Doepfer

HERE IS THE ANSWER FROM DIETER DOEPFER:

--- Dieter Doepfer <hardware@doepfer.de> wrote:
> From: "Dieter Doepfer" <hardware@doepfer.de>
> To: "bakis Sirros" <synth_freak_2000@yahoo.com>
> CC: "Chris Assall" <software@doepfer.de>
> Subject: AW: [Doepfer_a100] Re: Schaltwerk
> Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 13:44:02 +0100
> 
> > -----Urspr�ngliche Nachricht-----
> > Von: bakis Sirros
> [mailto:synth_freak_2000@yahoo.com]
> > Gesendet am: Freitag, 22. Februar 2002 10:13
> > An: dieter doepfer
> > Betreff: Fwd: [Doepfer_a100] Re: Schaltwerk
> >
> >
> > Note: forwarded message attached.
> 
> All I can say to this message is that the SCHALTWERK
> keeps all promises that are
> made in the advertising. Ans - as far as I know - it
> has no bugs. If a customers
> wants to have additional features that are not
> mentioned in the information of a
> product this is another point (e.g. a soft sync
> input or a linear FM input for
> the A-110 is not mentioned and is thus not
> available).
> Of course we try to add additional features if this
> is possible. But our
> programmer Christian Assall told me that the memory
> of SCHALTWERK is 98% used up
> and it is impossible to add additional features. But
> all features that are
> mentioned in the prospectus will work! We would have
> to redesign the SCHALTWERK
> main board completely, as the processor used is
> fully stretched. A new main
> board would cost at least 250 - 350 Euro and I'm not
> sure if the customers would
> be willing to pay that much for an (hardware and
> software) update.
> 
> And - our time is limited. We cannot realize
> everything that is possible. For
> the next few months we are completely busy with the
> new devices we announced on
> our web site. As far as I can see we have only 3 or
> 4 customers that ask for a
> SCHALTWERK update with new features and I think this
> is not as important as the
> design e.g. of a new device like the sensor keyboard
> or trautonium manual.
> 
> Best regards
> Dieter Doepfer
> Doepfer Musikelektronik GmbH
> http://www.doepfer.de
> email: hardware@doepfer.de
> 
> A copy of this answer is sent to our programmer
> Christian Assall
> (mailto:software@doepfer.de).
> 
>
________________________________________________________________________________
> ___________________
> 
> --- In Doepfer_a100@y..., "buechlerjoe"
> <buechlerjoe@t...> wrote:
> 
> hi joe, re-read the posts concerning the schaltwerk
> on the doepfer ez board
> forum. the regelwerk used some of the
> same boards as the schaltwerk. i own both of them. i
> find that when it comes to
> any Doepfer cpu controlled device,
> they are always short on memory, functions and other
> logic. i am really
> disappointed with the schaltwerk.
> there all kinds of bugs and shortcomings that should
> of been dealt with not now
> but 2 years ago. it's a shame that
> non of these  devices had the proper software
> revisions they deserve. i hear
> that every cpu and memory is maxed
> out, hence the reason they can not upgrade the
> software or add more functions.
> they build the shell of  their
> sequencers like a Mercedes but under power them like
> a 70's Volkswagen beetle.
> function definetely does not
> follow its form when it comes to the schaltwerk and
> the regelwerk.  i hate to
> sound harsh, but it is really sad when
> you have the units and start working with them, only
> to find out how under
> powered they really are. many others
> and i, have voiced our opinions and suggestions to
> better these products. ZIP,
> NADA AND NOTHING has been
> done about it for over a year. i guess they really
> care  about their products.
> everbody(reveiwers and customers)
> chewed out Waldorf, when they released the Q. well
> it's been 3 years and they
> upgraded their software so that
> the product functions properly. why Doepfer can't
> follow through, i have no
> idea. i have every filter doepfer has
> released for my A100.  ask me if i care about the
> A108 filter? ask me if i care
> about rotary potentiometers or
> sliders the pocket control?
> 
> THE ANSWER IS NO AND I MEAN NO .
> 
> start by fixing the products that others and i have
> paid for, so that they can
> function the way they should of been
> right from the start. i don't care  about a 48db
> slope filter, when i can
> achieve the same result by putting a few filters
> in series and have different control which you won't
> have in the proposed model.
> i have actually put off buying more
> A100 modules due the fact that nothing is happening
> with the software. i feel
> used and abused. i am now thinking
> about other systems and sequencers.
> 
> Mr. Doepfer PLEASE RE-READ THE POSTS ON THE
> REGELWERK AND SCHALTWERK ON THE
> DOEPFER EZ BOARD
> AND RECTIFY THE SITUATION. I AM BEGGING NOW, PLEASE
> FINISH THEM SO I CAN GO ON
> MAKING MUSIC WITH
> THESE MACHINES AND MY 12U A100 SYSTEM. I DON'T THINK
> THAT I AM OUT OF LINE
> ASKING FOR THESE
> REQUESTS HAVING INVESTED THE AMOUNT OF MONEY I HAVE
> IN THEM. THANKS FOR READING
> AND
> I HOPE THIS  DOES NOT FALL ON DEAF EARS.
> 
> RM
> 
> P.S. Bakkis i really appreciate the work you have
> done with this board for the
> Doepfer community. Kudos to you,
> my friend. now one small favor, please foward this
> post to Mr. Doepfer, so it
> can make a difference. thanks again
> 
> > > allow changing of patterns to create simple
> song,
> >
> > I understand why Doepfer doesn't want the
> Regelwerk to compete with
> > the Schaltwerk, but a simple solution would be to
> offer an "upgrade"
> > ROM for the Regelwerk, at additional cost, that
> would provide pattern
> > chains or songs, forward backward and pendulum
> modes, and all the
> > other features that have been artificially removed
> from the Regelwerk.
> >
> > Of course, its possible to create simple pattern
> chains by combining
> > the Regelwerk with A100 modules such as the A150
> switch. I frequently
> > do this to create 48-note "AABA" patterns and
> such, using the
> > resulting CV/Gate signal to control an A100 voice,
> or the Spectral
> > Audio Neptune.
> >
> > Still, I picked the Regelwerk over the Schaltwerk
> in order to have an
> > integrated step sequencing/soundshaping
> environment, and I find it
> > more than a little annoying that features that I
> need have been
> > artificially removed from the Regelwerk.
> >
> > Joe
> 


