCBs'
>>
>>http://www.proxxon.com/ lists the products available. I'm using the
>>Drillstand MB 140/S to drill the holes, and the "Bench Circular Saw KS
>>230" to cut FR4 materials. There you need the "Solid carbide saw
>>blade" of course but using this one cutting FR4 becomes fun.
>>
>>So far I'm quie happy with these but since I'm not that long in the
>>business I would apreciate feedback from this list with regard to
>>these.
>>
>>Markus
>
>proxxon also says they have good ball beared axles and gronded steel collets.
>
>the grinding hand tools are relatively cheap (30-40eur).
>
>they also have ready made drill presses from which they also say the spindles are good (and can easily
>drill 0,5mm).
>
>i don't know it that's true.
>
>i will see a local tool shop tomorrow to see what they carry.
>and what i think of ot when seeing it.
>
>(one can asess the quality for pcb drilling by viewing the tip of a good tool (ideal is carbide bit) ?)
>
>regards
>stefan