Homebrew PCBs

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, Alan King <alan@...> wrote:
>Hard to figure a way where people can't cheat easily.

I'm pretty sure that's one of the main reasons they *haven't* already 
done an unlimited non-commercial one. I have a feeling that if the 
Eagle people knew any of those who frequent places like this, on a 
"personal" level, they'd gladly let most of us run a fully functional 
version for whatever we could realistically afford to pay at our 
level. A genuine interest, and a willingness to use money from your 
own pocket, with no profits or reimbursement in sight, strictly for 
the "learning experience", is a pretty admirable intention to have. It 
would be cool if they had some sort of a "group buy", where mods,etc., 
from DIY forums and groups like this, could supply vouchers for their 
active members, to allow for a sort of "student" discount. I don't 
think most people talking about toner transfers, DIY etch tanks, or 
GPL-based web projects, are looking at making enough money to 
constitute a few hundred dollars for their circuit apps. I've seen 
several here who do indeed appear to have a wealth of knowledge on 
larger scale layout and PCB design rules, but the fact that they're 
here, sort of implies that they are likely to enjoy helping and 
learning from others.

I'm sure I'll sound like a cheapskate to someone here, but I think the 
prices Pete mentioned are plenty, for some of us "eternally non-
profit" types. Maybe $150 or below, for a full featured app, ideally 
even $100 or below. I still think there are some critical "commercial" 
functions they could target, without attacking the board size or 
number of parts. Even just a limit to double-sided boards would likely 
knock out a bunch of demo-ware exploiters. I could probably fish out a 
hundred functions in there which I don't even understand, much less 
ever see myself using, which are probably crucial to anyone sending 
boards off for mass production.   

I also still believe that if the limits,etc. force some people 
elsewhere, and they remain fairly "non-profit", I can't see any reason 
why they would return to pay a few hundred later on, and have to re-
learn whatever the current Eagle is, after growing accustomed to an 
alternative. Probably not the outcome they have in mind.

For the sake of split personality, I'll add one other thing to 
consider, for anyone who may still be reading. As someone recently 
mentioned in another forum regarding software piracy: Many non-
professionals will claim that by using a "pirated" version of 
something way beyond their skill bracket or budget, the developer 
isn't actually 'losing' any sales, because they wouldn't use it at all 
if it weren't "free". What they often don't realize, is that they may 
inadvertently be stealing from someone way more deserving or in need, 
as the smaller developers really ARE catering to people on that level. 
With the "harmless" freeware version, they have the option of jumping 
right over something they could actually have afforded, which might 
suit all their needs just the same.

One of the first mainstream computer audio systems was an app. called 
"ProTools" by Digidesign (actually hardware too). Being sort of a 
pioneer, it grew into sort of a "standard" with all the pro studios, 
and the name quickly spread down through the clients and smaller 
studios. To make a long story short, a few years later, they 
introduced a "freeware" version of the software, along with a couple 
entry level hardware offerings. All were limited in several areas, but 
they allowed students, hobbyists, and home studios the ability to run 
the "industry standard" system, which they would ultimately need to 
know how to use should they go "pro". Digi could easily afford to 
distribute the freeware and baby ProTools packages, often at prices 
which smaller developers couldn't begin to compete with. Needless to 
say, it pretty much ruined the market for quite a few younger audio 
packages.

If anyone knows that name, I really don't mean to clump CadSoft in 
with them. I was a ProTools owner from the first series, and I quickly 
realized that their support of previous customers, and their upgrade 
policies, were often a bit "questionable". I'm trusting the Eagle guys 
have more honorable intentions for those startup packages.

Thinking about this has made me realize that after learning some basic 
and/or confusing Eagle navigation, I must admit, I never really gave 
any of those other ones a chance. At the first sign of any bumps or 
features I couldn't figure out, I usually left. It sucks to think that 
many of us may be depriving some brilliant young programmers of the 
resources and feedback, which may blossom into something we'd all be 
proud to use. As you know, the young places often times are also more 
"in-tune" to individual user's bug reports and feature requests. Some 
of their instability, may only be a result of the smaller user base, 
leftover from Freagle's omnipotence in this end of the market.  

I'm going to make a point over the next few days, to give an honest 
effort to using that "DipTrace" thing from Jim's (jriggen55) post, and 
anything else I can demo which doesn't immediately crash on me. ;)

Sorry for the long-a** post!

George