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Drop on Demand vs. The Other Kind

Drop on Demand vs. The Other Kind

2006-05-31 by Brian Schmalz

I worked on a project for a company that makes CIJ (Continuous Ink Jet)
print heads like you are talking about here. I'm not sure I'd call it
archaic, in that it is the technology behind all of the date codes on
your pop bottles, etc. CIJ printers are used in packaging and printed
material production facilities because they can be run very fast, from a
pretty high distance above the material they're printing on. With the
right ink, they can print on just about anything. The actual print heads
are simply amazing pieces of technology - they set up an acoustic
standing wave inside the little ink tank at the bottom of the head,
which guarantees very precise droplet sizes at very precise times (a
constant stream of drops from each hole in the head - in the KHz range
if I remember correctly). The electrostatic forces are applied by tiny
fingers that fit between the droplet streams and deflect individual
droplets. Each droplet goes in one of two places - if the electricity is
on, it goes at a slight angle (onto the pop can or magazine, etc.). If
the electricity is off, it goes straight down into a little collector
thing which sucks the ink back up into the main reservoir for recycling
and printing again.

How is this on topic? It's not I guess, but I know that the inks they
used are _very_ resistant to everything. (Try etching the date code off
of your Coke can.) So they'd probably be great for making PCBs. You can
line up four or eight print heads to cover an 8" swath of conveyor belt,
so you could print whole boards in one swipe. If you had to make many
boards rapidly, with each one being slightly different, this might work
great. Except that the printer heads are super expensive, and it takes
about 30 minutes to get the printer running in the first place (once it
runs you don't shut it down) and involves a LOT of spraying MEK around
until it starts printing right.

*Brian

-----Original Message-----
From: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Andrew
Sent: Wednesday, May 31, 2006 4:07 PM
To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Homebrew_PCBs] Drop on Demand - was - Re: Unblocking epsons

In archaic inkjet printers the print head would
fire out a constant stream of drops. It would
then use an electrostatic charge to either direct
these drops out to the paper or back into an
ink collection system for re-use. The print
heads did not have any tiny tiny little elements
in them - they where just a nozzel being fed by
a pump.

Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Drop on Demand vs. The Other Kind

2006-05-31 by Codesuidae

Brian Schmalz wrote:
> [...] and involves a LOT of spraying MEK around
> until it starts printing right.

Oooo, atomized MEK! Sign me up!

:*)

Seriously though, thats pretty cool technology, thanks for the description.

Dave K

Re: Drop on Demand vs. The Other Kind

2006-05-31 by Andrew

> Brian wrote:
> they set up an acoustic standing wave
> inside the little ink tank at the bottom
> of the head, which guarantees very
> precise droplet sizes at very precise
> times (a constant stream of drops from
> each hole in the head - in the KHz range
> if I remember correctly).

Thanks for that - I never knew how they
got the drops to actually come out. I had
only ever had it explained as "pumped".

> <snip>
> and involves a LOT of spraying MEK around
> until it starts printing right.

Plus now we have another reason to not
drink cola straight from the ally can.
Alzheimers, rat droppings AND MEK sprayed
around the packaging plant :D

[Homebrew_PCBs] Re: Drop on Demand vs. The Other Kind

2006-06-01 by Robert Hedan

> -----Message d'origine-----
> De : Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com] De la part de Andrew
> Envoyé : mai 31 2006 18:42
> À : Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
> Objet : [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: Drop on Demand vs. The Other Kind
>
...
>
> Plus now we have another reason to not
> drink cola straight from the ally can.
> Alzheimers, rat droppings AND MEK sprayed
> around the packaging plant :D


Ok, as resident 'newb' ( <--- :P ) I'll have to ask, what's MEK?

I take it it's not something I want to have for breakfast.

Robert
:)

Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: Drop on Demand vs. The Other Kind

2006-06-01 by JanRwl@AOL.COM

In a message dated 5/31/2006 7:47:48 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
robert.hedan@... writes:

I'll have to ask, what's MEK?<<
Methyl Ethyl Keytone. Nasty very volitile organic solvent.

