The Yamaha AN1x Synthesizer mailing list

Hello,

With all my synths when I change programs on the synth my sequencer
records this program change but with the An1x it doesn't record it.
It records the notes but no program change. What can I do to change
this, is their some secret function to enable sending midi messages ?
Also weird is that when I put my synth on Local Of and I select the
right midi port I can't record on my sequencer. I have to put the
An1x in Local On mode. This isn't normal ! Can anyone please give me
some solution for this. Thanx.

Ginz.

--- In AN1x-list@yahoogroups.com, "ginzburg2001"
<sky50308@s...> wrote:

> Hello,
>
> With all my synths when I change programs on the synth my

sequencer

> records this program change but with the An1x it doesn't record

it.

> It records the notes but no program change. What can I do to

change

> this, is their some secret function to enable sending midi

messages ?

> Also weird is that when I put my synth on Local Of and I select

the

> right midi port I can't record on my sequencer. I have to put the
> An1x in Local On mode. This isn't normal ! Can anyone please

give me

> some solution for this. Thanx.
>
> Ginz.

Ginz,

The problems you describe sound like a configuration error
somewhere in your sequencer/MIDI set-up. Some details would
be helpful - there's not much info to go on in this email.

What platofrm are your running? Which OS? Which Sequencer
package? What type of MIDI Interface?

Jon

Thanx for your reply. I have a PC WIN98SE running cubase SX with an
edirol UM-880. I find it weird that it would be a configuration
problem in the sequencer/MIDI set-up because all my other synths do
it well. I can do Bulk dump and program changes with every other
synth without any problem with the same configuration. This afternoon
I made a second test and could transfer some program changes and
could work with local OF, but not for long because all of a sudden
when I tried to do a bulk dump it sort of freezed and everything got
weird again. I'm allmost desperate ... Could it be the OS of the
synth ?

Maybe you have a clue.

Ginz.

--- In AN1x-list@yahoogroups.com, "Jon" <jondl_2000@y...> wrote:
> --- In AN1x-list@yahoogroups.com, "ginzburg2001"
> <sky50308@s...> wrote:
> > Hello,
> >
> > With all my synths when I change programs on the synth my
> sequencer
> > records this program change but with the An1x it doesn't record
> it.
> > It records the notes but no program change. What can I do to
> change
> > this, is their some secret function to enable sending midi
> messages ?
> > Also weird is that when I put my synth on Local Of and I select
> the
> > right midi port I can't record on my sequencer. I have to put the
> > An1x in Local On mode. This isn't normal ! Can anyone please
> give me
> > some solution for this. Thanx.
> >
> > Ginz.
>
> Ginz,
>
> The problems you describe sound like a configuration error
> somewhere in your sequencer/MIDI set-up. Some details would
> be helpful - there's not much info to go on in this email.
>
> What platofrm are your running? Which OS? Which Sequencer
> package? What type of MIDI Interface?
>
> Jon

--- In AN1x-list@yahoogroups.com, "ginzburg2001"
<sky50308@s...> wrote:

> Thanx for your reply. I have a PC WIN98SE running cubase SX

with an

> edirol UM-880. I find it weird that it would be a configuration
> problem in the sequencer/MIDI set-up because all my other

synths do

> it well. I can do Bulk dump and program changes with every

other

> synth without any problem with the same configuration. This

afternoon

> I made a second test and could transfer some program

changes and

> could work with local OF, but not for long because all of a

sudden

> when I tried to do a bulk dump it sort of freezed and everything

got

> weird again. I'm allmost desperate ... Could it be the OS of the
> synth ?
>
> Maybe you have a clue.
>
> Ginz.
>

Okay. Now we have some info to work with. That Edirol UM-880
is a USB MIDI Interface - which is most likely the cause of your
AN1x specific issues.

I'm not surprised Local Off worked with the AN1x and could only
guess that some previous error on the USB bus had resulted in
a momentary glitch.

The AN1x reacts slowly to Program change commands. It's
always best to leave a measure or so inbetween program
change commands and the next MIDI Note On event. Again, a
momentary glitch on the USB bus might have caused a buffer
error on the AN1x - I expect you rebooted your AN1x at some
point?

The fact your other Synths and sound modules behave as
expected with Local Off and Programs Change on the UM-880
eliminates the possibility of a configuration error in Cubase, i.e.,
that you have Program Change commands or SysEx filtered in
Cubase.

I've not used USB on Win98SE but plenty of other list members
have commented on it. Perhaps you should search the list
archive. Have you doubled checked you're running the latest
drivers for your UM-880?
http://www.edirol.com/products/info/um880.html

I CAN tell you that AN1x SysEx dumps over USB can be a tricky
thing - on either platform. AN1x SysEx packets are unusually
large in size in comparison to other synthesizers. This presents
difficulties over USB which has no provision for error correction -
it's strictly a blind send and receive with no hand shaking. That
said, it can be met with success. This has been discussed at
length on this list over the past few years (see the list archives
for more info.) When you performed your bulk dump did you send
a '1 scene', '1 vce', '1-64 vce', etc. or 'all vce'? If you're not finding
success with an 'all vce' dump try one of the other options and
see if it works. Are you working ONLY with Cubase are have you
tried the same with AN1xEdit? What were the results?

