Yamaha DTXpress/DTXplorer/DTXtreme

Hey everyone.  I've been a drummer for 15 years and I have moved into 
an apartment.  Obviously, I can't just sit down and play my accoustic 
set anytime I want to without alarming my neighbors.  I've been 
looking into the DTXpress and the Roland V- Club.  Can anyone here 
offer a comparison between the two?  I've played both in the music 
store, but I can't really tell much in a 10 or 15 minute session.  
Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!!
Bryan

On Wed, 25 Sep 2002 23:07:05 -0000, you wrote:

>Hey everyone.  I've been a drummer for 15 years and I have moved into 
>an apartment.  Obviously, I can't just sit down and play my accoustic 
>set anytime I want to without alarming my neighbors.  I've been 
>looking into the DTXpress and the Roland V- Club.  Can anyone here 
>offer a comparison between the two?  I've played both in the music 
>store, but I can't really tell much in a 10 or 15 minute session.  
>Any help would be greatly appreciated.

That was my conclusion too, (that I couldn't tell a difference).  That
made a decision based upon price a very easy decision to make :)

I got the DTXpress and couldn't be happier.

After playing mine a while, I find that it makes an excellent 4pc kit
as it comes out of the box.

The stereo cymbal pad can trigger two different cymbal sounds and
choke them both (edge and flat area), The ride cymbal I use as a
splash, Tom3 becomes a  ride cymbal.

So you have a 4pc kit with 2 crashes, 1 splash and a ride.  Not bad.
There is still one stereo input left on the brain which can control
one stereo pad or two mono pads.

With a little creativity and erector set experimentation, the rack and
triggers can be positioned many different ways.

As I said, mine is set up like a traditional 4pc kit would be.  I have
Tom1 mounted directly to the cross pipe, as opposed to on the short
riser pipe.  Tom2 is mounted in the same fashion off the right side
pipe.  Tom3 (Ride Cymbal) is mounted under the right hand cymbal pad
(Splash).  I swapped out the long pipe that the snare and high hat
pads were mounted to for the shorter pipe (the long pipe was hitting
my left knee).  The high hat is mounted directly to a short pipe and
the brain is mounted to another short pipe, under the pipe that the
high hat is mounted to. I should mention that I took a hack saw to the
remaining long pipe, as it wasn't necessary any more.  I got one of
the medium sized pipes and a shorty out of it.  One of my remaining
short pipes is mounted into a "T" fitting on the end of the right side
pipe and is the perfect stick holder.  It holds two pair nicely.  I
epoxied the plastic "stopper" into the bottom so it wouldn't pop out
if a pair of sticks were dropped into it too hard.

I know this may all sound a little confusing, but my point is that the
kit as it is, is highly usable and customizable.

There is room in the brain to store more user kits than you'll ever
need.  Sometimes I sit down to play and end up just creating a kit or
two.  That feature alone makes it worth my money.  I don't gig, I just
jam.  Making my kit sound like whatever I'm jamming with makes me
happier than a pig in doo-doo.

BTW, I live in a house, work nights, and it's just me and my girl
friend.  I come home from work at 5:00am and start playing.  She gets
up at 6:00 and brings me coffee.  Sometimes I play at 11:00pm.  It's
absolutely fantastic, and I wouldn't trade it for the world.



Jim Tonak
ratzo@...

--- In DTXpress@y..., Jim Tonak <ratzo@t...> wrote:
> On Wed, 25 Sep 2002 23:07:05 -0000, you wrote:
> 
> >Actually, If you are talking about input 9/10, it is a DUAL input, 
not stereo. It will accommodate two mono pads or one DUAL pad, not a 
STEREO pad.
Scott

> So you have a 4pc kit with 2 crashes, 1 splash and a ride.  Not bad.
> There is still one stereo input left on the brain which can control
> one stereo pad or two mono pads.
> 
>
> Jim Tonak
> ratzo@t...

On Thu, 26 Sep 2002 01:09:37 -0000, you wrote:

>--- In DTXpress@y..., Jim Tonak <ratzo@t...> wrote:
>> On Wed, 25 Sep 2002 23:07:05 -0000, you wrote:
>> 
>> >Actually, If you are talking about input 9/10, it is a DUAL input, 
>not stereo. It will accommodate two mono pads or one DUAL pad, not a 
>STEREO pad.
>Scott

Read your manual.  It is a stereo input, and uses a stereo headphone
jack.  The snare trigger pad and crash trigger pad are stereo trigger
devices.  the TP-80S is stereo, while the TP-80 is mono.  Same for
PCY-80S and PCY-80.  You'll notice the little "S" on the TP-80S and
PCY-80S pads.




