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Somewhat embarrassing 220/2400 BO confession

Somewhat embarrassing 220/2400 BO confession

2006-03-21 by how786

Today, I finally got down to seriously testing and looking at 8X10
prints made by my 2400 and comparing them to BO (Eboni Black) prints
made on my 220. I did my prints on Merlin Natural.
 My surprising confession/conclusion is that no matter how hard I try
to tweak the 2400 prints in the Advanced B&W mode, I find the 220 BO
prints more pleasing to my eye. I am in somewhat of a stunned state
regarding this. That a printer I paid $69 for can make a print that I
prefer over those made in my $700 printer shocks my sensibility.
 I am going to try some more to see if I can just get the 2400 to
match what the 220 is outputing. 
 Best to all
 Howard

Re: Somewhat embarrassing 220/2400 BO confession

2006-03-21 by how786

OK.  I need some help here. I'm still fiddling around with my 2400
trying to make a print that matches the 220 BO output. (How
bizarre)Right now, I'm getting closer. The main difference is that the
220 BO prints have deeper blacks. 
 I'm not sure what to adjust in the 2400 ADV. B&W driver to deepen the
blacks. I'd appreciate some help with this.....I sure hope it isn't a
function of the Eboni Black simply being better ink!
 Thanks
 Howard
 


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "how786"
<how786@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
>  Today, I finally got down to seriously testing and looking at 8X10
> prints made by my 2400 and comparing them to BO (Eboni Black) prints
> made on my 220. I did my prints on Merlin Natural.
>  My surprising confession/conclusion is that no matter how hard I try
> to tweak the 2400 prints in the Advanced B&W mode, I find the 220 BO
> prints more pleasing to my eye. I am in somewhat of a stunned state
> regarding this. That a printer I paid $69 for can make a print that I
> prefer over those made in my $700 printer shocks my sensibility.
>  I am going to try some more to see if I can just get the 2400 to
> match what the 220 is outputing. 
>  Best to all
>  Howard
>

B&W HP 8750xi Printer

2006-03-21 by Brian Harris

My local Sams has dropped the price of the HP 8750xi down to $430.00.
 
I have been saving up money to purchase an Epson 2400; however, at $430.00 I am very tempted to purchase the 8750.  
 
The printer uses three tri color cartridges:  
  Cart 1:  Magenta, Cyan, and Yellow
  Cart 2:  Photo Blue Cartridge with three shades of blue
  Cart 3:  Photo Black Cartridge with three shades of black
 
Having a Tri color Blue cartridge is something that appears to be unique to the HP.  Most everyone else uses light cyan, light magenta, and light black for their secondary color cartrdige.
 
My biggest concerns are the use of multi color ink cartridges instead of single color cartridges and the apparent lack of 3rd party RIP support for HP printers in general.
 
Would any of you be so kind as to offer you thoughts on the 8750 in general and specifically B&W printing with it?
 
Thanks!!!
 
 

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

RE: [Digital BW] Re: Somewhat embarrassing 220/2400 BO confession

2006-03-21 by Paul Roark

> ... I'm still fiddling around with my 2400
> trying to make a print that matches the 220 BO output. 
> (How bizarre)

It's really not bizarre.  That little R220 is amazing. 

When I mentioned to an Epson rep from Long Beach how impressed I've been
with the R220, his comment was that they may have made it too good.  It may
be hurting the sales of more profitable printers.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com

[Digital BW] Re: Somewhat embarrassing 220/2400 BO confession

2006-03-21 by how786

Wow...thanks for the frank comment Paul.

 I feel like I am got a real dilemma here. I love the look of the 220
BO prints. I'm wondering if there is any way to get the 2400 to
reproduce this look for images larger than 8X10 or whether I must bite
the bullet and purchase another printer for larger BO printing.
 I'm hoping to hear from Clayton (or anyone else) on this issue since
I believe he has both a 200 and a 2400.
 Best Regards
 Howard

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Roark"
<paul.roark@...> wrote:
>
> 
> 
> > ... I'm still fiddling around with my 2400
> > trying to make a print that matches the 220 BO output. 
> > (How bizarre)
> 
> It's really not bizarre.  That little R220 is amazing. 
> 
> When I mentioned to an Epson rep from Long Beach how impressed I've been
> with the R220, his comment was that they may have made it too good.
 It may
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> be hurting the sales of more profitable printers.
> 
> Paul
> www.PaulRoark.com
>

Re: [Digital BW] Re: Somewhat embarrassing 220/2400 BO confession

2006-03-21 by Tom Baker

The smaller dropplet size, and higher dpi resolution of the 220 may make it difficult to find a larger printer that can produce the same quality 8x10.  Surely, if you were printing bigger (longer viewing distance) you should be able to produce the same visual quality using the same ink.  But, maybe not with up close, 8x10's.
   
  Tom Baker

how786 <how786@...> wrote:
  Wow...thanks for the frank comment Paul.

