Doepfer

hi there,
just joined the group and getting my first A100 this week.
it is the basic mini system with some extra loose modules.
how would i go about building an extra 3u case ontop of this to put 
the extra modules in and build into.
do i just need a blank case and then put the buss board thats 
available as an accessory in and join them together?
anyone in the UK know where to get cases from?
i also have an AS rs100 moog ladder filter unit. how easy will this 
be to incorporate into the new rack. will it just plug straight in 
or do i need some form of special cabling.

hope someone can shine some light on it all.

--- In Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com, "neilwight <neilwight@y...>" 
<neilwight@y...> wrote:
> i also have an AS rs100 moog ladder filter unit. how easy will this 
> be to incorporate into the new rack. will it just plug straight in 
> or do i need some form of special cabling.
> 

The RS100 does use the same +/-12v 
and +5v as the Doepfer modules. 
However, AS modules use a 16pin 
dipheader on a ribbon cable for 
connecting to the RS powersupply.

If you want to mix and match AS and
Doepfer, the easiest way to go is to 
buy an AS chassis/powersupply with 
the Doepfer adapter.  Other wise, you
will have to fabricate a Doepfer to
AS adapter, which, BTW, I have done.
I will post a picture of it later 
today so you can see what to do.

Ethan

ethan, 
thanks, that would be great to see as i wouldnt mind manufacturing 
one myself. i dont plan on getting too many AS modules just now so i 
think i will stick with a doepfer case and the common bus etc.

do you make your own cases?
is it just a case of putting the extra bus board into a case and 
then linking them up. i havent got the manual yet so maybe its all 
laid out in there.
have you got an RS100? how do you think it compares to the a120 as 
they are both moog copies.

neil

> The RS100 does use the same +/-12v 
> and +5v as the Doepfer modules. 
> However, AS modules use a 16pin 
> dipheader on a ribbon cable for 
> connecting to the RS powersupply.
> 
> If you want to mix and match AS and
> Doepfer, the easiest way to go is to 
> buy an AS chassis/powersupply with 
> the Doepfer adapter.  Other wise, you
> will have to fabricate a Doepfer to
> AS adapter, which, BTW, I have done.
> I will post a picture of it later 
> today so you can see what to do.
> 
> Ethan

Hi Neil,

> how would i go about building an extra 3u case ontop of this to put 
> the extra modules in and build into.
> do i just need a blank case and then put the buss board thats 
> available as an accessory in and join them together?
> anyone in the UK know where to get cases from?

Coincidently I have just been wondering whether I could make up the 
cases cheaper than buying them ready-made from EMIS. Conclusion - I 
doubt it. Firstly with only about £20 difference between the G3 and 
G6 cases, unless you need a small case, the G3 is not very economic. 
Also, if you join the 'Doepfer Owners Club' that Andy Horrell of 
EMIS 'runs', you get about 10% off all prices - if you get a thirst 
for more modules (very likely to happen...!) you recoup the 'joining 
fee' very quickly. So, the DOC price for a G6 is £175. You would need 
1 PSU and 2 bus boards to put in it. These are £44 and £23 resp, 
total £90. This doesn't include any panels yet, in particular the 
back panel with the power receptacle and switch. Doepfer do actually 
sell these as 'spares', at 35 euros, say £25. This leaves £60 for the 
side, top and bottom panels, all the rails and threadstrips etc. Even 
assuming you could find someone to sell them at half this £60 figure, 
the hassle in a) trying to find a supplier, and b) having to screw it 
all together (one would probably need to order all the screws 
separately as well....), for my money, just isn't worth the other 30 
quid!!

But don't let me put you off too much - it _is_ possible to put your 
own cases together, and the Doepfer stuff is a 'standard' size (but 
there are several 'standards'!), so if you want to build a custom 
rack or just happen to come across something that will do, then go 
for it.

Haven't got anything other than Doepfer stuff, so can't comment on 
others, but don't forget that the A-108 filter is also a Moog ladder 
type (which I do have, and sounds good!).

Regards,
Tim

You only need a common bus if you're going to spread your VCOs and 
ADSRs across cases. In a 6U or even 9U system it would be perfectly 
feasable to keep these modules in one case on a single bus, to avoid 
having to tie the buses together.