Jim Tonak
ratzo@...

Hairytrigger is correct. 9/10 is an input that will accomodate a 
dual zone pad (meaning a pad with 2 distinct piezos installed). The 
other inputs accomodate stereo pads (meaning 1 piezo and 1 switch, 
which includes all TP80s, PD7/9, etc..). I think it was post 1597 
that explained it all. I had to read it twice, and play around with 
my pads to fully understand it... Basically, a dual zone pad does 
not equal a stereo pad.

Heck, to test out this theory, plug in the TP80S into the 9/10 port. 
You'll only get 1 sound out of it (ie. can't assign the rim).

     clem..

--- In DTXpress@y..., Jim Tonak <ratzo@t...> wrote:
> On Thu, 26 Sep 2002 01:09:37 -0000, you wrote:
> 
> >--- In DTXpress@y..., Jim Tonak <ratzo@t...> wrote:
> >> On Wed, 25 Sep 2002 23:07:05 -0000, you wrote:
> >> 
> >> >Actually, If you are talking about input 9/10, it is a DUAL 
input, 
> >not stereo. It will accommodate two mono pads or one DUAL pad, 
not a 
> >STEREO pad.
> >Scott
> 
> Read your manual.  It is a stereo input, and uses a stereo 
headphone
> jack.  The snare trigger pad and crash trigger pad are stereo 
trigger

> devices.  the TP-80S is stereo, while the TP-80 is mono.  Same for
> PCY-80S and PCY-80.  You'll notice the little "S" on the TP-80S and
> PCY-80S pads.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jim Tonak
> ratzo@t...

On Thu, 26 Sep 2002 08:46:33 -0000, you wrote:

>Hairytrigger is correct. 9/10 is an input that will accomodate a 
>dual zone pad (meaning a pad with 2 distinct piezos installed). The 
>other inputs accomodate stereo pads (meaning 1 piezo and 1 switch, 
>which includes all TP80s, PD7/9, etc..). I think it was post 1597 
>that explained it all. I had to read it twice, and play around with 
>my pads to fully understand it... Basically, a dual zone pad does 
>not equal a stereo pad.
>
>Heck, to test out this theory, plug in the TP80S into the 9/10 port. 
>You'll only get 1 sound out of it (ie. can't assign the rim).

I tried it.  I stand corrected.

I wonder why the manual says nothing of this?  It makes no distinction
between 9/10 and the other stereo inputs...



Jim Tonak
ratzo@...

I haven't read the manual in-depth, but it's in the spec section. 
You'll see that inputs 1-8 have the spec L:trigger R:switch (or the 
other way around, can't quite remember). That's about the only place 
where you'll find the info. You'll notice the spec for 9/10 is 
different... Again, that post (1597 was it?) has all the info.

     clem..

--- In DTXpress@y..., Jim Tonak <ratzo@t...> wrote:
> On Thu, 26 Sep 2002 08:46:33 -0000, you wrote:
> 
> >Hairytrigger is correct. 9/10 is an input that will accomodate a 
> >dual zone pad (meaning a pad with 2 distinct piezos installed). 
The 
> >other inputs accomodate stereo pads (meaning 1 piezo and 1 
switch, 
> >which includes all TP80s, PD7/9, etc..). I think it was post 1597 
> >that explained it all. I had to read it twice, and play around 
with 
> >my pads to fully understand it... Basically, a dual zone pad does 
> >not equal a stereo pad.
> >
> >Heck, to test out this theory, plug in the TP80S into the 9/10 
port. 
> >You'll only get 1 sound out of it (ie. can't assign the rim).
> 
> I tried it.  I stand corrected.
> 
> I wonder why the manual says nothing of this?  It makes no 
distinction

> between 9/10 and the other stereo inputs...
> 
> 
> 
> Jim Tonak
> ratzo@t...

