Digital BW, The Print

Paul

I must have missed something at the beginning of all this.  But tagged or
untagged a file will have been worked up in a particular workspace.  It will
only look right in that space.  If it is untagged or assigned another
workspace either manually or by default because it is not tagged then it
will not look right, as you are aware.  I am not familiar with Elements but
can't imagine it isn't colour managed.  One may not be able to change freely
the tagged profile (do profile conversions etc) but if one is starting and
finishing in Elements then there will be no issues, even if files are
untagged.  

Recommending that people do NOT tag files when they have the capability to
do so is a very bad idea, in my opinion.  You introduce the risk that for
some reason that file gets opened in a workspace other than the one it was
prepared in and people wonder why the look of the file has changed.  This is
precisely the reason files can be tagged and policies set for identifying
and dealing with untagged files and profile mismatches.  No harm will ever
come of a person who leaves their image tagged with a non device specific
workspace.  The important thing is not to store working documents that have
been converted to a device specific environment.  Most anyone with the
smallest amount of colour management knowledge is aware of this and knows
that profile conversions to output spaces such as for printers should
ordinarily be done 'on the fly' only.

Fostering similar understanding with people starting out with Elements would
be good practice.  Basic colour management use is not hard or complicated,
certainly no harder than using a camera.  The types of profiles that one may
encounter are not hard to categorize and understand - ie device specific
(input and output, eg scanner and printer profiles) and non device specific
workspaces (GG2.2, Adobe RGB, ProphotoRGB, GG1.8 etc).  A good basic
understanding of the principles of a colour managed workflow can easily be
grasped with a little thought and focus and will leave someone far better
suited for moving forward.  There are some commentators here who rather than
providing the right sort of education have sort, no doubt with good
intention, to try to simplify their descriptions and tutorials on the
subject of using colour settings and profiles.   Rather than using the right
terminology and explaining concepts accurately and simply, they have
introduced confusing new terms and populated their articles with gross
inaccuracies which simply sow the seeds of future confusion.  I'd rather
people were provided with a good grounding and practice which will serve
them well as they learn more.

Cheers

Steve


> From: Paul Roark <paul.roark@...>
> Reply-To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> Date: Tue, 14 Mar 2006 12:21:43 -0800
> To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: RE: [Digital BW] Paul's Recommended BW Workspace
> 
>>> On the other hand, what workspace is used is made before the file is
>>> printed, and this will affect how the image is printed in a color
>>> managed workflow.
>  
>> Again this last statement is wrong.
> 
> No, it is correct in the context in which it was made.  The workspace was
> set in "Color Settings", and I clearly stated the file was un-tagged.  As
> such, the workspace determines how the image is displayed, and the ICC
> follows this to be sure the print matches.
> 
> I think you are assuming a file that has an embedded profile, but that was
> not the situation I was talking about.
> 
> I understand that in many instances, particularly color printing with a
> specific printer and inkset, embedding the ICC might be a good idea.
> However, my current thinking is that for the "Create ICC" profiles used in a
> the B&W "Print with Preview" workflows that I have in mind, I'm probably
> going to recommend un-tagged files.  My reasons for this are that, first,
> those who use Photoshop Elements cannot easily embed the ICCs.  Second,
> since the ICCs will include printer and tone specific information, and what
> tone is wanted and what printer is used may change, it might be best to just
> leave the file un-tagged until printing.  This shifts the view and print
> "look" to the underlying workspace that is selected in "Color Settings."
> You will note that I also am starting to include in the name of the file
> what space it was edited in, because the underlying file will be affected by
> the editing that is done in a specific space.
> 
> At any rate, the context of my discussion, as I noted initially, was with
> un-tagged files. 
> 
> Paul
> www.PaulRoark.com