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The consensus is that Tuesday Afternoon is Tenor Sax and Three Violins -
you can hear it pretty clearly, and since you have M-tron, you can try
it out. I've done it and that is the sound.
fourtytwominds wrote:
>
>
> Hello all.
>
> My name is Sean Lowrie. Sadly I do not own a 'tron, just the M-Tron
> samples; a
> MkVI is on my wish list. I've asked this question at the
> "Mellotronists" group and a member there suggested I should ask this
> group as well.
>
> I've had the samples for about a year and a half and I'm still trying
> to come up
> with the correct signal handling and mixing to get the megalithic
> Moody Blues
> and King Crimson sounds I'm used to.
>
> Last week I made a breakthrough. I'm currently splitting the output
> and taking
> that into to separate unbalanced inputs on my small multitrack mixer.
> First
> channel I leave dry, cut the low and high, and boost the mid range.
> The second
> channel I send all the signal to the internal effects unit on this
> board for
> reverb. (It's an Alesis board and I'm fairly happy with their
> electronic reverb
> circuitry, which even creates slightly different results for left and
> right
> channels) I have this signal boosted in lows and highs but scooped in
> the mid
> range: an approximate mirror of the dry channel settings. On my board
> L is 80Hz,
> M is 2.5kHz, and H is 12kHz. I'm getting fairly close to the sound I want,
> fairly close indeed, but I'm not there. I finally have the presence and in
> general a megalithic quality in sound.
>
> What I don't have is the chocolate-smooth sound that I'm used to out
> of King
> Crimson. I'm thinking specifically the studio tracks "Lament" and "The
> Night
> Watch" from the 1974 album Starless and Bible Black. When I listen to
> these
> tracks I notice that the sound has more... for lack of a better term
> "breath."
> The sound seems to be of much higher fidelity than I'm used to out of the
> Mellotron while still retaining the distinctive Mellotron sound.
>
> Through research on the internet I'm sure these tracks were studio
> recorded on
> two well maintained M400s. I've tried every sort of search I can
> imagine in
> Google, I've been hitting the King Crimson fan sites hoping for
> information.
> I've learned that RF scuttled an entire 2009 KC West Coast USA tour,
> that's
> where I live, over some hurt feelings or something, it's not clear
> what, but
> nothing on their mixing techniques.
>
> I'm listening to The Night Watch as I'm writing this long question.
> The sound is
> not any more present, and actually less megalithic than what I have,
> but it has
> time-CLARITY (not just a boost in the 4kHz area) that I cannot seem to
> achieve,
> along with a slight bit of chorus type phasing I think.
>
> On the front of the Moody Blues sound, I can't seem to get my sound as
> sleepy as
> Mike Pinder can. I understand his MkII he modified himself, but to my
> understanding he only removed the pre-amp circuit that boosted the
> signal at
> 10kHz. The "tone" knob on M-Tron, as on the real deal (to my
> understanding) is
> also at 10kHz and so I keep that real low, around 9'o'clock...
>
> The sound still isn't there. Infact, it seems too dull and smeared. I
> pulled out
> Days of Future Passed and listened to Tuesday Afternoon. I'm fairly
> sure the
> lead is "Trumpets and Trombones" doubled with "MkII Violins" and the
> harmony is
> "MkII Brass" again doubled with the violins. However, I'm noticing
> that the note
> attacks on the record have more of a harsh garbled attack, and my samples
> actually sound more like the instruments sampled than Mr. Pinder's
> MkII does. If
> it's a matter of tape cutting I'm sure I can't do anything about it.
>
> But still that's not entirely the whole problem. I'm still not getting the
> chocolate-smooth sound that is also hollow and graceful. I asked Mr.
> Pinder on
> his own forum, but that was nearly a year ago and I don't think he's
> logged in
> to the forum in all this time. His right certainly to do so. Doesn't
> solve my
> ignorance though...
>
> Is it a matter of compression technique? Using a haphazard collection
> of all
> digital equipment I don't have access to real-time compression, only
> after the
> fact in Audacity and so I tend to avoid compression as it becomes too
> much of
> guess-and-check work. Is there something else I'm missing out on? When
> it comes
> to the violin sound I've taken the care to exclusively use what M-Tron
> names
> "MkII Vintage Violins" which is by far the highest fidelity version of
> that tape
> set the sample set has. It's REALLY good. Still, I know I'm missing out on
> something.
>
> So, after 3 chapters worth of ranting (damn this is a loooooong
> question I've
> got) I ask you all, you who are lucky enough to have and use a real
> Mellotron
> (or those who have gotten really good at using the sample software),
> for your
> expert opinions and advice. I've been banging my head into a wall on
> this one
> and I've lost confidence that I'll get any further than this on my own.
>
> Thanks to you all so much, you deserve a cookie or dinner or something
> for even
> reading through what has got to be one of the longest emails in the
> last decade.
>
> -Sean Lowrie
> fourtytwominds@ yahoo.com <mailto:fourtytwomi nds%40yahoo. com>
>
>