Alesis Andromeda A6

Hi, all
Just got a new A6, been doing a lot of tweaking and experimenting.  
I found that the Aux outputs sound about 500% better than the main outs, to my ears-  
sounds like an imitation of itself.  
The difference in sound is makes me think there could even be a A/D conversion stage 
going on in there- whatever it is, it's gnarly.  

I spent the past week trying to reverse-engineer the robust Moog-style bass tone coming 
out of my ATC-1 monosynth.      It was an educational, but I wasn't able to get the A6 into 
the same ballpark tonally as the ATC. 
Switched outputs, major difference.   Still two different-sounding axes, but the Andy is 
sounding great, much more open, "real" and present.
I've switched back to listen to the main outs again several times to confirm; the difference 
is huge I think.

Seems like there are a lot of ways to cheese up the sound of this instrument!   
I had to check in with this list and learn about disabling background tuning, process 
engine settings, etc-  and now the outputs, before I could start getting a hip sound  (I also 
got good results changing envelope dynamics to "analog" whenever the "legato" setting 
isn't necessary, curious about how this works) 

I'm not sure if some kind of DSP circuitry is stepping on the tone at times or what.  
The Aux output defeats the master volume control, for example.  
But I'm glad the instrument's flexible enough to be able to get around a lot of this stuff.
I haven't found out how to reset outputs in Program mode at all, though..!
hoping I don't have to customize and reload entire banks of sounds, one by one since I 
prefer the Aux outputs, even without master volume control.

Any other technical info or tips for getting maximum tone would be great.  I'm gonna hit 
the books in the meanwhile...

Peace
Josh
http://jru.blogs.com/jru

--- In Andromeda_A6-ION@yahoogroups.com, "JR" <tactilius@y...> wrote:
> Just got a new A6, been doing a lot of tweaking and experimenting.  
> I found that the Aux outputs sound about 500% better than the main 
>outs, to my ears-  
> sounds like an imitation of itself.  
> The difference in sound is makes me think there could even be a A/D 
>conversion stage 
> going on in there- whatever it is, it's gnarly.  
>

I've done some tests myself (over a year ago), and I believe that the 
results were somewhat strange. I tested the A6 two times, and did a 
spectral analysis of various tones.  I also turned off all FX and 
distortion.  The first test result showed that the MAIN output had a 
noticible dip in the lower frequencies and higher freq. had their 
peaks slightly lowered... As if the sound was compressed coming out 
of MAIN.  The AUX in contrast, was louder and had high freq peaks 
intact and low end had no dip.  Bringing down the Volume of the MAIN 
seemed to bring it closer to the AUX spectrum.  

The second test showed none of the results above.  It showed the same 
response, except for the sound being louder on the AUX.

Now as far as I remember, the MAIN is ALL analog, except for a side 
chain FX channel that gets added before the MAIN potentiometer 
(volume knob).  Some people claimed that the longer signal chain 
might be the culprit, but I'm not to sure about the validity of 
this.  I think the volume pot itself is affecting the response curve, 
dependant on the incoming voltage.  I do NOT believe that there is 
any DA/AD conversion causing the curve to dip.

My next test is to try a frequency 'sweep' and calibrate to a 
specific set of levels.  Perhaps I can see if there truly is a reason 
for this, other than just 'louder output'.

i also guess it's the  MAIN potentiometer 
> (volume knob) that's causing the difference. maybe a quality topic.
just my guess, greetings sunny

> My next test is to try a frequency 'sweep' and calibrate to a 
> specific set of levels.  Perhaps I can see if there truly is a reason 
> for this, other than just 'louder output'.

Well I've conducted a test with my friend last night.  We sampled
various tones, and sweeps with both outputs.  We did realtime spectrum
analysis and then FFTs of sampled sounds.  Everything was sampled at
ADAT quality (48khz), and there was NO apparent difference.  Very
small differences were found, but they could've easily been small
differences in the cables or input jacks of the console itself.  
The AUX output was slightly louder at max than the MAIN output though.
Testing the volume knob at various settings and calibrating the AUX
volume to the same peak ALSO resulted in the same spectrum. FX were
turned OFF.

Thus, it seems that the AUX outputs might be just louder and driving
the mixer inputs on some setups just enough to give it extra ooomph.  

The waveforms tested were SAW and SINE.  The low end was tested more
accurately by using the subosc to overcome the keytracking issue. 
Tone sweeps were done using VCF #2 self-oscillating and sweeping from
ultra low to ~8khz.  The pre-filter saturation when driven too hard
was seen on oscilloscope, you can actually see a sine wave morph as
you slowly bring up the osc level.  

It certainly is strange, because I thought I really heard a difference
between the AUX and MAIN.  Seems like nothing is wrong with the volume
knob or the MAIN channel with these results.

I guess I have to put my money where my mouth is now,  since you've went 
through all this trouble here! (thanks for posting the info, by the way)   ; >
 I've got a nice A/D, will post some recordings when I get a sec and will generally try to 
debunk myself in the meanwhile.

I believe I can hear the distinction double-blind with no problem;  I kind of know what to 
listen for.    I've just had a much easier time programming once I started using the Auxes.  
I find it harder to get an open sound out of the main outs, sounds like there's some kind 
of coloration & a sheen there, it gets into the sound.


I don't think volume is the main factor (although we never do-!) -  my levels were 
changing all the time in any event, sometimes the main outs were set up to be louder, 
same results.   I use the same cables & board inputs.  

I'll check it out again over the weekend, will be rehearsing and gigging using the A6 as a 
bass synth.

One last thing to consider is that we hear a lot of nice stuff that doesn't show up at 48Khz.

peace
Josh Roseman
http://jru.blogs.com/jru






 --- In Andromeda_A6-ION@yahoogroups.com, "Tony" <cosmicspin@y...> wrote:

> 
> 
> > My next test is to try a frequency 'sweep' and calibrate to a 
> > specific set of levels.  Perhaps I can see if there truly is a reason 
> > for this, other than just 'louder output'.
> 
> Well I've conducted a test with my friend last night.  We sampled
> various tones, and sweeps with both outputs.  We did realtime spectrum
> analysis and then FFTs of sampled sounds.  Everything was sampled at
> ADAT quality (48khz), and there was NO apparent difference.  Very
> small differences were found, but they could've easily been small
> differences in the cables or input jacks of the console itself.  
> The AUX output was slightly louder at max than the MAIN output though.
> Testing the volume knob at various settings and calibrating the AUX
> volume to the same peak ALSO resulted in the same spectrum. FX were
> turned OFF.
> 
> Thus, it seems that the AUX outputs might be just louder and driving
> the mixer inputs on some setups just enough to give it extra ooomph.  
> 
> The waveforms tested were SAW and SINE.  The low end was tested more
> accurately by using the subosc to overcome the keytracking issue. 
> Tone sweeps were done using VCF #2 self-oscillating and sweeping from
> ultra low to ~8khz.  The pre-filter saturation when driven too hard
> was seen on oscilloscope, you can actually see a sine wave morph as
> you slowly bring up the osc level.  
> 
> It certainly is strange, because I thought I really heard a difference
> between the AUX and MAIN.  Seems like nothing is wrong with the volume
> knob or the MAIN channel with these results.