Hi Jim,

Consider it an initiation into the world of edrums - we've all
stumbled over the difference between dual and stereo triggers - and
you now are a member of the elite.   I bet if you research back far
enough you'll find many of us posted questions on this very subject. 
Now you to can help newer people through it.  Walt

--- In DTXpress@y..., Jim Tonak <ratzo@t...> wrote:

> On Thu, 26 Sep 2002 08:46:33 -0000, you wrote:
> 
> >Hairytrigger is correct. 9/10 is an input that will accomodate a 
> >dual zone pad (meaning a pad with 2 distinct piezos installed). The 
> >other inputs accomodate stereo pads (meaning 1 piezo and 1 switch, 
> >which includes all TP80s, PD7/9, etc..). I think it was post 1597 
> >that explained it all. I had to read it twice, and play around with 
> >my pads to fully understand it... Basically, a dual zone pad does 
> >not equal a stereo pad.
> >
> >Heck, to test out this theory, plug in the TP80S into the 9/10 port. 
> >You'll only get 1 sound out of it (ie. can't assign the rim).
> 
> I tried it.  I stand corrected.
> 
> I wonder why the manual says nothing of this?  It makes no distinction
> between 9/10 and the other stereo inputs...
> 
> 
> 
> Jim Tonak
> ratzo@t...

The manual is woefully lacking in explaining this distinction 
regarding stereo vs dual inputs.
I found a reference on page 10, the last item in the box at the 
bottom. Another reference on pages 40-41 in 'Voice parameters', IN 
(Input Source), where they describe the pad and rim functions.
None of this really explains it all well enough. A couple paragraphs 
would go a long way toward enlightening the uninitiated!
Scott
Does anyone use a stereo pad on HiHat? I'm interested in getting the 
'edge' sound that I miss with the pad. On real HiHats, the edge played 
 with the shoulder of the stick a more mushy, harsh sound than the tip 
of the stick on the  bow. Can you get that difference ? What type pad. 
I think everyone agrees that the tp80S sucks. And the PCY80S moves too 
much. I use a tom pad for ride cymbal too because the cymbal pads move 
too much! 

--- In DTXpress@y..., "clementpoon" <wifebeater@t...> wrote:

> I haven't read the manual in-depth, but it's in the spec section. 
> You'll see that inputs 1-8 have the spec L:trigger R:switch (or the 
> other way around, can't quite remember). That's about the only place 
> where you'll find the info. You'll notice the spec for 9/10 is 
> different... Again, that post (1597 was it?) has all the info.
> 
>      clem..
> 
> --- In DTXpress@y..., Jim Tonak <ratzo@t...> wrote:
> > On Thu, 26 Sep 2002 08:46:33 -0000, you wrote:
> > 
> > >Hairytrigger is correct. 9/10 is an input that will accomodate a 
> > >dual zone pad (meaning a pad with 2 distinct piezos installed). 
> The 
> > >other inputs accomodate stereo pads (meaning 1 piezo and 1 
> switch, 
> > >which includes all TP80s, PD7/9, etc..). I think it was post 1597 
> > >that explained it all. I had to read it twice, and play around 
> with 
> > >my pads to fully understand it... Basically, a dual zone pad does 
> > >not equal a stereo pad.
> > >
> > >Heck, to test out this theory, plug in the TP80S into the 9/10 
> port. 
> > >You'll only get 1 sound out of it (ie. can't assign the rim).
> > 
> > I tried it.  I stand corrected.
> > 
> > I wonder why the manual says nothing of this?  It makes no 
> distinction
> > between 9/10 and the other stereo inputs...
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Jim Tonak
> > ratzo@t...

Hi Scott,

I did have a kit defined with the edge of a TP80S pad
having a partially open HH sound, while on the main
pad I had more of a HH bow (and stronger attack HH
sound) and it worked fairly well.  I have noticed that
some TP80Ss have better rim trigger response than
others, but where stereo pads are concerned, my
experience is that many (if not all of them) seem to
suffer this inconsistency.  They all seem to work best
near the trigger itself (which typically is right near
the mount point), so sometimes you can jockey the
mounting so you're striking the pad on the rim
trigger.  You could try a dual trigger pad too -
giving you more control over the interactions, or
prevention of them by using two inputs.  

I think if you want to do this reliably, you may want
to use two HHs.  I had also run two pads and two
pedals, with the edge HH on the right side of the kit,
near the ride, and the bow one on my left - both
pedals were side by side.  Now, running two HHs is a
bit of a pain in itself, but if reliability is what
you want, running two HHs, one set for edge sounds and
one set for bow sounds will get you that. Of course,
this also requires two modules, and of course two
modules means more potential for those unused inputs
to leak, requiring the immediate insertion of new
(more) triggers to stem the flow, but let's not go
there... 