=====
synthfreak(parallel worlds)
athens-greece
[Doepfer_a100] group owner-moderator

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Sports - Coverage of the 2002 Olympic Games
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--- In Doepfer_a100@y..., bakis Sirros <synth_freak_2000@y...> wrote:
> HERE IS THE ANSWER FROM DIETER DOEPFER:
> 
> --- Dieter Doepfer <hardware@d...> wrote:
> > From: "Dieter Doepfer" <hardware@d...>
> > To: "bakis Sirros" <synth_freak_2000@y...>
> > CC: "Chris Assall" <software@d...>
> > Subject: AW: [Doepfer_a100] Re: Schaltwerk
> > Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 13:44:02 +0100
> > 
> > > -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
> > > Von: bakis Sirros
> > [mailto:synth_freak_2000@y...]
> > > Gesendet am: Freitag, 22. Februar 2002 10:13
> > > An: dieter doepfer
> > > Betreff: Fwd: [Doepfer_a100] Re: Schaltwerk
> > >
> > >
> > > Note: forwarded message attached.
> > 
> > All I can say to this message is that the SCHALTWERK
> > keeps all promises that are
> > made in the advertising. Ans - as far as I know - it
> > has no bugs. 

please tell mr.doepfer that the above statement is false. there are 
known bugs in the software. i have documented a few myself. i may not 
know how to build hardware or write code, but i do know how to read 
manuals and read between the lines when the manual is poorly written 
and poorly translated. i have put the schaltwerk through its paces 
and exhausted every possibility and discovered a few bugs. perhaps he 
never bothered to read his own forum on the ez board. if he had, he 
would not have written such a statement.
 

