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<div class="moz-cite-prefix"><br>
It's true it's old,<br>
<br>
I was just remembering this one, not as old:<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://archive.org/details/ThinkingInC">https://archive.org/details/ThinkingInC</a><br>
<br>
The Bruce Eckel "thinking in..." books had a good reputation in
the 2000's.<br>
I haven't looked into this particular one.<br>
<br>
Also, the Dr. Dobb's Journal archived articles might be of some
use.<br>
Andre Koenig also frequently wrote there.<br>
This now also is a bit old, but a lot of valuable programming
articles there that may not all be dependent on "outdated" ways of
doing things (let's say, some things today don't have to be as
cumbersome and round 3 corners to get the same result)<br>
<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.drdobbs.com/">https://www.drdobbs.com/</a><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Am 04.12.2020 um 17:22 schrieb Tony Sidaway:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAMFS3ehPXHx6+FrNSo3=r+H478LEyBYiEb-GJf41YKJTEX7jbw@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div dir="auto">When I started learning C in the late 1980s
Koenig's monograph "C traps and pitfalls" was very useful. I'm
not really sure it would be so much use now as the language has
changed somewhat under the influence of standardisation and
convergence with popular features from other languages.
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">C++ is a pretty good choice for low powered
processors, and frankly I don't see any great advantage to C
in such tightly constrained environments when we can see that
Arduino sketches, written in C++, scale quite well right down
to all but the smallest 8-bit AVR chips. If people are
squeezing a bootloader, a C++ runtime and a useful Arduino
sketch into 8kb of flash (just 4192 AVR instruction words) in
the ATtiny85 used in Digispark boards, I don't think C++ can
be that much of a liability.</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, 4 Dec 2020, 14:22
Steve, <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:sleepy_dog@gmx.de" target="_blank"
rel="noreferrer">sleepy_dog@gmx.de</a>> wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div>
<div style="font-family:Verdana;font-size:12.0px">
<div style="font-family:Verdana;font-size:12.0px">
<div>If you want to go the C route, you might find this
useful. Although this is for an outdated language
version, the basic pitfalls still apply.</div>
<div> </div>
<div><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://literateprogramming.com/ctraps.pdf"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">http://literateprogramming.com/ctraps.pdf</a></div>
<div><br>
Some of that of course also applies in C++ as they are
closely related.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>If you actually do already know C++ well, there's
really nothing to be said against using a sane subset
of it on bare metal "MCU" targets.<br>
You need to know what (not) to use and do, of course.
(I *could* elaborate)<br>
Programming "OO" in the way it was taught in Java
intro prog class at uni, probably not.</div>
<div> </div>
<div> </div>
<div>I hardly ever bother doing anything in pure C these
days, unless it's for a really small target.<br>
For reference, on a stm32 with 8 KB RAM and 64 KB
flash, I might still use C++ and can get a decent
amount of functionality in there.<br>
I don't remember a project, but 4K / 32K, I wouldn't
be afraid either. (but may use still less of C++)<br>
<br>
I make more or less extensive use of features that
need at least C++11, preferably C++14, if not 17, and
which current C does not offer.<br>
The number of contexts where "constexpr" can be used
increased from verison to version of what today some
call "modern C++",</div>
<div>and this particular feature alone has tremendous
impact on my "embedded" projects - it is the savior
from the much hated preprocessor macro insanity. (I
still use that, but in much fewer, special contexts)
Compile-time computation and real constants, that's
what almost tips me over to using the word "beautiful"
w.r.t. the C++ language. In a limited context, mind
you :D<br>
<br>
<br>
</div>
<div>- Steve<br>
<div>
<div style="margin:10.0px 5.0px 5.0px
10.0px;padding:10.0px 0 10.0px
10.0px;border-left:2.0px solid rgb(195,217,229)">
<div style="margin:0 0 10.0px 0"><b>Von:</b> "Shawn
Rakestraw" <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:shawn@epicpoolsga.com"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">shawn@epicpoolsga.com</a>><br>
Thanks Jay, I actually installed a VirtualBox
with Ubuntu tonight and started learning C. It
is a lot like C++. Hopefully I can pick up on
the basics of it pretty quick. At the moment I
have been a little confused about the * and **
next to variable names. Also the & variable
names. I found some resources about it and
realize they indicate pointers or something. I'm
just not following the reason to have a pointer
instead of the variable. I'm sure it will become
clear as I continue to learn. </div>
<div>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div class="gmail_attr">On Thu, Dec 3, 2020,
3:11 PM Jay Schwichtenberg <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:jschwich53@comcast.net"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer"
target="_blank">jschwich53@comcast.net</a>>
wrote:</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote"
style="margin:0 0 0 0.8ex;border-left:1.0px
rgb(204,204,204) solid;padding-left:1.0ex">
<div>
<p>I was an embedded/bare metal HW/SW
engineer and will say working with
embedded ARM uCs C.</p>
<p>C++ usually complicates things and is
overkill for run of the mill embedded
stuff. Don't know if it is still true
but at one time the C++ libraries had a
lot of bloat and took up a lot of
storage. I've also found C++ harder to
debug when people start overloading and
abstracting things.</p>
<p>If you do need to run object based code
you can in C. Take all the data for an
object and put it into a structure and
then pass a pointer to the structure
around through the code. This is more or
less the equivalent of a 'this
structure' that objects have in C++. The
data is isolated to a single object and
just use a new structure with different
data for another object. Also follow C++
and make you own constructors and
destructors to setup and shutdown
things.</p>
<p>Jay S.</p>
<div>On 12/2/2020 6:45 PM, Shawn Rakestraw
wrote:</div>
<blockquote>
<div>
<div>Please don't go into extreme
detail (unless you really want to).
I ask too many simple questions and
I feel bad that everyone spends
great amounts of time with it.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>I am thinking about programming
ARM chips like the STM32 for
something like Braids. I know that I
will not be making my own Braids
module anytime soon, but I would
like to start thinking about the
language I need to learn. I know the
most about C++. I also realize that
my question may be better asked as
what libraries should I load / study
up on.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>Thanks guys/gals</div>
</div>
<fieldset> </fieldset>
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