Walt

> Does anyone use a stereo pad on HiHat? I'm
> interested in getting the 
> 'edge' sound that I miss with the pad. On real
> HiHats, the edge played 
>  with the shoulder of the stick a more mushy, harsh
> sound than the tip 
> of the stick on the  bow. Can you get that
> difference ? What type pad. 
> I think everyone agrees that the tp80S sucks. And
> the PCY80S moves too 
> much. I use a tom pad for ride cymbal too because
> the cymbal pads move 
> too much! 
>

__________________________________________________
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New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo!
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Thanks for the input Walt.
I think, for my needs, that a single pad would work best.Whether it is 
stereo or dual only matters because I have already used all the 
inputs. I would have to give up my extra crash or my accessory pad.
I could actually do without the crash more that the 
accessory(woodblock, cowbell, sidestick, handclap, tambourine, 
tympani, etc.) The rim switch on the pcy80s actually works pretty 
well. If I could keep it more rigid, it might work. I have the little 
goodies that keep them from turning(a big problem), and I use 
oversized washers to help control the swing, but they still move too 
much for my liking for HH and Ride use.
I'm thinking possibly a bar-type pad, mounted at the front and just 
slightly below where I would normally hit the pad, I may be able to 
get it.
I'll keep working on it.
Thanks again...
Scott

--- In DTXpress@y..., Walt <wgardus@y...> wrote:

> Hi Scott,
> 
> I did have a kit defined with the edge of a TP80S pad
> having a partially open HH sound, while on the main
> pad I had more of a HH bow (and stronger attack HH
> sound) and it worked fairly well.  I have noticed that
> some TP80Ss have better rim trigger response than
> others, but where stereo pads are concerned, my
> experience is that many (if not all of them) seem to
> suffer this inconsistency.  They all seem to work best
> near the trigger itself (which typically is right near
> the mount point), so sometimes you can jockey the
> mounting so you're striking the pad on the rim
> trigger.  You could try a dual trigger pad too -
> giving you more control over the interactions, or
> prevention of them by using two inputs.  
> 
> I think if you want to do this reliably, you may want
> to use two HHs.  I had also run two pads and two
> pedals, with the edge HH on the right side of the kit,
> near the ride, and the bow one on my left - both
> pedals were side by side.  Now, running two HHs is a
> bit of a pain in itself, but if reliability is what
> you want, running two HHs, one set for edge sounds and
> one set for bow sounds will get you that. Of course,
> this also requires two modules, and of course two
> modules means more potential for those unused inputs
> to leak, requiring the immediate insertion of new
> (more) triggers to stem the flow, but let's not go
> there... 
> 
> Walt
> 
> > Does anyone use a stereo pad on HiHat? I'm
> > interested in getting the 
> > 'edge' sound that I miss with the pad. On real
> > HiHats, the edge played 
> >  with the shoulder of the stick a more mushy, harsh
> > sound than the tip 
> > of the stick on the  bow. Can you get that
> > difference ? What type pad. 
> > I think everyone agrees that the tp80S sucks. And
> > the PCY80S moves too 
> > much. I use a tom pad for ride cymbal too because
> > the cymbal pads move 
> > too much! 
> >
> 
> __________________________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo!
> http://sbc.yahoo.com

On Fri, 27 Sep 2002 04:48:04 -0000, you wrote:

>Hi Jim,
>
>Consider it an initiation into the world of edrums - we've all
>stumbled over the difference between dual and stereo triggers - and
>you now are a member of the elite.   I bet if you research back far
>enough you'll find many of us posted questions on this very subject. 
>Now you to can help newer people through it.  Walt

I'm still trying to think why they did it that way.  Perhaps it was to
offer some compatibility with other types of trigger pads?

Regardless, I'm glad I found out about it before I bought a stereo pad
and connected it to 9/10 :)

As an aside, I had been having the usual problems with my kick
trigger.  I found that when I turned my beater around to the rubber
back (it's not really a reversible or "two sided" beater), the problem
seems to go away.  Anyone else notice this?  I'm going to try and pick
up a rubber headed beater to replace the standard felt beater of my
Iron Cobra Jr. this weekend and see how it does on the long term.



Jim Tonak
ratzo@tampabay.rr.com