If a customers
> > wants to have additional features that are not
> > mentioned in the information of a
> > product this is another point (e.g. a soft sync
> > input or a linear FM input for
> > the A-110 is not mentioned and is thus not
> > available).

if a person wants to do it, he can have a technician look at the 
circuit and get it modified to his or liking. the possibility is 
available.this has no bearing in the case of the schaltwerk. i am not 
looking at a hardware modification i.e. extra jacks, pots or sliders 
and tearing apart the front panel and hardwiring them to the PCB. we 
are talking about writing code here to the make the schaltwerk a 
better and more usable machine.there is no tech out there that you 
can hire for this job.


> > Of course we try to add additional features if this
> > is possible. But our
> > programmer Christian Assall told me that the memory
> > of SCHALTWERK is 98% used up
> > and it is impossible to add additional features.

tell me why, when you were designing the Regelwerk you did not want 
to improve upon the situation, fully knowing that the cpu was tapped 
out with no room to spare and lack of memory was an issue. you could 
have designed a new board that would worked for each machine and 
written separate code for each machine's applications. that would 
have forseen the predicament you are in right now. sounds to me that 
you took the short way out. in the meantime you have not one, but two 
machines that are under powered and tapped to the max with no room 
for improvement. if you go camping in the woods for 2 days, do you 
bring 2 days worth of food or do you bring 3 or 4 days worth for 
insurance and safety just in case MR.MURPHY decides to tag along for 
the ride and goatfuck you.



 But
> > all features that are
> > mentioned in the prospectus will work! 

it is still very light in features considering the price. i read the 
manual for days and nights to get a feel of the machine does. i found 
a little short on features.. after reading the ez board forum i was 
led to believe that an update was coming. i had the extra cash and 
said to myself do it since i own lots of doepfer gear. 2 years later 
and nothing has happened. you release a new version with blue led's 
when you should be releasing an upgrade. i feel cheated.


We would have
> > to redesign the SCHALTWERK
> > main board completely, as the processor used is
> > fully stretched.

you should have re-designed it in the first place when you started 
working on the regelwerk. please see above.


 A new main
> > board would cost at least 250 - 350 Euro 

that is a little overpriced, you should bite at least half of the 
cost, since you shorted the machine in the first place.then you will 
able to sell the remaining ones more easily because they are fully 
functioning and more feature laden. seems to have worked for the 
MAQ16/3. i don't hear anyone complaining on that front.

>and I'm not
> > sure if the customers would
> > be willing to pay that much for an (hardware and
> > software) update. 


i am willing to pay $200 to $250 USD for an upgrade then take a 50% 
bath trying to unload a machine that nobody wants because they know 
nothing will ever get done about it.

 
> > 
> > And - our time is limited.

limited to designing 4 fader boxes that basically do the same thing 
except for the rotary pots and blue led's. help me out, i didn't know 
that took so much time for you as to avoid machines that are in 
circulation that need a resurrection from the current lobotimized 
state they are in. believe me i love these machines, i just want to 
see them get the proper fulfillment they deserve.

 We cannot realize
> > everything that is possible. For
> > the next few months we are completely busy with the
> > new devices we announced on
> > our web site. 

you should make it a priority and then move onto newer products.


As far as I can see we have only 3 or
> > 4 customers that ask for a
> > SCHALTWERK update with new features and I think this
> > is not as important as the
> > design e.g. of a new device like the sensor keyboard
> > or trautonium manual.

please do not take that as a rule. these are people that want to get 
on with their machines at full potential. you mean to tell me that 
you will put an A100 module out into the real based from the polls 
from this group. the average poll has an average of 8 to 16 people 
voting on them. there are 129 members on this group, that means only 
a little 10% of them decided to vote, i am sure you can figure out 
the math and economics here. plus not all the votes are 100% 
positive. the fact that 3 or 4 customers plus andreas lindholm and 
myself makes a total of 6 persons who strongly voice their opinions, 
should lead you to believe that there are at least 60 others out 
there that would love an upgrade. unless you only sold ten 
schaltwerks and that would us make a sorry lot. can you please tell 
us the statistics for