I take it it's not something I want to have for breakfast.<<

No; probably carcinogenic, but will at least modulate the natural
functioning of your body parts, if not set afire first.




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: MEK

2006-06-01 by Mycroft2152

Think of MEK as extreme nail polish remover (acetone).
It's actually the "big brother" to acetone. MEK is a
very common industrial solvent and must be used with
respect and all the correct protective equipment.

Great stuff!

Myc

--- JanRwl@... wrote:

> In a message dated 5/31/2006 7:47:48 P.M. Central
> Daylight Time,
> robert.hedan@... writes:
>
> I'll have to ask, what's MEK?<<
> Methyl Ethyl Keytone. Nasty very volitile organic
> solvent.
>
> I take it it's not something I want to have for
> breakfast.<<
>
> No; probably carcinogenic, but will at least
> modulate the natural
> functioning of your body parts, if not set afire
> first.
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been
> removed]
>
>


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Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: MEK

2006-06-01 by Leon Heller

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mycroft2152" <mycroft2152@...>
To: <Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, June 01, 2006 11:14 AM
Subject: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: MEK


> Think of MEK as extreme nail polish remover (acetone).
> It's actually the "big brother" to acetone. MEK is a
> very common industrial solvent and must be used with
> respect and all the correct protective equipment.

Acetone is ethyl ketone. I remember making it at school; the reaction got
out of hand, blowing the condenser etc. out of the flask and shattering them
on the ceiling. A green fountain of copper filings, copper sulphate,
sulphuric acid and ethanol shot up to the lab ceiling and rained down on us,
together with broken glass. The green stain was still there when I left a
couple of years later in 1960, it's probably still there.

Leon

[Homebrew_PCBs] Re: MEK

2006-06-01 by Robert Hedan

> -----Message d'origine-----
> De : Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com] De la part de Mycroft2152
> Envoyé : juin 1 2006 06:14
> À : Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
> Objet : [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: MEK
>
>
> Think of MEK as extreme nail polish remover (acetone).
> It's actually the "big brother" to acetone. MEK is a
> very common industrial solvent and must be used with
> respect and all the correct protective equipment.
>
> Great stuff!
>
> Myc


mmmm-okay...

Acetone is a good example that I can relate with, I use it to clean the PCBs
before etching and to remove the toner after etching.

Robert
:)

Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: MEK

2006-06-01 by Stefan Trethan

On Thu, 01 Jun 2006 12:14:19 +0200, Mycroft2152 <mycroft2152@...>
wrote:

> Think of MEK as extreme nail polish remover (acetone).
> It's actually the "big brother" to acetone. MEK is a
> very common industrial solvent and must be used with
> respect and all the correct protective equipment.
> Great stuff!
> Myc


Was that the one that damages the eyes so easily?
I don't remember for sure which it was.....

How is the evaporation rate of MEK compared to say acetone?


ST

Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: MEK

2006-06-01 by Mycroft2152

Do not get it in your eyes. Wear eye protection!

The evaporation rate is much faster. But nasty stuff.
Dissolves the fat out of your skin. Makes it very dry.

Myc

--- Stefan Trethan <stefan_trethan@...> wrote:

>
> On Thu, 01 Jun 2006 12:14:19 +0200, Mycroft2152
> <mycroft2152@...>
> wrote:
>
> > Think of MEK as extreme nail polish remover
> (acetone).
> > It's actually the "big brother" to acetone. MEK is
> a
> > very common industrial solvent and must be used
> with
> > respect and all the correct protective equipment.
> > Great stuff!
> > Myc
>
>
> Was that the one that damages the eyes so easily?
> I don't remember for sure which it was.....
>
> How is the evaporation rate of MEK compared to say
> acetone?
>
>
> ST
>
>
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Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: MEK

2006-06-01 by Lez

> Dissolves the fat out of your skin. Makes it very dry.

I'm 145 kg, about 24st, or a very a very large number of pounds, can
it help me????????

Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: MEK

2006-06-01 by lists

In article <000f01c68566$b8926c80$0501a8c0@AZATHOTH>,
Leon Heller <leon.heller@...> wrote:
> Acetone is ethyl ketone. I remember making it at school; the reaction
> got out of hand, blowing the condenser etc. out of the flask and
> shattering them on the ceiling. A green fountain of copper filings,
> copper sulphate, sulphuric acid and ethanol shot up to the lab ceiling
> and rained down on us, together with broken glass. The green stain was
> still there when I left a couple of years later in 1960, it's probably
> still there.

Ah the days of /real/ chemistry at school

Re: MEK

2006-06-01 by derekhawkins

> The evaporation rate is much faster.

Acetone has a higher evaporation rate compared to MEK when last I
checked.

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, Mycroft2152 <mycroft2152@...>
wrote:
>

Re: MEK

2006-06-01 by kilocycles

Back in the 1970's, into the early '80s, pro bowling champion Earl
Anthony soaked his bowling balls in MEK overnight before tournaments.
Very controversial practice, but it softened the surface and gave the
balls more "bite", and more breaking ability. He was the first guy to
make a million dollars on the PBA Tour.

I just Googled him, for more recent info, and he died in 2001 at the
age of 63. No, it wasn't cancer...he fell down a flight of stairs.

Regards,
Ted

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, Mycroft2152 <mycroft2152@...> wrote:
>
> Think of MEK as extreme nail polish remover (acetone).
> It's actually the "big brother" to acetone. MEK is a
> very common industrial solvent and must be used with
> respect and all the correct protective equipment.
>
> Great stuff!
>
> Myc
>
> --- JanRwl@... wrote:
>
> > In a message dated 5/31/2006 7:47:48 P.M. Central
> > Daylight Time,
> > robert.hedan@... writes:
> >
> > I'll have to ask, what's MEK?<<
> > Methyl Ethyl Keytone. Nasty very volitile organic
> > solvent.
> >
> > I take it it's not something I want to have for
> > breakfast.<<
> >
> > No; probably carcinogenic, but will at least
> > modulate the natural
> > functioning of your body parts, if not set afire
> > first.
---snip----

Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: MEK

2006-06-01 by Bryan Pope

lists wrote:
> In article <000f01c68566$b8926c80$0501a8c0@AZATHOTH>,
> Leon Heller <leon.heller@...> wrote:
>
>> Acetone is ethyl ketone. I remember making it at school; the reaction
>> got out of hand, blowing the condenser etc. out of the flask and
>> shattering them on the ceiling. A green fountain of copper filings,
>> copper sulphate, sulphuric acid and ethanol shot up to the lab ceiling
>> and rained down on us, together with broken glass. The green stain was
>> still there when I left a couple of years later in 1960, it's probably
>> still there.
>>
>
> Ah the days of /real/ chemistry at school
>
>
Speaking of chemistry - http://wired.com/wired/archive/14.06/chemistry.html

Cheers,

Bryan



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: MEK

2006-06-01 by derekhawkins

>Acetone is ethyl ketone.

Not quite, closest Acetone synonyms are Methyl Ketone and Dimethyl
Ketone. AFAIK, the synonym Ethyl Ketone doesn't exist. MEK is Methyl
Ethyl Ketone.

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Leon Heller" <leon.heller@...>
wrote:
>

RE: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: MEK

2006-06-02 by David R. Rachels

Be cautious of where and how you use solvents such as acetone, MEK &
Methylene Chloride. In addition to health risks these compounds attack most
plastics very aggressively.

DRR

-----Original Message-----
From: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com]
On Behalf Of Robert Hedan
Sent: Thursday, June 01, 2006 7:01 AM
To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: MEK

> -----Message d'origine-----
> De : Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com] De la part de Mycroft2152
> Envoyé : juin 1 2006 06:14
> À : Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
> Objet : [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: MEK
>
>
> Think of MEK as extreme nail polish remover (acetone).
> It's actually the "big brother" to acetone. MEK is a
> very common industrial solvent and must be used with
> respect and all the correct protective equipment.
>
> Great stuff!
>
> Myc


mmmm-okay...

Acetone is a good example that I can relate with, I use it to clean the PCBs
before etching and to remove the toner after etching.

Robert
:)





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