Jon

Hello Jon,

It seem that the An1x can't work properly with USB. I also checked
Edirol and have the latest drivers. This morning I tested by
connecting to a joystick midi port and didn't experience any problem.
Everything seems to work properly now ! Even the bulk dump.

Thanx for the good advice,

Ginz.

--- In AN1x-list@yahoogroups.com, "Jon" <jondl_2000@y...> wrote:
> --- In AN1x-list@yahoogroups.com, "ginzburg2001"
> <sky50308@s...> wrote:
> > Thanx for your reply. I have a PC WIN98SE running cubase SX
> with an
> > edirol UM-880. I find it weird that it would be a configuration
> > problem in the sequencer/MIDI set-up because all my other
> synths do
> > it well. I can do Bulk dump and program changes with every
> other
> > synth without any problem with the same configuration. This
> afternoon
> > I made a second test and could transfer some program
> changes and
> > could work with local OF, but not for long because all of a
> sudden
> > when I tried to do a bulk dump it sort of freezed and everything
> got
> > weird again. I'm allmost desperate ... Could it be the OS of the
> > synth ?
> >
> > Maybe you have a clue.
> >
> > Ginz.
> >
>
> Okay. Now we have some info to work with. That Edirol UM-880
> is a USB MIDI Interface - which is most likely the cause of your
> AN1x specific issues.
>
> I'm not surprised Local Off worked with the AN1x and could only
> guess that some previous error on the USB bus had resulted in
> a momentary glitch.
>
> The AN1x reacts slowly to Program change commands. It's
> always best to leave a measure or so inbetween program
> change commands and the next MIDI Note On event. Again, a
> momentary glitch on the USB bus might have caused a buffer
> error on the AN1x - I expect you rebooted your AN1x at some
> point?
>
> The fact your other Synths and sound modules behave as
> expected with Local Off and Programs Change on the UM-880
> eliminates the possibility of a configuration error in Cubase,
i.e.,
> that you have Program Change commands or SysEx filtered in
> Cubase.
>
> I've not used USB on Win98SE but plenty of other list members
> have commented on it. Perhaps you should search the list
> archive. Have you doubled checked you're running the latest
> drivers for your UM-880?
> http://www.edirol.com/products/info/um880.html
>
> I CAN tell you that AN1x SysEx dumps over USB can be a tricky
> thing - on either platform. AN1x SysEx packets are unusually
> large in size in comparison to other synthesizers. This presents
> difficulties over USB which has no provision for error correction -
> it's strictly a blind send and receive with no hand shaking. That
> said, it can be met with success. This has been discussed at
> length on this list over the past few years (see the list archives
> for more info.) When you performed your bulk dump did you send
> a '1 scene', '1 vce', '1-64 vce', etc. or 'all vce'? If you're not
finding
> success with an 'all vce' dump try one of the other options and
> see if it works. Are you working ONLY with Cubase are have you
> tried the same with AN1xEdit? What were the results?
>
> Jon

Hi Ginz,

>It seem that the An1x can't work properly with USB. I also checked
>Edirol and have the latest drivers. This morning I tested by
>connecting to a joystick midi port and didn't experience any problem.
>Everything seems to work properly now ! Even the bulk dump.

I'm glad to see that you have things sorted out for you.

Bulk dumps on the AN1x seem to be a good "torture test" of a PC MIDI system. As Jon mentioned, the AN1x sends more data than most MIDI devices, and the bulk data commands that most USB interfaces use assume that everything just "gets there" without retries or error recovery. (The same is true of the joystick, but the data packets are much smaller.) The AN1x uses huge 260K bulk dumps; I send less data programming my Korg BX-3 (19K), TWO Alesis QSRs (79K each), Antares AVP-1 (2.5K), and three MIDI Solutions boxes (about 200-500 bytes each) together! Now granted, the AN1x has a lot of programmable features, but the QSR is 16-channel multitimbral, and has external card support, so one has to believe that Yamaha could have compressed the data more if they wanted to.

Actually, there don't seem to be any guaranteed rules like "USB MIDI interfaces don't work with the AN1x," or "joystick MIDI interfaces always work." On my Windows 2000 system, I cannot send anything larger than a 1K file to ANY device through my joystick MIDI port, or it will probably hang -- the good old fashioned kind of hang, requiring a reboot of the system. AN1xEdit is out of the question. I've had problems with my Midiman 2x2 USB and the AN1x, but I've recently found that if I use a mix of the "A" and "B" interfaces (ex: IN B with OUT A), everything works very well. And both my Midiman and joystick interfaces used to work perfectly with the AN1x under Windows 98SE. It seems to be related to some combination of the OS, the device drivers, the background tasks running under Windows, and the hardware (motherboard, CPU speed, MIDI device, etc.) being used -- and it's almost impossible to sort out completely.

Regards,

-BW
--
Bruce Wahler
Ashby Solutions™ http://music.ashbysolutions.com
978.386.7389 voice/fax
bruce@...