1- how many version 1 MAQ16/3 were sold?
2- how many version 3 upgrades did you sell to version 1 owners?
3- how many version 3 MAQ 16/3 were sold since it was upgraded and 
released as such?
 
this may shed some light to the rest us left holding the proverbial 
bag on this issue. again bakkis, please relay this to mr.doepfer so 
we can have a better response that only 3 or 4 customers would want a 
better and upgraded regelwerk and schaltwerk. i don't think i am out 
of line asking for a better explanation  or solution to a nagging 
problem having spent $1100 USD and the machine lays there un 
fulfilled. thank you for your time.

kindest regards,
RM

> > 
> > Best regards
> > Dieter Doepfer
> > Doepfer Musikelektronik GmbH
> > http://www.doepfer.de
> > email: hardware@d...
> > 
> > A copy of this answer is sent to our programmer
> > Christian Assall
> > (mailto:software@d...).
> > 
> >
> 
______________________________________________________________________
__________

> > ___________________
> > 
> > --- In Doepfer_a100@y..., "buechlerjoe"
> > <buechlerjoe@t...> wrote:
> > 
> > hi joe, re-read the posts concerning the schaltwerk
> > on the doepfer ez board
> > forum. the regelwerk used some of the
> > same boards as the schaltwerk. i own both of them. i
> > find that when it comes to
> > any Doepfer cpu controlled device,
> > they are always short on memory, functions and other
> > logic. i am really
> > disappointed with the schaltwerk.
> > there all kinds of bugs and shortcomings that should
> > of been dealt with not now
> > but 2 years ago. it's a shame that
> > non of these  devices had the proper software
> > revisions they deserve. i hear
> > that every cpu and memory is maxed
> > out, hence the reason they can not upgrade the
> > software or add more functions.
> > they build the shell of  their
> > sequencers like a Mercedes but under power them like
> > a 70's Volkswagen beetle.
> > function definetely does not
> > follow its form when it comes to the schaltwerk and
> > the regelwerk.  i hate to
> > sound harsh, but it is really sad when
> > you have the units and start working with them, only
> > to find out how under
> > powered they really are. many others
> > and i, have voiced our opinions and suggestions to
> > better these products. ZIP,
> > NADA AND NOTHING has been
> > done about it for over a year. i guess they really
> > care  about their products.
> > everbody(reveiwers and customers)
> > chewed out Waldorf, when they released the Q. well
> > it's been 3 years and they
> > upgraded their software so that
> > the product functions properly. why Doepfer can't
> > follow through, i have no
> > idea. i have every filter doepfer has
> > released for my A100.  ask me if i care about the
> > A108 filter? ask me if i care
> > about rotary potentiometers or
> > sliders the pocket control?
> > 
> > THE ANSWER IS NO AND I MEAN NO .
> > 
> > start by fixing the products that others and i have
> > paid for, so that they can
> > function the way they should of been
> > right from the start. i don't care  about a 48db
> > slope filter, when i can
> > achieve the same result by putting a few filters
> > in series and have different control which you won't
> > have in the proposed model.
> > i have actually put off buying more
> > A100 modules due the fact that nothing is happening
> > with the software. i feel
> > used and abused. i am now thinking
> > about other systems and sequencers.
> > 
> > Mr. Doepfer PLEASE RE-READ THE POSTS ON THE
> > REGELWERK AND SCHALTWERK ON THE
> > DOEPFER EZ BOARD
> > AND RECTIFY THE SITUATION. I AM BEGGING NOW, PLEASE
> > FINISH THEM SO I CAN GO ON
> > MAKING MUSIC WITH
> > THESE MACHINES AND MY 12U A100 SYSTEM. I DON'T THINK
> > THAT I AM OUT OF LINE
> > ASKING FOR THESE
> > REQUESTS HAVING INVESTED THE AMOUNT OF MONEY I HAVE
> > IN THEM. THANKS FOR READING
> > AND
> > I HOPE THIS  DOES NOT FALL ON DEAF EARS.
> > 
> > RM
> > 
> > P.S. Bakkis i really appreciate the work you have
> > done with this board for the
> > Doepfer community. Kudos to you,
> > my friend. now one small favor, please foward this
> > post to Mr. Doepfer, so it
> > can make a difference. thanks again
> > 
> > > > allow changing of patterns to create simple
> > song,
> > >
> > > I understand why Doepfer doesn't want the
> > Regelwerk to compete with
> > > the Schaltwerk, but a simple solution would be to
> > offer an "upgrade"
> > > ROM for the Regelwerk, at additional cost, that
> > would provide pattern
> > > chains or songs, forward backward and pendulum
> > modes, and all the
> > > other features that have been artificially removed
> > from the Regelwerk.
> > >
> > > Of course, its possible to create simple pattern
> > chains by combining
> > > the Regelwerk with A100 modules such as the A150
> > switch. I frequently
> > > do this to create 48-note "AABA" patterns and
> > such, using the
> > > resulting CV/Gate signal to control an A100 voice,
> > or the Spectral
> > > Audio Neptune.
> > >
> > > Still, I picked the Regelwerk over the Schaltwerk
> > in order to have an
> > > integrated step sequencing/soundshaping
> > environment, and I find it
> > > more than a little annoying that features that I
> > need have been
> > > artificially removed from the Regelwerk.
> > >
> > > Joe
> > 
> 
> 
> =====
> synthfreak(parallel worlds)
> athens-greece
> [Doepfer_a100] group owner-moderator
> 
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Sports - Coverage of the 2002 Olympic Games
> http://sports.yahoo.com