I feel like I am got a real dilemma here. I love the look of the 220
BO prints. I'm wondering if there is any way to get the 2400 to
reproduce this look for images larger than 8X10 or whether I must bite
the bullet and purchase another printer for larger BO printing.
I'm hoping to hear from Clayton (or anyone else) on this issue since
I believe he has both a 200 and a 2400.
Best Regards
Howard

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Roark"
<paul.roark@...> wrote:
>
> 
> 
> > ... I'm still fiddling around with my 2400
> > trying to make a print that matches the 220 BO output. 
> > (How bizarre)
> 
> It's really not bizarre.  That little R220 is amazing. 
> 
> When I mentioned to an Epson rep from Long Beach how impressed I've been
> with the R220, his comment was that they may have made it too good.
It may
> be hurting the sales of more profitable printers.
> 
> Paul
> www.PaulRoark.com
>






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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: Somewhat embarrassing 220/2400 BO confession

2006-03-21 by jlk4410

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "how786" <how786@...> wrote:
>
>  Today, I finally got down to seriously testing and looking at 8X10
> prints made by my 2400 and comparing them to BO (Eboni Black) prints
> made on my 220. I did my prints on Merlin Natural.
>  My surprising confession/conclusion is that no matter how hard I try
> to tweak the 2400 prints in the Advanced B&W mode, I find the 220 BO
> prints more pleasing to my eye. I am in somewhat of a stunned state
> regarding this. That a printer I paid $69 for can make a print that I
> prefer over those made in my $700 printer shocks my sensibility.
>  I am going to try some more to see if I can just get the 2400 to
> match what the 220 is outputing. 
>  Best to all
>  Howard
>
Howard,
Thank you for your refreshing frankness! Ain't it a bitch? 
Keep us posted as to your progress.
Good Luck!
Julian

[Digital BW] Re: Somewhat embarrassing 220/2400 BO confession

2006-03-21 by ginnylady33

Howard,

  Have you tried tweaking up the contrast to deepen the blacks?

Regards
Ginny

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "how786"
<how786@...> wrote:
>
>  Wow...thanks for the frank comment Paul.
> 
>  I feel like I am got a real dilemma here. I love the look of the 220
> BO prints. I'm wondering if there is any way to get the 2400 to
> reproduce this look for images larger than 8X10 or whether I must bite
> the bullet and purchase another printer for larger BO printing.
>  I'm hoping to hear from Clayton (or anyone else) on this issue since
> I believe he has both a 200 and a 2400.
>  Best Regards
>  Howard
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Roark"
> <paul.roark@> wrote:
> >
> > 
> > 
> > > ... I'm still fiddling around with my 2400
> > > trying to make a print that matches the 220 BO output. 
> > > (How bizarre)
> > 
> > It's really not bizarre.  That little R220 is amazing. 
> > 
> > When I mentioned to an Epson rep from Long Beach how impressed
I've been
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> > with the R220, his comment was that they may have made it too good.
>  It may
> > be hurting the sales of more profitable printers.
> > 
> > Paul
> > www.PaulRoark.com
> >
>

Somewhat embarrassing 220/2400 BO confession

2006-03-22 by Jack Winberg

Howard et al:

OK, I'm convinced, but the price of this wondrous 220 printer seems 
to have risen, perhaps too much praise here!  :-)

The best price I seem to find is about $99 now, anyone know where it 
may be available for that tempting $69?

Thanks................... Jack Winberg

At 07:05 PM 3/21/2006, you wrote:
>From: "jlk4410" <Jlkmmw@...>
>Subject: Re: Somewhat embarrassing 220/2400 BO confession
>
>--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "how786" 
><how786@...> wrote:
> >
> >  Today, I finally got down to seriously testing and looking at 8X10
> > prints made by my 2400 and comparing them to BO (Eboni Black) prints
> > made on my 220. I did my prints on Merlin Natural.
> >  My surprising confession/conclusion is that no matter how hard I try
> > to tweak the 2400 prints in the Advanced B&W mode, I find the 220 BO
> > prints more pleasing to my eye. I am in somewhat of a stunned state
> > regarding this. That a printer I paid $69 for can make a print that I
> > prefer over those made in my $700 printer shocks my sensibility.
> >  I am going to try some more to see if I can just get the 2400 to
> > match what the 220 is outputing.
> >  Best to all
> >  Howard


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] Somewhat embarrassing 220/2400 BO confession

2006-03-22 by Tina Manley

At 07:54 PM 3/21/2006, you wrote:
>The best price I seem to find is about $99 now, anyone know where it
>may be available for that tempting $69?

I got mine at Best Buy for $99 with a $50 rebate.  Can't beat 
that!  Got the rebate check this week.

