Digital BW, The Print

George, I have a solution/idea for you that would be quite the upgrade to what you're doing now.

I lost my internet connection last night, so I had some time to think about a Piezography system for your needs. But, I was a little surprised to learn that 3MK is a black ink only system. I thought it was the MIS version of Epson ABW and that it used three shades of black. I read its specs and its definitely a black ink only system, albeit with three locations in which to put 100% black ink. This explains the ease at which its longevity testing is going. It is much more difficult naturally, to get longevity out of six and seven shades of black ink. But, that's neither here nor there when you're seeking very specific aesthetics. Even though we can easily fit Piezography K7 Sepia to your printer for killer longevity, your needs do not make you a candidate for carbon only printing.

In the meantime, you are seeking to make a typical selenium toned print and a typical azo type print in your Epson R1800. This would be my advice to you. If you are serious about the image-quality of your black & white printmaking, then you should be using dilutions of black that have been partitioned in order to divide a grayscale image into a much greater amount of gray values than you can realize by using black ink only. That is not an opinion, but a fact. You should use at minimum four shades of black (that's opinion). Piezographers typically use six and seven. The results are not just additional gray values but a depth to the quality of light that reflects back from my pigment. There would be zero metamerism if that is important to you. The concept of Piezography is not to imitate the darkroom, but to exceed it, as it carries its values and traditions forward in a digital era.

In an R1800 printer I would suggest using:

Piezography K7 shade 1 Matte Black
Piezography Warm Neutral shade 2/3 (50%50%)
Piezography Warm Neutral shade 4
Piezography Warm Neutral shade 5
Piezography Selenium Shade 2/3 (50%50%)
Piezography Selenium Shade 4
Piezography Selenium Shade 5

The Warm Neutral inks can give that straight azo look (slightly greenish warm tone) - and of course Selenium inks were designed in collaboration with my teacher Arnold Gassan to imitate short-bath selenium toning. These are what you're seeking.

This is a dual quad system and you would be in monochromatic nirvana being able to blend two curves together, or split tone between the two. You could add a little Warm Neutral curve to the Selenium curve and visa versa in highlights, midtones and shadows, or simply use one or the other. My pigment is so finely ground, that paper choice is how we do the variable tone in Piezography. So the possibilities without reverting to color inks might be limitless.

I have a system like the above running in my R2400 which I love for my own work. I do some wicked split toning using the three positions of the two curves blending - allowing mixes independently in shadows, midtones and highlights. We printed a number of portfolios for clients using this system to replace a dual quad StudioPrint system we had. We replaced it because I get significantly better shadow and highlight detail with the Piezography profiler than I can with the StudioPrint profiler.

George - if you would like to see your work printed on such a system - and if you can supply me with darkroom examples of what you once loved - write me off list and I will arrange a debut for you. Will allow me to pick out the best paper and curve blending for you. If you love it - you can then upgrade. 

Actually, this would be a significant upgrade to anyone using black ink only here - or who is using three shades of black as is found in Epson ABW or the MIS UltraTone system. 

Piezography is like the audiophile of photography, choosing image fidelity over the convenience of using color inks. It will realize much more depth and detail than you can achieve in silver or palladium.

If you need a matte/glossy system - you do have an "eighth" unused slot in my system suggestion.  I could flesh this matte only system out in just a few weeks and provide Roy with a media curves update for QTR. Would encourage me to do so on the 1800, 1900, 2200, 2400, 2880s if others were inclined to upgrade...  hint hint!  The matte/gloss would take a few weeks longer to develop.


Jon Cone
Piezography

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "togeorge626" <togeorge41934@...> wrote:
>
> My "holy grail" in my darkroom days was a French bromide enlarging paper (no longer available) toned in dilute selenium.  I currently use an R1800 3MK setup with Museo II paper for a "natural white" (slightly warmish) tone.  I really like the 3MK results, but have two questions:
> 
> 1)	To achieve a truly sepia warm when desired, can I use a 3PK setup in my R1800 along with a suitable baryta type glossy paper?
> 
> 2)	How do I produce a tone similar to dilute selenium with a minimal use of color pigments?
> 
> Thanks
>   George Ingram
> 
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "pr_roark" <roark.paul@> wrote:
> >
> > David Kachel <david@> wrote:
> > >
> > > 
> > >...
> > 
> > > Please remember that not ALL of us view "neutral" as a holy grail. Some of us would prefer very warm inks that so far do not exist.
> > 
> > 
> > A warm, what I think of as low gamut sepia print with a 
> > Lab B of about 14 is easy with MIS LK (and it's other glossy carbon K4 & UT inks).  That's as far as I've been able to get with the 100% carbon inks I've tested.  The old photo at http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/Carbon-Print-Tones.pdf is an example.
> > 
> > The MIS LK and Cone sepia hit about Lab B = 8 on HPR.  Aardenburg Imaging fade tests -- 
> > http://www.aardenburg-imaging.com/acceleratedagingtests.html -- provide the Lab values for the ink-paper combos tested.
> > 
> > When I look through the old photo books, I see a wide range of image tones.  When I made the sepia toner for the UT2 & 7, I targeted a darker sepia, it could then be mixed down with the MIS carbon.  The sepia toner I made was mostly yellow and magenta -- not very stable.  But I could reach a warmth that had a Lab B of about 25 (for a while).
> > 
> > I think the best current approach to darker sepia tones might be done with one of the orange HP or Epson pigments.  It may need to be combined with another color pigment to hit the values you want.  It one does have to use more than a single color ink, keeping the hue of the inks as close to the target as possible minimizes the wobble in tone as the inks fade and the image moves toward the carbon tone.
> > 
> > I decided the warm LK on glossy paper was a better route.  It's warm enough for me.  I'm curious how all the new types of glossy papers look when printed with the glossy carbon inks.  I think Hahnemuhle makes a non-OBA baryta paper that would be interesting to try with 100% warm carbon.
> > 
> > Maybe carbon nanotube pigments will be warmer yet -- a darker sepia.  I do hope they come down in price enough to start testing them seriously.  What the heck, I might even be willing to use the seconds from the higher tech uses for these products.  If they are successful as part of the solar thin film industry there may be enough inkjet grade nanotube pigments to supply us.  
> > 
> > Paul
> > www.PaulRoark.com
> >
>