rn,

fair enough...

but please, no goatf*cking.

thanks,
duff

--- In Doepfer_a100@y..., "duffnuff" <duffnuff@h...> wrote:
> rn,
> 
> fair enough...
> 
> but please, no goatf*cking.
> 
> thanks,
> duff

i read a book by Richard Marcinko, a navy seal, entitled Rogue 
Warrior. in the book, his use of the word goatfuck is always 
associated to Mr. Murphy of the famed Murphy's Law. i used the word 
in reference to the "in the woods" scenario and not in any way, shape 
or form to comment on the situation with the machines or the people 
at Doepfer. it was meant to highlight the fact,that if you don't plan 
in advance sometimes, you can get caught with your pants down. which 
seems to be the case. respect. 

RM

Okey. I too felt that RM was a bit on the overzealous side in his words to
Doepfer, but perhaps so was I. I guess you get a bit annoyed after adressing
things and getting replies that to keep it short goes, we don't want to fix
it, it is not a priority and by the way we used cheap components under the
shell so we can't.

Call me a sucker but the reason behind my own grumbles is the fact that I
expect quality to be a word that is more than skin deep. Doepfer
manufactures its gear as quality products using top components such like
alp-faders on the regelwerk and so forth. Maybe it is not written down in
the specs, but when I bought mine I thought that the same detail was given
to the functions and intestants of the machine. So this is an issue of
quality. If it is marketed as top of the line it should get that kind of
attention. That for me includes basics like patternchaining and different
note lengths that has been standard issue on any sequencer over the last ten
years?

So after failing to sell my unit for even half the retail price I do feel
cheated. On the other hand if it had these features or an option to use it
as a midi-cv(which could replace the non functional seqencer) it would be
very useful and wouldn't be just gathering dust along with my A100. Yes, you
heard right that too is gathering dust now cause of the lack of sequencing
possibilites...

I will do my best to discourage people to buy the regelwerk until a solution
comes up cause there are far better soultions on the market now that has a
future planned for them. I will however still tell people that the A100 is
good although the standard VCO tracks far less than perfect. And if they
manage to come up with a solution for these matters I have always wanted a
graphic VCO and oscillscope module and would by them on the spot.

That will be my final word about this until we get further information from
Dieter D on the matter.