The cost of the 3U and 6U cases is mostly comprised of the power 
supply, that's why the prices aren't that different. The actual 3U or 
6U case and bus boards are sort of "thrown in" with the power 
supply. Respects to Timothy, but neither is more "economical" than the 
other, it all depends on how many power supplies you want or need, and 
how you want to distribute the load among them.  I use two 3U cases 
and a 6U case - it provides more flexibility in the configuration, and 
the power-hungry modules can be allocated to the smaller cases to 
reduce the load on each individual power supply.

It would be fun and probably satisfying to make your own case, but I 
don't think there's be any economic advantage to it.

Joe

--- In Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com, "Tim Stinchcombe <timothy@t...>" 
<timothy@t...> wrote:
> Hi Neil,
> 
> > how would i go about building an extra 3u case ontop of this to 
put 
> > the extra modules in and build into.
> > do i just need a blank case and then put the buss board thats 
> > available as an accessory in and join them together?
> > anyone in the UK know where to get cases from?
> 
> Coincidently I have just been wondering whether I could make up the 
> cases cheaper than buying them ready-made from EMIS. Conclusion - I 
> doubt it. Firstly with only about £20 difference between the G3 and 
> G6 cases, unless you need a small case, the G3 is not very economic. 
> Also, if you join the 'Doepfer Owners Club' that Andy Horrell of 
> EMIS 'runs', you get about 10% off all prices - if you get a thirst 
> for more modules (very likely to happen...!) you recoup the 'joining 
> fee' very quickly. So, the DOC price for a G6 is £175. You would 
need 
> 1 PSU and 2 bus boards to put in it. These are £44 and £23 resp, 
> total £90. This doesn't include any panels yet, in particular the 
> back panel with the power receptacle and switch. Doepfer do actually 
> sell these as 'spares', at 35 euros, say £25. This leaves £60 for 
the 
> side, top and bottom panels, all the rails and threadstrips etc. 
Even 
> assuming you could find someone to sell them at half this £60 
figure, 
> the hassle in a) trying to find a supplier, and b) having to screw 
it 

> all together (one would probably need to order all the screws 
> separately as well....), for my money, just isn't worth the other 30 
> quid!!
> 
> But don't let me put you off too much - it _is_ possible to put your 
> own cases together, and the Doepfer stuff is a 'standard' size (but 
> there are several 'standards'!), so if you want to build a custom 
> rack or just happen to come across something that will do, then go 
> for it.
> 
> Haven't got anything other than Doepfer stuff, so can't comment on 
> others, but don't forget that the A-108 filter is also a Moog ladder 
> type (which I do have, and sounds good!).
> 
> Regards,
> Tim

--- In Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com, "neilwight <neilwight@y...>" 
<neilwight@y...> wrote:
> ethan, 
> thanks, that would be great to see as i wouldnt mind manufacturing 
> one myself. i dont plan on getting too many AS modules just now so 
i 
> think i will stick with a doepfer case and the common bus etc.
> 
> do you make your own cases?
> is it just a case of putting the extra bus board into a case and 
> then linking them up. i havent got the manual yet so maybe its all 
> laid out in there.
> have you got an RS100? how do you think it compares to the a120 as 
> they are both moog copies.
> 
> neil
> 
> 

Hi Neil,

I uploaded two pictures in my folder
that depict the simple Doepfer to AS
power adapter I made for my suitcase 
A100 when I added two RS95s. I have 
since aquired a custom case for my 
additional modules. I don't have an 
RS100, though, I have heard folks 
speaking highly of it. I do have an 
A120 and I like it plenty.

The first picture is as_adapter.jpg
this pic show the full construction.

The second pic shows the terminal 
connectors I used. The power bus board 
in my suite case just happens to have 
terminals labled +12, -12, +5 and ground. 
I used 4 color wire. The wire is connected 
to the 16pin dip sockets the same way the 
RS modules are labled. Just look at your 
module. you'll see which is +12, -12, +5 
or ground.

Let me know if you have questions,

Ethan

Hi Joe,

> supply. Respects to Timothy, but neither is more "economical" than 
the 
> other, it all depends on how many power supplies you want or need, 
and 
> how you want to distribute the load among them.  I use two 3U cases 
> and a 6U case - it provides more flexibility in the configuration, 
and 
> the power-hungry modules can be allocated to the smaller cases to 
> reduce the load on each individual power supply.

I agree entirely in that use of G3's or G6's depends on what you 
want. However, if you just pile them one on top of the other as I do 
(and plenty of others do too I suspect), then my current 3xG6 cases 
as 6xG3 would cost an _extra_ £483 (or $783 at En-port prices). 
That's _my_ economics ;-). So, each time you buy a G6 case you can 
convince yourself that its the right thing to do - think of all the 
money you have just saved, that can now be spent on other modules 
instead. The downside is that with all that gaping, empty rack space, 
you end up buying more modules sooner rather than later (so perhaps 
it's not such good economics after all...).

