<div dir="ltr">Particular need for CD series is when you need very small power supply current demand during non-switching states.<div><br></div><div>MC</div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Sat, Sep 18, 2021 at 7:41 AM Tom Wiltshire <<a href="mailto:tom@electricdruid.net">tom@electricdruid.net</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div style="word-wrap:break-word;line-break:after-white-space">Mike’s seems like a good point. Is there any particular need to use the CD series? Do you really need 15V logic?
<div><br><blockquote type="cite"><div>On 18 Sep 2021, at 11:13, Mike Bryant <<a href="mailto:mbryant@futurehorizons.com" target="_blank">mbryant@futurehorizons.com</a>> wrote:</div><br><div><div style="font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none"><div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Personally I wrote off all CD4xxx ICs a long time ago. You can get special 74HC devices with high voltage outputs for the few times you need to drive >5V, and these will always be newer faster, lower power designs with better input and output protection.<u></u><u></u></span></div><div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u> <u></u></span></div><div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u> <u></u></span></div><div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u> <u></u></span></div><div><div style="border-style:solid none none;border-top-width:1pt;border-top-color:rgb(181,196,223);padding:3pt 0cm 0cm"><div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif"><span> </span>Synth-diy [<a href="mailto:synth-diy-bounces@synth-diy.org" target="_blank">mailto:synth-diy-bounces@synth-diy.org</a>]<span> </span><b>On Behalf Of<span> </span></b>David G Dixon via Synth-diy<br><b>Sent:</b><span> </span>18 September 2021 05:08<br><b>To:</b><span> </span>'synth-diy mailing list'<br><b>Subject:</b><span> </span>Re: [sdiy] Issue with CD4024 Ripple Counter<u></u><u></u></span></div></div></div><div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><u></u> <u></u></div><div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Well, I wasn't writing off all CD4XXX chips. Just the ones with edge-sensitive clocks. The ones that just respond to logic levels never go wrong.<u></u><u></u></div><div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> <u></u><u></u></div><div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">The thing is, I'm developing a product for sale -- another one of my Sketchy Labs modules -- so it's important that I can rely on the chips I ultimately choose. At this point, I would never sell a module with a CD4024 in it.<u></u><u></u></div><div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> <u></u><u></u></div><div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Also, just to be clear, I had four CD4024s, but they were from two very different batches. They had different looks. Two had a gold stripe on one end, and the others just had plain white lettering. All seemed bad.<u></u><u></u></div><div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><u></u> <u></u></div><div class="MsoNormal" align="center" style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;text-align:center"><span lang="EN-US"><hr size="5" width="100%" align="center"></span></div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 12pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif"><span> </span>Pete Hartman [<a href="mailto:pete.hartman@gmail.com" target="_blank">mailto:pete.hartman@gmail.com</a>]<span> </span><br><b>Sent:</b><span> </span>Friday, September 17, 2021 3:28 PM<br><b>To:</b><span> </span>David G Dixon<br><b>Subject:</b><span> </span>Re: [sdiy] Issue with CD4024 Ripple Counter</span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p><table border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" style="border-collapse:collapse"><tbody><tr><td style="padding:0.75pt 0.75pt 0.75pt 0cm"><div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><span style="font-size:9pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;background-color:rgb(255,236,179)">[<strong><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif">CAUTION:</span></strong><span> </span>Non-UBC Email]</span><u></u><u></u></div></td></tr></tbody></table><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 12pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">he wasn't saying you were a noob. :)<br><br>He's saying writing off the entire CD4XXX series of chips (with prejudice) because it sounds like you got a bad batch is going to be alarming to those around here who are noobs.<br><br>I do think fishing a couple out to send to someone to grind down and check would be an interesting exercise.<br><br><u></u><u></u></p></div><div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><u></u> <u></u></div><div><div><div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">On Fri, Sep 17, 2021 at 3:28 PM David G Dixon via Synth-diy <<a href="mailto:synth-diy@synth-diy.org" style="color:purple;text-decoration:underline" target="_blank">synth-diy@synth-diy.org</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></div></div><blockquote style="border-style:none none none solid;border-left-width:1pt;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm"><div><div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">I'm tempted to dig those shitty chips out of the trash and mail them to you, to see if you fare any better, given that I'm such a noob (with 13 years of experience designing millions of dollars worth of successful synth modules).<u></u><u></u></div><div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> <u></u><u></u></div><div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> <u></u><u></u></div><div class="MsoNormal" align="center" style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;text-align:center"><hr size="5" width="100%" align="center"></div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 12pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><b><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif"><span> </span>bbob [mailto:<a href="mailto:fluxmonk@gmail.com" style="color:purple;text-decoration:underline" target="_blank">fluxmonk@gmail.com</a>]<span> </span><br><b>Sent:</b><span> </span>Friday, September 17, 2021 12:10 PM<br><b>To:</b><span> </span>David G Dixon<br><b>Cc:</b><span> </span>synth-diy mailing list<br><b>Subject:</b><span> </span>Re: [sdiy] Issue with CD4024 Ripple Counter</span><u></u><u></u></p><table border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" style="border-collapse:collapse"><tbody><tr><td style="padding:0.75pt 0.75pt 0.75pt 0cm"><div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><span style="font-size:9pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;background-color:rgb(255,236,179)">[<strong><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif">CAUTION:</span></strong><span> </span>Non-UBC Email]</span><u></u><u></u></div></td></tr></tbody></table><div><div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">lots of designers have used CD4000 series CMOS in SDIY circuits successfully. they have their place if used properly, and their limitations (like every technology). would be a shame if a newcomer were to be scared off of perfectly good parts just because you couldn't get it to work in your application. <span> </span><u></u><u></u></div><div><div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><u></u> <u></u></div></div><div><div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">bbob drake<u></u><u></u></div></div></div><div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><u></u> <u></u></div><div><div><div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">On Fri, Sep 17, 2021 at 2:52 PM David G Dixon via Synth-diy <<a href="mailto:synth-diy@synth-diy.org" style="color:purple;text-decoration:underline" target="_blank">synth-diy@synth-diy.org</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></div></div><blockquote style="border-style:none none none solid;border-left-width:1pt;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm"><div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">So, I went to the lab and set up a little breadboard. I put 4024 on it,<br>used my +15V and 0V rails to power it (yes, I decoupled with 104), and I<br>also set up a TL072 as a comparator driven by a triangle-wave LFO. I sent<br>the output of the comparator through a diode to have it go just between 0V<br>and +15V. I tried clocking two CD4024BEs, two CD4024BCNs, and one<br>MC14024BCP. The CD4024BCNs didn't even work. The CD4024BEs gave me some<br>really hashy looking outputs. The MC14024BCP worked perfectly. Then I<br>tested them in an ASR, with similar results.<br><br>So, I threw all of the CD4024s into the trash. Unfortunately, I only have<br>one MC14024B. I'm going to buy more, cuz they work well, without any<br>issues.<br><br>Lesson learned, I guess. I'm just not sure what the lesson is, other than<br>"don't use CD4XXX chips" or at least ones with edge-driven inputs.<br>Argghh!!! Why can't this stuff just work? 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