Tina

Tina Manley, ASMP
http://www.tinamanley.com 

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

RE: [Digital BW] Somewhat embarrassing 220/2400 BO confession

2006-03-22 by Paul Roark

Try eBay; there seem to be a few in the "buy it now" category at good
prices.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com 
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> -----Original Message-----
> From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jack
> Winberg
> Sent: Tuesday, March 21, 2006 4:55 PM
> To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Digital BW] Somewhat embarrassing 220/2400 BO confession
> 
> Howard et al:
> 
> OK, I'm convinced, but the price of this wondrous 220 printer seems
> to have risen, perhaps too much praise here!  :-)
> 
> The best price I seem to find is about $99 now, anyone know where it
> may be available for that tempting $69?
> 
> Thanks................... Jack Winberg
> 
> At 07:05 PM 3/21/2006, you wrote:
> >From: "jlk4410" <Jlkmmw@...>
> >Subject: Re: Somewhat embarrassing 220/2400 BO confession
> >
> >--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "how786"
> ><how786@...> wrote:
> > >
> > >  Today, I finally got down to seriously testing and looking at 8X10
> > > prints made by my 2400 and comparing them to BO (Eboni Black) prints
> > > made on my 220. I did my prints on Merlin Natural.
> > >  My surprising confession/conclusion is that no matter how hard I try
> > > to tweak the 2400 prints in the Advanced B&W mode, I find the 220 BO
> > > prints more pleasing to my eye. I am in somewhat of a stunned state
> > > regarding this. That a printer I paid $69 for can make a print that I
> > > prefer over those made in my $700 printer shocks my sensibility.
> > >  I am going to try some more to see if I can just get the 2400 to
> > > match what the 220 is outputing.
> > >  Best to all
> > >  Howard
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> 
> 
> 
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as
> they are often being updated.
> 
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> 
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to
> unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same
> page.
> 
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
> them short.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames.
> Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the
> membership without notice.
> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W
> printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from
> the membership.
> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and
> guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner
> and Moderators. See Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines in the Files
> section:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
> 
> BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
> YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE OWNER AND
> MODERATORS OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO
> YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR
> EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF
> PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE
> OWNER AND MODERATORS OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN
> ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE
> OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii)
> UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii)
> STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
> YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE
> PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
> 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
>

Re: Somewhat embarrassing 220/2400 BO confession

2006-03-22 by how786

Try Onsale.com. I got mine there. They should still be $69.
Howard


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Jack Winberg
<jack.winberg@...> wrote:
>
> Howard et al:
> 
> OK, I'm convinced, but the price of this wondrous 220 printer seems 
> to have risen, perhaps too much praise here!  :-)
> 
> The best price I seem to find is about $99 now, anyone know where it 
> may be available for that tempting $69?
> 
> Thanks................... Jack Winberg
> 
> At 07:05 PM 3/21/2006, you wrote:
> >From: "jlk4410" <Jlkmmw@...>
> >Subject: Re: Somewhat embarrassing 220/2400 BO confession
> >
> >--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "how786" 
> ><how786@> wrote:
> > >
> > >  Today, I finally got down to seriously testing and looking at 8X10
> > > prints made by my 2400 and comparing them to BO (Eboni Black) prints
> > > made on my 220. I did my prints on Merlin Natural.
> > >  My surprising confession/conclusion is that no matter how hard
I try
> > > to tweak the 2400 prints in the Advanced B&W mode, I find the 220 BO
> > > prints more pleasing to my eye. I am in somewhat of a stunned state
> > > regarding this. That a printer I paid $69 for can make a print
that I
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> > > prefer over those made in my $700 printer shocks my sensibility.
> > >  I am going to try some more to see if I can just get the 2400 to
> > > match what the 220 is outputing.
> > >  Best to all
> > >  Howard
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

[Digital BW] Re: Somewhat embarrassing 220/2400 BO confession

2006-03-23 by colingruk

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Roark" 
<paul.roark@...> wrote:
>
> 
 That little R220 is amazing. 
> 

> Paul
> www.PaulRoark.com
>
Has anyone compared a 220 BO print and a 2200 print BO print, both 
using Eboni on 8"x10"/A4?  Is the 220 print better in any way?  I use 
Prag so results for this paper would be especially welcome.

ColinGRUK

[Digital BW] Re: Somewhat embarrassing 220/2400 BO confession

2006-03-23 by Clayton Jones

Hello Colin,

>Has anyone compared a 220 BO print and a 2200 print BO print, both 
>using Eboni on 8"x10"/A4?  Is the 220 print better in any way?  I use 
>Prag so results for this paper would be especially welcome.

I have an R200, not the 220, so don't know how different they might
be. My R200 BO prints are not quite as good as I was getting from my
2200.  To the eye they are hard to tell apart, but with a magnifier
there is more dither banding.  It's also possible that, being a
cheaper printer, there may be more variance among different individual
printers.

Regards,
Clayton


Info on black and white digital printing at    
http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm

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