BTW (for Neil, Richard and any others interested) I now notice that 
on the Doepfer website under 'A100 Construction Details' not only is 
there a link to the people whose stuff they use (ProMa), but also 
a .pdf file of all the bits 'n bobs one needs to put a case together 
oneself (right down to the captive nuts and self-tapping screws!)

Tim

--- In Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com, "Tim Stinchcombe <timothy@t...>" 
<timothy@t...> wrote:
 
> I agree entirely in that use of G3's or G6's depends on what you 
> want. However, if you just pile them one on top of the other as I do 
> (and plenty of others do too I suspect), then my current 3xG6 cases 
> as 6xG3 would cost an _extra_ £483 (or $783 at En-port prices). 
> That's _my_ economics ;-). So, each time you buy a G6 case you can 
> convince yourself that its the right thing to do - think of all the 
> money you have just saved, that can now be spent on other modules 
> instead. The downside is that with all that gaping, empty rack 
space, 
> you end up buying more modules sooner rather than later (so perhaps 
> it's not such good economics after all...).

Hi Timothy

Apologies for the poor wording on my part. Yes I understand this point 
of view, and I wouldn't see the point of having 6X G3 cases. Its 
commonly said that the G3 case is uneconomical, I was just pointing 
out that there's a different way of looking at it i.e. that you're 
essentially buying power supplies, not cases. The G3 case isn't a 
ripoff.

If I decide to add another row of modules, I can buy a G6 case, put 
one of the G3 cases in storage, and have an A100 system with an odd 
number of rows. I won't have a "gaping hole" that looks ugly and might 
 make me spend a bunch of extra money for more modules than I 
wanted - as you say, not good economics after all. Later, if I 
decide to add yet another row of modules, I can add the second G3 case 
back to the stack and create a system with an even number of rows 
again.

What's more, the two G3 cases allow me to place the system bus (the G6 
case) anywhere I want in the stack - top, middle, or bottom. This 
flexibility turned out to be important to me, because I wanted the row 
containing the A155 sequence on top (to be unencumbered by patch 
cables), but I wanted the VCOs and ADSRs to me at eye level, rather 
than on the bottom of the stack. So I have G3 on top, G6, and the 
other G3 on the bottom. Works for me, anyway.

Joe

> 
> BTW (for Neil, Richard and any others interested) I now notice that 
> on the Doepfer website under 'A100 Construction Details' not only is 
> there a link to the people whose stuff they use (ProMa), but also 
> a .pdf file of all the bits 'n bobs one needs to put a case together 
> oneself (right down to the captive nuts and self-tapping screws!)
> 
> Tim

i had come to the same conclusion that the power supply was the 
expensive part of the case.
i only have a system in a G3 at the moment but already have too many 
modules.
i had though that perhaps i could have made up my own G3 case to go 
ontop creating a G6 module for relatively cheap as the bus board is 
only £30 and the power supply would be sufficient to cover them both.
i guess the smart thing would be to save up and buy a G6, move 
everything into that and then fill it up then extend into the G3 
when i grow bigger.
its just i have just gotten it and it is annoying that i will have 
to spend my module money on a case.
oh well.
i guess thats how it goes :(

neil

Its possible to convert a G3 case to a G6 case easily and 
inexpensively. Email Doepfer HW support for details.

OTOH if you got a G6 case you would have space for a 2-row and then 
later a 3-row configuration, with any additional investment going 
toward modules. Sometimes its a good feeling to have the PITA expenses 
out of the way up front.

Joe

 --- In Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com, "neilwight <neilwight@y...>" 
<neilwight@y...> wrote:
> i had come to the same conclusion that the power supply was the 
> expensive part of the case.
> i only have a system in a G3 at the moment but already have too many 
> modules.
> i had though that perhaps i could have made up my own G3 case to go 
> ontop creating a G6 module for relatively cheap as the bus board is 
> only £30 and the power supply would be sufficient to cover them 
both.

> i guess the smart thing would be to save up and buy a G6, move 
> everything into that and then fill it up then extend into the G3 
> when i grow bigger.
> its just i have just gotten it and it is annoying that i will have 
> to spend my module money on a case.
> oh well.
> i guess thats how it goes :(
> 
> neil